Alex Jones - COINTELPRO? Fascist Tool?

[JEEP]

Thanks Anart and Argonaut for those thoughts. I am obviously too emotionally invested in the whole area concerning this topic, taking it all too personally and putting it on a personal level as I thought it applied to me. Apparently, I can't see the forest for the trees. Is stress exacerbating my difficulties here? My mother was having issues with dementia and paranoia that was exhibiting for a number of years. My dad was the person who had to deal with it and he was the one taking care of her. Unexpectedly, he became ill and died a little over three months later. It was during this obviously high level of stress that my mother's condition seemed to worsen significantly. With the passage of time and settling into the new reality of her life (moved to assisted living here where I live; sold her house to pay for her care), she improved and the downward progression of her condition seems to have lessened although still happening.

I've always had a high level of empathy towards others. I see now I'm allowing myself to get too worked up over the issues of lies, truth, and how either is exposed. As Anart said, "Once one learns to See the lies easily, they are not offended by them, they merely note them, and the source/reason for them, and continue to gather what data is available, leaving the lies with the author."

I obviously have to work harder to truly understand and assimilate that statement.

[Argonaut]

I am obviously too emotionally invested in the whole area concerning this topic, taking it all too personally and putting it on a personal level as I thought it applied to me. Apparently, I can't see the forest for the trees.

I was once in the same boat regarding Icke. Identifications like this can be beaten by learning - about the object of identification AND about ourselves. It sounds like you're headed in the right direction.

Is stress exacerbating my difficulties here? My mother was having issues with dementia and paranoia that was exhibiting for a number of years. My dad was the person who had to deal with it and he was the one taking care of her. Unexpectedly, he became ill and died a little over three months later. It was during this obviously high level of stress that my mother's condition seemed to worsen significantly. With the passage of time and settling into the new reality of her life (moved to assisted living here where I live; sold her house to pay for her care), she improved and the downward progression of her condition seems to have lessened although still happening.

I'm sorry to hear about all of this! It's possible that the stress is related to your difficulties here - if for no other reason than it saps energy that you could otherwise be utilizing.

I've always had a high level of empathy towards others. I see now I'm allowing myself to get too worked up over the issues of lies, truth, and how either is exposed.

Understandable. We all want to help as many wake up as possible. But empathy is manifested powerfully through external considering - discerning between what will best help people and what may harm them.

As Anart said, "Once one learns to See the lies easily, they are not offended by them, they merely note them, and the source/reason for them, and continue to gather what data is available, leaving the lies with the author."

Exactly. And the flipside is that the people you wanted to reach via Jones haven't yet learned to See those lies.

I obviously have to work harder to truly understand and assimilate that statement.

It can be difficult to break free of black-and-white thinking, but you can do it. Just keep working - and networking!

[JEEP]

Thank you Argonaut for your replies. This entire process has proved to serve a purpose, badly needed for me. I always want to move forward and if that means stumbling and falling down repeatedly, that's OK as long as the end result is that I'm still moving forward. Suffice to say, I have experienced an epiphany. Knowing that others can identify with and truly care about the struggles I'm having helps stem the flow of energy depletion that such struggles inevitably create. 

[Argonaut]

Thank you Argonaut for your replies. This entire process has proved to serve a purpose, badly needed for me. I always want to move forward and if that means stumbling and falling down repeatedly, that's OK as long as the end result is that I'm still moving forward.

Suffice to say, I have experienced an epiphany. Knowing that others can identify with and truly care about the struggles I'm having helps stem the flow of energy depletion that such struggles inevitably create. 

Exactly, and that's the beauty of a network like this. On our own, it's horribly easy to fool ourselves into thinking we're moving forward when we're not. But feedback and mirroring from a good network makes us confront ourselves. Provided we submit to the process, of course.

And we definitely give mirrors because we care! Less than two years ago, I was having trouble seeing that. I rebelled against mirroring and viewed it as an attack. But I've since come around. The only thing being threatened by mirroring is our predator. The less we identify with IT, the less we'll feel like WE are being threatened. I'm glad you learned a valuable lesson here.

[JEEP]

Although I think it has been unquestionably established that anything vectored by Alex Jones is PTB manipulation, here are the nails in the coffin:

'Oath Keepers' Leader Arrested for Child Rape; Cops Find Stolen Grenade Launcher In His House

We first noticed Marine Sgt. Charles Dyer, aka "July4Patriot," back in March, when we ran one of the first reports on the "Oath Keepers" bloc of the Tea Party movement -- an organization devoted to recruiting military and police-force veterans into a Patriot-movement belief system predicated on a series of paranoid conspiracy theories, especially the notion that the federal government intends to begin rounding up citizens and putting them in concentration camps.

Dyer played a prominent role in connecting the Oath Keepers to the Tea Party movement, speaking at a July 4 Tea Party rally in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma. And he's been involved in organizing militia "maneuvers" in Oklahoma.

Dyer cropped up again in the news -- this time in the police blotter for allegedly raping a 7-year-old girl:

    An ex-military man has been arrested on charges of rape of a child and forcible sodomy.

    Charles Alan Dyer, 29, of Marlow, was arrested Tuesday afternoon by Stephens County Sheriff’s deputies, said Sheriff Wayne McKinney. Dyer served in the United States Marines in Iraq.

Oh, and guess what police found when they searched his home:

    During the search the sheriff’s deputies noted several firearms and a device believed to be a Colt M-203, 40-millimeter grenade launcher, a complaint filed in the United States District Court of Western Oklahoma by Alcohol, Firearms and Tobacco Special Agent Brett Williams said.

As the story from KAUZ-TV notes, Dyer had a history of making bizarre claims in his videos -- as well as violent fears of being arrested.

    “We come home and those bastards want to talk about how we’re domestic terrorists and a threat to this country. It makes me so angry,” said Charles Dyer, who has been accused of committing rape.

    ... More incriminating evidence against Dyer has surfaced in a YouTube video. The video shows Dyer, a former U.S. Marine, talking proudly about domestic terrorism. “Join the military?”, said Dyer. “Depends on what you want to do with it. Me? I'm going to use my training and become one of those domestic terrorists that you’re so afraid of from the DHS reports.”

    ... “I’m certainly not going to be hiding from my command anymore. I’m not hiding from ATF. Not hiding from FBI. Any organization. If they want to come get me I’m not going to be afraid,” Dyer said.

    “Patriots, we are not overpowered. If we united under one banner and fight for our children’s liberity and the constitution, our resolve is invincible to any standing army,” Dyer said.

GossipBoy is reporting that the rape victim was a close family member. They also report that Dyer had been in touch with a fellow militiaman linked to explosives dealing, and that when bomb-sniffing dogs searched Dyer's home, they indicated explosives had been stored there recently.

Meanwhile, unsurprisingly, the folks at American Resistance Movement -- a group Dyer was also prominently involved in -- are claiming that Dyer was set up, and the girl who accused him was "programmed" to do so. Accordingly, they've set up a "Free July4Patriot" fund, with a little button on their front page so you can donate.

Also, Dyer's YouTube page remains active.

Every movement attracts its freaks. But the Patriot movement attracts an inordinate number of them -- and particularly people with a pedophilia problem. (I can list at least 10 different prominent figures in the Northwest's Patriot movement in the 1990s who had a history of being charged with abusing and abducting children.) Evidently, being a pedophile leads to resentment of the government -- probably for its desire to lock you away.

We'll reserve judgment on Dyer's guilt or innocence for after the trial. But let's just say that the predictable claims that he's been arrested as part of a government plot to silence him are not exactly compelling in this case.

There's a video by this slimeball on the page as well which vividly contrasts with the Oath Keepers videos associated with Alex Jones' Fall of the Republic. So now, in addition to the Tea Party having connections to the billionaire Koch brothers with their totalitarian roots to Communism, here's a direct link to a pedophile rapist nutjob clearly promoting and preparing for violence which is ultimately also being promoted by Alex Jones.

One has to wonder at the synchronicity of these events, that the unexpected and last minute addition of Humble to the Nexus Conference revealed a link to Oath Keepers, already being discussed here in relation to Alex Jones, which led to the exposure of the Oath Keepers leader and his connection to the Tea Parties and a more subtle connection to July 4 (Independence Day as in the movie, 7/4). I feel these nefarious connections deserve even more attention and exposure.

[Argonaut]

One has to wonder at the synchronicity of these events, that the unexpected and last minute addition of Humble to the Nexus Conference revealed a link to Oath Keepers, already being discussed here in relation to Alex Jones, which led to the exposure of the Oath Keepers leader and his connection to the Tea Parties and a more subtle connection to July 4 (Independence Day as in the movie, 7/4). I feel these nefarious connections deserve even more attention and exposure.

Wow... The whole bunch is starting to rally together! Also, David Icke has even jumped in with Jones now. It does seem like interesting timing. All of the connections being formed between all these disinfo agents... I get this mental image of a net or spider web.

[Laura]

It's always been "Protocol 12" from the beginning.  They place their agents in any group and begin to vector them.

[Argonaut]

It's always been "Protocol 12" from the beginning.  They place their agents in any group and begin to vector them.

So the connections aren't forming, they're just becoming more obvious. And so much of it links to the Tea Partiers, which pulls most of right-wing America into the whole thing. No wonder the PTB put Obama in the White House!

[Dingo]

Here is an interesting tidbit. Daniel Estulin, a prominent voice in the Jone's crusade is going to be speaking at the EU about Bilderberg. What is up with that? This is him being interviewed on radio
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvn5ioyHwGw

One of the tricky things I have had to wrestle with, being a student of the stock markets, has been the accuracy of Estulin's calls regarding the stock markets amazing collapse of 2008, the amazing and never before seen (on a % level), recovery of 2009, and the housing collapse too. All of which he claims to have sourced from insiders at bilderberg meetings.

As Alex Jone's is obviously not trusted here, and with obvious good reason after reading some of this thread, it is still very difficult to know what to do with recent information, and that is, that the PTB want the public to reinvest before making one more final plunge of the markets, but this time it will not be as severe as the 2008 decline. Reasons, are because it would hurt the PTB too, if they took it down too far. The PTB though will have most of their wealth in hard assets, not paper, neverless, a decline would probably take all asset classes with it. My own analysis, based on Elliott Wave theory, and socionomics, also suggests a similar fate.

My pickle is, one one hand, I agree with Estulin based on my own analysis, and the fact that he has been accurate in the past three years, on other other hand, he is a voice of Jones, and Jones is not to be trusted...  

[Perceval]

More evidence that Jones is a very subtle disinfo agent. Here he rants about people who "hate Jews". Listen also to the way he talks himself up in the second half. Alex for president! Talk about grandiosity!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDTKBKGdbJ4&

[Argonaut]

My pickle is, one one hand, I agree with Estulin based on my own analysis, and the fact that he has been accurate in the past three years, on other other hand, he is a voice of Jones, and Jones is not to be trusted...  

Estulin's alignment with Jones doesn't invalidate him as a source of info. And heck, even Jones himself puts out SOME useful, accurate info. It's just a matter of using discernment to separate the good stuff from the garbage.

More evidence that Jones is a very subtle disinfo agent. Here he rants about people who "hate Jews". Listen also to the way he talks himself up in the second half. Alex for president! Talk about grandiosity!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDTKBKGdbJ4&

I listened to it, and UGH...  There's some truth mixed in there, but it's overshadowed by his B.S. and his ego. I love how he cites the fact that the mainstream media is now bringing up things that he's talked about in the past. As if MSM coverage somehow validates his "greatness." But wouldn't the truth be closer to the opposite, considering who runs the MSM?

[Perceval]

I listened to it, and UGH...  There's some truth mixed in there, but it's overshadowed by his B.S. and his ego. I love how he cites the fact that the mainstream media is now bringing up things that he's talked about in the past. As if MSM coverage somehow validates his "greatness." But wouldn't the truth be closer to the opposite, considering who runs the MSM?

Very true. The guy really is a perfect shill, because he's wrapped in enough plausibility to con a lot of people. No one stands back and actually considers the guy from a character/personality point of view. Then again, maybe a lot of his listeners actually like his narcissistic rants. He's like the spell-binder of the alt.news community.

[Argonaut]

The guy really is a perfect shill, because he's wrapped in enough plausibility to con a lot of people. No one stands back and actually considers the guy from a character/personality point of view. Then again, maybe a lot of his listeners actually like his narcissistic rants. He's like the spell-binder of the alt.news community.

I think the latter is often the case, unfortunately. It seems like people are either turned off by Jones completely, or they're his devoted fans who get whipped into a frenzy by him. I've actually had a Jones-loving friend tell me that Jones is "the only thing standing between us and a police state." It's pretty much blind hero-worship for a lot of those people. Kinda scary. But when he plays so much on the emotions I guess it's understandable. People are machines, and Jones knows how to push buttons. He definitely qualifies as a spell-binder.

[Guardian]

Wow... The whole bunch is starting to rally together! Also, David Icke has even jumped in with Jones now. It does seem like interesting timing. All of the connections being formed between all these disinfo agents... I get this mental image of a net or spider web.

Yup ...kinda like a network.  The phrase "Unholy Alliance" comes to mind.    As times get tougher, the lines become clearer... like gravitates towards, and allies with, like.  From what I can see, it looks like a pretty natural progression. 

[Rabelais]

One of the tricky things I have had to wrestle with, being a student of the stock markets, has been the accuracy of Estulin's calls regarding the stock markets amazing collapse of 2008, the amazing and never before seen (on a % level), recovery of 2009, and the housing collapse too. All of which he claims to have sourced from insiders at bilderberg meetings.
 

Its easy to call tops and bottoms in the markets when one has the inside track with Wall Street. The media is full of pundits and market analysts who have an uncanny knack for calling counterintuitive trends. Some are just very perceptive - and some are spoon fed advance information of engineered take downs or pump and dumps by the big investment banks... when it serves their agendas.

The housing bubble burst was called by GATA and their subscription newsletter, Le Metropole Cafe, back in 2004, just as was the derivatives bubble which created the 2008 collapse. But they are a network of brilliant people and not one guy working alone. The markets are all rigged these days and perception management is all that matters to those at the highest levels. Respected market analysts, for example Dennis Gartman,  can be counted on to talk-the-book of their most powerful patrons (GS, JPM, etc), and still offer enough valid advice to keep their subscribers and themselves profitable.

I learned several years ago that TA was no longer a reliable tool in manipulated markets, but recently fundamentals are also no longer of any use. These days its safest to just go long DOW and US$ and short gold/silver on days when Obama, Bernanke or Geithner are addressing the public/congress or G20, G8 type confabs are being held. This seldom fails. They can levitate failing markets and currencies at will.

Estulin may be the real deal, but he is not making any calls that others haven't also made earlier. Its not hard to be right when you are given advance peeks at the script. Given all of the other things we are seeing about Estulin, he is likely just another well paid bit actor.