The Difference Between Paleo and Paleo

I find too much fruit to be extremely problematical for many reasons, not the least of which is the insulin issue. Sugar is sugar is sugar, whether from fruit or honey or sugar cane. It triggers the pancreas and that should not be done too much or too often. The true paleo diet utilized low sugar berries more than anything else, and primitive fruits that were not as sweet and hybridized as the fruits of today.

So please, caution on the fruit! Major caution!
 
Ailén said:
Thanks for clarifying that aspect and for the links. But still, what about candida issues, like 3D student mentioned?

Since we are talking Paleo, I have a hard time imagining our ancestors eating so much fruit. There would have had no means of preserving it. So, maybe we should rather eat only seasonal fruits, and in moderation? I know for myself that if I eat a lot of fruit my blood sugar goes crazy. I can feel dizzy if I eat very sweet fruit on an empty stomach. :huh:

Right, candida. I think it's important to remember that candida overgrowth isn't caused by carbohydrate consumption. If there is a candida issue then the candida diet needs to be undertaken and special care regarding the starches consumed, restriction fruits, etc. needs to happen. But, if there isn't an issue with it there's no reason to be avoiding unrefined carbohydrates for fear of candida. The key here is unrefined carbs, not sugar. Eating sweet potatoes and buckwheat isn't going to cause candida.

Laura said:
I find too much fruit to be extremely problematical for many reasons, not the least of which is the insulin issue. Sugar is sugar is sugar, whether from fruit or honey or sugar cane.
<snip>
So please, caution on the fruit! Major caution!

OK, I guess I should have tread a little more lightly with the fruit comment. If you have issues with fruit, avoid it. I personally don't have any issues with fruit. I will occasionally even have a fruit meal when I'm looking to eat light (usually when I'm teaching I don't like to be burdened with a heavy meal, which I find can slow down my thinking). I've been known to eat five or six bananas in one sitting as a meal without having any issues with it. This may come down to type and constitution. I notice the two people who mentioned problems with fruit are type Os. I'm a type A. Maybe this has something to do with it.

I didn't mean to imply that everyone should go out and have a fruit feast. Everyone needs to test things carefully to see what works for them. All I meant with the fruit comment is to say that people don't need to worry about fruit causing metabolic syndrome; insulin resistance or type two diabetes etc.

[quote author=Laura]
It triggers the pancreas and that should not be done too much or too often. The true paleo diet utilized low sugar berries more than anything else, and primitive fruits that were not as sweet and hybridized as the fruits of today. [/quote]

But Laura, the whole point of what I've written is that triggering the pancreas is a natural reaction to eating carbohydrates and there's no reason to believe doing this is harmful. Eat carbs, trigger pancreas to release insulin, insulin shuttles glucose into the cells. Normal, natural process. Triggering this pathway shouldn't be sending anyone into tailspins. I do agree, though, that fruit has changed and that low-sugar berries are probably a better option, particularly for people who have issues with blood sugar control. But unrefined carbs, even from fruit, cause a slow release of glucose into the blood and shouldn't be sending anyone into hypoglycemia, like you're describing.

I dunno. Maybe this needs a bit more research. If some people are reacting badly to whole food unrefined carbohydrates then maybe this issue has a lot more to do with individual constitution than I had originally posited.
 
I also find that some people do better when they restrict sugar, including sweet fruits. Mostly O types, but also a B type. After getting over the die-off symptoms, I really felt great on an anti-candida diet low in carbs, or at least where the carbs were mostly coming from vegetables and blueberries as fruits. But I'm an O type and this seems to be one of the keys. In retrospect I think I also felt great on a rich protein diet because I was eliminating most lectins and sources of allergies which for me comes from plants and fruits. I am reminded of the following from the Lectin Report:

http://www.krispin.com/lectin.html

I have always promoted adequate protein in all of my dietary programs with moderate 'good' fats and moderate complex carbohydrates and plenty of fruits and vegetables. For some clients consistently eating enough protein was and is difficult. They (and the culture in which we currently reside) tend to diminish protein's important contribution to health, both mental and physical. When protein intake is maximized clients have found this moderate, easy to follow, program has aided them in restoring function of body and mind..

For some of my most difficult clients this simple basic program just hasn't given them the level of health and well being they so very much desire. Some of these most difficult clients have reported improvement in health using high protein, low carbohydrate diets. Some of the very best results came when switching to the so-called Paleolithic Diet. These programs included The Zone by Sears (the least effective of the bunch and the highest in lectins); D'Adamo's Blood Type Diet (the second highest in lectins and also not as effective); Eades Protein Power ; Atkins Diet Revolution ; The Specific Carbohydrate Diet from Breaking the Vicious Cycle by E Gottschall; and Neanderthin by Audette; and the Crook Candida Diet. The commonality is higher protein (and often natural unprocessed fats) and a reduction in carbohydrates, especially carbohydrates high in lectins.

Research shows a connecting link between these diets and the improvement in health being reported. Some of the symptoms and conditions that have been reported to respond include

* arthritis, both rheumatoid and osteoarthritis;
* allergy;
* asthma;
* high cholesterol;
* atherosclerosis;
* congestive heart failure;
* high blood pressure;
* diabetes;
* low blood sugar;
* hyperinsulinemia;
* chronic fatigue;
* fibromyalgia;
* all forms of IBS, Crohn's, colitis, celiac;
* chronic candida, repeated gut pathogen infections;
* malabsorption syndromes;
* failure to thrive;
* autoimmune diseases such as thyroiditis, lupus, MS, Parkinson's;
* dementia, Alzheimer's;
* autism;
* ADD/ADHD;
* Schizophrenia;
* osteoporosis;
* cancer, several types including breast;
* hypercortisolemia and hypocortisolemia;
* adrenal insufficiency;
* post viral syndrome;
* post traumatic stress syndrome;
* post polio syndrome;
* obesity;
* hormonal imbalances including low testosterone, low DHEA, PMS, and peri-menopausal symptoms and PCOS.

Higher protein has been shown clinically to improve many of these conditions but not all and it is not a wide enough connecting link.


In the 1970s research on lectins, lectinology, began increasing worldwide. For a more scientific overview see the end of this report.[...]

I always attributed this last part to blood types or our own individuality, so that a high-protein diet could not be a general formula for those who are very sensitive to lectins. Then this only seems to look into diet alone and not other factors like toxicity which can affect our metabolism.

I agree we need to do more research in this area. But at least we know that we have the elimination diet to help us find our own individuality to foods. It includes fruits ;) and some of us have chosen to moderate the sweet ones because we feel better when we do.
 
I find myself in the uncomfortable position of disagreeing with the Chateau folks on this one. My normal response to this would be to clam up and observe, assuming I must be wrong and waiting to see how things work out. But, seeing something Gonzo mentioned in a post on the Clif High thread struck a chord and made me decide to push forward instead, despite it making me uncomfortable. He described our process as:

http://www.krispin.com/lectin.html
<snip>
For some of my most difficult clients this simple basic program just hasn't given them the level of health and well being they so very much desire. Some of these most difficult clients have reported improvement in health using high protein, low carbohydrate diets. Some of the very best results came when switching to the so-called Paleolithic Diet. These programs included The Zone by Sears (the least effective of the bunch and the highest in lectins); D'Adamo's Blood Type Diet (the second highest in lectins and also not as effective); Eades Protein Power ; Atkins Diet Revolution ; The Specific Carbohydrate Diet from Breaking the Vicious Cycle by E Gottschall; and Neanderthin by Audette; and the Crook Candida Diet. The commonality is higher protein (and often natural unprocessed fats) and a reduction in carbohydrates, especially carbohydrates high in lectins.

<snip>

Higher protein has been shown clinically to improve many of these conditions but not all and it is not a wide enough connecting link.


In the 1970s research on lectins, lectinology, began increasing worldwide. For a more scientific overview see the end of this report.[...]

I always attributed this last part to blood types or our own individuality, so that a high-protein diet could not be a general formula for those who are very sensitive to lectins. Then this only seems to look into diet alone and not other factors like toxicity which can affect our metabolism.

I agree we need to do more research in this area. But at least we know that we have the elimination diet to help us find our own individuality to foods. It includes fruits ;) and some of us have chosen to moderate the sweet ones because we feel better when we do.

Yes, I hear you, Psyche. But I'm a little worried that maybe this path isn't the best one and it may have some serious consequences in the long term. These benefits listed in the above quote are congruent with what is reported on low-carb diets to begin with. Out of the gate, people are flying on how good they feel. Allergies clear up, skin clears, people are up at the crack of dawn with loads of energy. A lot of this can be attributed to the adrenal surge people get from being low-carb (shown to increase cortisol). Some can also be attributed to getting off the SAD. It's only after an extended period that things start to go sour.

And an early sign that things are going sour are an unusual sensitivity to carbs (like fruit), mood swings and cravings. On a normal, balanced diet, you won't have cravings. And a lot of your original symptoms start coming back like allergies and digestive issues.

Here's a couple of testimonials from low-carb victims on Stone's blog. I think it's a good indication of what people can expect if they continue on a low-carb diet.

http://180degreehealth.blogspot.com/2009/08/carb-wars-episode-i.html
http://180degreehealth.blogspot.com/2009/08/carb-wars-episode-iii.html

Like I say I'm concerned that people here may be unwittingly damaging their metabolism and will have a long arduous climb out of the low-carb hole ahead of them.
 
dugdeep said:
Laura said:
I find too much fruit to be extremely problematical for many reasons, not the least of which is the insulin issue. Sugar is sugar is sugar, whether from fruit or honey or sugar cane.
<snip>
So please, caution on the fruit! Major caution!

OK, I guess I should have tread a little more lightly with the fruit comment. If you have issues with fruit, avoid it. I personally don't have any issues with fruit. I will occasionally even have a fruit meal when I'm looking to eat light (usually when I'm teaching I don't like to be burdened with a heavy meal, which I find can slow down my thinking). I've been known to eat five or six bananas in one sitting as a meal without having any issues with it. This may come down to type and constitution. I notice the two people who mentioned problems with fruit are type Os. I'm a type A. Maybe this has something to do with it.

I don't think it is JUST type Os, though that could have something to do with it.

The thing is that, during our evolutionary history, we had access to fruits only seasonally. Fruits were eaten and the pancreas was stimulated only for a short season of the year. That generated fat deposition during the summer months that carried the individual through the winter and/or prepared the female body for pregnancy during the winter. It is only with the development of forced agriculture or long distance, cross-equator transport, that fruit has become available year-round. This plays hell with our systems which evolved over millions of years to deal with fruit only in season.
 
From: Sex, Lies and Menopause:

Picture life as a Slinky lying on its side: circles connected in a spiral. Now picture the one-way arrow of time traveling the circles of loops that seem to go on forever. If we follow the arrow of time as it carries information and energy through the organism (us)—in the form of food and light—coming in from the outside, traveling through us and out again on the other end, it becomes obvious that all organisms are dissipative structures—that is structures that lose energy just living.

We use up resources over time and literally wear ourselves out doing it. The Second Law of Classical Thermodynamics describes the process of the dissipation of energy as the movement of energy away from the point of equilibrium, which in humans is about the age of twenty-six years, when human growth hormone and estrogen start to decline.76 In our individual lives, the circles or loops carrying information begin to narrow as we age and run out of hormones. We literally start to run down like an old record player unwinding, in terms of physical function. This dissipation of energy is called entropy.

Entropy is essentially an organism moving away from order to disorder.77 Any closed system, like the human body or a cell, will spontaneously move in the direction of ever-increasing entropy or disregulation as the arrow of time moves away from equilibrium. With fewer hormones in place to regu¬late and mandate order, ever-increasing disorder ensues.

The loops in the spiral of eternity get smaller and smaller as we age. Just as a dying heart slows its beat in old age, your menstrual periods get shorter and shorter and farther apart as you approach menopause because our ovaries are running out of eggs.

That's why we run out of estrogen and are no longer fertile. The eggs were the source. Without an estrogen peak in a woman's blood every month, her brain stops sending the monthly signal to ovulate, or release the egg the next month. The absence of a released or "popped" egg leaves her with¬out the progesterone that would be secreted by the egg "shell," or degrading egg sac.

It is progesterone's major job to regulate the genes that cause all of a woman's cells all over her brain and body to grow, to differentiate, or to die.94-" Progesterone is one of the premier regulatory hormones. Without it rising cyclically, the woman becomes, literally and figuratively, on the cellu¬lar level, out of control. This is the beginning of aging and, ultimately, the onset of the death of the organism that is you.

Sex hormones register directly to genes95 that flip on and off according to hormonal directives, elicited by environmental cues. Sex hormones deter¬mine which genes are expressed (turned on) or silenced (turned off) in the nucleus of every cell in the body. Estrogen, progesterone, cortisol, testos¬terone, insulin, prolactin, and melatonin reach all the way down into the nucleus of every cell in every organ in your body to hit "promoter regions" and "response elements" on genes that literally control the stuff of life.

Hormones not only cause you to think, behave, and react in ways that enhance your chances for survival, but they also cause you to go forth and multiply.96-99 Without regular ovulation, which must be stimulated by high enough levels of estrogen, and without the progesterone that follows ovulation, the regulatory genes involved in cancer, heart disease, diabetes, Alzheimer's, and autoimmunity are left "deranged," or uncontrolled.'00-107 Your particular experience of this disregulation will take whatever form your inherited genetics dictate. In other words, when your sex hormones fall off and you start to die, the disease that gets you will depend on your family's personal threshold of entropy.

Will your heart or breast or blood sugar go first?

In most of us now, our biological age doesn't really match our chronological age anymore. When we lived outside most of the time and slept when it got dark and ate what the season offered us, we were as old, in years, as the number of trips we'd taken around the sun or how many "moons" or months we had lived. But now, at thirty-five, many of us are years older inside.

Now we live in a world where it seems as if the sun never sets and we never run out of fruit (sugar). Although we have evolved to experience one mating season a year, which is one summer, our lives in the modern world are all sex all the time. When the light is long—that is, in summer—we are programmed to feel sexy because the sunlight and plentiful carbohydrates of summer increase our insulin, which provides us with extra circulating estrogen and testosterone to let us appreciate it hormonally. That's why the beach seems so sexy—it's the light, not just the bikinis.

Conversely, when the days are short and dark outside, even though we may be sitting in front of a blinking computer screen under fluorescent lights, rising melatonin lowers our body temperature a few tenths of a degree,'" which is enough to cause a shiver and yawn. Your body is trying to remind you that it's winter outside and should be winter inside—of you, too. In nature, before now, we went dormant (more sleep, no sugar, very little sex) when the temperature dropped in winter, just like the other animals and plants. That's all different now Now we turn up the heat and get a cup of coffee.

By creating endless summer, we have changed the rules of life. Since the light is long all the time in our world, it has put us—our bodies—out of rhythm with the earth, on which we evolved to survive. Everything in this life is all about timing, and we've altered what had to be a rhythm, to be a constant. There is no tempo without variation. That's why it is as much of a physical and mental problem when your menstrual periods stop as it is when your heart starts skipping beats.

It's a physical impossibility to be part of life and not be able to keep time.

This fundamental change in our environmental cues for mating and aging began in the mid-1860s. Then, in the mid-1960s, after about ten de¬cades of altered light and food in exaggerated rhythms, birth control pills were invented and took us even farther away from the beat of nature and our own bodies.

In summer, the weightless, invisible energy of the sun saturates plants and fruit, they ripen, and we eat them. Any sugar is a carbohydrate and any car¬bohydrate is just sugar. When the plants and fruits as "solid sunlight" enter the body, over time the sun's energy becomes very visible as insulating weight around our middles and backsides. In the natural world, which still has sea¬sons, we would reburn this weight, this solar "charcoal," in winter, when sum¬mer's carbohydrates were gone. But when winter never comes because we have indoor heating and electric lighting, we continue to crave the carbohy¬drates of summer and become exhausted, and sexually a little crazy.

We go to the grocery store and buy fruits we would never have seen in winter before, plus thousands of recently invented forms of sugar that would never have been available to us seventy-five years ago.

Unfortunately for us, all that nature allows is one period of high insulin a year—the three months or so of summer. Since we evolved and adapted to this rhythm, when we are exposed to heat, sugar, and light for all twelve months of the year, we naturally experience accelerated biological time. Every year for us in the modern world has four summers, because just one of our modern years is twelve months of light and heat and sugar. That's why one year today is like four years to our Stone Age bodies, because our sensors for aging register "four trips around the sun" instead of just one.

We collaterally experience accelerated aging.

The hallmarks of being old, increasing blood sugar, arthritis, macular degeneration, and so forth, are also, not coincidentally, the hallmarks of Type II diabetes. This adult onset form of diabetes is on the increase in ado¬lescents as of this writing. Human timing mechanisms read the endless summer cues literally and respond automatically.

If this behavior goes on year after year, well, you do the math.

The fact that we enjoy all this light and heat doesn't mean our biology won't respond to it in the only ancient way it can. The false cues of endless summer affect not only our appetite for food but also our appetite for sex. In our brave new world, it's always mating season. We are experiencing a forty-year mating frenzy. It's not only apparent in our cultural obsessions, but in our ovaries, "party" has become a verb, and there are only so many eggs to go around.

This sleep/sugar/survival equation is the control mechanism on how fast we age, and how fast we age determines how fast we deplete the eggs in our ovaries. As children we matured faster and began ovulating sooner than our grandmothers did. The average age of menarche at the turn of the century was seventeen, for us it was twelve, for our daughters, it's down to ten years old.

Higher insulin levels not only mean faster maturation sexually, they mean that the reproductive machinery is on overdrive. We weren't meant to ovulate twelve months a year, every year, year in and year out, from a very young age. If we should have our first period at about seventeen years old and then, in the natural world, we would be pregnant soon afterward, and then breast-feeding, we'd save a lot of eggs and be exposed to high levels of estrogen and progesterone as a bonus. Birth control pills didn't save our eggs by stopping ovulation; instead, the androgens (testosteronelike hor¬mone drugs) actually caused egg cell death, as the eggs aged at an increased rate.17-'28 Picture a carton of chicken eggs left out in the heat for a couple of months. That's where we are.

It's about not enough death of one kind of cell or another.

Life and death is a three-act play consisting of genesis, florescence, and decay—the endless cycle of birth, life, and death. Cells are born, they live, but they must die so new cells can come again. When cells don't die cyclically, we start to.

While we are young, the ups and downs of estrogen and progesterone month after month strike the beat that keeps us rocking and rolling with the stresses of life that could negatively affect our health. When the cycling rhythm of "on and off" ceases, we can no longer handle germs, fatigue, and hot or cold weather; maintain our body temperature; or control our appetites under stress. We are beginning to die. Sometimes death can happen in as little as three years, or it can take as long as an agonizing twenty or thirty.

When our hormones stop humming the tune of the Sun and the moon and start keeping the beat of an artificial environment, our internal systems— which have evolved over millennia to adapt for survival—are being driven by artificial signals. When this happens, what was the dance of life becomes a malignant pas de deux. Those of us more genetically predisposed to be light- and food-
responsive suffer first and most from the altered rhythms. But in the end, losing the beat gets us all.

Menopause, or "egglessness," causes the breakdown of the estrogen and progesterone feedback system that controls all the cell cycles in your body. Remember the narrowing Slinky? That's the real problem. As we said ear¬lier, estrogen leads to progesterone by way of released eggs, and progesterone regulates the genes that cause cells to grow, differentiate, or die. Cancer is not really about too much growth of one kind of cell or another.

It's about not enough death of one kind of cell or another.

Early menstruation, one of the other risk factors, isn't even about estro¬gen. Early menstruation, "precocious puberty,"160-161 in its scientific guise, is a function of a high-carbohydrate diet (causing high insulin, an enormous growth factor in cancer) fostering accelerated aging, hence the term precocious. In this case, they've vilified the wrong hormone again.

The biggest clue is found in the statistics showing that in our grand¬mothers' generation, breast cancer struck one woman in twenty-eight and in our mothers' generation, one in sixteen. In ours, it's one in eight or nine. In our daughters it's expected to be one in five.1634" The escalating numbers reflect the pandemic proportions of this killer of women.

A woman actually has a triad of glands—hypothalamus, pituitary, and adrenal glands (called the HPA axis)—that act in concert to read the cues in her environment. The HPA axis has marked off the years she's lived by adding up all of the summer days of her life, when she had high levels of cortisol and insulin, and coming to the conclusion that she is old enough to begin the next phase of her life.22-25

When a girl has passed enough summers, her adrenal glands, which sit on top of the kidneys, take the cue from her brain's calculations of her age in relationship to time passed and pump more testosterone faster. In our world, adrenarchy often begins as early as age seven or eight, instead of ten to twelve,26 because artificial light and food have sped up our internal clocking mechanisms, hence the surge of precocious puberty in our time. The problem is that in today's world your chronological age may not necessarily be your biological age. The first sign of adrenarche is what medical textbooks call secondary sexual characteristics—armpit and pubic hair, for example. Eventually, leg hairs get coarser, and even head hair changes.

When testosterone reaches a certain threshold, or crescendo, it con¬verts, or becomes something else. An enzyme made in your fat base, called aromatase, controls the conversion of testosterone into estrogen. That's why "baby fat" is important to normal development and why young women ath¬letes often don't menstruate when they're too thin. With no fat, they have less estrogen to build a uterine lining to start that first period.

The conversion of testosterone to estrogen is the beginning of puberty.27 At first, the system begins to turn over slowly, like an obstinate starter in a car. It takes a while for it to rev up to speed. These low-level fluctuating sex hormones make it hard for you to sleep, and you begin to stay up later and later. This behavior is your brain and body's attempt to gain weight. Just like in summer, the longer you are exposed to light in a day, the more corti¬sol you make. Circulating cortisol levels mobilize blood sugar stored in your liver and muscles.

All of the extra blood sugar raises insulin production enough, over the course of just a few days, to make you insulin-resistant enough to gain, weight for winter and to make the enzyme aromatase appear to increase estrogen.'" As we said above, aromatase from your fat base is needed to try convert more testosterone to estrogen. Your body, by gaining weight, ing to optimize that mechanism."' Staying up late enhances weight gain, and by being awake later and later, you shorten your time to produce melatonin." Melatonin is made while you sleep and blocks estrogen receptors. There would be more melatonin, naturally, in the winter, since the

days are shorter. Short, colder days mean almost no carbohydrates, so fertility would be down, too, thanks to less estrogen reception and less insulin.

Not sleeping enough means less melatonin and puts you into summer or mating mode, with estrogen receptors listening and insulin high." On the way to menopause we run through this very same scenario of increased appetite for carbohydrates and decreased ability to sleep late because this is the only template nature knows for raising estrogen levels. But without eggs in place, it doesn't work.

When enough testosterone finally converts to estrogen," the pituitary gland responds with follicle (egg) stimulating hormone (FSH). The point of increasing FSH is to ripen eggs (actually, the follicles holding the egg) The ripening eggs throw off even more estrogen. At this point in puberty, a girl will go through a few anovulatory periods, but each time estrogen will peak higher and higher, until it actually peaks high enough to make the pituitary send luteinizing hormone (LH) down to her ovary to release her first viable egg."

The key to understanding life and death rests in being mindful of nature, and we're not mindful anymore. In the world we live in, weve blurred the distinction between summer and winter and day and night.' We can barely tell what season it is, let alone when the full moon is coming or going.

But your body still reads nature very clearly.

Otherwise, the artificial triggers wouldn't play such havoc with our systems.

The light of the moon in its various phases has always controlled and "phased" the hormonal interplay of our menstrual cycles." That's why most women cycle between twenty-eight and thirty days. In our brave new world, where we are no longer governed by natural light, including the natural tim¬ing of moonlight, our fertility is not as reliable. One hundred years is not quite enough to effect extinction through infertility.

But two hundred is. We're getting close to the point of no return.

We've only really been exposed in any great way to artificial light after dark since the turn of the twentieth century. Although we've had candles and then gaslights longer, the expense and mess of those forms of light made them less ubiquitous to the masses than cheap, easy electricity.

Moonlight is really the reflected light of our sun—still shining, out of our view—on the other side of the planet at night. The moonlight at night inhibits melatonin release just like sunlight in the daytime, the lightbulb in your refrigerator, or the light from your computer screen does.38 Any light at night changes natural rhythms. It is melatonin, in turn, that controls the amount of estrogen you receive by destabilizing the estrogen receptor.39-44 When the moon is bright and melatonin is low, you can feel your estrogen, and, conversely, when the moon light is dim and melatonin is high, you can't. The reason, psychologically, that moonlight is so universally romantic is because we have evolved to feel sexy in the extra light of the moon and act on those feelings.

The program for reproduction is run by the light and food supply. Just as the summer sun makes food and hormones more available for mating, your menstrual cycle of twenty-eight days has a "fruiting" period, too, guided by the amount of moonlight your skin and closed eyelids absorb.

etc.
 
More:

Perimenopause is problematic because women are hormonally in first-trimester pregnancy range. That is, the specific hormone ratios of insulin (high), estrogen (low), and thyroid (fluctuating) of early pregnancy are mimicked by perimenopause. This triggers "fetal" oncogenes to start flip- ping on,22 but perimenopausal women are stranded with no source of pro gesterone to give the growth or death command23 to turn those same genes off, because they don't have enough estrogen to make a peak to ovulate any¬more with any regularity, and there's no placenta on board. Without the progesterone from the remains of an empty egg sac, their low chronic estro¬gen is never turned off, either.

The state that they are in now is life-threatening.

It is the backdrop for cancer.24 The regulatory hormones for growth and death in your body are waning. 25-28 Without your sex hormones in place to read the environment, the environmental cues have become static noise. Without ovulation and its attendant progesterone to keep the balance between life and death in your cells, your life itself is in jeopardy.

If we follow the clues backward, we can see that the symptom of sleeplessness (of pseudopuberty) was the beginning of the end of ovulation. Although the growth potential—from either low levels of estrogen or high levels of insulin without progesterone on board to keep it in check—might have been enough to cause any number of kinds of cancer from lymphoma to ovarian to liver, the real danger is in the overproduction of prolactin2933 out of rhythm outside of nursing. Prolactin is a relative in the family of growth hormones known as somatostatins.

Without hormones, it is really impossible to sleep. Without sleep, prolactin keeps escalating. You'd never be awake off and on all night otherwise unless you were nursing. At the end of perimenopause, cortisol soars and estrogen and progesterone hit bottom . . . just as they do during labor and delivery." At this point in the template, your immune system revs up so high that it may attack your cartilage and mucus membranes, and that scenario creates joint pain (arthritis) and allergies, and an autoimmune disease called Hashimoto's Thyroiditis can happen now, too. Once your immune system has attacked and halted thyroid function, with the insulin resistance from sleeplessness, you just keep getting fatter.

The lack of progesterone coupled with dribbling estrogen and sky-high prolactin is the trigger to make milk, just as it is at postpartum. All of the ducts in your breasts are "festering" from the mammary gland stimulation of this hormonal scenario. Noninvasive or precancers, called ductal carcinomas in situ (DCIS), are diagnosed on mammograms for a lot of us at this point in the play. DCIS are sparkles of calcification and inflammation in your "rusty pipes." Nature assumes that when your estrogen plummets and progesterone is nonexistent, pregnancy is over and it is time to turn on your breasts.

But Mother Nature rules, and her rule says: With your hormonal profile, you'd better be nursing. If you still had a thyroid and enough growth hormone, you might actually make milk. But at your age you won't. However, under these circumstances, already high levels of prolactin continue to increase past the trigger point of real lactation. Your breasts are now all turned on with nowhere to go.

You can't hormonally be in a place to breast-feed and not do it for decades without experiencing repercussions of great magnitude. If you weren't diagnosed with cancer before menopause, in perimenopause, from a lack of progesterone due to hit-or-miss irregular ovulation from the falling levels of estrogen (because you're running out of eggs, which would produce that estrogen), you get a second chance when you finally run out of everything but insulin and prolactin.

We -have triggered the stress scenario over the last 150 years by eating too much carbohydrate and creating long hours of artificial light.3&39 In our bodies, all of the insulin we're producing creates insulin resistance.' While our bodies just get fatter and fatter, our brains can't access any of the sugar we eat because in the brain insulin resistance reads to the controls on behavioral cues as "famine," because of the lack of access to the body's own blood sugar'" (this mechanism is why overweight people are generally hungry people), and because all of the cortisol we're producing from the incessant light just reads as "fear."

Because of these artificial triggers, our environmental sensors honed by evolution lead us to keep eating sugar and trying to mate twenty-four hours a day because it seems like summer in our heads. Since year-in and year-out eating and mating is not a template on this planet, nature perceives a "bug" or glitch in the program and so shuts down for repairs. The way it shuts down is to slow reproduction by changing the individuals sexually in the group under stress.

The major "hormonal players" activated in the individuals of the group during any of these possible stresses are always cortisol (which reacts to light, temperature, and fear) and insulin (which reacts to light and the food supply)." Our insulin and cortisol mechanisms always act in tandem in stressful situations such as mating, famine, or fear. Mating season, because of sexual competition and aggression, is a biologically stressful event.

Remember that mating season is, in nature, always summer, because the light creates food and food makes reproduction possible. In summer, your insulin is up from the abundance of carbohydrates and your cortisol is up from the extended daylight. When the long light of summer relays to your brain the signal "Eat sugar now and get fat enough to make it through winter," a simultaneous hormonal pathway says "Mate now, so your baby will come in the spring when there is more light and food." Anyone who watches Animal Planet on TV knows this about bears, fish, and penguins. It's true about humans, too.46-47

Thrifty nature uses the same "summer scenario" of hormones—insulin, cortisol, and testosterone—used in mating to control population density, too. When nature has to decrease the population by culling the herd with rising infertility and metabolic disease, we have the rise in diabetes and infertility we see now By 1960 this event had been one hundred years in the making.

The status of the food supply, in the form of carbohydrate energy, is always represented in the body by the "when" and "how much" of insulin. The food supply literally writes the story of human potential, since human life and its accomplishments, like being able to work and to be able to have children, are based on the availability of food to give you the energy and lat¬itude to do both. The way the food supply can change the outcome of the story is by controlling the "punctuation," in the form of enzymes."

Enzymes can cut pieces off of molecules like progesterone and turn them into testosterone, or turn testosterone into estrogen or DHT (dihy¬drotestoterone).46 That means that enzymes can change the meaning of a molecular, physiological, informational sentence—that is, a directive to brain and body—just like a well-placed comma.

The enzymes are controlled by insulin," the amount of which is a result of the quantity and abundance of carbohydrate energy, provide the fine-tuning on your sex hormones. Whether or not we mate is a result of whether or not there's enough food for that kind of energy expenditure. This is how it's done: in summer, the carbohydrates available boost insulin. Insulin not only stores the sugar as fat for winter, it also enhances the production of an enzyme called 21-hydroxy/ase5'.52—this enzyme converts a form of progesterone into cortisol under normal stress like fear or weather changes, episodic conditions of short duration. Extra cortisol helps us deal with the stress.

However, in the presence of prolonged insulin secretion, nature assumes that it's mating season." In other words, nature, or your body, reads pro¬longed high insulin (insulin resistance) as summer because in nature that's the only time it's that high for that long. By the end of summer, we should be fatter for winter and have a bun in the oven—be pregnant.

In response, at the requisite threshold, "stress," which is read as light and food insulin resistance (no insulin action), stops the production of 21- hydroxylase,54 and instead of adrenal progesterone converting to cortisol, it becomes testosterone,55 which you need to reproduce. Because the food supply (insulin) is the control on reproduction (testosterone), it is insulin that controls the choice between the production of cortisol or testosterone. This mechanism of testosterone can either enhance masculinity in females in utero or, if it's too intense, cause male hormone resistance and actually feminize men.56

All fetuses start out as female."' Then, at about nine weeks gestation, the Y chromosome turns what seem to be all girls into some boys. Boys have an X and Y, and girls have two Xs. However, the amount of testosterone (androgen) seasoning mom's womb can actually turn an XY boy into a girl by affecting hormone reception. and brain and body architecture in the baby.62 Even though the baby girl has not )(X, but XY lineage.

In extreme examples, the resulting male XY "female" child will look, act, and think like a girl. There's absolutely nothing to betray her Y chromosome, until her teens pass and her period never comes—because she has no uterus or ovaries, and has a "blind" vagina with small testicles high up in her abdomen. The testosterone from her tiny testes that, at week nine in utero, should have worked its male magic went unread by androgen receptors.

In cases like this, stress on mom," any kind of stress—physical, mental, or light and food—promotes testosterone and soaks her in high cortisol (which made her insulin-resistant by way of cortisol mobilizing blood sugar, and took away her 21-hydroxylase,64 which made her testosterone pour). Then, the ultrahigh androgens (testosterone) in mom make the baby boy's androgen receptors retreat." This leaves only receptors that can read estrogen, making the little boy forever feminine. In the same way that insulin receptors can retreat and cause insulin resistance—the insulin receptor becomes resistant to the attempt by insulin to get blood sugar into the cell—testosterone resistance can happen" the same way.
 
dugdeep, the book is well worth reading for the evolutionary biology perspective - and she sure describes a lot of what is going on with people/society etc, quite accurately and reasonably. I don't necessarily think that her solution is the ideal one, though it seems to work for many people. I think that we could do a LOT of straightening things out in a less drastic way than HRT though using plant based progesterone has been very helpful for everyone I know who has tried it. The important things to me were about insulin and the seasonal nature of stimulating the pancreas and the consequences of doing it year round.
 
The benefits of dealing with yeast overgrowth and removing lectins and food sensitivities has been significant and even miraculous. We do eat more meats and fats, and less sugar, but our diet is not low in carbs, even when we moderate fruit consumption.

Laura said:
I don't necessarily think that her solution is the ideal one, though it seems to work for many people. I think that we could do a LOT of straightening things out in a less drastic way than HRT though using plant based progesterone has been very helpful for everyone I know who has tried it. The important things to me were about insulin and the seasonal nature of stimulating the pancreas and the consequences of doing it year round.

It is surely an interesting reading, and cortisol is also added into this equation.

When I was in med school in Costa Rica, they were telling us that we had a higher percentage of diabetes in relation to the rest of the world. That was awhile ago and this might have changed. But some proposed that it was due to genetics that made people geared to tolerate what was available, tropical fruits. And when Western diet entered the picture, we developed diabetes. I don't know if there is something published in regards to this. I thought that was interesting, but even then, considering that the indigenous population was exterminated almost in its entirety...
 
dugdeep said:
Here's some of what I've learned from my last few months of research. Unfortunately, what I've learned disagrees with what you guys are saying. I didn't realize when I posted originally that it actually was the position of the network that a low-carb diet is the ideal if it's tolerated. Frankly, from all the recent research I've been doing, I think this is a big mistake.

Here you are wrong because our position is NOT a "low carb diet." We have plenty of carbs all day long, just NOT simple carbs, like sugar, including the sugars in fruit.

So, this is the first mistake.

You were here, you saw that we eat blinis every day, quinoa, LOTS of complex carbs in veggies, so that is by NO means a "low carb diet."

Using yourself, with no overt symptoms, as a yardstick is dangerous. Indeed, there are some people whose systems seem to be able to tolerate about anything, and there are also those who APPEAR to be able to tolerate anything, and then drop dead of sudden strokes or heart attacks one day with no - NO - warning symptoms.

Those people who have sensitivities and whose bodies do react in overt ways instead of hidden ways, are much better yardsticks for what may or may not be good for people in general, and this is something you need to think about a lot, especially since you are in the position of guiding people's diet choices. The fact is, the results are not yet in on YOUR system, just because you don't have any overt symptoms. As Wiley wrote:

When the cycling rhythm of "on and off" ceases, we can no longer handle germs, fatigue, and hot or cold weather; maintain our body temperature; or control our appetites under stress. We are beginning to die. Sometimes death can happen in as little as three years, or it can take as long as an agonizing twenty or thirty.

Our first criterion is DO NO HARM. We know from all the research (which includes that you have cited AND rebuttals to those studies) in addition to our personal experimentation. As I've pointed out, we have almost every blood type in the house here, and we have a nice selection of auto-immune conditions, plus we have several with no apparent symptoms of anything at all who did, it turns out, have symptoms only they were very disconnected and subtle and could only be sussed out over long periods of time. One individual in the house who has no apparent sensitivities at all found, after experimenting, that taking in simple carbs did only one thing: produced a feeling of intellectual irritability and self-importance. It was a small clue, but one worth following for further experiments. The conclusion, at the end, was that simple carbs were inflaming this individual in an unusual way.

In this world where, the latest reports tell us, almost 50% of the population will soon be classed as obese, i.e. insulin resistant, adrenal fatigued, and there are, additionally, 20 to 40 million - or more - individuals battling diagnosed auto-immune diseases (in the U.S. ALONE) that can be linked to insulin resistance and adrenal fatigue and more, it is careless in the extreme to take the position you have taken and could do a great deal of harm.
 
dugdeep said:
However, one of the consequences of low-carb dieting is an increasing inability to moderate blood sugar levels. You essentially become carb intolerant and the longer you stay low-carb, the worse it gets. It doesn't make sense that a normal healthy individual would have difficulty eating fruit. Although I speculated before that this may have something to do with biochemical individuality, specifically blood type, now I'm more inclined to think it has to do with faulty blood sugar metabolism caused by low-carb dieting.

Long-term, low-carb has the same effects as low calorie dieting - lowered metabolism and thus lowered thyroid function, insulin resistance - all the things I mentioned in the first post of this topic that stems from the body's response to perceived famine.

This is where I think you are wrong as well. I have never gone low-carb except for very rare occasions, and the longest I stayed on that diet was 8 days. We wouldn't call that long-term low-carb. And yet, I have problems if I eat too much fruit. I know it's the same for others here.

I imagine that since you left us, you must have cut out rice completely from your diet. It will be interesting to see what it does to you. I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but having met you in person, I do think that you look a little bit inflamed, even if you don't manifest any particular symptoms. Maybe it would be worth a try reducing your fruit intake and seeing what it does to you? In other words, perhaps you are ignoring some symptoms even in yourself, and that could be coloring your research, and hence, the advice you give to others.
 
Laura said:
Here you are wrong because our position is NOT a "low carb diet." We have plenty of carbs all day long, just NOT simple carbs, like sugar, including the sugars in fruit.

So, this is the first mistake.

You were here, you saw that we eat blinis every day, quinoa, LOTS of complex carbs in veggies, so that is by NO means a "low carb diet."

OK. I thought I'd seen some advice on the forum that indicated a low carb approach, but I could be mistaken. The article on SOTT was maybe colouring my perspective.


I imagine that since you left us, you must have cut out rice completely from your diet. It will be interesting to see what it does to you. I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but having met you in person, I do think that you look a little bit inflamed, even if you don't manifest any particular symptoms. Maybe it would be worth a try reducing your fruit intake and seeing what it does to you? In other words, perhaps you are ignoring some symptoms even in yourself, and that could be coloring your research, and hence, the advice you give to others.

Yes, my diet is now pretty much exactly what it was when I was with you guys. No more rice, no eggs; which were the only two things I had been holding on to. I'm starting to get some very slight belly issues, but it might be due to the xylitol or I may need to cut back on the duck fat a little. I'll play around with it a bit to see.

And it's not disrespectful to point out that I may be a bit inflamed. If anything it's helpful. I've put on weight over the last month because I've been on an overfeeding regimen lately in an attempt to get my metabolism on track and raise my body temperature. At least I think that's the reason for the weight gain. Nothing in my diet has changed except for lately eliminating rice, eggs and not eating in restaurants ever. I don't think anything else has changed in my life environmentally either. The weight gain accompanied the increase in food intake, as I expected it would, so I assumed that was the cause. Are there other symptoms of inflammation I'm not noticing?

But yes, I guess I should cut out the fruit to see what happens. I did a quick calculation and figured when I was making blinis I was getting about 560Kcal as fat and only 285Kcal as carb. I was using fruit as an easy starch to try to counteract that ratio a bit. But I'll try replacing this with something else to see what happens when I stop eating fruit (or at least sweet fruit. Do you think apples and berries would be OK, still?).

Anyway, I'm sorry guys. I thought I was being helpful but I think I was just coming across as a bit of a jerk. I really should have known - I was a bit too emotionally wrapped up in the whole thing. My apologies.
 
dugdeep said:
Laura said:
Here you are wrong because our position is NOT a "low carb diet." We have plenty of carbs all day long, just NOT simple carbs, like sugar, including the sugars in fruit.

So, this is the first mistake.

You were here, you saw that we eat blinis every day, quinoa, LOTS of complex carbs in veggies, so that is by NO means a "low carb diet."

OK. I thought I'd seen some advice on the forum that indicated a low carb approach, but I could be mistaken. The article on SOTT was maybe colouring my perspective.

There ARE situations where a low carb approach is appropriate, especially when the individual is in a state of hyperinsulinism. Unfortunately, a LOT of people are in that state and it comes with adrenal fatigue. Never forget that each individual is different and there is no "one size fits all" diet though, in general, eating meat, increasing fats, eating complex carbs and limiting simple carbs is the way to go for everyone. Each person may need adjustment and this has to be emphasized.

For example, those who tend toward IBS must not go too heavy on increasing the fats - even good fats - because their systems cannot handle it.

dugdeep said:
Laura]In this world where said:
My perspective on fruit came from the fact that we've been eating it throughout our evolution so I can't see it as being public enemy number one as far as modern disease is concerned.

Humans ate fruit SEASONALLY and the fruit they ate was quite different from what is produced today from hybridized plants and trees. This is an all-important bit of data!!!

dugdeep said:
That being said, people are obviously more sensitive to many foods these days that used to be tolerated fine so I guess I need to adjust my position on that one if you all are finding there's issues with it.

The causes of the problems are manifold and there is no simple solution except as described above; that is the safest diet advice. Eat meat, increase good fats including saturated animal fats that we evolved to eat; eat plenty of complex carbs in the form of veggies; avoid grains like the plague, and other seed foods; avoid dairy; and eat fruit sparingly.

Why? Because we swim in a sea of toxins and we need to eat in a way that optimizes our detoxing ability. There is no way we can avoid the toxicity in the air, water, foods, environment, and people are dying from it and dying because their detox system has been compromised by not only too many toxins, but also by lack of the proper systemic tools to deal with it.

dugdeep said:
My thought was that, because low-carb diets can lead to greater difficulty with blood sugar control,

Well, low carb diets are only useful in special situations. We don't advocate them though we certainly avoid simple carbs to a great extent. That is to say, in our normal circumstances, we may eat fruit two or three times a week, some of us more than that, some of us less, depending on how we react. Some of us have to go completely simple-carb free for periods of time to let the pancreas rest because it so easily goes into hyperinsulinism.

dugdeep said:
and that a high fat diet can easily slip into a low-carb diet,

Not around us. We highly recommend the fats, but part of the diet is to put the fats on your veggies!

dugdeep said:
that might have been what was going on here but I guess I was wrong. Sorry about that. I guess it came across as an accusation. Kind of a jerk move on my part.

What happened is that you read some book, got all worked up and forgot yourself.

dugdeep said:
Yes, my diet is now pretty much exactly what it was when I was with you guys. No more rice, no eggs; which were the only two things I had been holding on to.

I'm hoping to take eggs back in a few more months. It may be a hope in vain, but I sure love them. I don't think that rice will ever be acceptable to the system, however, for all the reasons we have learned in the past year or two.

dugdeep said:
I'm starting to get some very slight belly issues, but it might be due to the xylitol or I may need to cut back on the duck fat a little. I'll play around with it a bit to see.

It's more likely to be the fruit. One thing I have noticed with amazement is how belly fat diminishes rapidly when the person lets the pancreas and adrenals rest and increases fat which helps the adrenals.

dugdeep said:
And it's not disrespectful to point out that I may be a bit inflamed. If anything it's helpful. I've put on weight over the last month because I've been on an overfeeding regimen lately in an attempt to get my metabolism on track and raise my body temperature. At least I think that's the reason for the weight gain. Nothing in my diet has changed except for lately eliminating rice, eggs and not eating in restaurants ever. I don't think anything else has changed in my life environmentally either. The weight gain accompanied the increase in food intake, as I expected it would, so I assumed that was the cause. Are there other symptoms of inflammation I'm not noticing?

Try cutting out the fruit and getting all your carbs from veggies and sweet potatoes, with lots of ghee on them.

dugdeep said:
But yes, I guess I should cut out the fruit to see what happens. I did a quick calculation and figured when I was making blinis I was getting about 560Kcal as fat and only 285Kcal as carb. I was using fruit as an easy starch to try to counteract that ratio a bit. But I'll try replacing this with something else to see what happens when I stop eating fruit (or at least sweet fruit. Do you think apples and berries would be OK, still?).

For the experiment, eliminate apples, but berries are okay. Forget about calories. Forget about ratios. Eat a piece of meat and eat veggies that are twice the size of the meat. Eat veggies for breakfast with your ham and blinis. A nice bowl of green beans or broccoli, steamed, is great with bacon and blinis!

dugdeep said:
Anyway, I'm sorry guys. I thought I was being helpful but I think I was just coming across as a bit of a jerk. I really should have known - I was a bit too emotionally wrapped up in the whole thing. My apologies.

A sign of inflammation, I think. You just experiment a bit as suggested and the facts will make themselves plain. It may take a little adjusting, you may need a bit less fat, but definitely, cut out the fruit for awhile and let the pancreas and adrenals rest.

I just LOVE sweet potatoes in the morning, fried until they caramelize, on a blini, with ham or bacon...
 
OK, thanks for your patience, Laura. I've added Wiley's book to my Amazon wish list.
 
dugdeep, thank for talking about your views, this way we all learn something we didnt know before :)

i found this passage interesting
The major "hormonal players" activated in the individuals of the group during any of these possible stresses are always cortisol (which reacts to light, temperature, and fear) and insulin (which reacts to light and the food supply)." Our insulin and cortisol mechanisms always act in tandem in stressful situations such as mating, famine, or fear. Mating season, because of sexual competition and aggression, is a biologically stressful event.

so the author says the major players insulin and cortisol are affected by a combination of light, temperature, and fear. The bit about Nature trying to cull the population by increasing metabolic syndrome is very interesting.

One question though: I'm thinking of ancient life in the equatorial regions, where there are no major seasons to speak of, and there is quite a lot of light, and temperature all year around. this would mean that there would be lots of natural food almost all year round that can keep insulin levels elevated. would this mean that ancient people in the equatorial regions ate more, procreate more, and eventually nature would take its course and 'cull the herd' by the population dying gradually from metabolic syndrome?

Was just thinking this after noticing the importance of seasons to the theory. probably there is something i have overlooked, i'll read it again. but this book's definitely on my 'to order' list!
 

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