NASA Satellite Finds Earth's Clouds are Getting Lower

[Avala]

Don't know if someone posted this yet, but its interesting.

http://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/misr20120221.html

Earth's clouds got a little lower -- about one percent on average -- during the first decade of this century, finds a new NASA-funded university study based on NASA satellite data. The results have potential implications for future global climate.

Scientists at the University of Auckland in New Zealand analyzed the first 10 years of global cloud-top height measurements (from March 2000 to February 2010) from the Multi-angle Imaging SpectroRadiometer (MISR) instrument on NASA's Terra spacecraft. The study, published recently in the journal Geophysical Research Letters, revealed an overall trend of decreasing cloud height. Global average cloud height declined by around one percent over the decade, or by around 100 to 130 feet (30 to 40 meters). Most of the reduction was due to fewer clouds occurring at very high altitudes.

Lead researcher Roger Davies said that while the record is too short to be definitive, it provides a hint that something quite important might be going on. Longer-term monitoring will be required to determine the significance of the observation for global temperatures.

A consistent reduction in cloud height would allow Earth to cool to space more efficiently, reducing the surface temperature of the planet and potentially slowing the effects of global warming. This may represent a "negative feedback" mechanism – a change caused by global warming that works to counteract it. "We don't know exactly what causes the cloud heights to lower," says Davies. "But it must be due to a change in the circulation patterns that give rise to cloud formation at high altitude."

and more . . .

[venusian]

There is an article on SOTT today about this:

https://www.sott.net/articles/show/241913-ENASA-Satellite-Finds-Earth-s-Clouds-are-Getting-Lower

It is interesting. I hope someone with a grasp of what is involved will make public more information on the implications. It does seem to be pointing in the direction toward potential ice age, rather than in the opposite direction.

[Yozilla]

"We don't know exactly what causes the cloud heights to lower,"

Maybe because clouds are "heavier" due to acquiring more and more precipitation "potential"...

[Laura]

I've been writing about this for awhile as the reason there are more contrails.  It is certainly gratifying to know that my little theory is correct.  And yes, as the article says, it seems to be indicative of something very important, but they don't know what...

[Windmill knight]

Global average cloud height declined by around one percent over the decade, or by around 100 to 130 feet (30 to 40 meters). Most of the reduction was due to fewer clouds occurring at very high altitudes.

Funny, in other words the clouds are lower because they are not higher! 

A consistent reduction in cloud height would allow Earth to cool to space more efficiently, reducing the surface temperature of the planet and potentially slowing the effects of global warming. This may represent a "negative feedback" mechanism – a change caused by global warming that works to counteract it. "We don't know exactly what causes the cloud heights to lower," says Davies. "But it must be due to a change in the circulation patterns that give rise to cloud formation at high altitude."

Oh I see! If there are indications to believe Earth is heathing or might be heating, then that proves global warming. But if there are indications of cooling now or in the near future, then that's caused by global warming too (although the guy explicitly says they don't know what's causing the clouds to lower); and it's also good news because that will ameloriate global warming! Gotta love the Wonderland logic of scientists who start with conclusions and then fix the data around it. 

Anyway, I do think this is very big and significant news, most likely a sign that the atmosphere is indeed cooling as a prelude to an ice-age.

[bngenoh]

This:

A consistent reduction in cloud height would allow Earth to cool to space more efficiently, reducing the surface temperature of the planet and potentially slowing the effects of global warming. This may represent a "negative feedback" mechanism – a change caused by global warming that works to counteract it. "We don't know exactly what causes the cloud heights to lower," says Davies. "But it must be due to a change in the circulation patterns that give rise to cloud formation at high altitude."

Struck me, because it's basically saying what was said in https://www.sott.net/articles/show/237356-The-Cs-Hit-List-02-Space-and-Weather-Science-Gone-Wild which btw was awesome. It also brought to mind these snips from the sessions:

Q:  You also made a remark once that ice ages occur much, much faster than people ever thought...
A:  Yes.

Q:  Do we need to invest in some mukluks and snowshoes?
A:  ??

Q:  Well, what I am trying to get at is: should we start stockpiling firewood?
A:  Maybe.

Q:  So, it could be that fast?
A:  Oh yes, and faster when in response to global" warming."

Q:  When you put "warming" in quotes, you obviously mean warming in more than just an ordinary sense?  Is that correct?
A:  And/or not really "warm." 

And:

Q: Why was the sea level several hundred feet lower? Because there was ice somewhere or because there was not as much water on the earth at that time?
A: Ice.

Q: Was the ice piled up at the poles? The ice sheet of the ice age?
A: Yes.

Q: So, Atlantis existed during the ice age?
A: Largely, yes. And the world's climate was scarcely any colder away from the ice sheets than it is today.

Q: Well, how could that be? What caused these glaciers?
A: Global warming.

Q: How does global warming cause glaciers?
A: Increases precipitation dramatically. Then moves the belt of great precipitation much farther north. This causes rapid buildup of ice sheets, followed by increasingly rapid and intense glacial rebound.

[JayMark]

I have seen an article saying that the high-atmosphere's temperature is decreasing. I can't remember where I saw that though. I think it might have been the NASA.

Cold air is dryer than hot air so it might be one of the reason. Question would be why?

[Soluna]

I suppose 'Global Warming' has two meanings =) The literal and the name tag applied to the theory. If I recall correctly - doesn't the periodic 'warming' cause the cooling? Due to the ice deposits melting, and reducing the salinity of the oceans, which interferes with currents and also makes the less salty oceans freeze more easily? In very simple terms!


I bet convincing humanity that THEY were the CAUSE of an Ice Age (via 'causing' global warming), would generate a huge amount of guilt on top of the fear and more practical difficulties!

[JayMark]

I suppose 'Global Warming' has two meanings =) The literal and the name tag applied to the theory. If I recall correctly - doesn't the periodic 'warming' cause the cooling? Due to the ice deposits melting, and reducing the salinity of the oceans, which interferes with currents and also makes the less salty oceans freeze more easily? In very simple terms!


I bet convincing humanity that THEY were the CAUSE of an Ice Age (via 'causing' global warming), would generate a huge amount of guilt on top of the fear and more practical difficulties!

What you are talking about is a disturbance/collapse of water currents. That can have a major impact on heat/humidity distribution. Now could that alone provoke a glacial rebound? Maybe, but I'm not sure.

But here what is important to consider is that if indeed our axis is slowly shifting, that alone could provoke a major drop in T° at least in some area(s) which then could suffer from drastic precipitation as a result of increasing air water content due to the current 'warming'.

If that was to happen, the accumulation of ice/snow on a large area could instantly decrease the radiation forcing of the earth and possibly lead us (very quickly) to a new ice age, just like a snowball (appropriate word) effect.

Si in résumé, current 'warming' could be viewed as a potential catalyst for potential glacial rebound.

OSIT

Peace.

[Nienna]

I suppose 'Global Warming' has two meanings =) The literal and the name tag applied to the theory. If I recall correctly - doesn't the periodic 'warming' cause the cooling? Due to the ice deposits melting, and reducing the salinity of the oceans, which interferes with currents and also makes the less salty oceans freeze more easily? In very simple terms!


I bet convincing humanity that THEY were the CAUSE of an Ice Age (via 'causing' global warming), would generate a huge amount of guilt on top of the fear and more practical difficulties!

What you are talking about is a disturbance/collapse of water currents. That can have a major impact on heat/humidity distribution. Now could that alone provoke a glacial rebound? Maybe, but I'm not sure.

But here what is important to consider is that if indeed our axis is slowly shifting, that alone could provoke a major drop in T° at least in some area(s) which then could suffer from drastic precipitation as a result of increasing air water content due to the current 'warming'.

If that was to happen, the accumulation of ice/snow on a large area could instantly decrease the radiation forcing of the earth and possibly lead us (very quickly) to a new ice age, just like a snowball (appropriate word) effect.

Si in résumé, current 'warming' could be viewed as a potential catalyst for potential glacial rebound.

OSIT

Peace.

Have you read Laura's article Fire and Ice: The Day After Tomorrow?

If not, you may find it interesting.

[Soluna]

Thank you for the link =) that helps make much more sense of things.

[JayMark]

I suppose 'Global Warming' has two meanings =) The literal and the name tag applied to the theory. If I recall correctly - doesn't the periodic 'warming' cause the cooling? Due to the ice deposits melting, and reducing the salinity of the oceans, which interferes with currents and also makes the less salty oceans freeze more easily? In very simple terms!


I bet convincing humanity that THEY were the CAUSE of an Ice Age (via 'causing' global warming), would generate a huge amount of guilt on top of the fear and more practical difficulties!

What you are talking about is a disturbance/collapse of water currents. That can have a major impact on heat/humidity distribution. Now could that alone provoke a glacial rebound? Maybe, but I'm not sure.

But here what is important to consider is that if indeed our axis is slowly shifting, that alone could provoke a major drop in T° at least in some area(s) which then could suffer from drastic precipitation as a result of increasing air water content due to the current 'warming'.

If that was to happen, the accumulation of ice/snow on a large area could instantly decrease the radiation forcing of the earth and possibly lead us (very quickly) to a new ice age, just like a snowball (appropriate word) effect.

Si in résumé, current 'warming' could be viewed as a potential catalyst for potential glacial rebound.

OSIT

Peace.

Have you read Laura's article Fire and Ice: The Day After Tomorrow?

If not, you may find it interesting.

Excellent!

I'll read it in details when I havetime.

Might clear things up for me as well!

Thanks.