Author Topic: 16th century comet sketches  (Read 1804 times)

Offline jupiterbeings

  • Padawan Learner
  • ***
  • Posts: 61
16th century comet sketches
« on: October 12, 2013, 01:34:39 PM »
Nice collection of comet sketches from the 16th century.

http://bibliodyssey.blogspot.co.uk/2013/09/comet-sketches.html

Not sure what section to post this in so if any moderator wants to move it......
'The Mystery of life is not a problem to be solved but a reality to be experienced'

Offline Gaby

  • Ambassador
  • ********
  • Posts: 4,930
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2013, 01:46:23 PM »
Those are pretty!
To love is to seek knowledge of the beloved. To know is to love. "For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. And now abideth faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love." 1 Corinthians 13:12-13. [Through a Glass Darkly: Hidden Masters, Secret Agendas and a Tradition Unveiled (The Wave or Adventures with Cassiopaea, Volume 4)]

Offline Michael BC

  • Padawan Learner
  • ***
  • Posts: 88
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2013, 03:13:42 PM »
What fascinating, informative images they are. Thank you Jupiterbeings.

Very much in line with Laura’s unearthing along with Cube and Napier’s descriptions and those of ancient Chinese comet watchers (I particularly like the sword in the sky image; Excalibur revealed!). Also the first image is very reminiscent of the rotating comet fragments filmed in various locations of late only to be passed off as failed rocket tests by the ptb! Brings to mind the whirling three handed symbol of the Isle of Mann - again clearly comet God iconography. Very interesting that the skies are repeatedly painted with low red clouds, obviously laden with comet dust. Other interesting details are corkscrewing snake/wyrm and hidden armies marching upon cloud tops! The grim reaper and all his attendants return with the tearing of the veil! Also what could be a very interesting depiction of the sun occulted.

Has anyone heard of 'Liber de Significatione Cometarum' before? I assume an English translation is highly unlikely. Could provide some missing links for Laura in terms of lost knowledge from the classical era.

Can any linguists translate any of the captions?

Shocking editorial comment though by the blogger. In a nutshell explains why modern man is in such trouble; first we have complete ignorance of the true (electrical) nature of comets, the part they play in bringing death and destruction to the earth (via plague virus in their dust) and their complex and mysterious interaction with human psyche, in particular the righting of imbalance when Pschopathy comes too much to the fore. This ignorance is then compounded by the authoritarian follower type mindset and attendant dismissive arrogance of the modern mind when faced with ancient knowledge that contradicts the mechanical nature of the standard model. Truly blind ignorance. 

Offline Endymion

  • The Living Force
  • ********
  • Posts: 1,877
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2013, 05:04:17 PM »
Thanks for posting this link, jupiterbeings. Beautiful and fascinating works of art.

Quote from: Michael BC
Shocking editorial comment though by the blogger.

Indeed.

Quote from: BibliOdyssey
In general, people held superstitious beliefs about comets and were convinced that they were bad omens and associated with the forces of dark magic or a sign of punishment to come from displeased Gods. Comets 'announced' that war, famine, pestilence and other consequences of sinful behaviour were on their way. This kind of religious punishment explanation of comets persisted up until the 16th and 17th centuries in Europe, when the speculative literature (and illustrations!) gave way, over time, to a more scientific appreciation of the phenomena.

Knowledge of comets' effects dismissed as 'superstition'! An example of the blindness caused by the triumph of 'progress' and the 'rational mind'.

The whole book is available online here.
He who goes slow goes far.
Georges Ivanovich Gurdjieff

Reality is under no obligation to conform to our beliefs.
Endymion

Ignorance is not a capital crime. It is a correctable condition.
Laura Knight-Jadczyk

Offline ametist

  • Jedi Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 266
  • RTTLTHBSHS
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2013, 02:08:16 PM »
Thank you sooo much for this post, Jupiterbeings!

I was just working on my dissertation, which is based around historical comet depictions and their interpretation.
This opened up a whole array of resources I probably wouldn't come across otherwise.
Right in time! Big thanks!


Offline jupiterbeings

  • Padawan Learner
  • ***
  • Posts: 61
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2013, 02:51:40 PM »
No problem Ametist..Hope you do well!
'The Mystery of life is not a problem to be solved but a reality to be experienced'

Offline Mal7

  • Jedi Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 495
    • Renaissance Books
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2013, 05:54:15 AM »
Has anyone heard of 'Liber de Significatione Cometarum' before? I assume an English translation is highly unlikely. Could provide some missing links for Laura in terms of lost knowledge from the classical era.

I did some googling and the original Latin text of the Spanish c.1238 work "Liber de Significatione Cometarum" seems to be reproduced on pages 16-61 of the following book, probably with an introduction in English (I haven't seen the book itself):

Latin Treatises on Comets between 1238 and 1638 A.D. edited by Lynn Thorndike. Published Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1950.

Offline Michael BC

  • Padawan Learner
  • ***
  • Posts: 88
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2013, 11:06:31 AM »
Thanks for that Mal7. Interesting starting date for the book - 1238 - just prior to the outbreak of the Black Death/plague in early 1300s.

Offline Dirgni

  • Jedi Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 371
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2013, 08:12:59 PM »
Thank you very much for this collection jupiterbeings. The sketches are very interesting.
The "Etoiles courants" look a little like contrails. I don't know the physics but it makes me wonder if contrails could be caused by "comens etc."?
During the last few months I saw a lot of very orange / reddish sunsets and sunrises. They were similar to the orange/red skies in the comet sketches...

When I saw these pictures I was reminded of an water colour of Albrecht Dürer - Traumgesicht (dream vision). When I searched for I found that he also made a couple of pictures with unusual things falling from the sky (e.g. comets, stones) or symbols I connect with these.



Traumgesicht (dream vision) - This picture is depicting a dream with a huge lot of water falling down (sheets of rain?).
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Traumgesicht_%28D%C3%BCrer%29.jpg

Text below (German):
"Im 1525 Jor nach dem pfinxstag zwischen dem Mitwoch und pfintzdag in der nacht im schlaff hab ich dis gesicht gesehen wy fill großer wassern vom himmell fillen Und das erst traff das erthrich ungefehr 4 meill fan mir mit einer solchen grausamkeitt mit einem ubergroßem raüschn und zersprützn und ertrenckett das gantz lant In solchem erschrack ich so gar schwerlich das ich doran erwachett e dan dy andern wasser filn Und dy wasser dy do filn dy warn fast gros [=sehr groß, H.B.] und der fill ettliche weit etliche neher und sy kamen so hoch herab das sy im gedancken gleich langsam filn [= scheinbar gleichmäißg langsam fielen]. aber do das erst wasser das das ertrich traff schie herbey kam do fill es mit einer solchen geschwindigkeit wy{n}t [=mit Wind] und braüsen das und ich also erschrack do ich erwacht das mir all mein leichnam [=Körper] zittrete und lang nit recht zu mir selbs kam Aber do ich am morgen auff stund molet ich hy oben wy ichs gesehen het. Got wende alle ding zu{m} besten.
Albrecht Dürer"


Text below (English Translation):
`In 1525, during the night between Wednesday and Thursday after Whitsuntide, I had this vision in my sleep, and saw how many great waters fell from heaven. The first struck the ground about four miles away from me with such a terrible force, enormous noise and splashing that it drowned the entire countryside. I was so greatly shocked at this that I awoke before the cloudburst. And the ensuing downpour was huge. Some of the waters fell some distance away and some close by. And they came from such a height that they seemed to fall at an equally slow pace. But the very first water that hit the ground so suddenly had fallen at such velocity, and was accompanied by wind and roaring so frightening, that when I awoke my whole body trembled and I could not recover for a long time. When I arose in the morning, I painted the above as I had seen it. May the Lord turn all things to the best.
Albrecht Dürer'



Melancholia I - There is a comet in the upper left corner.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:D%C3%BCrer_Melancholia_I.jpg


Witch Riding Backwards On A Goat - Something like stonesfalling from above  in the upper left corner.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Die_Hexe_%28Albrecht_D%C3%BCrer%29.jpg


Heller Altarpiece - Something like stones falling out of a "cloud".
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Albrecht_D%C3%BCrer_039.jpg


Loth´s Flucht (Loth´s Flight) - City burning in the background and something falling down.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Albrecht_D%C3%BCrer_054.jpg


The Revelation of St John: 5. Opening the Fifth and Sixth Seals - Fire rains from above.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Durer,_apocalisse,_05_quinta_e_setsa_piaga.jpg


The Revelation of St John: 3. St John and the Twenty-four Elders in Heaven - Someting very pointed coming out of clouds.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Durer,_apocalisse,_03_ventiquattro_vecchi.jpg


The Last Judgment - A sword pointing to Jesus' head, two angels with "trumpets", a man-eating dragon in the right hand lower corner...
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:D%C3%BCrer_-_Das_j%C3%BCngste_Gericht.jpg


The Revelation of St John: 8. The Battle of the Angels - Dragons or lions in the sky breathing something like fire.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:D%C3%BCrer_-_Der_Engelkampf.jpg




Albrecht Dürer 21 May 1471 – 6 April 1528) was a German painter, engraver, printmaker, mathematician, and theorist from Nuremberg. He lived during the dark ages when there was black death in Europe. For me he seem to depict what he has seen sometime.

Offline Laurelayn

  • Padawan Learner
  • ***
  • Posts: 74
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2013, 10:14:06 PM »
Wow, that first image on that site strongly resembles the picture of Comet C/2012 X1 (LINEAR) that is on the spaceweather front page right now
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7411/9665902698_28e9ccf65e_c.jpg
16th century comet sketches



http://0e33611cb8e6da737d5c-e13b5a910e105e07f9070866adaae10b.r15.cf1.rackcdn.com/Nick-James-2012x1_20131026_0500_ndj_1382766417.jpg
16th century comet sketches
The most successful tyranny is not the one that uses force to assure uniformity but the one that removes the awareness of other possibilities, that makes it seem inconceivable that other ways are viable, that removes the sense that there is an outside.
Allan Bloom; The Closing of the American Mind

Offline jupiterbeings

  • Padawan Learner
  • ***
  • Posts: 61
Re: 16th century comet sketches
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2013, 11:18:37 PM »
Interesting pictures from antiquity there Dirgni. And Laurelayn, that is extremely interesting. That looks uncanningly similar to comet linear....wow too!
'The Mystery of life is not a problem to be solved but a reality to be experienced'