Negro ?

truth seeker said:
Kios said:
It felt like a slap in the face so "Aouch, ok, bybye for this subject - i'm done anyway since I learned through the first answer"

I made it short in order to limit any noise. Now, I have to say, I'm glad I posted because I learn a few extra things over english vocabulary - which I really need to work on because I only speak it now and the writing became a disaster : :-[

Thank you :)
Got it.

I'm glad you posted it too! It was pretty brave of you because these conversations can be difficult but are still important. I apologize for any misunderstanding on my part. :flowers:
:hug:
 
Paddyjohn said:
Odyssey said:
truth seeker said:
I agree that the term was probably not racist. Even if it was written in English and in the context that African American's usually understand it in, I don't take offense to it because imo, it's the truth. In my current understanding something that's racist is usually based on or wrapped in a lie, regardless of who says it.

True, but in this politically correct, lie loving, hystericised world there are loads of people who would see it as racist. IMO, the article is just calling a spade a spade.


The term 'spade' is one of the most established and widely used derogatory racist terms in the UK - especially London. For a split second I thought you were making an inappropriate 'joke.'


Obviously you weren't but I thought I would flag this up for you as new visitors to the forum may misinterpret your post.


Spade a black person, recorded since 1928 OED), from the playing cards suit.

_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_slurs#S

No, I didn't intend it as a joke. I did realize that it could be interpreted that way only after I posted it. :halo: I don't hear the word spade being used much here in the US anymore as a derogatory term for blacks. But back to the original post, I think the article was simply calling out Obama for what he is, at least on the surface. We all know that he is a psychopath which supercedes race in any case.
 
Odyssey said:
Paddyjohn said:
Odyssey said:
truth seeker said:
I agree that the term was probably not racist. Even if it was written in English and in the context that African American's usually understand it in, I don't take offense to it because imo, it's the truth. In my current understanding something that's racist is usually based on or wrapped in a lie, regardless of who says it.

True, but in this politically correct, lie loving, hystericised world there are loads of people who would see it as racist. IMO, the article is just calling a spade a spade.


The term 'spade' is one of the most established and widely used derogatory racist terms in the UK - especially London. For a split second I thought you were making an inappropriate 'joke.'


Obviously you weren't but I thought I would flag this up for you as new visitors to the forum may misinterpret your post.


Spade a black person, recorded since 1928 OED), from the playing cards suit.

_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_slurs#S

No, I didn't intend it as a joke. I did realize that it could be interpreted that way only after I posted it. :halo: I don't hear the word spade being used much here in the US anymore as a derogatory term for blacks. […]

My first reaction was huh? Then I realized it was just one of those things and shouldn't be taken in the way it first appeared. I assumed that you would realize the possible interpretation afterwards too, at least no one became accusatory. :)

For what it's worth, the derogatory term I've heard more than any other in London is "black *#@!." In my experience, that last word is incredibly overused (especially with cockneys - not saying it's a cockney thing you understand) within the "flow" of speech of cockneys (and others) and not everyone will perceive this if unfamiliar. Slightly off-topic here, but this kind of illustrates the difficulties for non-brits. (even brits to some degree LOL) http://dialectblog.com/british-accents/ especially the last 3 points in the features section for cockney.
 
Ascien said:
Odyssey said:
Paddyjohn said:
Odyssey said:
truth seeker said:
I agree that the term was probably not racist. Even if it was written in English and in the context that African American's usually understand it in, I don't take offense to it because imo, it's the truth. In my current understanding something that's racist is usually based on or wrapped in a lie, regardless of who says it.

True, but in this politically correct, lie loving, hystericised world there are loads of people who would see it as racist. IMO, the article is just calling a spade a spade.


The term 'spade' is one of the most established and widely used derogatory racist terms in the UK - especially London. For a split second I thought you were making an inappropriate 'joke.'


Obviously you weren't but I thought I would flag this up for you as new visitors to the forum may misinterpret your post.


Spade a black person, recorded since 1928 OED), from the playing cards suit.

_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_slurs#S

No, I didn't intend it as a joke. I did realize that it could be interpreted that way only after I posted it. :halo: I don't hear the word spade being used much here in the US anymore as a derogatory term for blacks. […]

My first reaction was huh? Then I realized it was just one of those things and shouldn't be taken in the way it first appeared. I assumed that you would realize the possible interpretation afterwards too, at least no one became accusatory. :)

For what it's worth, the derogatory term I've heard more than any other in London is "black *#@!." In my experience, that last word is incredibly overused (especially with cockneys - not saying it's a cockney thing you understand) within the "flow" of speech of cockneys (and others) and not everyone will perceive this if unfamiliar. Slightly off-topic here, but this kind of illustrates the difficulties for non-brits. (even brits to some degree LOL) http://dialectblog.com/british-accents/ especially the last 3 points in the features section for cockney.


Yes, that two-word derogatory phrase is the most common one used in London and other UK areas, Ascien.


You made an interesting point about nobody became accusatory. More and more of that is happening in the world, or so I perceive. It is easy, in this ponerized system, for those enmeshed in it to 'score points' by jumping on others with charges of racism (just like anti-semitism) - even when it is fully clear that there is no racism involved.


I watched FIFA's Sepp Blatter bring the race card into the corruption furore over Qatar being selected as the host for a future world cup. Blatter mentioned racism in relation to it yesterday. He is using a political tool - if the accusations are thought to be racist then its quite possible that the whole corruption issue will be distorted and diverted. Those responsible for doing dodgy deals will be forgotten. And Blatter will be hailed as an anti-racist, and rather than being implicated in criminal activities, will be hailed a hero and have his position as head of FIFA endorsed and extended.


Shouting 'racist!' nowadays is a very powerful political tool.
 
Shouting 'racist!' nowadays is a very powerful political tool.

Also, if prejudice is simply a tool to suppress others based on their traits, the suppression by a small minority on the majority based on the majority not having the "I want to rule the world" trait, doesn't even have a term. At least none I'm familiar with. Although there's terms for other forms of prejudice that I would say are less pervasive by comparison: racism, sexism, antisemiticism etc.
 
Paddyjohn said:
You made an interesting point about nobody became accusatory. More and more of that is happening in the world, or so I perceive. It is easy, in this ponerized system, for those enmeshed in it to 'score points' by jumping on others with charges of racism (just like anti-semitism) - even when it is fully clear that there is no racism involved.

I still detest this but now I tend to roll my eyes or sigh when I hear the charge rear it's head.

Paddyjohn said:
I watched FIFA's Sepp Blatter bring the race card into the corruption furore over Qatar being selected as the host for a future world cup. Blatter mentioned racism in relation to it yesterday. He is using a political tool - if the accusations are thought to be racist then its quite possible that the whole corruption issue will be distorted and diverted. Those responsible for doing dodgy deals will be forgotten. And Blatter will be hailed as an anti-racist, and rather than being implicated in criminal activities, will be hailed a hero and have his position as head of FIFA endorsed and extended.

This grubby little man has more lives than Silvio Berlusconi, which takes some doing. The corruption in Fifa has never been more blatant than under his tenure. I was thinking what category within the political ponerology framework he would fall under and I think it's "spellbinder." I'm inserting this as I think it's important that such a well known figure as Josepp Blatter (especially as football/soccer encompasses, basically everywhere) should be seen exactly as he is; what he and his ilk do not want others to ascertain. Again slightly off-topic (which will be my last on this thread) and I am not trying to hijack this thread, P.P. is always worth quoting whenever the context is appropriate and I think it is here. This quote (and its a bit long) captures the views of regular people, the media (especially the written press - tend to call 'em "hacks" - football journalists) the pathological agenda of of those spreading this contagion, and all associations. Of course this is beyond "the beautiful game"...

Political Ponerology p.121-123 said:
Spellbinders are characterized by pathological egotism. Such a person is forced by some internal causes to make an early choice between two possibilities: the first is forcing other people to think and experience things in a manner similar to his own; the second is a feeling of being lonely and different, a pathological misfit in social life. Sometimes the choice is either snake-charming or suicide.

Triumphant repression of self-critical or unpleasant concepts from the field of consciousness gradually gives rise to the above-mentioned phenomena of conversion thinking, or paralogistics, paramoralisms, and the use of reversion blockades. They wind up streaming so profusely that they flood the average person’s mind. Everything becomes subordinated to their over-compensatory conviction that they are exceptional, sometimes even messianic. An ideology emerges, true in part, whose value is supposedly superior. However, if we analyze the exact functions of such an ideology in the spellbinder’s personality, we perceive that it is a means of self-charming, useful for repressing those tormenting self-critical associations into the subconscious. This ideology’s instrumental role in influencing other people also serves the spellbinder’s needs. [...]

The spellbinder places on a high moral plane anyone who has succumbed to his influence and incorporated the experiential method he imposes. He showers such people with attention and property, if possible.{if you know anything about Blatter, you'll know this is his "trademark." Money, high-sounding titles, hotels , all-expenses paid this that and the other} Critics are met with “moral outrage."{paramoralisms are no big deal for a shameless "feck" like him. Honestly, read the article of his latest remarks that Paddyjohn referred to, I'll put the link at the end.} It can even be proclaimed that the compliant minority is in fact the moral majority (Bolsheviks), since it professes the best ideology and honors a leader whose qualities are above average.

Such activity is always necessarily characterized by the inability to foresee its final results, something obvious from the psychological point of view, because its substratum contains pathological phenomena, and both spellbinding and self-charming make it impossible to perceive reality accurately enough to foresee results logically. However, spellbinders nurture great optimism and harbor visions of future triumphs similar to those they enjoyed over their own crippled souls. ...{wishful thinking, "STS cannot conceive of losing" etc}

In a healthy society, the activities of spellbinders meet with criticism effective enough to stifle them quickly. However, when they are preceded by conditions operating destructively upon common sense and social order; such as social injustice, cultural backwardness, or intellectually limited rulers sometimes manifesting pathological traits, spellbinders’ activities have led entire societies into large-scale human tragedy. [...]

Such an individual fishes an environment or society for people amenable to his influence, deepening their psychological weaknesses until they finally join together in a ponerogenic union. On the other hand, people who have maintained their healthy critical faculties intact, based upon their own common sense and moral criteria, attempt to counteract the spellbinders’ activities and their results. In the resulting polarization of social attitudes, each side justifies itself by means of moral categories. That is why such commonsense resistance is always accompanied by some feeling of helplessness and deficiency of criteria.{anyone who knows the game and its schizophrenic tribalism will/should be aware of the perennial commentary of the on-field action and less so, the off-field i.e. "the halls of power." Blah blah, "they've done this, they're ruining the game.. but we can't do anything." Words to that effect with a lot of cussing and with a lack of proper criteria, the same-old conversations occur. It's really quite dizzying.} The awareness that a spellbinder is always a pathological individual should protect us from the known results of a moralizing interpretation of pathological phenomena, ensuring us an objective criteria for more effective action. Explaining what kind of pathological substratum is hidden behind a given instance of spellbinding activities should enable a modern solution to such situations. ...

We shall give the name "ponerogenic association" to any group of people characterized by ponerogenic processes of above-average social intensity, wherein the carriers of various pathological factors function as inspirers, spellbinders, and leaders, and where a proper pathological social structure generates. Smaller, less permanent associations may be called "groups" or "unions" . Such an association gives birth to evil which hurts other people as well as its own members. ...

Such unions frequently aspire to political power in order to impose their expedient legislation upon societies in the name of a suitably prepared ideology, deriving advantages in the form of disproportionate prosperity and the satisfaction of their craving for power. ...{Fifa in a nutshell!}

One phenomenon all ponerogenic groups and associations have in common is the fact that their members lose (or have already lost) the capacity to perceive pathological individuals as such, interpreting their behavior in a fascinated, heroic, or melodramatic way. The opinions, ideas, and judgments of people carrying various psychological deficits are endowed with an importance at least equal to that of outstanding individuals among normal people. The atrophy of natural critical faculties with respect to pathological individuals becomes an opening to their activities, and, at the same time, a criterion for recognizing the association in concern as ponerogenic. Let us call this the first criterion of ponerogenesis.

Another phenomenon all ponerogenic associations have in common is their statistically high concentration of individuals with various psychological anomalies. ...

Groups dominated by various kinds of characteropathic individuals will develop relatively primitive activities, proving rather easy for a society of normal people to break. Things are different when such unions are inspired by psychopathic individuals.

And here, for any interested parties, is the president of the world governing body for football, "doing his thang"... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/worldcup2014/article-2653335/Sepp-Blatter-calls-British-media-racists-World-Cup-corruption-scandal-engulfs-FIFA.html

Which is a tiny portion of what he's said and done since... heck, the 1990s or so. A patho-political organization is what this Fifa government are, and so is its "rival" UEFA (a sub-structure within) the European version. I've stopped telling football fans (yeah I know, fanatics) about the money trails into, and out of Fifa (and ever-growing within UEFA now) because their eyes glaze over. Basically modern football/soccer is a mirror of, and a window into the operations of the global pathocracy. I'd argue that it's more obvious in the sporting microcosm than trying to discern the activities of the non-sporting politicking. For most people, it's equivalent to a "glimpse of (Castaneda) the eagle." (whatever that meant) you look at it and you go mad..or die.
 
This post became for me an excellent lesson in idioms. I have now expanded my vocabulary which is always good. As for the article, it seems clear to me that the derogatory term was of course used intentionally BUT NOT as a racial slur. Thanks everybody. :D
 
I can understand your upset, Kios, but if you really think about it, racism, sexism and homophobia (whether it manifests via oneself or others) seems to be a yet another form of trauma that results in cognitive dissonance for many. People believe the pathological lies told to them and unfortunately when someone attempts to tell the truth, because it's too painful, they react by holding on tighter to their illusion.

In many cases, it seems that the lie is rooted in the idea of victimhood that only serves to further separate people from each other and their true selves.

Would it mean that... (besides the "entertaining technical features" of a blockbuster) the movie "Django" would act as a kind of trigger for (black people) such a victimization mechanic?

Hoping that I am still on the right track, would it apply to so-called antifa/antiracists movements?

I hope that I am not off-track, and I thank you truthseeker, because your post litteraly "stopped me netto"!

When I have a look at antiracists movements, there is a part of myself which would agree with it, but I feel that it is not completely me, it is like a "dreaming" part of me who would like everything to be optimal. Something pathological like "Let's go we're all together!" At the same time, there is a feeling of something "being wrong" with these movements, manifestations, etc... It is like looking at these make me immediately understand that they are kind of "fighting winds", or something illogic in it, that I cannot express/understand!

Anyway that's fun to look at people who feel the need to go in the street to teach other people about being kind to other people (because without them, I don't think I would have been able to discover it myself)! :cool2: :cool2: :cool2:
 
know_yourself said:
Would it mean that... (besides the "entertaining technical features" of a blockbuster) the movie "Django" would act as a kind of trigger for (black people) such a victimization mechanic?
This is just my opinion, so fwiw. I haven't seen "Django Unchained" so can't really say much about it, but wouldn't be surprised to find out that it did act as an unconscious trigger for all people, not just black people. Others may feel differently, however.

I did a bit of a search on it just to try to get up to speed on what the movie was about and I could be off but if it may also act as a vehicle for revenge. Sort of to rile people up but not in a way that fosters creative solutions. Dunno.

know_yourself said:
Hoping that I am still on the right track, would it apply to so-called antifa/antiracists movements?
That may depend on the individual and how identified they are with what they're supporting. In other words, the why of it. Is the anger righteous and they are fighting for truth and because of the wrongness of the situation or are they hurt and projecting their anger onto others in order to 'get back' at them? Is their anger mechanical or conscious?

Maybe the problem with people getting caught up in the various isms (racism, sexism, etc) and phobias is that those ideas are sort of like symptoms of a much bigger disease. Imagine if all those groups were to suddenly realize that the real issue is psychopaths contempt of humanity and put their energies into that which addresses the root of the cause, that would really be something. Much easier said than done. That's just my 2 bits though.

know_yourself said:
I hope that I am not off-track, and I thank you truthseeker, because your post litteraly "stopped me netto"!
I looked up 'netto' but am still not sure what it means. Does it mean something like completely or cold? :)
 
[quote author=truth seeker]
I can understand your upset, Kios, but if you really think about it, racism, sexism and homophobia (whether it manifests via oneself or others) seems to be a yet another form of trauma that results in cognitive dissonance for many. People believe the pathological lies told to them and unfortunately when someone attempts to tell the truth, because it's too painful, they react by holding on tighter to their illusion. In many cases, it seems that the lie is rooted in the idea of victimhood that only serves to further separate people from each other and their true selves. I think most of us experience this regardless of what caused the initial trauma.
[/quote]

As a person who has lived on the continent in various stages of my life, it was a very uncomfortable existence to my freedom loving spirit. I made lots of acquaintances and lifelong friendships with people from all kinds of backgrounds, however I also had to fight for my rights every step of the way because of a perception. It is my observation that the perspective of the participant determines how the information is perceived. If one benefits from the system that survives on the oppression of others it can be difficult to see another person's viewpoint.

Only if you live the experience can you really speak to the circumstances another one finds themselves in. That's not to say one cannot have empathy & sympathy. It is about keeping an open mind and not making judgements, but accepting the fact that there are many layers to the "Matrix" that continues to feed off the fears of the masses, individually as well as collectively. As seekers of knowledge continuously, everything serves its purpose and our collective experiences affect the "Matrix" in one way or another, positive/negative/opposites. This is part of the process. Things are not always as they appear.

Being aware of this though does not give me comfort knowing that presently in this time & place my Brothers, cousins, Uncles, nephews are being targeted because of their skin color. My youngest brother is pulled over constantly for driving while black/negro? However, there is nothing I can do about the situation other than to tell him brother not not bring unnecessary attention to himself. What does that actually mean? The recent news events are things that have been going on for centuries that are now being publicized for the world to see.

Unfortunately, many people are still deceived by outward appearances and not the content of their character. How do people of color resolve their issues if the very system they participate in has found a way to continue oppressing the same people that are blamed for their condition. I think a look into U.S. History & the mindset that created it 1st is a better way to see the man behind the curtain. Mr. Obama has to do whatever his handlers tell him & because people of color are caught up in outward appearances, they continue to be deceived. They have been convinced that their Savior is an external one & not one within.

There is a perspective that continues to create divisiveness & self hate, inferiority & superiority. What gives anyone the rights to control or dictate the the choices of another. Many assume that Black People & enslavement are one in the same. That we had no culture before the invention of America or Europe, however these ideas are false and until people of color know who they are, they will continue to be portrayed as enslaved people in this "free" world. Maybe that is one of the reasons the elements of our history are hidden including the larger history of humankind. Just my 2¢.
 
truth seeker said:
This is just my opinion, so fwiw. I haven't seen "Django Unchained" so can't really say much about it, but wouldn't be surprised to find out that it did act as an unconscious trigger for all people, not just black people. Others may feel differently, however.

I did a bit of a search on it just to try to get up to speed on what the movie was about and I could be off but if it may also act as a vehicle for revenge. Sort of to rile people up but not in a way that fosters creative solutions. Dunno.
Well, it's clear that what is in the movie is not something which normal people do:D
I was thinking about the kind of cognitive dissonance such a movie might induce to people.. The movie is very violent and there are many bold "antagonist" parameters, like the right of killing, the skin color question, the right of revenge and how it is applied, etc... Well, while looking for peace and tranquility, I sure would not stand watching it!

know_yourself said:
Hoping that I am still on the right track, would it apply to so-called antifa/antiracists movements?
truth seeker said:
That may depend on the individual and how identified they are with what they're supporting. In other words, the why of it. Is the anger righteous and they are fighting for truth and because of the wrongness of the situation or are they hurt and projecting their anger onto others in order to 'get back' at them? Is their anger mechanical or conscious?

truth seeker said:
...Imagine if all those groups were to suddenly realize that the real issue is psychopaths contempt of humanity and put their energies into that which addresses the root of the cause...

My question is: if these person have anger they need/choose to direct outwards in such a way (*ism), and taking in consideration the psychopatic veil in society, which seems carefully & consciously spread by some nasty rag men, what level of responsability do these persons have?

I mean that I wanted to consider, in a way, this movie for a kind of well-studied trigger (instead of something like "entertainment", or whatever it is supposed to be).

Thing is that there was an bigger amount of people who saw this movie who absolutely loved it... I was stunned about the expression of some of my friends or other people about it!

truth seeker said:
I looked up 'netto' but am still not sure what it means. Does it mean something like completely or cold? :)
Yes!
 
know_yourself said:
truth seeker said:
This is just my opinion, so fwiw. I haven't seen "Django Unchained" so can't really say much about it, but wouldn't be surprised to find out that it did act as an unconscious trigger for all people, not just black people. Others may feel differently, however.

I did a bit of a search on it just to try to get up to speed on what the movie was about and I could be off but if it may also act as a vehicle for revenge. Sort of to rile people up but not in a way that fosters creative solutions. Dunno.
Well, it's clear that what is in the movie is not something which normal people do:D
I was thinking about the kind of cognitive dissonance such a movie might induce to people.. The movie is very violent and there are many bold "antagonist" parameters, like the right of killing, the skin color question, the right of revenge and how it is applied, etc... Well, while looking for peace and tranquility, I sure would not stand watching it!

Louis Farrakhan, leader of Nation of Islam, has made an analysis of Django. Video in english subtitled in French.

_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3oet7EY9tQ

He does not mention the main issue that underlies such movies : horizontalization of anger (how do we say it in english ?). The oligarchy is trying not to be held responsible for the current "crisis" (quotation marks because the word crisis is not proper. What we are going through is not a crisis but a paradigm change. A crisis involves a recovery, a return to the original state. There will be no economic recovery but it is not the topic of this thread). So, it has to find scapegoats. In France, it is the muslim community, second community of France with more than 5 million people. French muslims are often demonized in the french media. I'm not sure there are many muslims in Wall Street.
 
truth seeker said:
From what I can tell, it seems like a translation from the english term "house negro" (asterix mine):

_https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_Negro

"House Negro" (also "House N*gger") is a pejorative term for a black person, used to compare someone to a house slave of a slave owner from the historic period of legal slavery in the United States. The term comes from a speech "Message to the Grass Roots" (1963) by African American activist Malcolm X, wherein he explains that during slavery, there were two kinds of slaves: "house Negroes", who worked in the master's house, and "field Negroes" (also "field -homies-"), who performed the manual labor outside.

He characterizes the house Negro as having a better life than the field Negro, and thus unwilling to leave the plantation and potentially more likely to support existing power structures that favor whites over blacks. Malcolm X identified with the field Negro. The term is used against individuals,[1][2] in critiques of attitudes within the African American community,[3] and as a borrowed term for critiquing parallel situations.

Here is the Youtube speech by Malcolm X, that Truthseeker is referring to:


https://youtu.be/znQe9nUKzvQ
 
Back
Top Bottom