Are the C's giving us the Beta course, and not the Alpha course?

ge0m0 said:
While there are numerous and proven methods for individuals to advance spiritually, and the concept of satsang, or community, is available on those paths, it does seem unique that FOTCM is pursuing a novel path. Work of any kind by committee is difficult and often the result is compromise rather than advancement. With the sensitivity of spiritual endeavor and subjective interpretation, I imagine it can get dicey.
Click to expand...

Well, it depends what folk are looking for, where their aim is fixed. Some people like the idea of certain things which in reality lay far beyond us as we are, some ideas have those nice sounding words that go with them too after all. Others get fixated on mystical, magical thinking, forgetting the basics - but when do I get my super-powers?! See how many offshoots of Gurdjieff's and Ouspenskys schools (and the rest) have lost their line of force, their direction, have faded away into virtually nothing, or worse have become only caricatures of schools. No good getting all misty eyed about it and in the process forget the basics, nothing will change.

To get back to the basics is no easy thing though, but a sincere group who dispense with preconceived notions of what the Way is, can achieve a great deal between them. Can network and share knowledge in ways which were never possible before, can learn to distinguish and See the truth between them, as a group. What one learns to see, all can learn through a shared process. It is the a, b, c, necessary for other lessons, but of course many do not see it, or fail to see the apllication. Dicey business indeed. ;)
 
electrosonic said:
As we know, we're currently in a STS 3d incarnation cycle of 309,000 yrs or so. And now finally this phase is coming to an end.
It would appear that the normal process of graduating from a 3D STS existence without a wave approaching is extremely difficult, and quite rare, although still perfectly possible for an individual to achieve.
The difference is that this would all be dependent on an individual critical mass.
Click to expand...

Does this analysis mean that there were no groups before? Maybe some hints from individuals in the past attaining this critical mass are out there, if you mean the transition to 4D, but if it was an individual effort (no teachers?) could not be assumed.
 
whitecoast said:
It's in topics like these that I think the distinction between knowledge, being, and understanding (knowledge x being) becomes valuable. I myself know a lot of "spiritual" people who are very optimistic, embodied and uplifting to be around. Many people do. And many of these are vegans, who advocate an unhealthy and destructive diet. Many of these are also Obama voters, ignorant of the good Putin and Russia do in the world. They consume cannabis, mushrooms, pharmaceuticals and vaccines while criticizing tobacco and meat consumption. A good frequency resonance vibration comes in handy for a number of things, and means you are still probably useful to creation on some level. But no matter how well-intentioned, believing in lies vectors and twists one's efforts into harm for humanity.


The lifestyle of a monk could have been a viable path in the ancient past where true knowledge and exact science was utterly scarce. In such a state faith is the only real option. But the external conditions have changed, and the traditional methods are comparably far less effective than adapting to and taking advantage of the network-building capabilities.
Click to expand...

Well said whitecoast.
Having the best intentions for humanity without knowledge and being leads, ultimately, to disaster.
Gurdjieff's analogy of the coach comes to mind.
 
Redrock12 said:
whitecoast said:
It's in topics like these that I think the distinction between knowledge, being, and understanding (knowledge x being) becomes valuable. I myself know a lot of "spiritual" people who are very optimistic, embodied and uplifting to be around. Many people do. And many of these are vegans, who advocate an unhealthy and destructive diet. Many of these are also Obama voters, ignorant of the good Putin and Russia do in the world. They consume cannabis, mushrooms, pharmaceuticals and vaccines while criticizing tobacco and meat consumption. A good frequency resonance vibration comes in handy for a number of things, and means you are still probably useful to creation on some level. But no matter how well-intentioned, believing in lies vectors and twists one's efforts into harm for humanity.


The lifestyle of a monk could have been a viable path in the ancient past where true knowledge and exact science was utterly scarce. In such a state faith is the only real option. But the external conditions have changed, and the traditional methods are comparably far less effective than adapting to and taking advantage of the network-building capabilities.
Click to expand...

Well said whitecoast.
Having the best intentions for humanity without knowledge and being leads, ultimately, to disaster.
Gurdjieff's analogy of the coach comes to mind.
Click to expand...
The thing is, these kinds of people are so sure of themselves and their knowledge. They took some mushrooms, read the Celestine prophesy, visited India and suddenly they have all the secrets of the universe. They dismiss anything contrary to their beliefs with a"knowing smile". It is sad because they mean well, they aren't bad people but their ignorance is crippling to the soul.
All we can do is plant the seeds and flap our butterfly wings. Lead by example.
 
ge0m0 said:
Numerous yogis come to mind, as does the adage: 1 in a million choose to follow the path of Truth, and of those only 1 in a million succeed. That is also probably understating the matter. I'd say more like 1/M consider such a path and think they are on it, of those 1/M actually walk it with enough sincerity to get anywhere at all, and of those 1/M reach the goal. Not good odds. It's the greatest task.
Click to expand...
1 in a million of 1 in a million would mean that the odds are that 1 individual succeeds in 10,000 years. (Assuming generously that the world population has averaged 5 billion throughout history, and with an average life span estimated at 50 years.)

If you add a third 1/M, the result is that one would expect to find that 1 individual in 10,000 years walks the path "with enough sincerity to get anywhere at all", and 1 individual in 10,000,000,000 years reaches the goal. Which is like saying the odds that a single human individual has reached the goal in the last 100,000,000 years are 100 to 1.
 
electrosonic said:
Question: Are the C's giving us the Beta course and not the Alpha course? And what would the Alpha course entail?

Hear me out on this one, hopefully it'll make more sense shortly!

What I'm suggesting is that the C's aren't giving us the Alpha course (or the A material) in how to transit from 3D STS to 4D STO, but that they are giving us the Beta course (B material) specifically tailored for our current situation.
Click to expand...

I think I see what you're getting at. If you read up on A, B and C influences, here, it makes sense that we'd be given 'B' material, because we wouldn't be able to understand the C influences/material yet (or A in reference to your theory). However I think the C's were more pointing toward encouraging us to think for ourselves, question everything and (if one so desires) to work on seeing reality more objectively.
 
I think what was being gotten at was the idea of leaving this reality. At a point before the wave it would come from the individual not wanting. And this holds true today, but we live in a time where many could be making this transition. This means that in order for maximum transition we as a human race need the maximum amount of leaders/examples for the ones on the lower rungs of the latter to learn from. If everyone who was ready just left then the crop of the "good" might be pretty slim.
I don't think that the original idea proposed was meant to cause any sort of division. I think he or she was just understanding a possible important idea (I can not say because in my current state of 3d sts I certainly don't speak for the C's). Let's understand that the C's are essentially an experiment regardless of their existence. So why not think about what the electosonic had to say before writing it off as heresy. I understood what he was saying and I can't say whether it is right or wrong but nobody else here can make that judgement either. Either way, an infinite reality can come up with infinite definitions of what is specifically pertinent at any given point in time. I personally was entertained by such an idea (as wrong or possibly right as it may be). And just because something is called beta doesn't make it any less important than alpha. What is the point of alpha if there is no beta? Ever heard of plan B. Sometimes it's just as important as plan A. And maybe if we, as a human race, had done a better job in the past we could still be on plan A.
I don't see this as heresy or anything, just something to think about.
Sorry if I defended the 'bad' guy here but I found his/her post to at least be worthy of thought. Peace out and stay cool. :referee:
 
"I don't think that the original idea proposed was meant to cause any sort of division."

I agree with you Captainmurphy, I also think electrosonic handled the whole thing pretty well, he/she appeared to say...."already then" and went back to work.
 
Well thanks guys for your comments, no matter what your point of view, they are all appreciated, honestly.

I'd like to say that putting the ideas formulating in my head into a readable format on this page, so that you guys can understand exactly the point I was trying to make, is tremendously difficult! Often it takes me an age to find the words to put in a post - on the odd occasion I just blunder through in order to get it out there quickly - the original post in this thread falls into the latter category I'm afraid.

So let me clarify a couple of things for you, that may help you to see where I was coming from ....

Firstly, I most definitely wasn't trying to promote, or insinuate, an 'us or them' scenario. This had never even crossed my mind, and I'm sorry some people thought that was the direction I was trying to take.
I was actually assuming that all of us involved with the C's have the same opportunity to learn from them at this point in time.

My choice of using the words 'Alpha' & 'Beta' was erroneous - as it implies Alpha is more important than Beta. I simply wanted to imply there was a difference.

And so to the difference I was talking about .... and this is perhaps the point for debate ....... My assumption (and yes its just an assumption, based on comments made by the C's at one time or another, but still just my own musings) is that people who lived in the past 300,000 yrs would of had to of applied a 'slightly' different methodology in order to affect a graduation from 3D STS.
It seems to me that the imminent wave is giving an opportunity for a mass graduation, which is best effected by a networked STO based relationship worldwide.

If there was no wave, your graduation from 3D STS would of had to of been a product of a more singular (certain less global) application of knowledge. A more individual based methodology?

So what I'm suggesting is that; yes of course the C's are telling us everything we need to know about the world, and life in general, and aren't hiding anything - but they may well be emphasizing the network application of it in a greatly amplified way due to the imminent arrival of the wave, whereas if they had the same communication with an individual 3000 yrs ago, they might of put more emphasis on other aspects.

I'm sure there is a comment from the C's somewhere, where they were asked how many people over the last 300,000 yrs had actually left 3D STS for 3D/4D STO, and it was a small number. I'm damned if I can find it now though lol.

Anyway, I hope that allows you to understand my idea a little better.
And remember, its just an idea, not a fact, and certainly open for debate, so please debate :)
 
electrosonic said:
Well thanks guys for your comments, no matter what your point of view, they are all appreciated, honestly.

I'd like to say that putting the ideas formulating in my head into a readable format on this page, so that you guys can understand exactly the point I was trying to make, is tremendously difficult! Often it takes me an age to find the words to put in a post - on the odd occasion I just blunder through in order to get it out there quickly - the original post in this thread falls into the latter category I'm afraid.

So let me clarify a couple of things for you, that may help you to see where I was coming from ....

Firstly, I most definitely wasn't trying to promote, or insinuate, an 'us or them' scenario. This had never even crossed my mind, and I'm sorry some people thought that was the direction I was trying to take.
I was actually assuming that all of us involved with the C's have the same opportunity to learn from them at this point in time.

My choice of using the words 'Alpha' & 'Beta' was erroneous - as it implies Alpha is more important than Beta. I simply wanted to imply there was a difference.

And so to the difference I was talking about .... and this is perhaps the point for debate ....... My assumption (and yes its just an assumption, based on comments made by the C's at one time or another, but still just my own musings) is that people who lived in the past 300,000 yrs would of had to of applied a 'slightly' different methodology in order to affect a graduation from 3D STS.
It seems to me that the imminent wave is giving an opportunity for a mass graduation, which is best effected by a networked STO based relationship worldwide.

If there was no wave, your graduation from 3D STS would of had to of been a product of a more singular (certain less global) application of knowledge. A more individual based methodology?

So what I'm suggesting is that; yes of course the C's are telling us everything we need to know about the world, and life in general, and aren't hiding anything - but they may well be emphasizing the network application of it in a greatly amplified way due to the imminent arrival of the wave, whereas if they had the same communication with an individual 3000 yrs ago, they might of put more emphasis on other aspects.

I'm sure there is a comment from the C's somewhere, where they were asked how many people over the last 300,000 yrs had actually left 3D STS for 3D/4D STO, and it was a small number. I'm damned if I can find it now though lol.

Anyway, I hope that allows you to understand my idea a little better.
And remember, its just an idea, not a fact, and certainly open for debate, so please debate :)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the clarification electrosonic , not really well understood that alpha and beta, I agree with you, graduation at the end of this cycle, with the arrival of the wave, is a great opportunity for all of us, just imagine what it would all of us without having met Laura and the Cassiopaeans, that if it would be catastrophic.

:scared:
 
I'm not sure the message would be all that different because the same ideas and concepts would still apply to each individual, any time during the 300,000 years. The percentage of people who would actually listen might get higher, in a smaller geographic area, the farther back you go in time because the controlled STS message would be less widespread than it is today (no TV, internet, etc.).

So if a person like Laura made contact and began spreading the message, (and they did), they might be able to create more of a following right around them, and consequently be able to form a community right there. The Cathars created a society based on similar teachings, I think, which would be more difficult - or impossible - to do today.

Creating this network was only possible because of the internet, and we have formed a kind of community that spans the entire globe. Imagine how hard it would be to get the same number of people listening and reading today, all in the same area.

Maybe the fact that we are so spread out is more conducive to causing ripples that reach all over the globe, perhaps creating the great opportunity for change that the C's talk about with respect to the arrival of the Wave. Or perhaps more adherents concentrated in a single area might have the same effect due to stronger, more outreaching ripples.

Either way, I think the message and method would always have remained the same, but the way in which it would spread would depend on the times.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom