obyvatel said:
[quote author=Red Star]
It is only my opinion... but:
......
Some mishmash of ideas here.
As axj and Psalehesost pointed out, experience shows pain precedes understanding. Of course there can be pain without any understanding. To say if we had the correct perception then there wouldn't be pain is putting the cart before the horse.
And since you chose to illustrate your opinion with Zen stories, per my understanding, in a traditional Zen setting, these opinions about pain would likely meet with the master's stick or other similar devices.
[/quote]
These Zen stories are only examples I've used to express two ideas. I could have used extracts from Mahabharata, from Sartre's works, Sufi teachings, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, Rambo III or whatever.
I am not saying there is not physical pain. Of course there is, it is evident.
Maybe I have not been very clear and you have not understood me. I was refering to
mental pain, to the idea that there must be
pain to gain, to the idea that, in order to learn, we must
work very hard, to the idea that
our feelings will hurt us in our quest for the light because the predator's mind will try to retake control over us and other people will be used by the forces of darkness against us.
If we think that to feel this pain is the only way, what do you think we are going to find in our lives?
That, in my opinion,
is the way for those who don't know how to control their mind. These thoughts can appear in any moment but it is in you the free will of feeding them with your attention or not.
Much people in this forum think Gurdjieff teachings are important. Well, remember what Gurdjieff said about not seeing the exit door or believing there is one door only.
Think for a moment in little Peter at the school... It is Mathematics time, the teacher gives him a problem to solve, a system of linear equations...
If Peter doesn't like Mathematics, he will feel that this work is painful, he will think it is a pain in the neck.
But if Peter, even not understanding Mathematics, thinks this problem is a good opportunity to learn, then he will work in it with joy, because the understanding of the problem (experience) will allow him to find the solution (knowledge) and he will be able to resolve similar problems in the future (to apply the knowledge).
So, it is not a problem of hard work. It is a problem of attitude, a problem of how you face the reality.
When I have said that to REALIZE you are the Prime Creator is the key I was not being simplistic. There is a lot of people in this forum who think we are the Prime Creator. But, how many people REALIZE about it?
That is the difference and it is one of the most difficult things to achieve. Not because it is inherently hard, but because it is necessary the will to find the way to truly understand this by ourselves.
We can read Castaneda, Mouravieff, Parmenides, Bhagavad Gita, Lankavatara Sutra... but until we don't
decide to find the way to truly understand we are the Prime Creator, we will not be able to REALIZE about it. Yes, we can believe in it, but this is not the same.
Once we realize about it, then the
"essential goal" of the "true mind" which Castaneda talked about will be
strategically aligned. This is, the most important goal of all:
To be unified "again", to achieve 7th Density (in Cassiopaean terms). This is the most important thing of all and the ultimate goal and everything that happens or must be decided between "now" and that other "moment" is in function of this goal.
Only when our
"essential goal" is aligned with the unification we can have
faith. Until then, we are only, if you will permit the Cassiopaean phrase,
"Lost lambs beying in the knight".
And please, do not think I'm talking about sit and meditate and forget about the physical world and the events that are happening. That is not necessary in order to align our
"essential goal" and
act conform to it in every decision we take.