What programs have YOU discovered?

[Oxajil]

After noticing this for many many years, it has just dawned on me that it may a program or it is just plain pathological.

I will be doing something, mechanically like locking the front door, turning off the oven, things that we all do everyday.  But then after a short time, my thoughts go in the direction of..."did I turn the oven off?"  "Did I lock the door"  "where did I put such and such, it was just in my hand?"  Now yes this could be short term memory loss, but I think that it is more my mechanicalness of doing something without thinking about the action only later to go over it in my mind and not remember if I did it.  May be a cross circuit of system one doing things and system two being asleep or thinking about something else.

Have to admit I am a bit compulsive like I may check the car doors after I know I locked them, two or three times   or I just locked the front door, but have to check if it is locked.  Or this compulsiveness I describe is just more of the program running because I don't want to be in a position of not being able to check my doubts and have to 'worry' about it the whole time until I can finally check and see.

I have this tendency as well, but it has become less. I've noticed that when I do check twice, it was because there was too much on my mind that made me forget whether I did it. As you have discovered this tendency, perhaps it would be an interesting experiment to try to see if you can be present in the moment. So for example when you put your keys on the table, try to be present when you do it or even tell yourself ''Okay so let me put the keys here on the table'' (talking to myself helps in these things). Maybe doing some practicing in this area could help with being a bit less mechanical in your daily life. I've noticed that the more I pay attention, the less I would need to double/triple-check or look for things (and it saves some unnecessary stress also). Regarding your compulsiveness, maybe you can reduce the frequency on checking, like maybe just check once, instead of two or three times. And see if that helps in any way. Fwiw.

[lux]

I think compulsive behaviors may be symptoms of a hidden trauma. Such behavior as intrusive checking may be associated with feeling of insecurity. Possible to solve the problem rather through deeper discovery of the problem, not superficial changes. Otherwise, trauma will apprise about itself, causing other problems.

[lake_george]

After noticing this for many many years, it has just dawned on me that it may a program or it is just plain pathological.

I will be doing something, mechanically like locking the front door, turning off the oven, things that we all do everyday.  But then after a short time, my thoughts go in the direction of..."did I turn the oven off?"  "Did I lock the door"  "where did I put such and such, it was just in my hand?"  Now yes this could be short term memory loss, but I think that it is more my mechanicalness of doing something without thinking about the action only later to go over it in my mind and not remember if I did it.  May be a cross circuit of system one doing things and system two being asleep or thinking about something else.

Have to admit I am a bit compulsive like I may check the car doors after I know I locked them, two or three times   or I just locked the front door, but have to check if it is locked.  Or this compulsiveness I describe is just more of the program running because I don't want to be in a position of not being able to check my doubts and have to 'worry' about it the whole time until I can finally check and see.

I have this tendency as well, but it has become less. I've noticed that when I do check twice, it was because there was too much on my mind that made me forget whether I did it. As you have discovered this tendency, perhaps it would be an interesting experiment to try to see if you can be present in the moment. So for example when you put your keys on the table, try to be present when you do it or even tell yourself ''Okay so let me put the keys here on the table'' (talking to myself helps in these things). Maybe doing some practicing in this area could help with being a bit less mechanical in your daily life. I've noticed that the more I pay attention, the less I would need to double/triple-check or look for things (and it saves some unnecessary stress also). Regarding your compulsiveness, maybe you can reduce the frequency on checking, like maybe just check once, instead of two or three times. And see if that helps in any way. Fwiw.

To add on to what Oxajil wrote about being more present when I lock the front door, or turn of the stove, etc., it helps me to take extra notice of the sensation of my hands locking the door, or the sensation of turning off the stove.  I guess also another way to be to say out loud, "I am locking the door."  Then while I am driving away wondering if the door is unlocked, I have the memory in my hand of the sensation of closing it.  I suppose if I said it out loud I could remember hearing myself say it, play back the recording of me saying it.  To me this makes it more 'concrete' and that I just now today did this.   FWIW....

[mabar]

I think compulsive behaviors may be symptoms of a hidden trauma. Such behavior as intrusive checking may be associated with feeling of insecurity. Possible to solve the problem rather through deeper discovery of the problem, not superficial changes. Otherwise, trauma will apprise about itself, causing other problems.

I think that that could be my case, I do have this tendency to check out certain things,  I had been having improvements and depends in which state of mind I am at the present of doing mechanical things, I do concentrate and try to not think in other things, as turn off the oven, check the door is closed ... mostly they are regarding security issues? and mostly regarding other people's things that I am using, like the apartment which I am staying (doors, oven, boiler, windows, plugs, tv). If I feel fine with myself do not need to check it compulsively, but if I am anxious state, not trusting other people and along of not trusting myself and overall negative thinking, so it is for sure that I check them more than 3 times.

I think I started with the iron (for cloths), it was like 10 years ago (in short, I was lost and my selfsteem plumed at that time), so whenever I use the iron, I checked it out like tree times to be unplugged and cold, sometimes I was away from home and I did came back to check ti out, of curse that mania worsen through time because I started with other things. Like if I closed or not the door of the garage.  I am saying I think I started with the iron, because there is a story behind it:

I may had like 10 years old, I was in company with my brother and two cousins at their room playing with a iron-toy (that needed to be plugged) so, time passed and our parents called us to leave, our home was in front my cousins (in a private street like with 8 houses)  and my cousins and their parents  went to their grandparents to pass the night, early next day our neighborhoods alert my parents, that my cousins house was burning.  Fortunately, the house was saved (being made of bricks); the fire started in my cousin's room, I remember being too shocked seeing how the house was burning -I supposed our parents asked us, the fire department said the iron started the fire....  -being kids- typical ... "unplugged the iron" said one to the other and ... no one unplugged it. I do not remember if our parents said anything, like grounding us, but my self steem at that time was not good, I supposed I felt responsible of burning my uncles home --I know now that I was not responsible at all-- but I do not know how to "go into the past and erase that thought" and that's why I keep checking and double checking stuff.  And keep observing the why, the when, .... last time when it was more, intense? my parents were around.

[Oxajil]

I think compulsive behaviors may be symptoms of a hidden trauma. Such behavior as intrusive checking may be associated with feeling of insecurity. Possible to solve the problem rather through deeper discovery of the problem, not superficial changes. Otherwise, trauma will apprise about itself, causing other problems.

That can definitely be the case, which is why, perhaps, the right way to go about it is to Work on the self by figuring out these traumas, by writing, networking etc. and at the same time trying to change our behavior, as in doing what it doesn't like to do, and to try to become more aware of ourselves as far as that would be possible. I've also noticed that faking until one makes it, and doing what it doesn't like to do, has helped me with figuring out why I had a certain behavior before.

[Bluestar]

I think compulsive behaviors may be symptoms of a hidden trauma. Such behavior as intrusive checking may be associated with feeling of insecurity. Possible to solve the problem rather through deeper discovery of the problem, not superficial changes. Otherwise, trauma will apprise about itself, causing other problems.

Yes, I do understand that this may be the case.  Am almost finished reading the book "In An Unspoken Voice" by Peter A. Levine.  This is a wonderful book there is a thread that you can find  here.  Once finished with this book will start some of the exercises it recommends. 

Doing pipe breathing helps and I have not been as compulsive as in the past.  Thinking that it may be behavioral patterns as well and what I do is convince myself I did lock the door.  I think also worrying is inhereted from parental programming.  Also what I have been doing lately is before leaving, run a mental and visual check making sure every thing is turned off before leaving the house.  And as I lock the door, say a prayer and ask for protection, which gives some comfort and know I locked the door. Knowing full well that anything can happen and I don't anticipate or expect protection from anything.  You know "I'm just askin"  plus it makes me conscious of my action.

When aware of what I am doing, which is more often than not these days, paying attention like mentioned here;

it helps me to take extra notice of the sensation of my hands locking the door, or the sensation of turning off the stove.

does ease any compulsive behavior.  The worst is when locking my car door and turning at least twice and hitting the car lock button, just to make sure I did it, even though I know it was done.  It is
'just to make sure' kind of thing.  Am going to just lock it once and deal with the uncomfortable feeling, trying to see where the feeling occurs in my body.  All the while paying attention to those around me.  Hard as it is, learning is fun.

The main point of my posting here was to express it as a program and make it forefront on the work I am doing at present and to network into the mix for some insightful feed back.  As in the purpose of this thread, making it 'public' so to speak gives it energy enough to maybe expose it for what it is.  Thanks for the feed back.

[Mariama]

I have lots of programs, but one of them related to this forum is: I always fear the replies of you forum members/lovely people to my posts. So, instead of clicking on 'Show new replies to your posts' I read other posts, preferably in other threads.

I have an urgency program that I managed to resolve a couple of times with the help of EE. Last night, just before doing an EE session, I was thinking of my ex and I started feeling miserable. Then I was thinking how I would really like to talk to his sister, in other words, I was giving in to my emotions. I had to tell myself to just leave it and start the EE session. I really had to fight hard! When I had finished I did not feel the need to call her anymore. Instead, I had a long talk with my children, which was much more constructive.
The other day I was thinking of checking all my valuables in the house in order to see whether they had been stolen by my ex. There was this wave of urgency and panic washing over me. I had to check it that very instant. It couldn't wait. But I forced myself to sit down (and stood up again right away), sat down again and told myself to start pipe breathing and POTS. It only took a few minutes and the sense of urgency and panic was gone.
But I used to do some crazy things when this urgency program was running.

Back to reading this GREAT thread.

[echo]

Funny, I was reading this thread today and thinking how great it was. 

Very nice to read how you dealt with your "urgency" program, Mariama. I recognize the same program and I know the feeling of not having given in to sudden urges to do things, how things usually turn out better that way, more "whole" (less enthropy is the word I'm actually thinking). It seems that it is usually better to think beforehand, when there are emotions.

 

[Psalehesost]

The result of getting confused about putting Work concepts in practice:

I've long been avoiding mechanical behavior that I could see is such, in favor of following other impulses that I didn't see as mechanical. I now realized that it is all equally mechanical. And that avoiding the former and engaging in the latter merely means losing the ability to observe myself, in no longer seeing the mechanicalness at play.

And seeing myself is vital to being able to keep in mind, in the moment, which actions go for or against my Aim, and the goals connected to it that I have set. This should be the real basis of judgment - if actions are expedient, watch the machine engage in its work; if detrimental, then exert effort to change track.

Blindly trying to suppress everything identified as mechanical is, in effect, shooting myself in the foot, and as a blind, automatic activity it is in itself a mechanical program.

[Carlise]

The result of getting confused about putting Work concepts in practice:

I've long been avoiding mechanical behavior that I could see is such, in favor of following other impulses that I didn't see as mechanical. I now realized that it is all equally mechanical. And that avoiding the former and engaging in the latter merely means losing the ability to observe myself, in no longer seeing the mechanicalness at play.

And seeing myself is vital to being able to keep in mind, in the moment, which actions go for or against my Aim, and the goals connected to it that I have set. This should be the real basis of judgment - if actions are expedient, watch the machine engage in its work; if detrimental, then exert effort to change track.

Blindly trying to suppress everything identified as mechanical is, in effect, shooting myself in the foot, and as a blind, automatic activity it is in itself a mechanical program.

I agree, this is the only standard by which we should measure our actions. Though it is hard to know 100% of the time whether a given activity would help or hinder us, and it is easy to come up with rationalisations when we let our guard down.

I would have a very hard time defining something I do that is not mechanical, in the way G describes it. Even reading, networking etc could be seen as mechanical,  but it is inspired by the face of god that we have consciously chosen, and this is key IMO.

[Mariama]

The result of getting confused about putting Work concepts in practice:

I've long been avoiding mechanical behavior that I could see is such, in favor of following other impulses that I didn't see as mechanical. I now realized that it is all equally mechanical. And that avoiding the former and engaging in the latter merely means losing the ability to observe myself, in no longer seeing the mechanicalness at play.

And seeing myself is vital to being able to keep in mind, in the moment, which actions go for or against my Aim, and the goals connected to it that I have set. This should be the real basis of judgment - if actions are expedient, watch the machine engage in its work; if detrimental, then exert effort to change track.

Blindly trying to suppress everything identified as mechanical is, in effect, shooting myself in the foot, and as a blind, automatic activity it is in itself a mechanical program.

Thanks Psalehesost. It is an important point that you make and I will try to remember it. I have only just begun reading the fourth way books and I feel like a novice...
In my case I do not think that I was shooting myself in the foot. I was preventing myself from making any emotional mistakes and hanging on to people that I should cut out of my life. I just did not know how to do it in any other way.
But I am confused now. Were your responding to my post at all?

[Psalehesost]

But I am confused now. Were your responding to my post at all?

No; as do others in this thread, I simply posted my own personal "discovery", a problem of my own observed. Sorry for the confusion. I don't think my issue seems very relevant to what you described yourself as struggling with - detrimental patterns to be fought.

[Emmanuel]

The fear of rejection is still a great program I try to overcome, it leads to self-pity and giving up things I started sometimes.
Although it is still there, I have won some battles which make me hope.

I just started trapped in the mirror after finishing Unholy hungers so it's obviously stirring old wounds and putting things into a proper context where I can finally understand how it all works.

Yes, the fear of rejection...Very powerful. And goes hand in hand with fear of unknown, witch is in my opinion fear of loosing the control of situation (meaning not accepting the situation how it is )  and the fake power "be like I wish and want". Typical R-complex predator thinking, thought.

[Emmanuel]

once we think such thoughts and forget, are they still in there somewhere? have they changed us in some way, or are the effects lost as soon as they slip from our consciousness?

Interestingly enough,

"But of what use is it to him if he also does not remember?" said one of us.

"Essence remembers," said G., "personality has forgotten. And this was necessary because otherwise personality would have perverted everything and would have ascribed all this to itself."

See this thread http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=6989.msg49787#msg49787  for the full context.

Like. Thanks for the link, Anart.

[Tristan]

Fear of rejection also seems strong in me, among others. Sometimes I have moments when I can overcome these fears. Today, after a brief session of EE and POTS have been a moment of no-fear at/in the end, it was a sudden forgetting.