The Real World > Religion
Re: The Black Madonna
Laura:
Regarding Black Goddesses, Tom Lethbridge writes in "GogMagog: The Buried Gods", about the great mother goddess, Magog:
--- Quote --- ... At one time there was nothing at Wandlebury but a smallish goddess and a peculiar horse. ... she was probably Epona, or whatever Epona was called in Britain at that time. Her title was Ma-Gog. ...
Epona was a Gaulish horse goddess, said by tradition to have been fathered by a mortal man on a mare goddess. ... The addition of the Moon symbol turned here into a much greater figure. Epona is probably the Greek goddess "hippa", the mother of Apollo, the sun god, and daughter of Pallas and the winged horse. The winged horse is a symbol frequently found on pre-Roman British coins. [...]
...some change had come over the religious or political situation in this part of England to cause the construction of additional figures on a grander scale. [...]
There appear to have been three immigrations. ... The second wave is sometimes spoken of as the Marnian Charioteers..... a Celtic mixture coming from Gaul, who by intermarriage with the earlier Bronze and Iron Age people living in the district before them, produced the great Celtic tribe of the Iceni. They were a tribe in which rule descended through the female line. ...
A generation before Caesar's conquest of Gaul, a third immigration began into Britain. This was a Belgic, that is, half Celtic and half German people.... Caesar describes them as the most warlike of the Gauls. ...
Wandlebury itself ... appears to have been made during the second immigration by the Marnian people. .... It is only a guess that they were the makers of the Horse Goddess. This seems all the more probable when we regard them as being Iceni. I take this name to have been something like Eachanaidh or Equidios, and to have meant "The Horse People."
With the Belgic invasion the area seems to have been occupied by the Catuvellauni, who may have been related to the Chatti from beyond the Rhine. ... Belgic farmers pressed back the Iceni further into East Anglia. The tribal boundary in this direction was probably the river Lark. ...
Gervase of Tilbury mentions the Wandali, or Vandals, in connection with Wandlebury and says that the place took its name from them. ...
The pressure of the Belgic tribes seems to have forced numbers of the older peoples to move far north into Scotland and overseas into Ireland. It is clear that this must have taken place, for the Belgic peoples came to occupy nearly the whole of southern Britain from Dorset to Cambridgeshire and large areas elsewhere. ...
It seemed reasonable to me to look for some settlement of Iceni elsewhere and I have little doubt that they are Ptolemy's Epidii of Kintyre. These are Horse people too. Their modern descendants call themselves Mac Eacherns, Mac Eachans, or MacEachrans. They claim to have been the great horse people and even that they are descended from a Horse Lord (or Lady?). ....
Two miles from Kilberry on the road to Tarbert ... in the west of Scotland, is a seat of the Cailleach... The Cailleach was one of the most important deities in the west of Scotland. Cailleach is not her name, of course, you must not mention that, it just means "old woman" and has sometimes become rather derogatory. It can be a witch. Nevertheless, the Cailleach was a goddess. Amongst other things she controlled the winds, seas, and seasons; she kept a beautiful maiden (Spring or the New Moon?) in a cave in Glencoe, who ran away with Diarmid, the Gaelic Adonis. Numerous rounded hills are named after the Cailleach. They are her breasts. She is the Great Earth Mother in her "old woman" phase. She is Black Annis of Leicestershire, with her dark face and horrid teeth; but I think she is also the Gruagach, the Fair-Haired One, who is the same goddess in her middle-life phase. ...
Two hundred yards from the Cailleach's seat is "Slochd na Chapuill", the hollow of the Mare, and just beyond this is "Glac na h'Imuilte", the hollow of the Struggle. ... Here in the hollow of the struggle, tradition tells of a most peculiar fight. Although it is now spoken of as a Clan battle, nobody knows what clans fought. One of the "clans" brought a wise woman, a Cailleach, to help them win. The struggle consisted in one side trying to pull the Cailleach off her horse and the other side trying to keep her on it.
Now, this is most important, for it is clearly an account of an ancient ritual ceremony. The Cailleach is the Earth Mother and a woman riding nude on a horse was widely believed to be a great bringer of Fertility. ... The Cailleach with her horse is the Celtic Artemis, or Diana if you like. She has a dark face in her phase as an old woman and, according to Pliny, the women of Britain used to blacken their nude bodies before attending some of Diana's Festivals. Black Dianas are known. They are the moon in her dark phase. ...
--- End quote ---
This then connects to the great white horse of Uffington and Lady Godiva:
--- Quote from: Tom Lethbridge --- The horses... three ancient ones, Bratton, Uffington and Tysoe... Dr. Margaret Murray has drawn our attention to the story of Lady Godiva and the probable connection between her white horse and the White Horse of Uffington. ...Uffa of Uffington is not derived from some unknown Anglo-Saxon landowner, but related to the Greek Ippos, a horse. Ippos itself is clearly related to the name of the north Gaulish horse goddess, Epona...
Lady Godiva was just taking the place of the goddess at some ritual procession at Coventry in honour of Epona
It was Gog-diva (not Godiva), the holy lady Gog. In other words the rider represented Ma Gog. ...
These ritual processions of nude women on white horses, riding out to confer benefits on the people, are closely related to the Kintyre tradition. There the struggle with the demon of darkness was actually portrayed in mimic conflict. Godiva at Coventry was veiled in her hair; at Southam she was painted black. The ceremony would have ended in an unveiling, when the New Moon was then revealed. At Banbury she had bells on her toes to scare off the demon. Demons hate noise. That is what the bells are for. ...
--- End quote ---
Then, he goes on to speculate about the meaning of the Black Faced woman, black painted women, and the related rituals.
--- Quote from: Tom Lethbridge --- {The ritual's performance} was regarded as necessary to ensure the continual progress of the seasons, which had to be carried out in face of the opposition of the Powers of Darkness. ...
In its simplest form, before the sun, as the male god, became of greater importance to the rulers of the land than the moon, the Great Earth Goddess, something had to be done to help the moon past the clutches of the Demon of Darkness, winter and scarcity.
--- End quote ---
Had Lethbridge been aware of cometary disasters, the literature exposed by Clube and Napier, etc, he might have put a different spin on this; that it was not to "save the moon" so much as it was to save the Earth itself from the darkness of the dust and destruction of comets...
--- Quote from: Tom Lethbridge --- That is why Godiva is veiled or blackened. At first she represented the old moon and then, after a struggle such as the traditional one at Kintyre, she reappeared as a new moon. ...
A woman painted black, or veiled (Veiled Isis?) in some way, used to ride in procession up that hill and was then revealed by the priests, after being washed or otherwise uncovered in some sacred grove or precinct on the top. ...
No invention in different localities could surely have produced such similar conceptions as Kali in India and the Cailleach and Black Annis in Britain. ...
The Celts of Britain always claimed that they were related to the Greeks and Trojans. A study of their gods certainly seems to show that this was true. What was the Wooden Horse of Troy but one of Magog's ceremonial figures? ...
Kali (meaning "black") or Kali Ma (black mother). Hindu, wife of Siva. She is black with matted hair, three red eyes, one in the middle of her forehead, red palms to her hands and projecting teeth. Girdled with snakes and necklaces of human skulls, she is the goddess of death and destruction in which capacity she carried a sacred pickaxe for digging graves. ... She is also, however, the goddess of fruitfulness, being identified with Maha-devi, Durga, Parvati and others. She appears to be the dark phase of the moon....
The Cailleach has a blue-black face, one eye in the middle of her forehead and projecting teeth. The Gruagach is supposedly "the Fair Haired One", but is also a destroyer. The Cailleach carries a hammer and thunderbolts. ... She can turn herself into a standing stone. ... She is the dark of the moon and the Great Earth Mother. Like Kali in many particulars and even name, she was goddess both of destruction and fruitfulness. ...
Black Annis, Black Anni, or Cat Anna of Leicestershire. She had a blue face, was one-eyed and had projecting teeth. A goddess of destruction, she frequented a cave in the Dane Hills. The name of the hills may be derived from Danu, the Irish goddess, or from Diana. From the branches of an oak tree, Black Annis used to drop on the heads of passers-by and destroy them. Like the Cailleach, whom she resembles in other ways, she is therefore linked with trees and in particular with the oak, which was sacred among the Gauls of Galatia to the Goddess of Heaven. Later, with the change from the rule of women to that of men, the oak became sacred to Zeus. Black Annis can hardly be separated from the Cailleach. She also appears to be Danu, or Anu. ...
Ma-Gog .. The Earth Mother and Moon Goddess ... in all three phases.
--- End quote ---
Lethbridge goes into some detail, but it does seem that the Black Madonna is a survival of the worship of Ma-Gog.
And, there is this from the Cs:
--- Quote ---
Q: The legend was that the god, Phoebus Apollo, danced at Stonehenge every nineteen years. What does this relate to ?
A: Symbolic. Tides, moon eclipses, that sort of thing. Think of Wiccans entubed on the information superhighway!
--- End quote ---
See also this thread: http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=9338
and this one:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=8657.0
for some additional clues.
Patience:
--- Quote from: Laura on August 20, 2008, 11:05:50 AM ---
Lethbridge goes into some detail, but it does seem that the Black Madonna is a survival of the worship of Ma-Gog.
--- End quote ---
From the little I had read on the net, it did not seem like there was any particularly good or widespread theory about where these Black Madonnas came from, but that seems to be it if we can believe Lethbridge. Pretty fascinating... Now, I just wonder why there are so many survived in France compared to elsewhere. There seems to be in the whole country an interest in preserving the heritage of one's province. Maybe this attitude allowed so many Madonnas to be preserved.
Laura:
--- Quote from: Patience on August 20, 2008, 01:26:36 PM ---
--- Quote from: Laura on August 20, 2008, 11:05:50 AM ---
Lethbridge goes into some detail, but it does seem that the Black Madonna is a survival of the worship of Ma-Gog.
--- End quote ---
From the little I had read on the net, it did not seem like there was any particularly good or widespread theory about where these Black Madonnas came from, but that seems to be it if we can believe Lethbridge. Pretty fascinating... Now, I just wonder why there are so many survived in France compared to elsewhere. There seems to be in the whole country an interest in preserving the heritage of one's province. Maybe this attitude allowed so many Madonnas to be preserved.
--- End quote ---
I would speculate that the images survived in France with a HEAVY overlay of Christianity that pretty much wiped out any of the older meaning, while in that one spot in England, in Scotland and perhaps in Ireland, a bit of the meaning survived, though highly distorted. More of the "old ways" survived there than in France in general, it seems.
But yeah, when I read how Lethbridge worked his way through this one, I realized that he was definitely onto something. Put that together with his speculations about Baal as formerly being a goddess (The Shining One) and then the Baalzebul controversy in the New Testament, and it seems that there are traces of evidence that whoever was behind the "Jesus legend" was a worshipper of the goddess Ma-Gog - Baal. That then, comes back around in the Black Madonnas, so maybe it wasn't entirely lost - it was just Christianized.
But, with Lethbridge's input, combined with what we know about cometary interactions from Clube, et al, a rather more complete picture is forming.
Laura:
It's interesting that the feast of the "Ascension of the Virgin Mary" is on August 15th. That generally falls in line with the Perseid meteor shower. In fact, it was while watching the Perseids on August 16 of 1993 that my children and I saw the "Flying Black Boomerang." Eleven months later, to the day, the Cs appeared on the scene on July 16th.
--- Quote from: Wikipedia --- The Perseids are associated with the comet Swift-Tuttle. The Perseid meteor shower has been observed for about 2000 years, with the first known information on these meteors coming from the Far East.
--- End quote ---
Interesting that it has been around as long as Christianity... and there may have been something to see in the sky at that time of interest. Also interesting that the information came from "The East," like the Wise Men.
In early medieval Europe, the Perseids came to be known as the "tears of St. Lawrence."
--- Quote from: Wikipedia --- Saint Lawrence (c. 225 – 258) (Latin: Laurentius, meaning "laurelled") was one of the seven deacons of ancient Rome who were martyred during the persecution of Roman Emperor Valerian in the year 258.
Such early legends made Lawrence a native of Huesca (Roman Osca) in Hispania Tarraconensis who had received religious instruction from Archdeacon Sixtus in Rome. When Sixtus became Bishop of Rome in 257, Lawrence was ordained a deacon and was placed in charge of the administration of Church goods and care for the poor. For this duty, he is regarded as one of the first archivists and treasurers of the Church and was made the patron of librarians. {...}
Lawrence is said to have been martyred on a gridiron. During his torture Lawrence cried out "This side’s done, turn me over and have a bite." {"Assum est, inquit, versa et manduca."} {...}
According to lore, among the treasure of the Roman church entrusted to Lawrence for safe-keeping was the Holy Chalice, the cup from which Jesus and the Apostles drank at the Last Supper. Lawrence was able to spirit this away to Huesca with a letter and a supposed inventory, where it lay hidden and unregarded for centuries. {...}
According to Christian mythology, the Holy Grail is a relic that was sent by St. Lawrence to his parents in Spain. He entrusted this sacred chalice to a friend whom he knew would travel back to Spain, his home country. While the Holy Chalice's exact journey through the centuries is disputed, it is generally accepted by Catholics that the Chalice was sent by his family to a monastery for preservation and veneration.
--- End quote ---
None of the above suggests why the Perseids are referred to as the "Tears of St. Lawrence."
However, these things remind me of a few odds and ends said by the Cs that may or may not be relevant clues:
--- Quote --- 7 June 97
Q: In reading the Celtic legends, I discovered that
Cassiopaea was equated with Danu, or Don, as in Tuatha de
Danaan, or the court of the goddess Danu. So, in other
words, the supreme goddess of the [Northern Peoples] was Cassiopaea.
And, Cassiopaea is found in the zodiacal area of Aries,
the 'lamb,' where Cephus the 'rock' and 'king' is also
found, as well as Perseus, 'he who breaks' and
serpentarius. The image is of Perseus overcoming the
serpent, and the ancient Celtic engravings of the horned
god show him gripping two serpents by the throat. I would
like to understand the symbology here...
A: You are on the right track.
Q: What is the symbology of the 'breaking of rocks,' as in
the alchemical texts, as well as related to Perseus as 'he
who breaks?'
A: Occurs at a time when rocks break, as in the
electromagnetic impulses that emanate from earthbound
rocks when sheared by tectonic forces, and much more
importantly, the possible utilization of said forces
whether naturally or otherwise induced.
--- End quote ---
--- Quote --- (Discussing Rennes-le-Chateau)
12 July 97
Q: ... in my perception of this arrangement on this stone, is it that the two sides need
to be united, is that correct? Or is the Arrow from the P-S pointing at the spider a divider
of two opposing groups?
A: Open for your discovery!
Q: Oh, you guys are BAD to me tonight!
A: No, we be berry berry goood to Lawra!
--- End quote ---
and
--- Quote --- 4 April 98
Q: Okay, I get the connection. In the studies of the Triple
Goddess, I came across some interesting things. You
suggested that I should research the Third Man Theme. I
have discovered that the origin of the word 'man' meant a
female - the goddess. The oldest word for the male of the
species was 'wer' as in 'werewolf.' So, the Third Man
Theme could mean actually, the Triple Goddess. Am I
correct?
A: Close, if viewed through "sheets of rain."
Q: Okay. Tracking the Triple Goddess back to the oldest
references, we get to KaliMa. There are all kinds of
derivations of this name, but the thing that strikes me is
the relationship to the goddess Kell, or Kella, as well as
to the word kell, Celts, and how this might be transformed
into the word 'Cassiopaea.' Can you comment on this?
A: Do not the Celts like "kelly" green?!?
Q: Yes. So. What does 'green' have to do with it?
A: Keep searching... learning is accomplished thusly, and
learning is fun!
--- End quote ---
and
--- Quote --- 2 Jan 99
Q: So, we are back to something else. I once asked about the Third Man Theme and that perhaps you meant that the imagery was that of the Triple Goddess relating to the Isle of Man... and you said 'if viewed through sheets of rain.' So, in this book that I am reading, it talks about the fact that the Celts of Gaul worshipped the Rain as the manifestation of the Goddess, and the Celts of Scotland worshipped the Sun... the male God. Does this relate in any way to this remark you made about sheets of rain?
A: In an offhand way.
Q: Anything further you can tell me in terms of a clue about 'sheets of rain?'
A: Not for now, when you get there, you will find the chalice.
Q: Where and WHAT chalice?
A: Wait and see!
--- End quote ---
and
--- Quote --- 17 August 2003
Q: (L) I don't think that was one of your options. (A) well, someone on the physics newsgroups was discussing this, so maybe it is a confirmation. (L) Look! It's raining. (After months of extraordinary heat and many deaths, rain was significant.)
Q: (A) So we can ask then about this weather breakthrough yesterday, is it a sign of a break through in our own situation?
A: One day there will be sheets of rain.
--- End quote ---
Getting back to the origin of the Perseids,
--- Quote from: Wikipedia ---Comet Swift-Tuttle was discovered by Lewis Swift on July 16, 1862 and by Horace Parnell Tuttle on July 19, 1862, independently. The comet made a return appearance in 1992, when it was rediscovered by Japanese astronomer Tsuruhiko Kiuchi.
The comet is on an orbit which will almost certainly eventually hit either the Earth or the Moon, though not within this millennium. Upon its 1992 rediscovery, the comet's date of perihelion passage was off from the then-current prediction by 17 days. It was then noticed that, if its next perihelion passage (August 14, 2126) was also off by another 15 days, the comet would very likely strike the Earth or Moon. However, the orbit was improved by the identification of earlier passages, dating as far back as 69 BC, and the new orbit's stability turned out to be greater than expected, making the threat disappear.
--- End quote ---
Can anybody else find anything out about the "tears" and the comet?
Alana:
--- Quote from: Laura on August 20, 2008, 04:51:23 PM ---Can anybody else find anything out about the "tears" and the comet?
--- End quote ---
Well, there's this article from 2006, in the Canadian
-http://enews.coloradomtn.edu/index.cfm?method=c.artDetail&artID=1804
--- Quote ---Historians tell us that the Romans martyred a Christian deacon named Laurentius on August 10 in the year 258 AD by cooking him alive on an outdoor iron stove called a gridiron. It was during this torture that Laurentius reportedly cried out, "I am already roasted on one side and, if thou wouldst have me well cooked, it is time to turn me on the other." That night, as Laurnetius’ family and friends carried away his body, they noticed a number of bright streaks falling through the sky. They marveled at the miracle and believed that the streaks were the fiery tears of Laurentius falling from heaven. For centuries after that August night, people all over the world have continued to marvel at the sight of St. Lawrence’s tears every August.
We now know that the streaks of light are caused by tiny bits of space dust shed long ago by a comet named Swift-Tuttle. As they enter the Earth’s atmosphere at 60 km/sec, the dust particles burn up as meteors about 60 miles over our heads. The August meteors seem to fan out from a point in the northeastern sky within our constellation Perseus, so the meteor shower is formally called the Perseid meteor shower. Over the centuries, the time of peak activity has shifted from the night of August 10 to August 11, but some Perseid meteors can be seen for about a week on either side of that date.
--- End quote ---
I also found here
-http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/7905/lorenzo.html
that St Lawrence was also a librarian and archivist:
--- Quote ---A patron saint of libraries and librarians is Saint Lawrence the Librarian. He is a third century saint and martyr (died 258 AD) who had responsibility for the written archives and records of the early church.
...
As librarian and archivist, Lawrence was thought to have a list of all the members of the early church, and the locations of all the mythical hidden hoards of gold belonging to the Vatican. Captured by the soldiers of the Emperor Valerian a few days later, on August 8, 258 AD, he was told to produce all the wealth of the church. He was given only two days to bring all the treasures to the imperial palace. Particularly desired were the names of all the Christians who were also Roman nobles, since they could be ransomed for gold by the emperor, or executed and their wealth confiscated by the emperor for the state.
Lawrence gathered up the all the diseased, orphaned or crippled Christians on the appointed day, brought them to the palace, and told the startled emperor that "These are the treasures of the church!"
According to tradition, for his presumed impudence, Lawrence was then slowly roasted on a grill on the site of the Basilica di San Lorenzo in Rome, in the hope that he would publicly renounce his religion and reveal the names of the wealthy Christians. He is often represented holding a gridiron to memorialize this grisly manner of martyrdom. Although St. Lawrence was most certainly beheaded and not roasted, the traditions of his being cooked are somewhat stronger than actual fact. As a result, St Lawrence is also considered a patron saint for cooks.
....
His feast day is August 10th, and is usually celebrated by librarians and archivists (in honor of his traditional method of death) with cold cuts.
--- End quote ---
Sounds like a decent man.
I also found that black Madonnas are found in 3 places in Greece, connected to mythical places/events, and blood, rape and the underworld. Probably the Greeks took dark literally :/ :
-http://gogreece.about.com/od/specialinterests1/tp/blackmadonna.htm
--- Quote ---1. The Black Madonna of the Nekromanteion [seen in picture above]
An example of trompe l'oeil painting, the chapel that is built on top of an alleged ancient entrance to the underworld once ruled over by Persephone and Pluto conceals an unexpected image of a Black Madonna, invisible until you approach it closely.
2. Lesvos - Taxiarchis Monastery
A sculptured image of Mary is displayed here at this monastery on the island of Lesvos just outside the village of Mandamathos (Mandamadhos). This sacred image is partially encased in silver. The "clay" from which it is formed is said to be made from the blood of slaughtered monks which stained the earth.
3. Crete - St. Titus' Basilica, Gortyn
This very early Christian basilica contains an icon of a Black Madonna in the ruined church, which is still used for services. The site is also by the sacred tree where Europa is said to have mated with Zeus and conceived their sons Minos, Rhadamanthys, and Sarpedon.
--- End quote ---
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