Clues in forum names?

Hi All

Over the last few months I've been trying to apply mirrors offered to others to myself, and see how they fit. Its been bringing up quite a few things.
This question was brought up by a recent thread and recalling previous threads that have mentioned chosen forum names as possible clues in regards to the poster (that even they might not see).
Perhaps its a the theological clue?

Anyway, I applied that to myself and was hit by absolute panic at the thought...which I now find both worrying and intriguing.
I think I'm too close to this to unpick it by myself so would like to ask for some feedback/mirroring on this.

I chose this username about 14 years ago now when I was at college, and have carried it ever since. I realise I am heavily invested in it, especially emotionally (which I am going to explore after posting this). It was at a time where my social isolation program was running full tilt, and being a teenager this didn't help things.
I use to watch a cartoon involving anthropomorphous animals, several of which where foxes. Because of a relationship between two of them I identified at the time with the 'external' emotions involved....which is where my investment in the name (idea/identity) came from.

I think the panic at confronting this identity of mine comes partly (majorly?) from fear of rejection (by the forum) but I am uncertain if this is all of it, or if its as simple as that?

Hi Redfox,
What if this panic just comes from the fact that you just discovered a hidden program you weren't aware of before? You remember me of a discussion I had with a forum member about that program of acting/saying what would please the forum in order to be accepted. This is very common when we join a group but your investigation is a little different and maybe the reason is more profond. Hope you share your finding to mirror our own panics :)
From my own little experience, discovering programs in oneself is very painful. Yes you feel a little better and freer afterwards but at moment it is scary to see that we don't control our inner life. Maybe I am projecting onto your case but ultimately, could it be a working hypothesis?

Hi Redfox,

I also have used the mirrors for others on myself, or sometimes a mirror comes as a story being told in conjunction with self reflection; it was actually through an indirect mirror that I got my first glimpse of myself. So for a long time I would only seek out mirrors through such ways and it naturally became mechanical. In order to operate like this, I had to be overly careful with how I was presenting myself and how little of myself I chose to share. My experience is while indirect mirrors can be helpful, seeking them can easily be a way of keeping the predators mind hidden.

As for your nick, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. I don't know that there is any theological significance, but since you mention an identification with it and it's history, there could be something there. We can all act as foxes in the chicken coup, but I suppose the important thing is if we're willing to share enough of ourselves to see that. Perhaps your negative introject is getting more of a meal over your angst over your nick than you are getting in terms of discovering truth? Maybe the nick served you well in college - with little knowledge to counter a self absorbed environment, feeling maladjusted to it can be be normal.

I think I remember the C's saying how much we obsess over names (or something like that). We probably do.

RedFox said:

I think the panic at confronting this identity of mine comes partly (majorly?) from fear of rejection (by the forum) but I am uncertain if this is all of it, or if its as simple as that?

Click to expand...

I think I understand where you're coming from.

A couple of years ago, I had to change the nick I'd been using for about ten years, for a purely technical reason. I changed everything over to "PepperFritz", but still kept an old email account in the old name, with mail from that account being automatically forwarded to my current one. Recently I had to go into that old account, and was surprised by the deep cringe of shame I felt at the old nick, at the (now) obvious self-importance it screamed, at the person I had been when I used to use it. I had an immediate urge to delete the account, but then stopped myself. I realized it would probably do me good to have that reminder around, to make sure that I would never forget what a foolish, puffed-up, self-absorbed, fraud I had been for so long, and how easy it would be to fall back asleep and walk in those shoes again.

Perhaps you also have "shameful" -- or maybe "painful" -- associations with the nickname, in terms of who you were when you first adopted it?

Redfox says:
I think the panic at confronting this identity of mine comes partly (majorly?) from fear of rejection (by the forum) but I am uncertain if this is all of it, or if its as simple as that?

Click to expand...

Maybe it has to do with the concept of 'identity'. Isn't that part of the allure to an 'online nickname', the ability to 'reinvent oneself'? If a person doesn't feel able to be open in life, then goes on to create an online identity, wouldn't it follow that this identity would be a strongly held 'I', bringing up all the hidden programs tied to suppressed emotions?

My nick 'Gimpy' is an adjective of real life: I walk with a cane, and without one I limp. :)

That said, there's more in it than that: self-pity, false sense of victimization, 'suffering', etc. Those are emotions/programs that need to be acknowledged and worked through daily, the nick itself reminds me of that.

Maybe thinking through the nickname Redfox, and observing what bubbles up, will help you find these identity-programs, so you can suss them out?

Redfox said:

I think the panic at confronting this identity of mine comes partly (majorly?) from fear of rejection (by the forum) but I am uncertain if this is all of it, or if its as simple as that?

Click to expand...

More important than confronting the identify is, I think, confronting why you would feel fear of rejection by the forum.

Your posts are, (and I've read a lot of them), as far as I can tell, externally considerate, thoughtful, empathetic, informed and to the point.

Redfox said:

I chose this username about 14 years ago now when I was at college, and have carried it ever since. I realise I am heavily invested in it, especially emotionally (which I am going to explore after posting this). It was at a time where my social isolation program was running full tilt, and being a teenager this didn't help things.

Click to expand...

It sounds as though you were going through a difficult time at this stage, and withdrew perhaps to figure things out.
As the parent of a teenager, I actually find it rather endearing that you watched cartoons about anthrpomorphic animals at this point in your life - a little solace for yourself which hurt no one.

You didn't share what "the external emotions of two of them (the foxes)" were that you identified with, but whatever they were they evoked something inside of you at the time which you identified with and which, it seems, you're questioning now.

Isn't a significant part of the work of the forum freeing ourselves from Identification? Isn't that what you're doing?

Would you, as a member of the forum, reject someone else going through a similar struggle.?

Do you think you have to be perfect to be accepted here? I don't think that the issue is that the forum will reject you - I think that the issue is that you are rejecting a part of yourself.

RedFox said:

This question was brought up by a recent thread and recalling previous threads that have mentioned chosen forum names as possible clues in regards to the poster (that even they might not see).

Click to expand...

Well, the idea behind that is based on the idea that we inhabit a symbolic reality/symbolic Universe. I think this is very much the case, much more so than people generally consider. Not only do our subconscious minds send out all sorts of symbolic clues to others about what is going on inside us in everything from voice intonation to disease to verbiage or posture and more, but the 'Universe' sends out seemingly limitless information to us, symbolically via our 'reality'. I've often wondered if our entire reality isn't comprised solely of symbolic messages/information from the Universe to us - but that's a bit of a digression.

Regarding usernames, it came to our attention quite a while ago that, almost without exception, the trolls and pathologicals who visited this forum would reveal what they were, either through their username or their avatar - as if they could not refrain from doing so - or as if whatever was acting through them needed to leave a little calling card. So, we noted it on the forum, occasionally, when it was very obvious.

rf said:

Anyway, I applied that to myself and was hit by absolute panic at the thought...which I now find both worrying and intriguing.
I think I'm too close to this to unpick it by myself so would like to ask for some feedback/mirroring on this.

Click to expand...

I think what Los wrote might apply:

Los said:

Perhaps your negative introject is getting more of a meal over your angst over your nick than you are getting in terms of discovering truth?

Click to expand...

Perhaps some part of you is feeding on this? It might be worth considering. Ultimately, since we all choose our usernames, we all have personal reasons for doing so, thus there is some level of identification with them, be it small or large. I'm not saying that it's useless to contemplate such things as self-examination, but getting worked up into a panic about it indicates that something else is going on ( aside from a possible misuse of energy from different centers - ultimately if one is panicked by something that should not, objectively, cause a panic, then, at the very least, they are likely thinking with the energy of the emotional center).

So, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar - or not. Recapitulation is powerful, so I'm not dismissing your exploration, just suggesting that the emotional reaction to it might indicate that some feeding is going on, on some level, in some way - or I could be completely mistaken. fwiw.

Hey Redfox,

considering names and nicknames , I have been reminded of a small excerpt in ISOTM:

ISOTM said:

With this began long talks about the impressions that a man produces on other
people and how he can produce a desirable or an undesirable impression.
Those around him see a man's chief feature however hidden it may be. Of course
they cannot always define it. But their definitions are often very good and very near.
Take nicknames. Nicknames sometimes define chief features very well.

Click to expand...

gimpy said:

[...] If a person doesn't feel able to be open in life, then goes on to create an online identity, wouldn't it follow that this identity would be a strongly held 'I', bringing up all the hidden programs tied to suppressed emotions?

Click to expand...

In my personal case I can agree on it, that a nickname can describe a part of a human very well and also a part that is suppressed and not even acknowledged yet.
The name -the attribute- of it than can shed some light on where to work on, or to look for more information.

Hello Redfox,

I have recently went through the process of dealing with my own nick. While my situation is quite different than yours, it still brings to mind all the different and unique actions and events that go into ones creation of a nick. I created mine several years ago, based on a event in my life. After a lot of recapitulation and dealing with many of my little I's, I was finally able to let it go.

I was finally able to realize the real reasons I had created it; to draw attention to myself, and feed on those who were drawn into asking. I was asking for pity, and attention! I realized this about a year ago, and have finally starting dealing with it. Most people would never be able to see this from my former nick, as you would have to know me to have any clues. My point is, I identified the issue and made the move to correct the problem.

You have received a great deal of input in this thread. I think it is up to you to decide where to go from here.

Good Luck,

gwb
formerly (gwb1995)

RedFox said:

Anyway, I applied that to myself and was hit by absolute panic at the thought...which I now find both worrying and intriguing.
I think I'm too close to this to unpick it by myself so would like to ask for some feedback/mirroring on this.
[...]
I think the panic at confronting this identity of mine comes partly (majorly?) from fear of rejection (by the forum) but I am uncertain if this is all of it, or if its as simple as that?

Click to expand...

Hi RedFox;

Please excuse the lengthy post, but maybe I can offer something that might help.

I don't think there's enough information in your post to offer specific comments on, but if it makes you feel any better, I'm sure, at one time or another, we've all created and become heavily invested in one or more of our "I's".
If I'm understanding you correctly, you're afraid that your nick is possibly attached to some undesirable part of you and that, possibly, the forum may be aware (or may become aware) of this "something" about you that you are not (aware of).

Well, I can only speak for myself, but all I see is "RedFox" and my only associations with it are your posts. It seems to me that you are simply identifying with a confused emotional understanding regarding your chosen nick.

What does your "observer I" note about all this?

Check out "Expanding the present moment":

[quote author=http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=ogi4a9p8jqacfd5pmf256rg540&topic=22.msg561#msg561]
[...]
"Now, next time try to feel the heat and turn your "self viewer" on yourself, inside, so that you sort of say "whoah! What am I feeling? Why am I feeling it? What is reasonable about what I am feeling? Let me go over in my mind carefully; what IS reasonable and what I know to be true based on FACTS...?" and so on. Keep thinking hard and feeling the heat, and keeping it below the level of the neck. DOing this while in the state of heat is truly a magical act."
[...][/quote]


Have you explored the dissociation/narcissism angle? For all I know, you could have created this nick/identity during an over-compensation reaction to your negative introject.

This may be interesting: (emphasis mine)

From Laura:
[quote author=http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=6989.msg49142#msg49142]
What often happens in an individual who has a strong negative introject as described by Goulomb above, is that he/she cannot bear this constant "self-criticism" because it is too painful. So, he creates his own buffers/programs against it which generally are very narcissistic and "self-important."
[...]
The way this happens is described in Martha Stout's book, "The Myth of Sanity." It is called "dissociation." When the negative introject comes in, the individual dissociates into fantasy about the self being strong and powerful, capable, able to outsmart everyone else, getting even, being a misunderstood messiah, and so on.

...when you are grown up, you have all these automatic ways of thinking about yourself that are absolutely contradictory, and you spend most of your time shifting from the negative introject to any one of many dissociated states that deny the introject and provide a "saving fantasy" all of which precludes your being able to deal with what is here, now.
[...]
Just a series of words that remind you of the "old days" is enough to trigger the automatic running of the program.

Quite often, the narcissistic programs include a lot of negative thoughts about other people which are designed to put them down, to diminish them, to cast them in a bad light because that is how the narcissistic program works: anything that starts the negative introject MUST be destroyed! The instant the negative half of the emotional center starts to vibrate, that energy can be usurped by the intellectual center, and all kinds of thoughts that have no basis in reality begin to run through the mind.[/quote]


Additionally, PepperFritz's stating "...a foolish, puffed-up, self-absorbed, fraud I had been for so long", struck a chord with me.

I have been heavily invested in many "I's" relating to my immersion in "Neo-Tech", Dianetics, some limited education and training in Scientology and my own research from Adam Smith's Economics to Baruch Spinoza's philosophy and everything Aristotle and Plato.

For a long time on this forum, I felt the presence of "I's" and their fear of being exposed as frauds, but what am I to do? I find myself in the midst of everyone here now. The work I'm interested in doing doesn't support the idea of running away and hiding out of fear - just the opposite - I'm excited about the possibility of exposing my fraudulent I's and making myself a unified "I". I just hope I make it long enough to see all that happen in this lifetime.


Hope this helps!

Hi All

Just wanted to say thanks for all the replies. Its taken me some time to get round to replying to this thread, between holidays, a huge amount of high strangeness and my programs going nuts and running amok (in my head mostly) while trying to get to the bottom of it all its been a weird old week!

My apologies if this post turns out a bit long, but I (think) I've learnt a lot I'd like to share.

Starting with the idea that led to the panic...the theological meaning of forum names

anart said:

Well, the idea behind that is based on the idea that we inhabit a symbolic reality/symbolic Universe. I think this is very much the case, much more so than people generally consider. Not only do our subconscious minds send out all sorts of symbolic clues to others about what is going on inside us in everything from voice intonation to disease to verbiage or posture and more, but the 'Universe' sends out seemingly limitless information to us, symbolically via our 'reality'. I've often wondered if our entire reality isn't comprised solely of symbolic messages/information from the Universe to us - but that's a bit of a digression.

Regarding usernames, it came to our attention quite a while ago that, almost without exception, the trolls and pathologicals who visited this forum would reveal what they were, either through their username or their avatar - as if they could not refrain from doing so - or as if whatever was acting through them needed to leave a little calling card. So, we noted it on the forum, occasionally, when it was very obvious.

Click to expand...

This sums up completely the idea I tried applying to my own forum name...
I could see my panic was completely out of proportion but couldn't at the time separate myself enough from it/its related thinking.

The observations here (especially of 'me') helped me see how negative this was towards myself....buddies final point brings it home

buddy said:

For a long time on this forum, I felt the presence of "I's" and their fear of being exposed as frauds, but what am I to do? I find myself in the midst of everyone here now. The work I'm interested in doing doesn't support the idea of running away and hiding out of fear - just the opposite - I'm excited about the possibility of exposing my fraudulent I's and making myself a unified "I". I just hope I make it long enough to see all that happen in this lifetime.

Click to expand...

It reminded me of why I started persuing all this :)

anart said:

Los said:

Perhaps your negative introject is getting more of a meal over your angst over your nick than you are getting in terms of discovering truth?

Click to expand...

Perhaps some part of you is feeding on this? It might be worth considering. Ultimately, since we all choose our usernames, we all have personal reasons for doing so, thus there is some level of identification with them, be it small or large. I'm not saying that it's useless to contemplate such things as self-examination, but getting worked up into a panic about it indicates that something else is going on ( aside from a possible misuse of energy from different centers - ultimately if one is panicked by something that should not, objectively, cause a panic, then, at the very least, they are likely thinking with the energy of the emotional center).

So, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar - or not. Recapitulation is powerful, so I'm not dismissing your exploration, just suggesting that the emotional reaction to it might indicate that some feeding is going on, on some level, in some way - or I could be completely mistaken. fwiw.

Click to expand...

It took me a while to mull this over to start to understand it....
Judging by my state of mind during the experience it was a missuse of energy, and part of me was quite probably feeding on another part of me. This is something I've been trying to figure out for a while, so would like to double check.....is it possible for one 'I' to feed off 'yourself'?? Because this is the conclusion I'm starting to draw.
I've been aware for some time (way before sott) how I could/did feed off others and vowed to not do so again. I've not always been successful, but to consider internal feeding is new to me....reading back over some of my other posts it does look like this may be what I've been doing.

Presumably if the negative introject is just the internalised negative elements of the parent(s), then any feeding the parents did could possibly be internalised too?


Without replying to everone individually (which is what I started doing, but realised it was going to turn into an essay! lol) I'll try and sum up what else I've uncovered.
I had a few milder repeats of the dream I posted about being rejected by my friends/girlfriend, combined with a dream of being in prison and asking why I was there and no one able to answer me, half waking into a state of fighting something intangible (reminded me of Laura's 'dream' of eclipsing energy centres), it was like someone had metaphorically kicked a wasps nest...pretty much all my programs had there volume turned up to max this week.
Trying to observe everything ended up making everything worse....until I realised something important in that my observing would alter what I was observing. I appeared to be buffering whatever part of me I actively observed.
It turns out that I need to observe the part of me that creates buffers (is capable of shutting off any part of me) in order to be able to observe. I don't think I'[d have seen that if the colume of all the programs wasn't up so high.

Ok, so to the root cause of the panic. Without going into too much details, my mums mum was probably a genuine narcicist, my mum did the best she could and has had therapy to deal with most of her issues, but not until after I was born. From what she's told me and from what I've so far peiced together almost from day one I must have learnt to suppress my own needs/expressions/emotions in certain areas as it would be 'too much' for her and she would shut down.

Trapped in the Mirror said:

Fear of separation rules Delores's life, much of which has its basis in her mother's narcissistic isolation as well as her dad's abandonment. Separation anxiety often has its origin in the period around age two when the child needs to practice separation by coming and going from his parent. The child returns periodically for "refueling", which means to feel the parent's happy greeting assuring him that all is well. A favorable response shows that his independent action is acceptable and that the parent will be there when needed.

Click to expand...

I have memories of having to sneak away from my mother to be able to practice autonomy, all the while knowing that I only had moments to lesson her 'fear', or she would 'shut down'.
She hid it well (to some degree) but I've always been highly empathic (or so it seems)...perhaps even over sensitive to other feelings (up until recently).

With all this in mind I've actually been able to feel some of the pain related to this (before it'd appear and part of me would buffer it, then the other programs would run). I had a waking version of the dream I posted, with my girlfriend leaving and for the first time in I don't know how long actually really started to feel what I must have felt years ago. Ouch...
I can't feel its full intensity yet, or for long periods it seems without programs kicking in. But I know I must feel it to be free of it.

....I remember feeling the same panic at the thought my nickname might be hiding something the first day she left me at primary school, when I realised after some time she had gone. I think I've got a handle on dealing with the disassociation of all this, its the drive behind the programs I'm working at.

My mother also had quite a bit of paranoia, between this and other things I seemed to lack tools for social interactions.
I can also see how all of this (around the time of secondary school and then college) turned into feeling socially isolated, and rejected by women.
Choosing my nickname after watching the animated foxes came about due to a story of two of them, the male being a social outcast finding the love of a female. I'd drift off into fantasies of actually being a 'fox'. Fortunately before and once finding my girlfriend I've been quite happy being human :P

Its dawned on me that perhaps the reason this emotional pain seems such a big thing to deal with is that, thought avoiding it all this time its become identified as all 'I' am. So have the programs around it.
A false centre of gravity?
Now all I have to do is get past my earliest emotional defences.....hm

Hopefully I'm on the right track with all this!


On a a different note...

anart said:

I've often wondered if our entire reality isn't comprised solely of symbolic messages/information from the Universe to us - but that's a bit of a digression.

Click to expand...

Its something I'm exploring at the moment...if I can gather enough data I'll post some idea on this later. :)

Hi All,

This thread has been hugely insightful for me. Firstly about the names, my own nickname "Kinyash" which is a true nickname was given to me when I first went to Form 1 (about 13 years old). At one point in time I decided that I did not want this nickname and informed everyone of the same. One of the senior boys reacted immediately by shouting the name back at me and in fact he marched me bakc to my dorm shouting out this nickname to all and sundry. By the time he was through the name was pretty permanent!

As I recapitulated these events, I suddenly realised that I spent a lot of time in high school in a dream world created by my negative introject exactly as described in Buddy's post below.

Buddy said:

From Laura:

What often happens in an individual who has a strong negative introject as described by Goulomb above, is that he/she cannot bear this constant "self-criticism" because it is too painful. So, he creates his own buffers/programs against it which generally are very narcissistic and "self-important."
[...]
The way this happens is described in Martha Stout's book, "The Myth of Sanity." It is called "dissociation." When the negative introject comes in, the individual dissociates into fantasy about the self being strong and powerful, capable, able to outsmart everyone else, getting even, being a misunderstood messiah, and so on.

...when you are grown up, you have all these automatic ways of thinking about yourself that are absolutely contradictory, and you spend most of your time shifting from the negative introject to any one of many dissociated states that deny the introject and provide a "saving fantasy" all of which precludes your being able to deal with what is here, now.
[...]

Click to expand...

This dreaming was a way of escaping the shock of boarding school, bullying and missing home. Indeed it did help me survive and to a large extent crafted who "I" am i.e. one of my many "I's". Initially the dreams were all narcissistic but "positive" in the sense that I was the hero of one sort or another-sports, girls admiring me etc etc. However, somewhere along the line my imagination took a turn and I started visualising fights with bullies and how I would beat them up totally. At one time I believed in my dreams so much that I decided I would take on the main bully when he came around next. I can't recall exactly what happened but at the last moment something stopped me from reacting. later I felt so stupid at even thinking I could take on this bully in a physical fight when he was twice my size. I was on a self destruct program!

I can now see how this dreaming still continues in my life and I often catch myself doing what I now understand to be my intellectual centre hijacking the energy from my negative emotional center. Believe me it is not pleasant where the mind can go, and I have experienced several close calls when driving! Over the last three years or so due to self observation, I am often able to recognise when this is happening and bring it to a halt. The amazing thing is that "i" do this reluctantly and within me is a desire to play out the full dream. I can see now from this thread where this all originated.

Back to "work"!

Kinyash

I think any progressive person changes quite frequently and nick names made long ago become null and void.

I think of nicknames i made for using online when i was 16 and i would not choose the same nickname now because it seems childish or too different to what i am now.

I've done research into nickname choices in the past to see if there are any patterns to people choices, and it seems to be quite random for most people, people choose whatever they were thinking at the time, day, minute and often just stick with that for consistency.

However if you picked a nickname because you wanted people to perceive you in a certain way then that possibly does say something about your state of mind/ego.

And symbolically, well not everyone makes nicknames, some people just use their name or shorter version of their name, so all in all i would just say it's something that meant something to you at the time and you stuck with it.

I'm sure a lot of us that made nicknames in our teens laugh at it now :)