'Missing 411', by David Paulides: Tracking unusual missing persons cases
- Thread starter findit
- Start date
Jtucker
Jedi Master
New Paulides' Interview on Coast to Coast. Some fascinating stuff regarding urban disappearances.
The Elisa Lam evidence is reviewed around 1:50:00 and Dave has some great points that indicate the impossibility of of her death being a suicide.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ORWJgFxU14&feature=youtu.be
Apparently there's an International Reptoid Resistance Movement - and a caller from that group comes in at 2:20:00ish. He actually asks an interesting question. I felt he was sort of asking about TDARM. A lot of the callers seem pretty lucid, and not chasing UFO's which is encouraging for Coast to Coast.
Around the 2:34:00 mark a caller mentions that Coroners/M.E.'s are FBI plants? Interesting point. How do Medical Examiners/Coroners get appointed?
Something that I hope gets explored along these lines is the bizarre newspaper article from the LA Times,
_http://www.metatech.org/wp/reptilians/underground-city-reptilians-aliens-los-angeles/
The actual newspaper article from the period seems pretty detailed.
Also the Kenny Veach story is mentioned. Very unusual... To almost predict your own disappearance _http://www.viralnova.com/m-cave/
The Elisa Lam evidence is reviewed around 1:50:00 and Dave has some great points that indicate the impossibility of of her death being a suicide.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ORWJgFxU14&feature=youtu.be
Apparently there's an International Reptoid Resistance Movement - and a caller from that group comes in at 2:20:00ish. He actually asks an interesting question. I felt he was sort of asking about TDARM. A lot of the callers seem pretty lucid, and not chasing UFO's which is encouraging for Coast to Coast.
Around the 2:34:00 mark a caller mentions that Coroners/M.E.'s are FBI plants? Interesting point. How do Medical Examiners/Coroners get appointed?
Something that I hope gets explored along these lines is the bizarre newspaper article from the LA Times,
_http://www.metatech.org/wp/reptilians/underground-city-reptilians-aliens-los-angeles/
The actual newspaper article from the period seems pretty detailed.
Also the Kenny Veach story is mentioned. Very unusual... To almost predict your own disappearance _http://www.viralnova.com/m-cave/
That Lam case was definitely very strange.Jtucker said:
Most of the cases were young men, with an unusually high proportion of those men being German (as in some of the Missing 411 clusters) and also having an interest in religion.
Paulides mentioned the pressure he had received from people to just come out and admit that Bigfoot was responsible for the Missing 411 cases. He felt vindicated now in refusing to do so, as these urban cases look like the same kind of thing is going on, without so much reason to think "Bigfoot" is involved.
Paulides mentioned that at one cluster of Missing 411 cases, there had been one particular individual working for the FBI to monitor those cases. Paulides went back to interview one of the families, and asked if there were anything else that he (Paulides) didn't know about the case. They told him that that FBI individual had since commited suicide.
I was just looking through the Eliza Lam case thread, and I do think in this recent interview Paulides made it sound a bit stranger than it was. He mentioned how the water tanks were 8 ft tall with smooth sides, as if it would be impossible for someone to climb to the top of them. But the pictures do show some railing at the side that one could use to climb up. Or there are stairs and a ladder to the top of the higher structure next to the tanks, from the roof of which one could drop down onto the tanks. These stairs and ladder are shown in this video at 3:32:Mal7 said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPHK5OO-NKU
Paulides also mentioned how they had to cut the tank to get her out. I was wondering if this meant she physically wouldn't fit through the hatch or not. If she physically wouldn't fit through the hatch, dead or alive, then this would be extremely strange, but it seems this wasn't the case. This was compared in the interview to the case of the farm where 4 bulls were mysteriously found inside a tank.
Mal7 said:
In one of the videos that Paulides did (can't remember which one), he said not to buy his books, but to buy Hunt for the Skinwalker and I think this was in response to questions of who was doing the abducting. In Hunt for the Skinwalker, there are a few sightings of hyperdimensional/interdimensional windows. So that could be a factor in some of the disappearances in a city, and, in the wild. There was even a description of a Bigfoot-type being coming through one of those windows in Hunt for the Skinwalker.
So a Bigfoot could be involved; and descriptions that sound a lot like Bigfoot have been stated several times by people witnessing something and by a few of those who were "returned".
Yes. I was thinking "vindicated" was maybe too strong a word. It wasn't the word Paulides used. He made the remarks about how people wanted him to admit it was Bigfoot near the end of the interview, after a couple of callers had called in with various explanations - it's aliens in spacecraft, it's demons. Paulides was continuing to take the same approach of refusing to commit to any particular explanation. "What's doing this?" - "I don't know." So he wasn't ruling out bigfoot.Nienna said:
In these new cases, many of the men were discovered many days later in water. But careful examinations by coroners showed they couldn't have been in the water the whole length of time that they were missing. So they must have been "held" somewhere, and then dumped in the water many days afterwards.
Jtucker
Jedi Master
Good point, Nienna, regarding the "Hunt for The Skinwalker" reference Paulides' has mentioned. I think in one of the earlier SOTT interview segments from a MUFON seminar he mentioned that book. I went and read the book and I think what stands out is that a group of independent researchers applied documented methodical controls to their investigation of the ranch. Reading between the lines, the investigators seemed to have been shocked by how much push back and derision they received for simply publishing the data. That in my opinion, could not be explained away as purely physical phenomena.
Out of the two missing 411 books I've read (North America & Beyond and Devils in The Details), only 1 case had actual Bigfoot connections - just Dennis Martin. There may be others in the first two books, but I am pretty sure they are not in the majority. That doesn't mean that there isn't a Bigfoot element involved, but the evidence just isn't there.
In my opinion, Paulides' has always hinted at a hyper-dimensional hypothesis for a good portion of the abductions he's investigated. I would have to go dig through the two books of his I have and find specific quotes, to find the exact instances. I think there could possibly be another level of explanation beyond the hyper-dimensional hypothesis, but I can't imagine what it might be. I agree that all the info from the C's and from hundreds of physical reports is that Sasquatches have a hyper-dimensional essence, but I don't think some other form of abduction can be ruled out.
Out of the two missing 411 books I've read (North America & Beyond and Devils in The Details), only 1 case had actual Bigfoot connections - just Dennis Martin. There may be others in the first two books, but I am pretty sure they are not in the majority. That doesn't mean that there isn't a Bigfoot element involved, but the evidence just isn't there.
In my opinion, Paulides' has always hinted at a hyper-dimensional hypothesis for a good portion of the abductions he's investigated. I would have to go dig through the two books of his I have and find specific quotes, to find the exact instances. I think there could possibly be another level of explanation beyond the hyper-dimensional hypothesis, but I can't imagine what it might be. I agree that all the info from the C's and from hundreds of physical reports is that Sasquatches have a hyper-dimensional essence, but I don't think some other form of abduction can be ruled out.
Jtucker
Jedi Master
"In these new cases, many of the men were discovered many days later in water. But careful examinations by coroners showed they couldn't have been in the water the whole length of time that they were missing. So they must have been "held" somewhere, and then dumped in the water many days afterwards."
Mal7, I think this is the key. There is a zero time element when these bodies are found days later with no lividity. If you look at he Cullen Finnerty case, this guy sounds like he's phoning home from another dimension while he's being pursued. I saw this case on Dateline a few months ago and it laid out the evidence and then twisted the conclusion, IMO.
In his cell phone calls where he doesn't know where he is, he's panicking. The area he should be in (physically) in has been known to him his entire life. And this guy is a high level football player who is not afraid of physical threats. He has monster defensive lineman coming at him for three hours a week trying to take him down.
Mal7, I think this is the key. There is a zero time element when these bodies are found days later with no lividity. If you look at he Cullen Finnerty case, this guy sounds like he's phoning home from another dimension while he's being pursued. I saw this case on Dateline a few months ago and it laid out the evidence and then twisted the conclusion, IMO.
In his cell phone calls where he doesn't know where he is, he's panicking. The area he should be in (physically) in has been known to him his entire life. And this guy is a high level football player who is not afraid of physical threats. He has monster defensive lineman coming at him for three hours a week trying to take him down.
Jtucker
Jedi Master
Mal7 said:
I would add to this how someone actually gets on a roof in an old hotel.
I'm a bit of a buff for old architecture and have tried my best to explore the nether regions of early 20th century hotels. To get on the roof of where you're not supposed to be is very hard. I can't say I've been to the Cecil in L.A. but I have tried to get onto hotel roofs in in NYC and here in Canada (sometimes successfully). I would say with Elisa Lam, why would she ever go up there? For the most part, there are numerous locked doors and there is never a straight path to the roof. Taking into account the area of downtown L.A., if she was the victim of a killer, there are hundreds of easier places to dump a body with little effort if you look at L.A. county murder cases. Carrying even a 100 lb girl up stairways and up a ladder to put her in a tank doesn't seem like the path of easiest resistance psychopaths would take.
Also, from what I've seen in NYC, the ladders that lead up to the top of these cistern/water tanks is really steep and rarely maintained. Not something that would appeal to someone attempting suicide. Why not just jump off the roof - accepting that you could make it up there? And if the elevator footage is accurate about her state of mind at the time, then she seems really freaked out. Navigating the stairwells and the locked doors to get to the roof seems less likely than another more immediate action going into the street or the lobby?
I think when she exited that elevator, she left our 3D reality IMO.
Jtucker said:
There were other strange things about the case. e.g. an uncommon form of Tuberculosis occurred in the area after, which is tested for by a test called the "Lam-Elisa" test. Also bloodhound dogs found no trace of her on the roof. Her cellphone was missing and never found.
I think if it were foul play, hiding the body on the roof wouldn't be that strange, as opposed to removing the body from the building and driving around LA with it. The locked doors and alarms could be accounted for if there was an inside connection - someone with keys and able to switch off the alarm.
The ladder could be vertical and I think someone could still be carried up it, using the fireman's carry with the person over their shoulders. This would be difficult and strenuous, but not impossible. The maintenance of the ladder I don't think would be an issue. The ladders are made of solid metal and be unlikely to become so corroded that they can no longer be used. This video, (real AFAIK) show's someone carrying a motorbike up a ladder on their head: :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1OD-GHql6o
I think locked doors would tend to rule out suicide as being likely, if the locked doors were the only access to the roof. I think it was said somewhere that the roof could also be accessed by the fire escape ladders? If for some reason the doors weren't actually locked on this day, or it was possible to bypass the locked doors, then I think suicide could still be considered. (Or perhaps not exactly suicide, but a disturbed mental state causing someone to climb around on the roof, and then go through the hatch on a water tank, and become trapped.)
Jtucker
Jedi Master
Good point about the potential of an inside job. The hotel is not usual in terms of what I have experienced. It has a very nasty past.
_http://www.xojane.com/fun/the-cecil-hotel-elisa-lam
It is completely possible that this was a ritualistic killing. Tila Tequila (not that I'm quoting her as a sober source) also tweeted that Elisa Lam was ritualistically killed (as was Paul Walker). Regardless of the source, downtown L.A. has a long history of ritual killings.
I think it's possible that Elisa's story may converge with some of the Laurel Canyon doings that Dave Mc Gowan investigated in Laurel Canyon. Although it's not 100% accurate (there's a thread here in detail), it may capture some of the "deals" made in L.A. that still are going on. That being said, I still feel that Elisa Lam's story is not a human abduction. I don't think the evidence has enough human imprints to make it viable IMO. I'm not ruling it out, but it feels outside a "Skid Row" hotel murder. To me, with the video, and the detailed misdirected investigation it feels like one of Keel's reports from West V where way too many disinfo (at the time) agents are involved to obscure the evidence.
_http://www.xojane.com/fun/the-cecil-hotel-elisa-lam
It is completely possible that this was a ritualistic killing. Tila Tequila (not that I'm quoting her as a sober source) also tweeted that Elisa Lam was ritualistically killed (as was Paul Walker). Regardless of the source, downtown L.A. has a long history of ritual killings.
I think it's possible that Elisa's story may converge with some of the Laurel Canyon doings that Dave Mc Gowan investigated in Laurel Canyon. Although it's not 100% accurate (there's a thread here in detail), it may capture some of the "deals" made in L.A. that still are going on. That being said, I still feel that Elisa Lam's story is not a human abduction. I don't think the evidence has enough human imprints to make it viable IMO. I'm not ruling it out, but it feels outside a "Skid Row" hotel murder. To me, with the video, and the detailed misdirected investigation it feels like one of Keel's reports from West V where way too many disinfo (at the time) agents are involved to obscure the evidence.
hiker said:Keit said:hiker said:Paulides was recently interviewed on "coast to coast" about the movie, with listeners calling in during the show. A woman by the name of Gina calls in at 1:24:50, with a "survivor story". She appears to be genuinely shaken and scared telling about the experience, which sounds like a really scary high strangeness situation. It's one thing to read about the cases, but listening to people telling about their experiences really brings things to life.
_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUZhxOtfxQs
Just a note that the video was removed by the user. Do you by any chance know the date of the interview? Because I tried looking for it on YT, and found this one, but I don't think it's recent, just uploaded recently. Thanks.
I think the date was 20th July 2015, the interviewer George Noory. The Coast to Coast website seems to have the interview (one has to sign in to be able to listen/ download, I haven't tried that yet).
Feels somehow suspicious that the youtube version was removed...
_http://www.coasttocoastam.com/show/2015/07/20
I found it by this U-tuber Post-Conflict September
Coast To Coast AM - August 30, 2015 Urban Disappearances
_https://youtu.be/3ORWJgFxU14
This is a recent incident as discussed on "Coast To Coast AM - August 30, 2015 Urban Disappearances" by Paulides.
News cast videos included.
Two articles from the same Station. The discovery and the conformation.
Family of Missing San Francisco Tech Worker Says His Body Was Found in SF Bay
Updated at 1:36 PM PDT on Thursday, Nov 13, 2014
_http://abc7news.com/news/family-believes-body-found-in-sf-bay-is-dan-ha/392387/
_http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Family-of-Missing-San-Francisco-Tech-Worker-to-Hold-Press-Conference-282450491.html
Also Two recent incidents Yosemite Ca.
09/05/2015 AT 05:30 PM
Missing Hiker Is Found Dead in Yosemite, Adding to Summer of Tragic Incidents at National Parks Across the Country
_http://www.people.com/article/missing-hiker-found-dead-in-yosemite-national-park
Also
YOSEMITE NATIONAL PARK Monday, March 23, 2015
Family finds missing hiker injured in Yosemite
_http://abc30.com/news/family-finds-missing-hiker-injured-in-yosemite/569675/
Three Edits:
News cast videos included.
Two articles from the same Station. The discovery and the conformation.
Family of Missing San Francisco Tech Worker Says His Body Was Found in SF Bay
Updated at 1:36 PM PDT on Thursday, Nov 13, 2014
_http://abc7news.com/news/family-believes-body-found-in-sf-bay-is-dan-ha/392387/
_http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Family-of-Missing-San-Francisco-Tech-Worker-to-Hold-Press-Conference-282450491.html
Also Two recent incidents Yosemite Ca.
09/05/2015 AT 05:30 PM
Missing Hiker Is Found Dead in Yosemite, Adding to Summer of Tragic Incidents at National Parks Across the Country
_http://www.people.com/article/missing-hiker-found-dead-in-yosemite-national-park
Also
YOSEMITE NATIONAL PARK Monday, March 23, 2015
Family finds missing hiker injured in Yosemite
_http://abc30.com/news/family-finds-missing-hiker-injured-in-yosemite/569675/
Three Edits:
Attachments
kalibex
Dagobah Resident
Just got his most recent book (Missing 411: A Sobering Coincidence) in the mail yesterday - a bit hesitant to start it, as I know that a feeling of impotent frustration (to say the least) will accompany the reading of it.
I think people used to face up more forthrightly to the fact that yes, we humans appear to have our own predators (from above and beyond the usual consensus reality). At the moment, it's that cognitive dissonance 'But...but...we're the top of the food chain - there's nothing out there that can 'get' us!' versus 'No, you're not. And people are plucked out of this reality every so often...' that causes that distress, I suppose.
Assuming that hypothesis is 'correct' (or correct enough), that yes, humans are occasionally plucked up out of our consensus reality, from forest and field, from city streets, some to be 'returned', some not... would our culture (re)recognizing that, it becoming simple common knowledge (again) be of any benefit? (Assuming such a paradigm change was even possible, which it may not be.)
Does simply knowing that there may be a 'hand', poised to pluck you up, that this could happen at any time, confer enough protection to 'stay' that hand?
If not, our cultural 'amnesia/denial' could be seen as simple self-kindness and an inevitability.
I think people used to face up more forthrightly to the fact that yes, we humans appear to have our own predators (from above and beyond the usual consensus reality). At the moment, it's that cognitive dissonance 'But...but...we're the top of the food chain - there's nothing out there that can 'get' us!' versus 'No, you're not. And people are plucked out of this reality every so often...' that causes that distress, I suppose.
Assuming that hypothesis is 'correct' (or correct enough), that yes, humans are occasionally plucked up out of our consensus reality, from forest and field, from city streets, some to be 'returned', some not... would our culture (re)recognizing that, it becoming simple common knowledge (again) be of any benefit? (Assuming such a paradigm change was even possible, which it may not be.)
Does simply knowing that there may be a 'hand', poised to pluck you up, that this could happen at any time, confer enough protection to 'stay' that hand?
If not, our cultural 'amnesia/denial' could be seen as simple self-kindness and an inevitability.