Open Mindedness, objective "morality" about eating

Today I've been reading an article on sott that telled that thoses signs we might have in common here in this community (mental illness, worriness, open mindedness, loneliness, lazyness, trustiness, ...) may be signs of high intelligence.

https://www.sott.net/article/326190-7-signs-that-you-are-probably-smarter-than-average-no-IQ-test-required?utm_content=buffera77ef&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

This part in particular caught my attention, ...

3. New ideas

Set against the higher levels of mental illness and anxiety, is the fact that more intelligent people are more likely to come up with new ideas.

Historically, that might mean rejecting superstition and finding new ways of organizing society.

One study argues that this explains why more intelligent people are more likely to be atheists and more likely to be politically liberal (Kanazawa et al., 2010).

This study found that young adults who described themselves as 'very conservative' had an average IQ of 95, while those who described themselves as 'very liberal' had an average IQ of 106.

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because later on I sumbled upon a video on facebook that prompted me to think I may be too much liberal or open minded to not be outraged over some kind of eating customs in asia...

The video was about a chinese man eating a frog while still alive. I quickly browse for youtube to find this video and similar to see the comments, and as I expected, the video and others alikes had a lots of dislikes and intollerant, mean comments and paramoralism like "someone kill him", "asian are nasty..." etc...

Here if you want to see but beware for sensitive people (graphic!!!)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca0wZCVD9M8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIybhJOracw

While I admit I've felt choked and disguted about this type of eating , I was also having a weird laughing about it and then I felt more disgusted and outraged on the intolerance from the massively negative comment...
I also recalled having felt that kind of similar disgust about viewing comments on a video about hunters...
So I couldn't help to feel sympathy for the guy... I though that everyone have the free will to do everything they want and also that what may be perceived as bad in the western world might be customs in china, like it's not morality perceive as bad there to eat animal while they are still alive...

But at the same time I found it disgusting to taking pleasure about killing animal just for fun, the sadism aspect, which is a symptom of pathologic/psychopathic mind. :(

But then I though everyone have to eat and so have to kind of "like" what they eat so everyone do take a certain pleasure when eating, so i though it's kind of hypocrite to be outraged about this... :/

So I wondered what the community might think about this, and the objective "morality" stance about food. Is eating food and enjoying it while still alive objectively good or bad ?

I heard it tastes like chicken...

If you watch the longer version of the video, you'll see that the Chinese boy has no left arm. So you know, he may have been accustomed to it, or is doing it for the stunt value. Plus he's young and like the C's said once, the hormones rage!

Personally I do not believe in "morals" since all "morals" are relative/subjective. Society dictates "morals", so it depends on how much stock you put in society!

Below is what Gurdjieff had to say in ISOTM:

There is nothing general in the concept of 'morality.' Morality consists of buffers. There is no general morality. What is moral in China is immoral in Europe and what is moral in Europe is immoral in China. What is moral in Petersburg is immoral in the Caucasus. And what is moral in the Caucasus is immoral in Petersburg. What is moral in one class of society is immoral in another and vice versa. Morality is always and everywhere an artificial phenomenon. It consists of various 'taboos,' that is, restrictions, and various demands, sometimes sensible in their basis and sometimes having lost all meaning or never even having had any meaning, and having been created on a false basis, on a soil of superstition and false fears.

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[quote author= Muxel]Personally I do not believe in "morals" since all "morals" are relative/subjective. Society dictates "morals", so it depends on how much stock you put in society![/quote]

Morals are not sincere and are part of the fake personality.

Gurdjieff instead aims for ''inner morality'' :

[quote author= Gurdjieff]• You should forget about morality. Conversations about morality are simply empty talk. Your aim is inner morality.[/quote]

Inner morality= conscience.

Conscience is universal, objective and part of the real I. (Higher Self)


[quote author= onemen]While I admit I've felt choked and disguted about this type of eating[/quote]

Rightfully so, to survive killing is necessary, it's part of life. But to let other beings suffer unnecessary is pathological. You don't eat something while it is still alive.

bjorn said:

...
Rightfully so, to survive killing is necessary, it's part of life. But to let other beings suffer unnecessary is pathological. You don't eat something while it is still alive.

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Eating something which is dead ? Letting other beings suffer necessary ? Killing to survive ?
It looks like a pathological way of life...
Mamma Mia ! Trapped into 3D STS

eat for sustenance, Not for enjoyment of so-called flavor. 'Tis all an illusion. Take control.

[quote author= Sow]Letting other beings suffer necessary ? [/quote]

Killing animals with the less stress possible. It's never stress free, I don't like it either.


[quote author= Sow]It looks like a pathological way of life...

Trapped into 3D STS[/quote]

Life feeds on life in this environment.

In the Bible after the fall Adam couldn't bring himself to kill animals. But after a while he realized he had to do so to survive. Kind of symbolic I think.

It's not meant to be fun or anything.

But eating meat is necessary to get out of 3STS. That's why it is a sacrament. We need it to function properly and learn our lessons. Without it, no lessons will be learned and this cycle of taking lives to survive will go on forever.


Besides that, don't forget that animals also hunt each other. Life and death, trying to survive. I think it all offers necessary shocks and lessons in the animal kingdom. And it also does for us. Being limited in our form offers lessons. Maybe that's the whole purpose of it.

Sow said:

Eating something which is dead ? Letting other beings suffer necessary ? Killing to survive ?
It looks like a pathological way of life...
Mamma Mia ! Trapped into 3D STS

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I don't think anybody's trapped here. We all still have free will and the ability to 'work things out' for ourselves (a mind). Plus whatever level of internal conscience each individual possesses. Think of it like a school, with rules, both seen and unseen.

Agree with you Ruth and bjorn : life is some kind of school, a 3D STS one, that's why it is somehow pathological I guess.

AL Today said:

eat for sustenance, Not for enjoyment of so-called flavor. 'Tis all an illusion. Take control.

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This is an ascetic way of life Al Today. I'm not sure that it is the only way for controlling the illusion of life. Why not enjoying with gratitude the food allowing our sustenance ?

I'd like to ask a couple of questions about your post, sow. It could be that something was lost in the translation.

Sow said:

bjorn said:

...
Rightfully so, to survive killing is necessary, it's part of life. But to let other beings suffer unnecessary is pathological. You don't eat something while it is still alive.

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Eating something which is dead ?

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What do you eat? Is it dead or alive?

Sow said:

Letting other beings suffer necessary ?

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I didn't see any mention in bjorn's post that said that suffering is necessary; what he said is that to let other beings suffer UNnecessarily is pathological.

Sow said:

Killing to survive ?
It looks like a pathological way of life...

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For those of us, here, in 3D on this planet, yes, killing animals (or plants) to survive is a way of life here. Those who think eating raw food is good have no idea the harm they are doing to themselves. And, agricultural farming kills many species of animals to produce the raw food.

So, yes, it may be a pathological way of life, but that's how it is here on the Big Blue Marble.

Nothing was lost Nienna. I just was kind of emphasizing how pathological may life appear on the Big Blue Marble.

[quote author= Sow]Agree with you Ruth and bjorn : life is some kind of school, a 3D STS one, that's why it is somehow pathological I guess.[/quote]

Without this struggle of life and death necessary lessons may be not be learned. It's something you sign up for in a way reincarnating on the BBM. ''Higher self'' of a cow if you can call it like that doesn't want to be a happy 2D cow eating grass forever. It wants to experience, learn and graduate. And the struggle of life and death is involved in that. So is this struggle of dealing with predators really pathological?

In truth it just is. We has 3D beings cannot see the lessons within so we may miss this higher perspective.

In it's essence, life and death are the same. Beginning of something anew, beginning of new lessons. OSIT.

bjorn said:

You don't eat something while it is still alive.

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Some customs are more pathological than others.
I get that inflicting unnecesseraly stress and suffering to others beings is very pathological as also the very act of filming it to show it up on purpose to others may also be pathological (sadistic which I remember is a symptom of pyschopathic behaviour) as it inflict stress and suffering to sensitive viewers.

Muxel said:

If you watch the longer version of the video, you'll see that the Chinese boy has no left arm. So you know, he may have been accustomed to it, or is doing it for the stunt value. Plus he's young and like the C's said once, the hormones rage!

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Yes i've seen the longer version, I just wanted to emphasize the negative reaction on this video which the longer video didn't had as much views & reaction on youtube.

I just wanted to be sure If i was right to be more outraged about the reactions than the actual eating customs.
We feed on life to survive so weither you end his life by eating it alive (take an other less extreme exemple : oysters), or you end its live before cooking it for feeding, does the former suffer more (more pathological) than the later in the process or it's the same in the end ?

bjorn said:

But eating meat is necessary to get out of 3STS. That's why it is a sacrament. We need it to function properly and learn our lessons. Without it, no lessons will be learned and this cycle of taking lives to survive will go on forever.

Besides that, don't forget that animals also hunt each other. Life and death, trying to survive. I think it all offers necessary shocks and lessons in the animal kingdom. And it also does for us. Being limited in our form offers lessons. Maybe that's the whole purpose of it.

Click to expand...

Sow said:

Why not enjoying with gratitude the food allowing our sustenance ?

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I Agree.
It's kind of hard to do that as I'am used to eating in a bad way, like just "filling" my stomach until i'm done, until I stumbled upon a video showing porks for example and then I remember that I am feeding on dead animal... So I guess the gratitude and sacrament aspects is importat to keep in mind.
I recalled having read a post from Laura about how to eat our feed mindfully as a kind of meditation but I can't locate the specific post.

bjorn said:

[quote author= Sow]Agree with you Ruth and bjorn : life is some kind of school, a 3D STS one, that's why it is somehow pathological I guess.

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Without this struggle of life and death necessary lessons may be not be learned. It's something you sign up for in a way reincarnating on the BBM. ''Higher self'' of a cow if you can call it like that doesn't want to be a happy 2D cow eating grass forever. It wants to experience, learn and graduate. And the struggle of life and death is involved in that. So is this struggle of dealing with predators really pathological?

In truth it just is. We has 3D beings cannot see the lessons within so we may miss this higher perspective.

In it's essence, life and death are the same. Beginning of something anew, beginning of new lessons. OSIT.
[/quote]
Really pathological I guess, for 'patho' means suffering in Greek, which is a main lesson on the BBM.
I wouldn't really say that life and death are the same in their essence : birth and death are complementary opposites, life encompasses both...
But yes, it just is

[quote author= Sow]I wouldn't really say that life and death are the same in their essence : birth and death are complementary opposites, life encompasses both...
[/quote]

Yes, but it is the start of new lessons for both transitions. And creation is nothing more than a school. So in essence it's the same?

I got that from the C’s. I figured that is what they meant?

[quote author= November 16, 1994 ]Q: (L) Is this transitioning of energy from higher densities into third density or solid matter kind of a traumatic event for universal energy?
A: Subjective.
Q: (L) Is it a form of death?
A: Death and birth are the same.
Q: (L) Was it a requirement to be on a planet with a dying star for this remolecularization to take place?
A: If 3rd density remolecularization.
Q: (L) So, for energy to go into 3rd density physical level... is energy moving down when it comes into 3rd level?
A: No. Upward. [/quote]