Ambition, lack thereof, and why we do anything.

ScioAgapeOmnis

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I was just thinking about the concept of ambition - why some people have it, others don't, what does it even mean, how to get it, and why we would even want it. We have STO and STS, and both are pretty ambitious in their own ways. We know what motivates STS - acquisition of power, wealth, and sensate. Basically they like to get people to do things, they like shiny things, and they like stimulating their physical nerve endings that their brain interprets as pleasure. Pretty boring. Most of the prominent figures on this planet are examples of STS ambition, and it's no wonder that many people have no ambition at all because they see THAT as the pinnacle of human achievement, and not sharing the same STS drive, they kinda abandon ship and don't do much with their lives, thinking it's either that or nothing. So they choose nothing, and kinda just go through the motions. But they haven't really explored the opposite - STO. There are very few examples of STO (if any), explanations of how and why it is "desirable" (for lack of a better term), and it's not exactly advertised or taught in any comprehensive way. And often when it is discussed, it's somehow still STS in disguise - to make yourself feel good about doing something for others. Or just to be nice to others. No one explains why, how, to what end, etc.

On the futility of STS - imagine being a rich caveman. Or even rich in medieval times. What the hell could they possibly even buy that's worth all this trouble? A big rock? How fancy! 1000 years from now people will, if humanity kept advancing, look the same way at Bill Gates. You got all this money - but all you can do with it is get something incredibly primitive and pointless. An iPhone 11, maybe a bunch of them, and a big screen TV! A house and an island you can't even utilize. Wow! And so on. We might as well mentally skip this right away, and say being rich, just to get whatever shiny things your primitive society produces, is always rather pointless. So of course most people will just say "I don't want an island, a giant rock, a billion iPhones, or a huge empty mansion, or a Bugatti". And society doesn't really have a lot of alternatives - we are labeled as consumers, and consumerism is supposed to be "good enough" motivator to go to work each morning.

Let's look at STO. You serve self through others. You give all to those who ask. Why would this motivate someone? How can this be explained or taught in a way that can inspire? It's always mischaracterized - either as altruism and self sacrifice or as I said above, as STS in disguise. Basically, I think that's one of the reasons the world is the way it is - people are bored with STS but don't have a good role model (or just a conceptual model) of STO as a practical and effective way they can thrive. So they either have to follow in the footsteps of ambitious STS and hope that leads to happiness (it won't), or probe blindly by simply following their hearts, and single-handedly fight off inner and outer programs/obstacles to try to achieving some semblance of STO candidacy, if they don't get swept up and derailed along the way.

So my thought was - there ought to be an instruction manual for STO. At the end of the day, there is no reason to do anything unless you are properly motivated, and the motivation comes from the heart, but without guidance, that's how well-meaning people hurt themselves and others, get taken advantage of by manipulators, etc. I remember in one of the sessions the C's were asked about depression, and the answer was something like "do something for someone else". I think that's a good answer for a lot of struggles or suffering we experience - figure it out, even if only so you can help someone else avoid the same suffering.

I think there's a lot of answers in "Creating a new world" thread, Cass wiki, the Romantic Reading thread, and just this forum in general. I'm imagining some kind of small booklet that is basically a self-help booklet (self help through others lol), but focused on STO philosophy. It focuses just as much on the "why" as the "how", the potential pitfalls, the benefits for everyone involved, etc.

As the world gets more and more chaotic and genuinely scary, the old systems are tightening their noose and starting to fail as people turn away from the lords of chaos. But people don't have an alternative model except to say "this one sucks". There's a real danger of "out of the frying pan, into the fire" situation. That's kinda always the case with revolutions - the new boss is always the same or worse than the old boss. Even if the booklet serves to jump-start something that evolves over time, it would be food for the heart, and for thought.

Anyway, just an idea. I'll compile my thoughts and put together a rough draft in this thread the best I can (may take me a few days to do) - let me know if this is a fruitless exercise, or if the idea is dumb, or whatever. All thoughts, help, criticism, etc obviously welcome.

I think this forum has an intimidating amount of information for newcomers and old timers alike - the threads are long, the books are many, and stuff is always being added. I think for some topics it is unavoidable, but other stuff can be summarized without losing its essence or being dangerous to do (like health topics). Perhaps there's value in doing it, especially given the attention span of the average person these days.
 
Some random silly title ideas:
“Hitchhiker’s Guide to Serving Others”
“Recipe for Zoroaster”
“Serving Yourself Through Others”
“Self Help through Others”
“Serving Others for Dummies”
“To Serve Man - For Real”
“Cure for Depression and Lethargy”
“The Most Ambitious Book Ever”
“If You Ain’t Dying, You Ain’t Living”
“Why You Lack Ambition”
“Fellowship of the Cosmic Mind’s Guide to Not Being a Bitch About Everything”
“How Service to Others Leads to Joy”
“Give All to Those Who Ask”

..some of them are silly or only marginally relevant or provocative to be picked up by someone.
 
Interesting question: What is STO ambition? Because for me ambition is close to want/desire, which STO doesn't do. Maybe it's just to give all when asked? Or to teach others?

Perhaps STO is like filling one's cup with wholesome drinks, where for STS it always spills over and never satisfies.

We know what an STO candidate is, right? If we can condense a good portion of the material down to some basic guidelines for being an STO candidate, then I think it's fruitful.

I like these two:
“Self Help through Others”
“Serving Others for Dummies”

Thanks for the idea.
 
Well, it is always a question of perspective and also of having a little more reading from other followers who have gone through similar situations and have been able to navigate the maze.


A person can be ambitious and use it for good, if what he ambitions is part of the soul's pronounced desire to be a better person, to understand the other (inner consideration - outer consideration) you can ambition with intention, but not with anticipation. Much ambition is more tied to anticipation, to desire the result of something, than the ambition to do something with intention in the present, fluid tense.


Let's say you have the idea, the ambition to have a better and more comfortable chair to sit in. Or you can have ambition by wishing it and imagining how it would be and that you want it, or you can have ambition with intention and work on it, learning in the process, until you finally materialize it. When the new chair comes to the demonstration, then you have CREATED something that is good. Not only for yourself, but for humanity in general.


On the other hand, why should there be a STO manual? There is no point in having such a manual, if the meaning of life is to learn how to get out of the STS mode into the STO mode through your lessons, both individual and collective.
 
In school one of my teachers told me "I wish you more ambition". Way back in grade 10, I saw the futility of it all. Plus the fact that what was being taught wasn't correct. I did well in math, and biology. Science was a bit sketchy. But was struggling with the rest. Autocorrect helps with spelling. One teacher would accuse me of having my personal dictionary.
 
We know what an STO candidate is, right? If we can condense a good portion of the material down to some basic guidelines for being an STO candidate, then I think it's fruitful.

For me, the key is to be less STS, and not thinking about being STO. If STO is a mode of existence that goes hand in hand with the natural flow of things, when you choose to say NO to STS, by default you are going to STO because it automatically fills up, by this very condition of the natural flow of things.
 
By ambition I was thinking essentially motivation. I’d bundle having a drive or soul questing under that - a reason to put in effort and strive. I just think a lot of people seek self help books because they lack the drive to fix their life and work hard for something better. They look for life coaches and personal trainers to have an external forcing element. When the coach goes away they often fail to self motivate. I think partly that is because the books don’t necessarily explain the “why” very well, but they have lots of advice for “how” - how not to procrastinate, how to stick to a diet, etc. The “why”, if provided, doesn’t dig deep enough and touches on the obvious. The coaches are like drill sergeants or parents - you may become dependent on them to do stuff. But the root is “why should I do any of that if all the world has to offer me is pretty uninspiring and boring”. Depressed unmotivated people for example often see everything as a dull gray, but they’re not necessarily bad or selfish people, just highly unmotivated.

For example, I often would be highly uninterested in a school subject if the teacher was boring and bad. I later realized it wasn’t the subject, it was the way it was presented.

I was talking to my brother the other day about what makes people do “the right action” consistently. Why does one person start and stop, and yoyo’s things like diets and exercise, and someone else will just start and commit for years. People often ask such people how they started, what made them stick with it, and often they have no answers. I woke up one morning, felt like picking up a dumbbell, and never stopped. Something just clicked. Like a switch was flipped in my head. Go figure.

And perhaps this may be the reason this booklet thing won’t work - I don’t know how to trigger a switch in someone’s head. But I do know that perspective can play a large role. On this forum we often talk about doing what “it” does not like. Your little i’s will always try to talk you out of anything beneficial and you have to do it anyway. It helps to be properly motivated to override their pleas. You basically have to feel worse not doing the thing than doing it. Even if your little i’s like it, something in you has to REALLY not like it.

For me, that motivation is kinda what I was hoping to present in this booklet. It’s basically making a case for STO, for a better world, and convincingly argue why it is preferable for the vast majority and how it may work. It’s an alternative to what this world currently has to offer, and without knowing about this alternative, you may not know that there is something better possible, even in your own personal life at a small scale. Kinda how Jordan Peterson has been able to get a bunch of college kids cleaning their rooms and taking responsibility - by explaining the concept, and making them see the benefits and suggesting practical approach to reach them. He has a way to make the difficult seem simple - he convinces you that you CAN do it, you have the power, and it will be difficult but you are literally made for the job. The “why” is kinda already in those kids, he just brings it out to the surface and gives it power.

Nobody WANTS to be miserable, people just often don’t know what to do and why, so they feel stuck and immobile.
 
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People often ask such people how they started, what made them stick with it, and often they have no answers. I woke up one morning, felt like picking up a dumbbell, and never stopped. Something just clicked. Like a switch was flipped in my head. Go figure.

And perhaps this may be the reason this booklet thing won’t work - I don’t know how to trigger a switch in someone’s head. But I do know that perspective can play a large role. On this forum we often talk about doing what “it” does not like. Your little i’s will always try to talk you out of anything beneficial and you have to do it anyway. It helps to be properly motivated to override their pleas. You basically have to feel worse not doing the thing than doing it. Even if your little i’s like it, something in you has to REALLY not like it.

For me, that motivation is kinda what I was hoping to present in this booklet. It’s basically making a case for STO, for a better world, and convincingly argue why it is preferable for the vast majority and how it may work.

A couple of things come to mind. First of all I think the motivation for what amounts to a shift in Being is necessity. At some level the person must find it necessary either physically, mentally (psychologically), or emotionally to have to change.

That for me is fundamental to the how of it. As for the why it would be a good thing, which amounts to being desirable for the self, 'The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People' comes to mind but admittedly I've read very little of that book. I should get back to it.

But you notice we are still operating based on self. Not to worry, as we are told self is best served through serving others and I believe that's true but how best to convince another?

Not a terrible idea though.
 
And on that note - I’m kinda thinking that a lot of people will be hitting rock bottom soon as the world disintegrates. People will be losing jobs (already are from lockdowns), facing more riots and a police state, and generally just driven to a bankruptcy and desperation to change something. Once misery is spread far and wide, they will introduce the “great reset” Orwellian global system as the solution - so out of the frying pan and into the fire. Lots of people will be looking for alternatives to the way things were, and there may be an opportunity there to present STO as an alternative. Of course, there is also a risk that transmarginal inhibition will set in, and people’s suffering will make them more likely to accept lies and false solutions from authorities. So global suffering can be a catalyst for change, but I’m worried the change will be for the worse under the guise of stability, peace, order, etc.
 
“Hitchhiker’s Guide to Serving Others”
“Recipe for Zoroaster”
“Serving Yourself Through Others”
“Self Help through Others”
“Serving Others for Dummies”
“To Serve Man - For Real”
“Cure for Depression and Lethargy”
“The Most Ambitious Book Ever”
“If You Ain’t Dying, You Ain’t Living”
“Why You Lack Ambition”
“Fellowship of the Cosmic Mind’s Guide to Not Being a Bitch About Everything”
“How Service to Others Leads to Joy”
“Give All to Those Who Ask”
I like “Hitchhiker’s Guide to Serving Others” and “Give All to Those Who Ask”.

As for the "why" question, I think that it just comes naturally to people who gravitate towards STO to act in certain ways because they have an inert guide and they just feel that "it is the right thing to do" without them being really able to explain it. It seems to be an inner drive for people aligned with the potential to become less STS to just do something fruitful in that regard. The inert being seems to drive it so to say. I would guess that quite many if not all beings who have succeeded to become less STS (or even becoming STO) never really knew exactly "why" they did what they did and they just did it.

I guess a fruitful direction to look at for the "why you should do it" would be materialism. In a world were so many people have been told that there isn't anything more than the material universe, the reasons to do good have become quite obsolete because "nothing has consequences" in this imaginary material world. If more people would be made aware that there is a lot more to life than materialism and that every action has consequences in afterlives and such, there might be better grounds for them to understand "why" it would be a good idea to gravitate towards STO. So I guess the afterlife discussion might be useful direction to look at in that regard.
 
But you notice we are still operating based on self. Not to worry, as we are told self is best served through serving others and I believe that's true but how best to convince another?

And on that note - I’m kinda thinking that a lot of people will be hitting rock bottom soon as the world disintegrates. People will be losing jobs (already are from lockdowns), facing more riots and a police state, and generally just driven to a bankruptcy and desperation to change something. Once misery is spread far and wide, they will introduce the “great reset” Orwellian global system as the solution - so out of the frying pan and into the fire. Lots of people will be looking for alternatives to the way things were, and there may be an opportunity there to present STO as an alternative. Of course, there is also a risk that transmarginal inhibition will set in, and people’s suffering will make them more likely to accept lies and false solutions from authorities. So global suffering can be a catalyst for change, but I’m worried the change will be for the worse under the guise of stability, peace, order, etc.

It seems that this thread appeared in a synchronized way, because in facebook I am talking about a similar topic. We are talking about: How easy it is to make people believe a lie, and hard it is to undo that work again! In reference to something said by Mark Twain.

The conversation was taking the following course (I will put only my answers):


The thread begins like this:

On page 281 of his autobiography, Mark Twain says: "How easy it is to make people believe a lie, and hard it is to undo that work again", which eventually translated into popular culture as "It is easier to deceive people than to convince them that they have been deceived".

And in Creole it is said: "If you think, you go out".

What do we do?

My answers:

Most of the time you can't do anything. The only one who can is reality, it brings you down to earth from a slap on the neck. The deception ends when you hit the floor.

And that's the most fu*ked up thing. When you get to that extreme reality doesn't like to be denied one bit. On an individual level, life becomes a living hell. At the collective level? We are already seeing it. Empires fall, and civilizations fall. To quote the General: "In cataclysms, the pupil of man has seen God again and, as a reflection, has seen himself again". The General saw it coming from far away.

As you can see, the issue in question is appearing on both sides of the world. We see that the possibility of change is in the need of the individual or when SHTF.
 
I cannot see how it would be possible to condense the in's and out's of the Work into a handy do-it-yourself guide for self improvement. It's like trying to compress all the content of this whole forum into bite-sized chunks. Something like that would never have any long lasting impact, as most aphorisms don't either.

Let's not forget that most forumites came along here out of some sort of inner necessity, triggered by some form of total bankruptcy and after a long, painstaking inner quest. The paths to the Work and the Way are as varied as those who walk them. You wouldn't be able to cover all or even most of those in such a simple format.

My two cents.
 
One can lead a horse to water, but cannot force the horse to drink. It's difficult to get through to people because of their buffers and illusions they so dearly hold on to. It keeps them from thinking for themselves, however, it's hard to do that when one doesn't know themselves. Their true self is the one that can hold a candle against seemingly impossible odds and can hold one's ground against the predator's mind. When things get bad (whether in the external or internal world) will they choose to blame others or sleep it off? To find oneself, in part, is to go through one's own struggles and battles as graceful as one can and see what's left after the bones are stripped bare. After that, it is quite hard to entertain one's old illusions any longer.

By ambition I was thinking essentially motivation. I’d bundle having a drive or soul questing under that - a reason to put in effort and strive. I just think a lot of people seek self help books because they lack the drive to fix their life and work hard for something better. They look for life coaches and personal trainers to have an external forcing element. When the coach goes away they often fail to self motivate. I think partly that is because the books don’t necessarily explain the “why” very well, but they have lots of advice for “how” - how not to procrastinate, how to stick to a diet, etc. The “why”, if provided, doesn’t dig deep enough and touches on the obvious. The coaches are like drill sergeants or parents - you may become dependent on them to do stuff. But the root is “why should I do any of that if all the world has to offer me is pretty uninspiring and boring”. Depressed unmotivated people for example often see everything as a dull gray, but they’re not necessarily bad or selfish people, just highly unmotivated.

For example, I often would be highly uninterested in a school subject if the teacher was boring and bad. I later realized it wasn’t the subject, it was the way it was presented.

I was talking to my brother the other day about what makes people do “the right action” consistently. Why does one person start and stop, and yoyo’s things like diets and exercise, and someone else will just start and commit for years. People often ask such people how they started, what made them stick with it, and often they have no answers. I woke up one morning, felt like picking up a dumbbell, and never stopped. Something just clicked. Like a switch was flipped in my head. Go figure.

And perhaps this may be the reason this booklet thing won’t work - I don’t know how to trigger a switch in someone’s head. But I do know that perspective can play a large role. On this forum we often talk about doing what “it” does not like. Your little i’s will always try to talk you out of anything beneficial and you have to do it anyway. It helps to be properly motivated to override their pleas. You basically have to feel worse not doing the thing than doing it. Even if your little i’s like it, something in you has to REALLY not like it.

For me, that motivation is kinda what I was hoping to present in this booklet. It’s basically making a case for STO, for a better world, and convincingly argue why it is preferable for the vast majority and how it may work. It’s an alternative to what this world currently has to offer, and without knowing about this alternative, you may not know that there is something better possible, even in your own personal life at a small scale. Kinda how Jordan Peterson has been able to get a bunch of college kids cleaning their rooms and taking responsibility - by explaining the concept, and making them see the benefits and suggesting practical approach to reach them. He has a way to make the difficult seem simple - he convinces you that you CAN do it, you have the power, and it will be difficult but you are literally made for the job. The “why” is kinda already in those kids, he just brings it out to the surface and gives it power.

Nobody WANTS to be miserable, people just often don’t know what to do and why, so they feel stuck and immobile.

Perhaps it's not just knowing exactly how to trigger the switch in someone's head, but knowing if that switch can be triggered in another. If one knows that the switch can be triggered, the how can be done in real-time. However, preparatory work beforehand on the how can definitely be beneficial to this end in jumpstarting someone's critical thought. Knowing the if also helps preserve energy.

With regards to the booklet, I think it is a great idea. It more or less respects free will of others and for those ready to see it, they may likely feel a pull towards it.

There is a booklet out there published by QFG called Life Is Religion that leans a bit heavy on the esoteric side and explains a lot of what the STO mindset is, so perhaps a booklet that distills these concepts and relates them in layman's terms can serve as a larger "rye catcher" so-to-speak.
 
As for the "why" question, I think that it just comes naturally to people who gravitate towards STO to act in certain ways because they have an inert guide and they just feel that "it is the right thing to do" without them being really able to explain it. It seems to be an inner drive for people aligned with the potential to become less STS to just do something fruitful in that regard. The inert being seems to drive it so to say. I would guess that quite many if not all beings who have succeeded to become less STS (or even becoming STO) never really knew exactly "why" they did what they did and they just did it.

I see it the same way. The motivation for an STO path, which is really the spiritual path, comes from deep within - as a drive or “heartfelt desire“.

The more we let go of mental programming and work through emotional blocks, the more we become who we really are. And this in turn strengthens the connection to the Higher Self or Source, from which the drive or “heartfelt desire“ for the STO path come.

It also seems that not everyone is ready for this in this lifetime (organic portals?), so we can only help those who on their own reach the point of choosing it.
 
Let's look at STO. You serve self through others. You give all to those who ask. Why would this motivate someone?

When you do something to help others, they feel good, and they are also encouraged to be good themselves. At the same time, you feel good, and you also gain more strength to resist your own negative or entropic tendencies. It's technically selfish, but at the point where we call that "selfish" when doing precisely the opposite is "much more selfish", it's saying there is nothing that isn't selfish. That may be the case, but clearly there is a way of thinking, speaking and doing (i.e. being) that is the least selfish we can be. That's the one we go for, because, well, the alternative makes others and you feel bad, and as an ideology, is a literal dead end street.
 
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