C60 supplements - any thoughts?

awakener

The Force is Strong With This One
I have been interested in the biochemistry of metabolism since changing my diet a couple of years ago to paleo/semi keto (which solved a bunch of inflammatory and autoimmune problems for me and REALLY improved my life). Looking at all the pathways that have been demonstrated (or theorised!), it feels like metabolism is an orchestra, which has the potential to play beautiful symphonies but often starts off OK and ends up making ... well - just noise - until the audience gets fed up and shuffles off to 5D!

While reading, I came across references to studies showing that a C60 (buckminsterfullerene) suspension was shown to be protective against liver damage and cancer in rats, and also had some life extending effects. C60 is the fourth allotrope of carbon, described as "buckyballs", spherical molecules containing 60 carbon atoms http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buckminsterfullerene
http://www.curemygenes.com/litterature/C60/F-Moussa-Nano-Letters.pdf (this is a good summary of the information)

I kind of discounted the idea at the time (it seemed too easy and "low level" physics to be a biological solution). However, more and more it seems that metabolism (including resistance to disease, stress and also improved cognition) are heavily linked to improving cell redox potential at a macro level. Things that do this:
1) Activating the phosphate pentose pathway (ketogenic diet)
2) Vagal nerge stimulation
3) Cryotherapy (leptin release)

Obviously when I found the forum and site, it gave what I'd seen as just a physical protocol a whole new dimension.

It was also interesting to read in the transcripts about an "as yet undiscovered enzyme relating to carbon" - http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,27516.msg337267.html#msg337267

It seems plausible that C60 could give great short term improvements to redox potential (it's >200 x more effective than vitamin C at electron donation)

There are a couple of commercial sites relating to it which seem slightly "off" .. I don't know how else to describe it

I was wondering if anyone had any experience / thoughts / information relating to this? It seems really interesting, but also worried that it could be similar to the monatomic gold thing?

Thanks!
 

Alana

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
Thanks for this, I didn't know about these buckyballs. Their structure looks very cool and interesting too, and the rat experiments sound promising. I don't know about looking on the internet to buy an oil though from any site. It seems that the process of putting the buckyballs in the oil is pretty lengthy, it will probably cost an arm and a leg for a tiny bottle, and there haven't been any human trials yet. And those are my over-cautionary thoughts.

After a bit of search I found this site that sells it for € 13.68 per 50 ml. And there are people's testimonials who tried it.

_http://shop.owndoc.com/p-203/c60-olive-oil-buckminsterfullerene-buckyballs-in-oil.html

I think it all sounds fascinating! According to wiki it might even inhibit reproduction of the HIV virus

Buckminsterfullerene also inhibit the HIV virus. In particular, C60 inhibits a key enzyme in the human immunodeficiency virus known as HIV-1 protease; this could inhibit reproduction of the HIV virus in immune cells.[citation needed]

So, promising properties.

Another interesting refence by wiki:

The structure associated with fullerenes was described by Leonardo da Vinci.[8] Albrecht Dürer also reproduced a similar icosahedron containing 12 pentagonal and 20 hexagonal faces but there are no clear documentations of this.[9] [10]

Another article I found:

Diet of buckyballs nearly doubles rat lifespan
By Brian Dodson
April 22, 2012

Sometimes I (almost) envy mice, rats, and yeast - it seems that almost any aging research we carry out on them doubles their lifespan and returns semi-senescent (say, a human equivalent of about 60 years of age - not thinking of anyone in particular, of course) to youthful vigor. It now appears that dramatic anti-aging results are associated with dietary ingestion of buckyballs, more properly known as C-60 fullerene.

A recent French study looking for chronic toxicity resulting from ingesting buckyballs dissolved in olive oil found that 10 month old rats who ingested the human equivalent of a tenth of a gram of C-60 buckyballs (which in technical grades cost less than US$10/gram) several times a week showed extended lifespans instead of toxic effects.

All C-60-treated rats survived to at least 59 months, with the oldest surviving to 66 months. The control group lived for periods ranging from 17 months to 37 months, while an additional group fed only the extra olive oil lived for periods of 36 to 57 months. For the curious, the olive oil dosage was equivalent to a person adding about eight tablespoons of uncooked olive oil to their daily diet without compensating for the additional calories. Similar results have been reported for mammals held in a state of semi-starvation, but that is obviously not a pleasant lifestyle.

All fullerenes are susceptible to clumping when dissolved in oil, so the preparation of the olive-oil/C-60 solution is rather lengthy. In these tests, 50 mg of C-60 buckyballs were added to 10 ml of virgin olive oil. These were stirred for two weeks at ambient temperatures with no incident light. Following the stirring, the solutions were centrifuged at 5,000 g for an hour. The fluid was separated from the precipitate, and was then passed through a 0.25 micron filter. The resulting liquid contained 0.8 mg/ml of C-60 buckyballs.

The results beg the question - what is going on here? Is the life extension just for those lucky rats again, or is there a mechanism that might transfer over to humans? The study was aimed at discovering if a diet of buckyballs has any toxic effects, and the good news is that no toxicity was found. The buckyballs did move throughout the body (including the brain and central nervous system), and even enter individual cells. The ingested C-60 had an elimination half-life from blood of about 10 hours, so was essentially fully eliminated from the body within two days. It is not clear from the report if the C-60 was eliminated from intracellular fluid on that time scale.

Specific studies of the effect of C-60 buckyballs on oxidative stress in the rats were performed by studying the effects of carbon tetrachloride (CCl4) injection. Carbon tetrachloride is well known to be poisonous to rats, being highly hepatotoxic (toxic to the liver). It is also associated with delirium and intoxication such as is experienced in the abuse of solvents.

Rats which had been pretreated by water, by olive oil, and by olive oil containing C-60 buckyballs all showed typical signs of intoxication within a few minutes of CCl4 injection. However, while intoxication persisted in the water and olive oil groups for 24 hours, the olive oil and C-60 group emerged from intoxication after only five hours.

In rats experiencing the pretreatment, but unexposed to carbon tetrachloride, autopsy revealed essentially normal livers. In those given a CCl4 injection, however, the livers from rats pretreated with water or olive oil showed important damage - a great deal of inflammation as well as large necrotic areas (dying or dead tissue). In contrast, the livers from rats pretreated with olive oil and C-60 buckyballs showed little damage or CCl4-induced cell death. Biochemical markers of liver damage showed far less elevation in the rats pretreated with olive oil and C-60.

It does appear there is a real physiological effect on metabolic processes, and that oxidative stress in particular is significantly reduced in rats by chronic oral ingestion of an olive oil/C-60 solution. As oxidative stress is one of the factors usually associated with aging, there may well be a reasonable mechanism for the lifespan extension, especially if excess oxidation within individual cells is prevented by intracellular buckyballs. Will people react to a treatment of this sort with lifespans of 180-200 years? Only time will tell.

The research was recently published in the journal Biomaterials

The link you posted above
http://www.curemygenes.com/litterature/C60/F-Moussa-Nano-Letters.pdf

has pictures of the rat's livers and other photos/graphs.

awakener said:
It was also interesting to read in the transcripts about an "as yet undiscovered enzyme relating to carbon" - http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,27516.msg337267.html#msg337267

You are talking about this part:

http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,28383.msg353167.html#msg353167

November 26 said:
Q: (L) Okay, at the time this "Mark of Cain" came about, were there other humans on the planet that did not have this configuration?

A: It was added to all simultaneously.

Q: (L) How did they physically go about performing this act? What was the mechanism of this event, the nuts and bolts of it?

A: Are you ready? DNA core is as yet undiscovered enzyme relating to carbon. Light waves were used to cancel the first ten factors of DNA by burning them off. At that point, a number of physical changes took place including knot at top of spine. Each of these is equally reflected in the ethereal.

I really don't know if the reference is to C60. It looks like such a "complete" molecule, makes all others look unfinished, osit.
 

nicklebleu

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Interesting piece of info - maybe there is something in it ... BUT, I couldn't advise anyone to experiment with that at this present stage. The main reason is that there are no studies so far about what exactly happens in humans, when C60 is introduced.

There is a study in rats which shows that C60 accumulate in liver tissue, despite being excreted via bile to some extent. Another article claimed that C60 is cytotoxic to cells and disrupts membranes, while other studies report no damage at all.

Until further research has been done in human cell cultures and humans, I advise against experimenting with this, especially as this is a nano-particle and physical effects might be more relevant than metabolic effects in eliciting any biological effects - a field that is under intense study at this stage.
 

awakener

The Force is Strong With This One
Yes the tox message is difficult to interpret - the tissue tests seem to indicate oxidative toxicity at relatively low levels (50ppb), but al the in vivo stuff (at much higher doses) seems to show the opposite. Much of it appears due to structure, size and delivery mechanism.

Anyway, I think this is one to watch - a source of redox potential that doesn't (apparently) interfere with existing organic metabolic pathways might be very useful in the current polluted, high-stress environment.
 

Mike

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Today, I finished watching an interview of Clif High where he talks about people taking C60 as an experiment to extend their lifespan and for increased overall health. Supposedly the C60 has many health and rejuvenation benefits and this was discovered by accident by tested rats to find out the lethal dose of C60 in terms of industrial use. The rats who were administered C60 in olive oil lived much longer than the control rats.

Here is the interview with Clif High. The discussion of C60 starts at minute 4:55 and continues almost to the end. At the end of the interview he talks about C60 helping with liver disease that he says would have probably killed him by now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xLrYL3rpIo

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buckminsterfullerene
In 2012 a toxicity study by Tarek Baati and Fathi Moussa from the University of Paris, showed that C60 dissolved in olive oil was not toxic to rodents.[26] In a video interview with Professor Fathi Moussa regarding the study, further information was provided regarding the toxicity study, and the method of action whereby the lifespan of the rodents was increased by 90% relative to controls when the animals were dosed with C60 olive oil.[27]

26 Baati, Tarek; Moussa, Fathi (June 2012). "The prolongation of the lifespan of rats by repeated oral administration of [60]fullerene". Biomaterials. 33 (19): 4936–4946. PMID 22498298. doi:10.1016/j.biomaterials.2012.03.036.

27 Moussa, Loera (Director) (8 October 2012). Full Interview With Professor Fathi Moussa (Television production). Paris: Loera, C60.NET.

Here is the link to the video (reference 27) - http://c60.net/full-interview-with-professor-fathi-moussa/

Here is a page I found where you can download a copy of the paper (reference 26) - https://www.researchgate.net/publication/224004891_The_prolongation_of_the_lifespan_of_rats_by_repeated_oral_administration_of_60fullerene

Abstract
Countless studies showed that [60]fullerene (C(60)) and derivatives could have many potential biomedical applications. However, while several independent research groups showed that C(60) has no acute or sub-acute toxicity in various experimental models, more than 25 years after its discovery the in vivo fate and the chronic effects of this fullerene remain unknown. If the potential of C(60) and derivatives in the biomedical field have to be fulfilled these issues must be addressed. Here we show that oral administration of C(60) dissolved in olive oil (0.8 mg/ml) at reiterated doses (1.7 mg/kg of body weight) to rats not only does not entail chronic toxicity but it almost doubles their lifespan. The effects of C(60)-olive oil solutions in an experimental model of CCl(4) intoxication in rat strongly suggest that the effect on lifespan is mainly due to the attenuation of age-associated increases in oxidative stress. Pharmacokinetic studies show that dissolved C(60) is absorbed by the gastro-intestinal tract and eliminated in a few tens of hours. These results of importance in the fields of medicine and toxicology should open the way for the many possible -and waited for- biomedical applications of C(60) including cancer therapy, neurodegenerative disorders, and ageing.

This is the C60 product that Clif High mentions in the video and via twitter that he uses. The C60 is in either avocado or coconut oil - https://www.c60purplepower.com/

Supposedly according to Clif High, there is a group of around 120 people in France experimenting with it as a group and that there are people researching C60 for health benefits in France, German and Russia and more research is available in these languages.

The claims by Clif High seemed pretty extraordinary, so I wanted to at least do a search, where I found the above information, to collaborate at least some of what he is saying.

C60 reminds me of the many benefits and uses from people taking activated charcoal.
 

nicklebleu

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Bear said:
Today, I finished watching an interview of Clif High where he talks about people taking C60 as an experiment to extend their lifespan and for increased overall health. Supposedly the C60 has many health and rejuvenation benefits and this was discovered by accident by tested rats to find out the lethal dose of C60 in terms of industrial use. The rats who were administered C60 in olive oil lived much longer than the control rats.

That info is certainly all interesting, but what are you going to do with it?

At this stage jumping online and order some buckyballs to the tune of USD 120/ 4oz is a pretty long stretch for me. How do the rat results translate into human beings?

The other thing is that my goal is not necessarily to live longer, but to live a more optimal life. The two are not necessarily superimposed. And even if I did, how am I going to find out? Live 20 years on this stuff spending a fortune just to find out I was wrong?

Unless I see some hard data I'm not going to buy this stuff at this point in time, seems all to be a bit risky. Mind you, I am not very risk averse, but in this case the longterm benefits don't seem to warrant the risks.

Just my 2 cents.
 

Mike

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
nicklebleu said:
Bear said:
Today, I finished watching an interview of Clif High where he talks about people taking C60 as an experiment to extend their lifespan and for increased overall health. Supposedly the C60 has many health and rejuvenation benefits and this was discovered by accident by tested rats to find out the lethal dose of C60 in terms of industrial use. The rats who were administered C60 in olive oil lived much longer than the control rats.

That info is certainly all interesting, but what are you going to do with it?

I'm personally not going to do anything with it at this point. Just collecting data and posting it.

Maybe there is more information available now than three years ago and that information may not be in the English language, which limits me personally.
 

Astrocyte

Padawan Learner
Bear said:
I'm personally not going to do anything with it at this point. Just collecting data and posting it.

Maybe there is more information available now than three years ago and that information may not be in the English language, which limits me personally.

I am taking C60 since about two years and still alive. Now taking fairly good dose at one or two months interval. C60OO is an interesting product, the most evident effects produced that I am reasonably sure are not placebo is big improvement in aerobic performance (run distance), complete disappearance of joint pain (but possibly caused by another "thing" I'm taking) and mysteriously high resistance to thermal burn and UV effect on exposed skin when welding.

The resistance to burn and UV damage is the effect I qualify as having the lowest probability of being a placebo.
 

Yupo

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
The resistance to burn and UV damage is the effect I qualify as having the lowest probability of being a placebo.

This is indeed very interesting.
 

Astrocyte

Padawan Learner
Update

Have stopped C60OO since a couple months to test correlation with a strange effect. I have to manipulate routinely a polymer baser fiber and I'm pretty sure this fiber have negative effect on my skin. While taking C60OO or like 3 or 4 weeks afterward, I develop a skin condition at point of abrasion with the offending polymer (zone of strong abrasion), the skin become hard like a normal reaction to abrasion but the hard layer stay thin and eventually crack revealing sensitive soft tissue, like if the healing process was hampered. After few weeks of no C60OO, it does not seem to occur.

Maybe the theory that C60OO is so strong at free radical removal that it interfere with tissue repair that need a certain amount of free radical and inflammation to induce self-repair.

Will make a new batch of C60OO soon to check if the effect come back.
 
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