Electric Universe Theory

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ExactChange

Guest
Hello all,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_Universe_model
http://www.plasmacoalition.org/plasma_pages/pp_sep2002.htm
http://www.haltonarp.com


I sorta came across these theories while looking into the history of Nikola Tesla and his theories on Radiant Energy. Now it's been a few years since my college physics courses but I read plenty of sci-fi and have an active imagination. I can't really tell if this model works but there seem to be a number of people with titles writing on the subject.

So here are some claims I've come across. Dissect at will!

A diffuse plasma field can conduct current without the need for collisions. As ions stray out of position, they are driven back into position by the em field of the rest of the surrounding plasma. Plasmas held in a tube cunduncting current have been found to demonstrate 3 states based on the current density (highest to lowest) Dark Current, Normal Glow, and Arc.

The sun is not a giant fusion reactor that has heat come from the core in convection. The sun's corona produces temperatures up to 2,000,000 K but sunspots reveal that the lower photosphere is much cooler at around 6000 K. If instead current is being passed outwards from the suns center (current from an outside source?), a surrounding plasma field will demonstrate the dark current, normal glow, and arc effects based on the charge density passing through successively larger spherical shells.

Electric discharges on planetary, lunar, or asteroid structures leave behind circular craters as the discharge will be 90 degrees from the surface. If all craters were caused by material collisions, one might expect to see a number of non-circular craters caused by off-center hits. Close up views of asteroids show large numbers of circular craters.

Earth acts a massive self repairing, leaky capacitor from a charge differential between "ground" and the planet's ionosphere. Lightning bolts caused by this voltage differential. Earthquakes caused by subsurface lightning effect. Anyone seeing a connection to Tesla here?

Planetary magnetospheres can interact when they are close enough and in the correct positions. This may be responsible for ancient catastropies on earth when passing through Venus's "tail".

Based on observed redshift and the theories of Hubble, we have believed ourselves to be within an expanding universe. If stellar and galactic redshifts can be caused by another process besides distance and velocity, the expanding universe model needs to be reexamined. Halton Arp points to observations of a galactic flare from NGC 3516 which appears to have ejected two redshifted quasars. He describes a quantifiable intrinsic redshift that seems related to the age of the quasar (young not old).

Now this sort of thinking has also gotten Creationists working on how they can use this to bring us back to a 6000 year old Earth which leads me to some skeptism. In addition most of the sites describing these models have several books to sell. I'm not ready to start worshiping the all powerful universal current stream or flux capacitor, but I do feel somewhat motivated to explore ways of tapping into this radiant energy.

So what do you think?
 

ark

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ExactChange said:
I can't really tell if this model works but there seem to be a number of people with titles writing on the subject.
Even if you "an't really tell if this model works", you can give us the list of "number of people with titles writing on the subject" and tell us what titles they have :)
 
P

PiNgMaSta

Guest
Exact,

Interesting post my friend.

I have posted one of my theories in this group and opened discussion on it. However I have many theories that have evolved from observational studies I have made while pursuing the holly grail :)
Your question relates to this. If you have seen my post on "Earth at deaths door" you will note that I made reference to the "collapsing universe" theory.
I believe it will be debunked very soon. If you are interested I will explain another part of my theory now. Read on if you like or just skip to the bit where I talk about your "radiant energy" question :)

The Universe IS collapsing:

I do not have the time to place my entire theory here but I will attempt to explain it quickly in layman terms in an attempt to expedite this post.

Imagine, if you will, the STC (Space Time Continuum) as a piece of plastic film or wrap. Now hold this film firm and taught.
Under the film place a rotating magnet to emulate the magnetic field of the universe. Now with the film held taught and the magnet rotating you now place 100 metal bearings on the film evenly over all over the film..... Now the reaction will happen ultra fast in this experiment but imagine this reaction in slow motion over billions of years.
Once the bearings are on the film they will begin to move in sympathy with the magnetic field you created. The bearings will all move toward the centre in a "spiral" motion. As they do this the bearings gather at the centre of the film and once the weight in the centre reaches "critical weight" the film will tear and the bearing drop through the plastic.

I believe the universe works in the exact same fashion. Our planets sit on the "film" being the STC. As more planets and stars head toward "the greatest mass" the centre of the galaxy becomes heavier and heavier...
Once the centre of the universe reaches that same "critical weight" the STC will fracture.
Now as we ALL KNOW, when a magnetic band breaks it releases a massive amount of energy. This is demonstrated simply by our sun on a daily bases. When a solar flare rises and the magnetic band of that flare snaps it releases enough energy to shut down cities on earth as we saw back in the 1940's was it?... Not sure but the fact remains that energy is released when you break a magnetic band. Microwave ovens work on disturbing the magnetic field and create energy from the reaction so we know it happens.
Now when a magnetic field the size of the STC fractures what do you think might be the result?...
Yes if you guessed "Big Bang" you are absolutely correct :)
I believe if you read through other recent posts in this forum there are a number of people asking if the "Big Bang" could happen again and if you subscribe to my theory then the Big Bang is a natural galactic process that has happened before and will do again....
Ok... So... Now that is explained I can hear people out there asking "Why does the universe look like it is expanding"? lol
God I wish I had a white board and a marker! hahahaha
The reason the universe appears to expand is smoke and mirrors. Mother Nature's greatest visual trick! :)
As we all head toward the Greatest mass the STC is bending more and more under the increasing weight. The STC is looking more and more concave as the years roll on and more matter gathers in the centre. Imagine, again, the plastic film with the bearings. As the weight gathered in the centre the film began to sag in the middle yes?
Now if you imagine yourself traveling down a funnel (same as you use to poor petrol into a lawn mower for instance). Now if you are ball bearing 1 and close to the centre or spout of the cone shape you are traveling MUCH faster than ball bearing 2 at the top or lip of the funnel.
Looking back up the funnel from bearing 1 it would appear that bearing 2 is moving away from you and it would appear to get faster the further down the spout you get.
So in my world of madness I believe scientists have been tricked by an optical illusion and would love the opportunity to prove my model for the universe one day. If only I had an education I might be able to get into a university with this thesis lmao
In any case that is a VERY VAGUE description of how I believe the universe works. You will note that if you apply my model to the universe you will easily explain away other questions that science has not been able to answer with regard to other phenomenon...

Why we can not get our calendar perfect and why we require leap years?.... Could it be due to our calendar being built on a 2 dimensional universe? Is the fact that our orbit in the universe (not just solar system) changes up and down as well as side to side a contributing factor?

The unexplained phenomena of the Earths "wobble" on its axis. Does it not make sense that our planet will lilt in sympathy of the "vortex" we are traveling down? Being that "the greatest mass" is governing the magnetic poles of the entire universe then it stands to reason. As our planet moves in a circular fashion around the "vortex" our poles will remain constantly in position as dictated by the greatest force. We are revolving in a circular motion around the sun but the sun does not govern our magnetic polarity so as we move around the sun our planets axis will change in accordance with the greatest mass.

I could go on explaining away a lot of sciences greatest questions with my model but I could well be wrong and my theory may simply look legitimate due to a lot of coincidences?... No idea but it is how I picture it all working in any case and it answers all my questions :) The only way for me to prove my theory is to study it and I am a poor, unemployed back yard scientist. Most expensive experiment I can afford is the old "egg in the bottle" trick hahahahahahaha

Well my theory out of the way it may give you a clue to where I am going with your radiant energy question.

I am of the opinion that "radiant energy" is the exact same thing as heat and light... It is a byproduct of an energy exchange.
How do you capture light?... How do you capture heat?... How do you capture power?...
We know that power is generated by moving electrons from one spot to another. Two items with differing potentials will always obey the laws of nature and attempt to balance itself. In this balancing attempt electrons move from one point to another and as they do this they create an energy. The faster you excite the electrons the more energy they produce.
So unlike power generated by difference in potential you are asking how to grab this "energy" and store it to be used later on.
If you crack this question, my friend, you will be set for life :) The reason we have so many power issues at the moment is that science has not discovered a way to store this energy. The reason why wind generators are not effective when there is no wind for instance.... Because we can not grab the power... We use it as it is generated.
Plasma may be a way of capturing this energy? In any case to discover how to capture radiant energy you would be inventing a completely new way of handling power.
My personal belief is that the secret lays in magnetics. Our entire universe works on magnetics and a magnet is one of the few things that can "defy gravity". I firmly believe that in order to capture any radiant energy your machine would be built on a magnetic battery type of set up. If you could charge the electrons enough to stick together then you could capture them. Magnetic fields have been known to bend light so if they can affect the path light travels I am SURE it can capture electrons.... My inventions rely on magnetics mostly to create power but, although I believe I am close to cold fusion, I have still not devised a way to capture produced energy.

Anyway I have gone on enough. Cheers for stimulating my brain again... Love this web site!!!! lmao
 
E

ExactChange

Guest
Ark,

Here is a site with many papers http://public.lanl.gov/alp/plasma/papers.html

Kristian Birkeland http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kristian_Birkeland
Hans Alfven http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannes_Alfv%C3%A9n
Anthony Peratt http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Peratt
Halton Arp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halton_Arp
Donald Scott http://www.electric-cosmos.org/

There are many others writing on the subject but not all are physicists.
 
E

ExactChange

Guest
Ping,

As for energy storage, MIT has produced some good work on enhancing capacitors and batteries. Ultracapacitors constructed with carbon nanotubes can store more energy than standard batteries while providing fast charge/discharge times and can be charged/discharged over a million times with negligable memory effect. Another group is working on a technique to grow capcitance within plants by injecting a tailored virus. It might be possible someday to paint organic microcapacitors onto a flat surface.

Flywheel technology is another area worth considering, however I dislike so much moving parts. Some cities also store power generated at off-peak hours into a giant air compression tube.
 
L

Linnea

Guest
Hello ExactChange, Ark & Ping and all other interested in electric/plasma cosmology!

I recently sent a message in the "dark companion star" discussion, where I spoke about the electric universe hypothesis. Nice to see that someone else on the Forum also thinks it's worth some investigation!

Besides the links you give, Exact, I would like to add
public.lanl.gov/alp/plasma/universe.html Antony Peratt's site, complete introduction though not very well organized.
www.the-electric-universe.info I haven't read it all but it looks interesting
www.plasmacosmology.net A philosophical approach to consider.
and finally a wider theory, encompassing the preceding researchers:
www.holoscience.com, which is also linked with the Kronia group of interdisciplinary catastrophists.

So, when you've checked these sites out, we'll continue the discussion! I would love to be able to explain some of the theory, but I must admit I'm not... So please read some of the info on the sites - I think both educated and non-educated people (as far as you have at least some "college physics"!) will find insights in this theory.

A few reflections that came into my mind while studying these sites for a small and quite informal speech I made in february this year (Herault, France):

* What if we, who live in the 0,01% of the universe that is NOT plasma, suffer from an organization of matter/energy that does not correspond to our (and the universe's) true nature? Here, matter does not self-organize - except when it is in the form of cells, which by the way inspired the choice of the term 'plasma'. The only "organization" we find is mounts, piles, pyramids... governed by gravity laws. Energy does not self-produce neither; it is governed by the laws of thermodynamics, the entropy... While in a electromagnetic environment energy organizes matter into a cell-like, filamentous structure based on spirals, that renews energy (moving magnetic fields, electric currents... you'll understand better with the sites! :-) )
* When we align ourselves with what the Cassiopaeans called 4th density, maybe we have a stronger biomagnetic field... Whe working qi gong or i chuan, we feel the spiraling movement of qi, the cosmic respiration/energy... When contemplating the beauty of nature, from the dna to the sunflower to the galaxy, we see spirals... When we study old cultures, we find that they painted spirals...
* I linked in my mind the form of a birkeland current with that of a DNA-string and some of the Cassiopaeans commentarys on these, for example that the DNA is changed by certain frequencies and cormic rays.
* I thought of the networking mode and the pyramidal system we're living in as manifestations of matter governed by electric/magnetic forces as opposed to gravity.

I look forward to continuing this discussion. I think there is a lot more to this hypothesis than what first meets the eye, and I hope you will be critic and not swallow all the information as truths. Because, even if some parts of the hypothesis are wrong, it seems to 'fit' with many things in other areas, and helps us to combat superstitions.
 

ark

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ExactChange said:
Ark,

Halton Arp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halton_Arp


There are many others writing on the subject but not all are physicists.
Can you tell me what Halton Arp has to do with "electric universe"?
 
E

ExactChange

Guest
Ark,

Halton Arp's work deals with redshifts and he attempts to destroy the Big Bang Theory. I'm not sure if he is a proponent of Plasma Cosmology per se, but it looks as if his work is referenced quite a bit on the Electric Universe websites. As proponents of these theories are also interested in tossing out BBT, it may be that they are just using his work to springboard their own work.
 

ark

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ExactChange said:
As proponents of these theories are also interested in tossing out BBT, it may be that they are just using his work to springboard their own work.
But his work is in no way a springboard for their theories. In fact, quoting Halton Arp they put themselves in a funny position, becoming less reliable (as anyone who is quoting works that are not dealing with the given subject). In fact, you could check it yourself before quoting the reference to Halton Arp in your post. I did the check and it did not compute.

In general, we must be very careful when quoting sites that are parts of the official American government sites. To disinform on important matters is one of their top priorities. One has to be rather mature and experienced when using the data from these sites, as it is not easy to see what is the real data, and what is a bait used to catch a fish. (They are fishing for information, for names of the people who get interested, for names of the people who know something relevant etc. etc.)

As a matter of fact: I am not against the idea of the "electric universe". Here is my post to another forum from May 2001:

Ark: There are more puzzles and unknowns present in the
phenomena of cosmic electrodynamics than just that of
planetary magnetic fields. The origin of the magnetic field
of the sun is not entirely clear. We do not know the nature
of the currents that generated most of the cosmic magnetic
fields. In our own planetary system we can observe enormous
steady currents between Jupiter and its moon Io. There seems
to be a large electric potential difference between inner
and outer faces of Io. The stresses between Io and its
plasma torus are communicated in the form of Alfven waves.
Much less is known about elusive occasional cosmic
discharges documented in collections of anomalous planetary
phenomena. (See for instance "The moon and planets. A
catalog of astronomical anomalies", Compiled by W.R.
Corliss, The Sourcebook Project, 1985). Los Alamos plasma physics web site
states: "Just as gravity was the basis for
astrophysics in the twentieth century, electromagnetism will
be in the twenty-first century. This forthcoming scientific
revolution is presaged by the rapid pace of discoveries
about our own star, the Sun, and its total plasma
environment, and discoveries about the nature of
interstellar medium."
......
Ark: As of today the mechanisms of solar and planetary
magnetic and electric phenomena are not completely
understood. One possibility is that present theories based
on magneto hydrodynamics will be able to explain all
observed phenomena. But there is another possibility: that
cosmic bodies were born in complex and turbulent processes
involving multidimensional structure of space and time
itself, and that cosmic phenomena that are puzzling us today
will open the door towards completely new physics.

********

While writing the above, I studied the "Electric Universe"
web site, and I liked their ideas - although they are not
developed to any degree.

ark
:cool:
 
E

ExactChange

Guest
Ok so there's been discussion about planetary polar shifts and complete shutdowns of our magnetic shielding. I've been wondering about how our current carbon 14 or other radiometric dating methods would take that into account.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/carbon-141.htm

If carbon's (and I'm assuming other radioactive particles) halflife is based on interactions with cosmic rays, wouldn't there a different halflife during magnetic failure?
 
E

ExactChange

Guest
For that matter it seems that we use radiometric dating on asteriods. We've found them to be among the oldest rocks in the solar system.
 

shijing

The Living Force
Since James McCanney's work was discussed recently in the recent 12/12/10 session, I thought I'd post a recent video from the Thunderbolts site, the first part of Debunking Misconceptions about the Electric Universe.

Speaking of McCanney, I'm about halfway through his book right now, and so far my favorite hypothesis of his is that oil is not (or at least isn't largely) terrestrial in origin, but rather the result of the dumping from a large cometary body (perhaps Venus) onto the surface of the Earth in a pollution event like the one mentioned in the session. The reason this could happen is because larger bodies have enough mass to attract elemental debris from surrounding space as they travel, and elements such as hydrogen, oxygen, and carbon mix together to form water and hydrocarbons. In a near pass, a larger object (Earth) could strip this material away from a smaller body (Venus), causing water and oil to literally rain down upon the surface of the Earth, explaining, for example, why so many creatures are found in present-day tar-pits.
 

bngenoh

The Living Force
How about Electric Physiology:
Ferroelectricity—a spontaneous electrical polarization—was first discovered in potassium sodium tartrate, a salt, in 1920. The effect is reminiscent of ferromagnetism. At first, hydrogen bonding was thought to be essential for this property, until the finding of the ferroelectric oxide BaTiO3 two decades later. In 1974, ferroelectric liquid crystals were produced, following theoretical predictions based on intuitive symmetry arguments. Since then, intense scientific efforts have uncovered hundreds of ferroelectric materials in various forms, including submicron films, nanotubes, nanowires, integrated ferroelectrics, etc., many of which are neither hydrogen bonded nor oxides [1]. Now, writing in Physical Review Letters, Yuanming Liu and co-workers at the University of Washington in Seattle, with collaborators at Boston University, Massachusetts, demonstrate evidence of ferroelectricity in mammalian tissue [2].

The most prominent feature of ferroelectric materials is the ability to reverse their polarization by applying an electric field, again reminiscent of ferromagnets. The reversal typically occurs below a phase transition temperature, leading to a characteristic hysteresis loop of polarization plotted against applied electric field, and a butterfly-shaped loop in the deformation-voltage graph—properties that are the basis of commercial ferroelectric memories. Ferroelectric materials are usually also piezoelectric and pyroelectric, in that their polarization behavior can also be modulated by mechanical forces or temperature, respectively. Such versatile properties, and the ability to control them through several parameters (pressure, temperature, electric field) make them useful in many advanced technologies, such as ultrasound devices, high-quality infrared cameras, sonar, and vibration sensors, to name but a few examples.

Due to its attractive properties and applications, it is tempting to ask if ferroelectricy, like piezoelectricity and pyroelectricity, has also evolved in biological tissues through natural selection. Indeed, piezoelectricity in bone was discovered in 1957 and later reported in other biological materials as diverse as DNA, collagen, and silk. The piezoelectric effect is now generally thought to play an essential role in biological force sensing. For example, sustained applications of an electrical potential could stimulate both resorption and growth of bone [3]. Most recently, piezoelectricity has also been suggested to be one of the toughening mechanisms in seashells, the effect triggering energy dissipation upon external mechanical forces [4]. Analogously, pyroelectricity in bone and tendon was discovered in 1966 [5] and later reported in various biological tissues, including skin epidermis and the spinal cord [6]. The pyroelectric effect can, for example, enhance the efficiency of thermal energy conversion to electrical energy, for example, for sensor applications [6]. In comparison, however, there is so far very limited evidence for ferroelectricity in biological systems, especially in soft tissues.

[...]

Liu et al. obtained phase-voltage hysteresis loops at different points of their samples [Fig. 1(b)] consistently, indicating an overall ferroelectricity of the sample. The reversal in the piezoresponse phase occurred at a certain voltage, the so-called coercive voltage, which was measured to be approximately 8.4 V on the positive side and −10.8 V on the negative side, the asymmetry reflecting the existence of an internal polarization.The phase contrast was approximately 180 degrees, which is a clear indication of polarization switching. Associated with the phase reversal, the deformation-voltage butterfly loops were also observed [Fig. 1(c)], which saturated at a relatively high voltage, as expected, suggesting that the response was piezoelectric instead of electrostatic. The characteristic hysteresis and butterfly loops shown in Figs. 1(b) and 1(c) establish the existence of ferroelectricity in these samples. Through detailed switching-spectroscopy mapping, it was further recognized that the internal polarization of the aortic walls was biased outward. The relaxation studies also confirmed that the inward polarization switched by a negative voltage is unstable, and would reverse spontaneously to the more stable outward orientation shortly after the switching voltage was removed. [...]

The above discovery poses interesting questions regarding the purpose of ferroelectricity in aorta walls, where the blood pressure is highest and most pulsatile. Could the engineering principles of ferroelectricity, only mastered in modern times by mankind, have already been implemented in nature for millions of years? For example, could ferroelectricity function as a critical component in a local integrated memorylike structure, together with nerves within the aorta?
The memory like structure is very interesting, because it could be a basis, for how we store traumas in our bodies.
Beyond all these possibilities and promises, however, it should be emphasized that how ferroelectricity occurs in such a biological system as aortal walls is still a mystery, although it has also been reported recently in sea shells, so there are precedents for biological ferroelectricity [4]. Interestingly, the intima’s structure, when examined by atomic force microscopy reveals a fibrous network with globular particles. Could these be connected with the observed ferroelectricity? Will the same behaviors exist under normal physiological conditions as well as in dry samples studied in the laboratory?
Source: http://physics.aps.org/articles/v5/19

The "fibrous network with globular particles" bit brought to mind, The Electric Universe's Cosmology, the fibrous networks being akin to Birkeland currents, and the globular particles being stars, planets, etc.

So it really is an as above so below type thing, one of the differences being scale.
 

shijing

The Living Force
bngenoh said:
The memory like structure is very interesting, because it could be a basis, for how we store traumas in our bodies.

If so, it might be another clue about how E/E works.
 
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