Is Roger Waters becoming the new troll of the radical left?

IronFloyd

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
I was watching the video of Roger Waterd in Brazil, where he makes a criticism and calls not to vote for the fascist Bolsonaro, but this, he does, together with showing on the screens, a list with the names of "neo fascists" that are making the world a shit, and among those that includes Vladimir Putin, that if, at least with a question mark, but whatever, Waters includes him in some way in the same bag within the neo-fascists. Obviously he includes Donald Trump as the main fascist, which he describes as the new Hitler (in his show too saying in the song "Pigs" (Three Different Ones); "Trump, you're a pig, Trump, you're an asshole", and in synthesis, with a new insult in each country), but with Barack Obama he always tended to praise him, and if there were criticisms to him, they were always lukewarm, to finally end up saying about Obama; "The country will soon learn to miss its reflexive, articulate, intelligent, political and measured forms..., love".

Of course Roger Waters has had very clear positions with respect to Israel, and what he pointed out about the White Helmets, but "in addition and subtraction", I think there is a strong confusion in his mind, almost to point of he is becoming in another puppet to confuse the masses with these mixtures of truths with lies. In another hand, a few years ago I had the opportunity to witness his show, which in addition to bombastic and spectacular, I found a certain taste of plastic, with many passages in the show even using playback, unlike David Gilmour's concert that I witnessed in 2015, where under a simple staging he generated an electrifying and beautiful atmosphere without the need to resort to confusion and radicalizing people.

 

Turgon

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Yes, I saw him in concert last year and he had the same message in regards to Putin and Trump. Which is too bad because even though I've always had a lot of respect for Roger Waters as an artist and how outspoken he has been, especially in regards to Palestine, he really dropped the ball on this one. One of the things I really enjoyed about Pink Floyd was how they mixed certain political and social commentary in their music in an almost abstract way, but his recent tour felt like 'too much' and 'in your face' with his images and videos of Trump and Putin.
 

Renaissance

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Seems there's very few celebrities, musicians, etc who actually get the big picture of what is going on in the world. The anti-Russian propaganda has been far reaching. Most simply do not have a clue as to the details of geopolitics or the histories of foreign nations, which makes for fertile ground in believing lies. What seems to have happened over the past couple of years is that the mindset of the 'Deep State' or whatever you want to call it has become the mind of 'the people', i.e. the programming has become complete. In other words, it's not just the Deep State that is driving things anymore but also the corrupted will of the people, which includes influential people like Roger Waters.

The political hysterics driving such people are saturating every facet of culture: music, movies, language, literature, arts, sports, education, technology, and science. Agenda driven creations lack substance. They have the "taste of plastic" as you mention, IronFloyd. And then there is the fallout because their creations have become ruined. People leave Facebook because they don't want to be controlled or told what they can and cannot share. They don't watch the latest Star Wars because the franchise doesn't care about the fans. They stop reading the news and stop watching (American) football because it's all so damn political. Then when it becomes apparent that things aren't working anymore, what do they do but blame Russia!!
 

Alana

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
Well, I agree with his latest "US hands off Venezuela" message, even if he is anti-Trump. He probably only now realizes that the US is staging a coup in the country, even though they've been trying to accomplish it through different means ever since the 90s, so it seems to be a Deep State objective more than Trump's.
 

IronFloyd

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
Well, I agree with his latest "US hands off Venezuela" message, even if he is anti-Trump. He probably only now realizes that the US is staging a coup in the country, even though they've been trying to accomplish it through different means ever since the 90s, so it seems to be a Deep State objective more than Trump's.
Totally agree, especially now that a concert "in favor" of Venezuela (actually against Maduro; "Venezuela Live Aid") is being organized, with mostly right-wing people, and the only one who has said things more or less as are in this case, has been Roger Waters... I hope someday he reconsider his vision completely mistaken about Putin, especially now that Russia is practically the only one that is really helping Venezuela.

 

Windmill knight

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Moderator
FOTCM Member
Totally agree, especially now that a concert "in favor" of Venezuela (actually against Maduro; "Venezuela Live Aid") is being organized, with mostly right-wing people, and the only one who has said things more or less as are in this case, has been Roger Waters... I hope someday he reconsider his vision completely mistaken about Putin, especially now that Russia is practically the only one that is really helping Venezuela.
He's been right about Palestine and Venezuela; but wrong about Putin (though I haven't checked out what he exactly said about him), and at least partially wrong about Trump. But it would be too much to ask, IMO. Sadly, in our world it is next to impossible to find a public figure who checks all the right boxes. Even Jordan Peterson was saying that Assad was gassing his own people. So I guess we are just going to have to be a bit tolerant and patient with those who appear to be honest and good-willed, even if they don't always get it. We too are learning here, and we may be proved wrong as well regarding different topics. It's all too human I guess, and part of the lessons on this planet, never or very rarely to find all the golden eggs in one basket.
 

Gandalf

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
So I guess we are just going to have to be a bit tolerant and patient with those who appear to be honest and good-willed, even if they don't always get it. We too are learning here, and we may be proved wrong as well regarding different topics. It's all too human I guess, and part of the lessons on this planet, never or very rarely to find all the golden eggs in one basket.
Indeed but here what helps us quite a lot is Networking. You can not see all the sides of a problem if you are alone but in group and with networking, we do increase our chance to have a better look and understanding.
 

IronFloyd

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
He's been right about Palestine and Venezuela; but wrong about Putin (though I haven't checked out what he exactly said about him), and at least partially wrong about Trump. But it would be too much to ask, IMO. Sadly, in our world it is next to impossible to find a public figure who checks all the right boxes. Even Jordan Peterson was saying that Assad was gassing his own people. So I guess we are just going to have to be a bit tolerant and patient with those who appear to be honest and good-willed, even if they don't always get it. We too are learning here, and we may be proved wrong as well regarding different topics. It's all too human I guess, and part of the lessons on this planet, never or very rarely to find all the golden eggs in one basket.
You are quite right, and regard to Waters and his particular vision about Putin, it could be said that in his statements, he is somewhat confused, sometimes it seems that he is about to hit the nail, but generally what he has said in his assessments, is put him almost at the same level with Trump. But the most confusing thing is what he has done in his shows, where he put Trump as a puppet and the new "Hitler", and Putin as another neofacist along with other even more nefarious political figures, and as the puppeteer who handles this "Monster Trump" in his evil.

I agree with you in the sense that patience and observation are the keys here.

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