Le mystere des cathedrales, plate 40, the sacred marriage

[T.C.]

Could anyone tell me what is the figure to the left of the picture hiding behind the tree? Fulcanelli seems to have not noticed it (yeah, right!).

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

Is that picture available online anywhere?

 

[the_hammer]

I haven´t read the entire book yet, so this is just a guess. I would think that the person behind the tree could be a representation of the residue from the process, since they stand as a unit (but divided) in the shade of a tree with a dove resting at the top.

 

[D Rusak]

The whole book is actually online at _www.scribd.com/doc/48435/ Fulcanelli-Le-Mystere-de-Cathedrales

In my copy it is quite difficult to make out. My computer isn't being too happy right now (browser crashed twice upon trying to zoom in on the plate) so I'm going to enlarge a photocopy of the book tomorrow.

NB- In my copy (Sworder) of the book plate 40 is listed as "Jacques Coeur's house- Treasure Chamber. Tristan and Isolde group".

Also, Fulcanelli notes on p. 143

Finally, let me describe a detail of some value to the analysis of the symbol. The tree situated behind Tristan is laden with enormous fruit-gigantic pears or figs- in such abundance that the foliage disappears in the mass of fruit. Truly it is a strange place, this Forest of Mort-Roi (Dead King), and how like it is to the fabulous and wonderful Garden of the Hesperides!

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

FYI:



I believe that's the image in question.

 

[Approaching Infinity]

Yikes, looks like a grey to me.

 

[T.C.]

The Hammer wondered if the figure could be the residue of the process. This is a possibility, but, would Fulcanelli not have mentioned this? After reading Secret History of the World, it appears that Fulcanelli did not include an analysis of Auch Cathedral which LKJ suggests is probably the most important of all, with key-like qualities. So there is an example of an ommission by him. I posted on casschat that to me it did look like a grey, but no one commented. I thought the section on UFO's etc might have been a more appropriate place for discussion.

 

[Zadius Sky]

The Hammer wondered if the figure could be the residue of the process. This is a possibility, but, would Fulcanelli not have mentioned this? After reading Secret History of the World, it appears that Fulcanelli did not include an analysis of Auch Cathedral which LKJ suggests is probably the most important of all, with key-like qualities. So there is an example of an ommission by him. I posted on casschat that to me it did look like a grey, but no one commented. I thought the section on UFO's etc might have been a more appropriate place for discussion.

Well, any works or analysis of Fulcanelli should be discussed in "The Work" section, which is why I just noticed your thread had been moved to from "UFO" section.

Yikes, looks like a grey to me.

Yeah, it does. It seems to me, from looking at the image (provided by SAO), that the Grey might be both symbolic and literal. What purpose does the Grey have for "Tristan and Isolde"? I have yet to read the Fulcanelli. So, this is my initial assumption (and I'm not sticking to it).

The whole book is actually online at _www.scribd.com/doc/48435/ Fulcanelli-Le-Mystere-de-Cathedrales

Thanks Rusak! I've been meaning to find that.

Edit:

I just looked at the section in "Le mystere des cathedrales" where that image is concerned. I would like to insert a full quote (page 141-43) for this thread.

A fine group, sculptured on a bracket, ornaments the room called the Treasure Chamber. We are told that it represents the meeting of Tristan and Isolde. I shall not contradict that and, in any case, the subject does not change the symbolic effect. This fine medieval poem is part of a cycle of Round Table romances, which are traditional hermetic legends, reviving the Greek fables. They directly concern the transmission of ancient scientific knowledge in the guise of stories, popularized by the genius of the trouveres of Picardy (pl. XL).

In the centre of the motif, a casket in the form of a cube protrudes at the foot of a bushy tree, whose foliage conceals the crowned head of King Mark. On each side appear Tristan of Lyonnesse and Isolde, the former wearing a chaperon with buriet and the latter a crown, which she is adjusting with her right hand. Our characters are shown in the Forest of Morois on a carpet of long grass and flowers and they are both gazing at the mysterious hollowed-out stone, which separates them.

The myth of Tristan and Isolde offers a parallel to the myth of Theseus. Tristan fights and kills the Mohout, Theseus the Minotaur. We rediscover here the hieroglyph for the manufacture of the Green Lion-hence the name Tristan of Lyonnesse-which is taught by Basil Valentine in the form of the combat between the two champions, the eagle and the dragon. This strange encounter of chemical bodies, whose combination provides the secret solvent (and the vessel of the compound), has been the subject of many secular fables and sacred allegories. It is Cadmus, pinning the serpent to an oak tree; Apollo killing the monster Python with arrows and Jason destroying the dragon of Colchis. It is the combat between Horus and Typhon in the Osirian myth; Hercules cutting off the heads of the hydra and Perseus cutting off the Gorgon's head. St. Michael, St. George and St. Marcellus destroying the dragon are Christian counterparts of Perseus, mounted on his horse Pegasus, killing the monster which guarded Andromeda. It is also the combat between the fox and the cock, which I mentioned when describing the Paris medallions; the combat between the alchemist and the dragon (Cyliani); between the remora and the salamander (Cyrano de Bergerac); between the red serpent and the green serpent, e t ~ .

This uncommon solvent enables the natural gold to be reincr~ded,~softened and restored to its original state in a saline, friable and very fusible form. This is the rejuvenation of the king, described by all the authors, the beginning of a new evolutionary phase, personified, in the motif we are considering, by Tristan, nephew of King Mark. In fact the uncle and the nephew are, chemically speaking, one and the same thing; of the same kind and similar in origin. The gold loses its crown-that is to say it loses its colour for a certain period-and remains deprived of it until it has reached that degree of superiority to which art or nature may carry it. It then inherits a second one, 'infinitely nobler than the first', as Limojon de St. Didier assures us. Thus we see the outlines of Tristan and Queen Isolde standing out clearly, while the old king remains hidden in the foliage of the central tree, which is growing out of the stone-as the tree of Jesse grows out of the chest of the patriarch. Let us also note that the queen is the wife of both the old man and of the young hero. This in accordance with hermetic tradition, which makes the king, the queen and the lover combine to form the mineral triad of the Great Work. Finally, let me describe a detail of some value to the analysis of the symbol. The tree situated behind Tristan is laden with enormous fruit-gigantic pears or figs-in such abundance that the foliage disappears in the mass of fruit. Truly it is a strange place, this Forest of Mort-Roi (Dead King), and how like it is to the fabulous and wonderful Garden of the Hesperides!

 

[Beau]

The Hammer wondered if the figure could be the residue of the process. This is a possibility, but, would Fulcanelli not have mentioned this? After reading Secret History of the World, it appears that Fulcanelli did not include an analysis of Auch Cathedral which LKJ suggests is probably the most important of all, with key-like qualities. So there is an example of an ommission by him. I posted on casschat that to me it did look like a grey, but no one commented. I thought the section on UFO's etc might have been a more appropriate place for discussion.

Well, any works or analysis of Fulcanelli should be discussed in "The Work" section, which is why I just noticed your thread had been moved to from "UFO" section.

I agree with Thomas. The original post was about the picture of an alien-looking creature in one of Fulcanelli's plates. I didn't see anything wrong with him posting it in the UFO section. We're not so rigid as to say one HAS to post works or analysis of Fulcanelli in The Work topic. It fits here and it would fit in UFO, What's on your mind... There's no hard and fast rules for these things.

 

[Zadius Sky]

I agree with Thomas. The original post was about the picture of an alien-looking creature in one of Fulcanelli's plates. I didn't see anything wrong with him posting it in the UFO section. We're not so rigid as to say one HAS to post works or analysis of Fulcanelli in The Work topic. It fits here and it would fit in UFO, What's on your mind... There's no hard and fast rules for these things.

In some ways, I knew that. I was merely stating as a possible why would his thread been moved. However, I didn't move it. fwiw.

 

[Ivan_]

Hey guys, I made a cell-phone photo of a similar odd creature in a church in Berlin (loaded with hermetic symbols), namely this one _http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolaikirche in english and _http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolaikirche_%28Berlin%29 in german. Here it is the particular photo: http://img36.imageshack.us/i/05052010026.jpg/. I can give a spasmodic try to interpret the whole picture, and you can help if you wish. Being connected with the Adam and Eve theme, I guess you know what that thing and the snake in the tree might be. The tool in the creature's hand looks like a sickle/scythe (from etymoonline: sickle:

O.E. sicol, probably a W.Gmc. borrowing (cf. M.Du. sickele, O.H.G. sihhila, Du. sikkel, Ger. Sichel) from V.L. *sicila, from L. secula "sickle" (cf. It. segolo "hatchet"), from PIE base *sek- "cut" (see section). Applied to curved or crescent-shaped things from 1459. Sickle-cell anemia is first recorded 1922.

and also I found the part of the transcripts which refer to Scythians:

Q: What was the meaning of the Sword thrust into the ground that was worshipped by
the Scythians; the Scythians being connected with the Hyperboreans and Celts of Britain?
A: Scithe.
Q: Who was that?
A: Scythe.
Q: That was the Sword God? Saturn?
A: No.
Q: That was the meaning of the sword thrust into the ground; it was a scythe?
A: Empowerer, or so they thought.
Q: Which god did this sword in the ground represent?
A: Maybe Zeus.

but to be honest I don't know the background of that particular research of Laura's, so following your advice, I probably shouldn't try to interpret because of possible misinterpretations, methinks, is either the technology with which the Lizzies altered humans or a symbolism of the Fall of going for physicality, the STS "harvest" of the snake as whole. I am not sure about the symbol on the right - the person with the horn, my wild guess is that it is the horn of Amalthea, but I am most probably wrong. From Etymology Online - horn

O.E. horn "horn of an animal," also "wind instrument" (originally made from animal horns), from P.Gmc. *khurnaz (cf. Ger. Horn, Du. horen, Goth. haurn), from PIE *ker- "uppermost part of the body, head, horn, top, summit" (cf. Gk. karnon, L. cornu, Skt. srngam "horn"). Reference to car horns is first recorded 1901. A hornpipe was originally a hornepype (c.1400), a musical instrument with bell and mouthpiece made of horn, later (c.1485) "dance associated with sailors" (originally performed to music from such an instrument). To horn in "intrude" is attested by 1880, originally cowboy slang, on the notion of buffalo behavior)

Then, are the angels, which I have always wondered what they really, fully meant, appart from what I would think - an angels acording to the C's is an STO being - a winged pure being, sometimes a child sometimes an "adult" angel - dweller of the higher realms. An old man, probably symbolising God, (between whose feet stays a young person, who that is an what he symbolizes I don't know), takes out a sword, which is, according to my latin dictionary - ferrum, gladius, ensis, mucro - a sharp point, edge, dagger point, chalybs-steel, iron, sickel, sword, and i can also remember this part of the transcripsts on swords:

970712
A: Swords, daggers pierce...
Q: Is this P-S something about "Percy?" Swords, daggers, pierce...
Damascus? Damascus steel?
A: Search for learning.
Q: Okay. Now, I have got this "Et in Arcadia ego" rearranged to
"Tiena arca Ida geo." Am I onto something here, or am I nowhere
near it?
A: Close.
Q: And we have the Rho-Chi for Rosy Cross, and we have the Ida,
which is Tejeda on Tenerife, and we have the REDDIS, which I am
interpreting as Rhedae, or
Rhea, which is another name for Ceres or Demeter, and REGIS as
Dionysus, one being the earth and the other being the spirit, and the
CELLIS being the feminine principle, and the Arcis being the
masculine principle... and then we have this Prae-cum which is
above the spider image. Why is the arrow pointing from the P-S
down to the spider? What is the spider?
A: You know of the spider!
Q: Well, yes, but I know what I know, but I don't know if I am getting
anywhere!
A: You will when you connect "the dots."
Q: Connect the dots... My God! Swords, daggers.... I GET IT!
A: It is the "destiny!"
Q: Yeah! I just got the image of the "Piercing of the spider," rather
like pinning it to a piece of paper as a specimen where it can no
longer spin its web and entrap!!!

Above his head is a halo, aureole (laurentum, Or , aura, - from auris - heaven, gold - and strangely - ear, which, if you follow, takes you to aristo - great, spica, spicum, and the then spiculum - sharp point, sting, spear, dart, then with the change of one single vowel it becomes speculum - mirror, observe. Sorry can't help it :P ). Appart from the obvious things which wrote about, I can't go further because I have lots of missing pieces and am very far from a final picture of the complete truth of this image. I could be very wrong somewhere though, I am not able to interpret esoteric symbols, the fact that I couldn't get anything new out of it proves it, but I tried and am willing to learn how to do it. Criticism is strongly encouraged, where needed ofcourse, if needed - removal, moving and any kinds of corrections by the mods. I still have not found the texts on those stone plates in written form (which are in old german), which I should do for a complete picture. I created a small album with the photos from that place which I took and posted them here if someone is interested: _http://profile.imageshack.us/user/propi11, there are a few videos too but I don't know where to upload them. I hope that some day soon I will be able to buy a decent camera and upload for all of you decent images of German churches, cathedrals, museums as they contain symbols, some of which are somewhat known to us - oaks, doves, roses, horses, etc. Berlin itself is loaded with all this symbolism of classic mythology and hermeticism.
Edit: Added 3 videos as well, here: http://img526.imageshack.us/g/file26473.mp4/ . On a side note, since I didn't see anywhere else in the forum, let this be removed by the mods if I'm wrong, here are illustrations from Dwellings of the Philosophers online: _http://cista.net/Houses/Houses%20of%20the%20Philosophers/Album1.htm. FYI If you delete parts of the link and leave _http://cista.net/Houses/ you will see an incomplete (osit) version of Dwellings (in Word 2007 it amounts only to about 257 pages or something, nothing like the real book which is more than 500).

 

[Andromeda]

Yikes, looks like a grey to me.

Geez, it DOES look like a grey...

 

[Ivan_]

I found a few versions of plate 40, the sacred marriage, which I would like to share with you, hope it will be helpful, starting from the ones that are more clear and going to the ones that are rather vague (concerning the personage behind the tree I mean):

_http://www.archerjulienchampagne.com/photo-1169329-tristanyseult.champagne_jpg.html

_http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/Cul.de.lampe.hotel.Jacques.Coeur.Bourges.png

_http://herve.delboy.perso.sfr.fr/tristan.jpg

_http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3171/3033611411_aea310ca2e.jpg

_http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1234/1340303351_455090e6cb.jpg

_http://idata.over-blog.com/0/23/43/31/champagne4/champagne.chambre.tresor.ipg.jpg
To the mods: resize, move or otherwise change as you please :)
There are also a few articles about this in french:
_http://www.archerjulienchampagne.com/article-2523792.html
_http://www.nephtys.com/jacques-coeur-bourges-alchimie-6.htm
It seems to me it's not a gray. I can't give an answer to the question who is that person though, at least not yet, sorry.
Added: I can make a guess based on the second article and some lame translation by google translator that this is: "A fool (mercury) that spies." (Un fou (le mercure) les épie. ). I can't verify that but it's my best guess up till now. I will keep you updated if I find anything new.

 

[David]

For what its worth, the figure behind the tree reminds me of the ‘hidden one’, the figure with his hand missing perhaps signifying an initiate (the hidden hand mentality, the hand missing might be pure accident), the box perhaps like Pandora's Box and the lady looks like she just fell out of her tree or rather her tree collapsed and her partner looking down from his tree in the middle, maybe signifying the a fall from grace, if so would the opening of the box or door make for the restoration of all things or the fall of the next tree.

It's hard to see the little details from the pictures and the different angle of the pictures makes it seem quiet difference regarding the details, anyway just my two cents.

Edit added; The C's suggested the figure behind the tree is a ‘Houdini’ of sorts. Houdini makes me think that maybe the Hitler's big and small through out history are the straight jackets, Houdini in and out at opportune moments starting wars, generally guiding humanity into the abyss that sort of thing maybe even manipulating/guiding the guy with no right hand appearing where a hand should be, kind of fits in with the last supper info (SHOTW). Kind of fits with the expression ‘I would give my right hand or arm for ….’.

Oops, Pandora didn't have a box only a Jar (shotw) sorry, but it seems to me like a box or door, false treasure/trouble, a stumbling block.
Is the Lady the hidden treasure that loved to be found (Goddess, Nature itself) she is well healed and a crown, her partner still in his tree and apart of nature also perhaps, she seems to be already married, why call it a sacred marriage when it looks like the beginning of trouble in paradise (separation), perhaps caused by Houdini, the guy in the middle could represent humanity with or without the right hand going for the gold (rich or poor) or maybe it would turn out in the end to help the Goddess back on her feet and she might return the favour and get the Houdini out of here, I do like happy endings, hope springs eternal, anyway that's my impression slightly adjusted way off, maybe.

A magician once said “Magicians are more educated than the public are in deception”, well Houdini was a magician and magicians deceive in order to put food on the table.

Just an impression

 

[okiron]

Question: (the figure hiding behind one of the three)1. what kind or what type of clothing would have a ball like shape attached on a sleeve? and would it represent the status of that figure? and also, what is it that he's holding in his LEFT hand? the first picture shows a small head on a stick (that's what it looks like to me that is) but than it gets distorted on the stone carvings, including the last pencil drawing, why are those different than the first pencil drawing; the one with the "head on the stick"? I get the impression it has something to do with listening to the talking head or a voice from something or somebody. But the distorted seems to me looks more like a device like calculator.

Question:(the young prince)what culture or timeframe show where a man takes his (left) arm from his sleeve and holds his hand on his chest to gesture what?
So many questions ..how does one go about finding such answers?
okiron

Question:(the box/plate) The first picture shows there's something in it, somekind of object but the rest seems like the box/plate is empty or writtings of somekind, why did the artist see it differently?

Question:(the princess) To me the princess looks more like she seducing or enticing the prince. I mean she's practically laying flat. She's pulling her dress and exposing her shoe! I wouldn't call that "sacred", imo. and who is that hiding beside the princess? The first picture shows someone with wings?? but not the others, it looks more like a sleeve to me, it almost kinda makes you think it's the princess herself adjusting her crown.

Question:(the trees) The first tree with fruits and a dove , the second tree holds a head (old king) with scrolls (fist picture) underneath it looking directly at the princess or maybe it's looking at the figure beside the princess? The third tree to me seems like it's been cut right before the branching. It almost looks like a human brain don't it?

You know the more I type out these questions, the more it appears as a story being told, ooh how weird is that. But this story sounds somewhat like what Laura's been writting about in her books. So the mystery really does center around this box/plate...was there an actual object holding somekind of knowledge, gone missing? or was it taken, if so by whom? and most of all what was this object of knowledge, if I interpreted correctly?