NeuroFeedback and Electroencephalography

Ant22

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
J'ai entendu parler de ce casque hier matin avant cristal Prières Laura et Reiki à 3h du matin en France, qu'en pensez vous ?

I heard about this helmet yesterday morning before crystal Prayers Laura and Reiki at 3am in France, what do you think?

Hi PERLOU, it does look interesting and the price is attractive too - compared with the cost of NeurOptimal. Apparently, what makes NeurOptimal better than other systems is the fact it is nonlinear. The brain is non-linear too and most other systems are linear. I can't see any information regarding this system being linear or nonlinear. Have you come across this information anywhere?
 

anka

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Choepel told me a story about the company's experience with the Food and Drug Administration in the US. Let me tell briefly what I remember. As I understood it, the FDA does not like NO because the system does not require any master degree in science to operate and it brings fascinating therapeutic results. No surprise for those who know what 'good' FDA has done for American people during its existence. So FDA started to investigate Zengar which went on for 12 months and made everyone in the company almost paranoid because for some time it seemed that the days of NO are over in the US.

At the end officers came to Zengar's with this ultimate resolution. Either NO must be registered as a medical devices (which would mean only medics could operate it) or it has to be registered as a health&wellness device under condition that no therapeutic properties shall be advertised. If this was breached it would mean serious offense and legal trouble. Understandably, Zengar opted for the latter to stay on the market but the paranoia does not fade away and the company had to start pushing very strict policy even towards business NO users from other continents. Never ever shall the word 'therapeutic' be used by any of NO service providers from now on. Zengar has already been checking randomly many foreign website of NO providers and will continue to do because the threat from FDA is obviously very real.

So who knows what's in store next... maybe some day this Big Deep Med consortium will try to corrupt Zengar founders or press them to make NO somewhat exclusive because services that help to improve peoples health don't fit the depopulation agenda? I certainly wish Val Brown and his wife will stand their ground so users of NO system would continue to benefit. Time will tell.
 

SMM

The Living Force
NeurOptimal have offers running from November 18th to December 18th open to PASS Members. It includes $0 cashdown and 0% interest for 12 months on systems' financing. If shipping abroad (from Canada), there'll still be taxes bear in mind.
 

liam1310

Jedi
Great info on here, thanks guys.

Have the funds now to rent a machine and have the book Laura mentioned, healing developmental trauma. I'm looking at this site the only one I found so far that rents the machine.
They use a muse headset, is anyone familiar with this set up? Just want to make sure that it will do the job before spending the money.
 

goyacobol

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Great info on here, thanks guys.

Have the funds now to rent a machine and have the book Laura mentioned, healing developmental trauma. I'm looking at this site the only one I found so far that rents the machine.
They use a muse headset, is anyone familiar with this set up? Just want to make sure that it will do the job before spending the money.
@liam1310 ,

I do not think this clinic has NeurOptimal units. NeurOptimal is not the same as most neurofeedback treatments. I hope you have read the whole thread before doing treatments or making payments.

This is a long thread but it started in 2013 before we found NeurOptimal in 2017. The first mention of NeurOptimal started here on page 1 in case you want to see the progress after we discussed the differences and advantages. Most of our testing switched to NeurOptimal after having good results.

NeurOptimal has also been referenced in one of the Cs sessions. The session was done while Laura was monitored by a NeurOptimal unit.

Session 14 April 2018:
[Laura was connected to the NeurOptimal machine during the session to see if any interesting brainwave activity was recorded. See next post for comments on the data we were getting. To enhance this highly scientific endeavor, Arky brought his gauss meter down, and it was placed on the table near the board.]

Laura session with Neuroptimal 14 April 2018.jpg
NeurOptimal does not try to program/re-program using preset database parameters but gives your brain feedback dynamically using general brainwave level changes registered as breaks/pauses in audio/video feedback.
 

anka

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I do not think this clinic has NeurOptimal units. NeurOptimal is not the same as most neurofeedback treatments. I hope you have read the whole thread before doing treatments or making payments.
I am actually tempted to try Muse myself not because I would think it will do any good but because I have a friend who came to me for NO3 sessions (now postponed for health issues) and she's owner of one Muse headset. From what she told me I understand that a Muse device tries to really deliver an information in an invasive manner as you described and she used to use it for truck driving during nights but she mentioned that it was really working for 2-3 hours as if you had a triple coffee and than a strong boomerang effect (described by Gaby in interview with Val Brown) came in, with a tiredness and mild 'depression'.

I was thinking that I would like to try one session of some linear neurofeedback just to get an idea how it feels and what kind of strange device gets som much promotion on the internet these days. Allegedly instead of gentle interruptions which you get in NO3, a linear neurofeedback from Muse) pushes the brain with series of 'clicks', sometimes sounding like an automatic weapon. Not that it is something I want to experiment with in long term but would like to have a comparison. Maybe just playing the sound in the speakers during one experimental session.

BTW, the mentioned woman has really enjoyed her first sessions, described it very pleasant and fell asleep so deeply every time that I had to let her with the system on afterwards about 10-15 minutes undisturbed because it was obvious she needed it so badly :) For a deeper effect we need to give her a longer training series but she felt some result immediately (she is diagnosed with Parkinson). I will report my finding with first group of people soon.

Edit: P.S. But I second goyacobol's suggestion, liam1310. Don't spend a penny on buying or renting any other systems. Better wait for access to NeurOptimal.
 

liam1310

Jedi
@liam1310 ,

I do not think this clinic has NeurOptimal units. NeurOptimal is not the same as most neurofeedback treatments. I hope you have read the whole thread before doing treatments or making payments.

This is a long thread but it started in 2013 before we found NeurOptimal in 2017. The first mention of NeurOptimal started here on page 1 in case you want to see the progress after we discussed the differences and advantages. Most of our testing switched to NeurOptimal after having good results.

NeurOptimal has also been referenced in one of the Cs sessions. The session was done while Laura was monitored by a NeurOptimal unit.

Session 14 April 2018:


NeurOptimal does not try to program/re-program using preset database parameters but gives your brain feedback dynamically using general brainwave level changes registered as breaks/pauses in audio/video feedback.
Thank you, I will pay more attention in the future. So if I understand correctly, most biofeedback techniques take a reading/ from the brain, based on results a program is then set up to reprogram the brain, on the other hand with neurOptimal feedback the computer tells the brain what needs to be done through feedback pauses in music etc so the brain knows were to correct itself.
 

nicklebleu

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Thank you, I will pay more attention in the future. So if I understand correctly, most biofeedback techniques take a reading/ from the brain, based on results a program is then set up to reprogram the brain, on the other hand with neurOptimal feedback the computer tells the brain what needs to be done through feedback pauses in music etc so the brain knows were to correct itself.
The audible ‘clicks’ in NO indicate a ‘shift’ in the brain, but doesn’t tell the brain what to do, it merely highlights that something is happening. The brain with its innate capability to self-regulate is then left to choose whether or not it will do something about it.

On the other hand linear neurofeedback trains the brain within tight parameters, chosen by the practitioner. This requires a lot of experience to get right, and even then is a bit hit and miss, as often the complaints indicate both overactivity in one part of the brain and underactivity in another. It is to some degree possible to upregulate some parts and to downregular others, but only at a few sites. The brain is a complexly networked organism and often there are unintended consequences in up- or downregulating certain parts in isolation.

NO avoids this issue and leaves it to the brain to sort it out.

Hope that makes it a bit more clear.
 
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