Noble Music

Mountain Crown

The Living Force
I've been looking at music as the motor center's creative manifestation, not to imply of course, that any center is ever functioning entirely in isolation. There is, however, something about music I would like to consider: it can have sentiment, but often won't; it can be programmatic or not (historically there were times this was frowned upon); it can be a purely aesthetic or mathematical statement; it may include lyrics, and it can make you get up and dance!

The motor is regarded as one of the centers of consciousness, and in music it expresses itself, with the ability, often noted, to speak transcendentally to the soul.

I thought I'd list some of its more sophisticated moments - please don't read this as a snubbing of other forms where there is great value. Music is a language of sound, and as in any language there are varying degrees of maturity. Also, this doesn't necessarily mean complexity, some of the most sublime is expressed simply, whether in music or in words.

Beethoven's Piano Concerto no. 5 (Emperor) is an excellent start. It is profound, superbly crafted, and meaningful. It celebrates music for itself while communicating a range of emotions.

I've listened to this in my darkest hours; it brings my emotional center to conclude that life is worthwhile, that it should be approached maturely, and along with suffering beauty can be experienced. Well, it does that to me anyway.

[quote author=Wikipedia]
I. Allegro

The piece begins with three full orchestra chords, each followed by a short cadenza, improvisatory in nature but written out in the score. These short cadenzas recur intermittently throughout the piece.

As music's Classical era gave way to its Romantic era, composers began experimenting with the manner in which one or more solo instruments introduced music. Beethoven had already explored such possibilities in his Piano Concerto No. 4, but the monumental piano introduction in Piano Concerto No. 5 – it lasts for nearly two minutes – foreshadowed future concerti such as Mendelssohn's Violin Concerto or Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto in B-flat minor.

The first movement is deceptively complex. Despite its use of simple chords, including a second theme constructed almost entirely out of tonic and dominant notes and chords, it is full of complex thematic transformations. The complexity is intensified once the piano enters with the first theme, as the expository material is repeated with far more complex variations, virtuoso figurations, and complex modified chords. The second theme enters in the surprising key of B minor before moving to C-flat major and at last the expected key of B-flat major several bars later.

Aside from the opening cadenzas, the movement follows Beethoven's trademark three-theme sonata structure for a concerto. The orchestral exposition is a typical two-theme sonata exposition, but the "second exposition" with the piano has a triumphant virtuoso third theme at the end that belongs solely to the solo instrument. Beethoven does this in many of his concerti. The coda at the end of the movement is quite long, and, again typical of Beethoven, uses the open-ended first theme and gives it closure to create a satisfying conclusion.

II. Adagio un poco mosso

The second movement in B major is, in standard contrast to the first, calm and reflective. It moves into the third movement without interruption when a lone bassoon note B drops a semitone to B-flat, the dominant note to the tonic key E-flat.

III. Rondo: Allegro ma non troppo

The final movement of the concerto is in seven-part rondo form (ABACABA), a typical concerto finale form. The piano begins the movement by playing its main theme, then followed by the full orchestra. The rondo's B section begins with piano scales, before the orchestra again responds. The C section is much longer, presenting the theme from the A section in three different keys before the piano performs a cadenza. Rather than finishing with a strong entrance from the orchestra, however, the trill ending the cadenza dies away until the introductory theme reappears, played first by the piano and then the orchestra. In the last section, the theme undergoes variation before the concerto ends with a short cadenza and robust orchestral response.[/quote]

Mozart's Violin Concerto No. 3 in G major, K. 216 II. Adagio

Arguably the most gifted of all composers. A musicology professor of mine used this as an example of Mozart reaching maturity as a composer. It is indeed beautiful.

[quote author=Wikipedia]
The second movement is also in ABA form, and in the dominant key: D major. The orchestra begins by playing the well known and beautiful main theme, which the violin imitates one octave higher. The winds then play a dance-like motif in A major, which the violin concludes by its own. After a conclusion in A, the violin plays the main theme again, remaining in the same key. When it should have sounded A natural, it sounds A sharp, and the melody switches to B minor, in a fairly tragic passage. It soon modulates back to A major, and to the home key of D major through the main theme. After the cadenza, and in a quite unusual thing for Mozart to do, the violin plays the main theme again , thus concluding the movement in D.[/quote]

Verdi's Storm Scene from "Rigoletto"

One of the great moments in opera. Rigoletto is about a tortured soul among psychopaths who ruin his life. The opera is filled with musical genius.

[quote author=metoperafamily.org]
The jester sends Gilda off to Verona disguised as a boy and pays Sparafucile to murder the Duke. A storm gathers. Gilda returns to overhear Maddalena urge her brother to spare the handsome stranger and kill the hunchback instead. Sparafucile refuses but agrees to kill the next stranger who comes to the inn so that Rigoletto will receive a dead body—even though it is not the one he has paid for. Gilda decides to sacrifice herself for the Duke. She knocks at the door and is stabbed.
 
MC said:
The motor is regarded as one of the centers of consciousness


Is it? Or is it regarded as one of the lower centers that comprise the 'three-brained being' called Man? I don't think the motor center helps to comprise 'consciousness', at least not in the way you seem to be implying - though it can be utilized by consciousness to express and function in this reality. That's not to say that the motor center does not have its own energy - it does, which is why it's a 'center' - but it is a center that serves a very specific purpose in this 3D realm - so perhaps it would be more accurate to say it is utilized to express, instead of it expresses itself? This is just my current understanding, and, of course, I could be mistaken.
 
MC said:
I've been looking at music as the motor center's creative manifestation, not to imply of course, that any center is ever functioning entirely in isolation. There is, however, something about music I would like to consider: it can have sentiment, but often won't; it can be programmatic or not (historically there were times this was frowned upon); it can be a purely aesthetic or mathematical statement; it may include lyrics, and it can make you get up and dance!

The motor is regarded as one of the centers of consciousness, and in music it expresses itself, with the ability, often noted, to speak transcendentally to the soul.

It may be that you’re referring to a very deep layer of the subconscious here (although I might be wrong). I’m just speculating but if the music is creative or 'noble music' it may come from the same realm from which the process of hypothesis formation comes from in mathematics and science. Poincare talks about the ‘subliminal self’ which, I think, might be referring to the subconscious where flashes of insight come through initiating the process of hypothesis formation and possibly truly creative musical compositions might also come from that same realm (just speculating on that though).

Poincare writes:

http://www.fullposter.com/snippets.php?snippet=385
Henri Poincaré
Mathematical Creation

[…] Such are the realities; now for the thoughts they force upon us. The unconscious, or, as we say, the subliminal self plays an important role in mathematical creation; this follows from what we have said. But usually the subliminal self is considered as purely automatic. Now we have seen that mathematical work is not simply mechanical, that it could not be done by a machine, however perfect. It is not merely a question of apply ing rules, of making the most combinations possible according to certain fixed laws. The combinations so obtained would be exceedingly numerous, useless and cumbersome. The true work of the inventor consists in choosing among these combinations so as to eliminate the useless ones or rather to avoid the trouble of making them, and the rules which must guide this choice are extremely fine and delicate. It is almost impossible to state them precisely; they are felt rather than formulated. Under these conditions, how imagine a sieve capable of applying them mechanically?

[…] A first hypothesis now presents itself: the subliminal self is in no way inferior to the conscious self; it is not purely automatic; it is capable of discernment; it has tact, delicacy; it knows how to choose, to divine. What do I say? It knows better how to divine than the conscious self, since it succeeds where that has failed. In a word, is not the subliminal self superior to the conscious self? You recognize the full importance of this question.
 
anart said:
MC said:
The motor is regarded as one of the centers of consciousness


Is it? Or is it regarded as one of the lower centers that comprise the 'three-brained being' called Man? I don't think the motor center helps to comprise 'consciousness', at least not in the way you seem to be implying - though it can be utilized by consciousness to express and function in this reality. That's not to say that the motor center does not have its own energy - it does, which is why it's a 'center' - but it is a center that serves a very specific purpose in this 3D realm - so perhaps it would be more accurate to say it is utilized to express, instead of it expresses itself? This is just my current understanding, and, of course, I could be mistaken.

I am also just speculating, but maybe what he means by the word "center" here is along the lines of the word "interface"? If that is the case then we have the following: "the motor is regarded as one of the [interfaces] of consciousness". So I think that the motor "center/interface" in tandem with the lower emotional "center/interface" can help one to tune to the the "higher emotional center" through music, movements/dance, or both like "spear dancers" of the "past."

There have been times when music has given me the "push" to keep striving on in my "soul questing", especially at times when I am really down. Perhaps this might be an example of the the motor center acting as like an interface for higher consciousness to temporary bleed through to the 'three-brained being' and give it a "push". I don't know for certain however and could be just subjectively making stuff up through my imagination.
 
anart said:
MC said:
The motor is regarded as one of the centers of consciousness


Is it? Or is it regarded as one of the lower centers that comprise the 'three-brained being' called Man? I don't think the motor center helps to comprise 'consciousness', at least not in the way you seem to be implying - though it can be utilized by consciousness to express and function in this reality. That's not to say that the motor center does not have its own energy - it does, which is why it's a 'center' - but it is a center that serves a very specific purpose in this 3D realm - so perhaps it would be more accurate to say it is utilized to express, instead of it expresses itself? This is just my current understanding, and, of course, I could be mistaken.

I feel this is very accurate anart, thanks. My use of the term 'consciouness' came from observing that the centers acquire knowledge, even independently; the concepts of knowledge and consciousness are concomitant.

[quote author=Rain Tree]I am also just speculating, but maybe what he means by the word "center" here is along the lines of the word "interface"? If that is the case then we have the following: "the motor is regarded as one of the [interfaces] of consciousness". So I think that the motor "center/interface" in tandem with the lower emotional "center/interface" can help one to tune to the the "higher emotional center" through music, movements/dance, or both like "spear dancers" of the "past."

There have been times when music has given me the "push" to keep striving on in my "soul questing", especially at times when I am really down. Perhaps this might be an example of the the motor center acting as like an interface for higher consciousness to temporary bleed through to the 'three-brained being' and give it a "push". I don't know for certain however and could be just subjectively making stuff up through my imagination.
[/quote]

I like your application of interface Rain Tree. You know, "making things up through imagination" is, in a sense, what the intellect does when verbalizing insight.

[quote author=kenlee]It may be that you’re referring to a very deep layer of the subconscious here (although I might be wrong). I’m just speculating but if the music is creative or 'noble music' it may come from the same realm from which the process of hypothesis formation comes from in mathematics and science. Poincare talks about the ‘subliminal self’ which, I think, might be referring to the subconscious where flashes of insight come through initiating the process of hypothesis formation and possibly truly creative musical compositions might also come from that same realm (just speculating on that though).[/quote]

Very interesting kenlee, thanks. I wonder if "subconscious" and "subliminal self" are the best terms here. It seems Poincare is pointing to a meta-process of consciousness, while the prefix "sub" connotes either "less" or "under."
 
In all aspects of music, Bach is the giant among giants.

Johann Sebastian Bach Cello Suite No. 1 Prelude

[quote author=Wikipedia]A prelude (Germ. Präludium or Vorspiel; Lat. praeludium; Fr. Prélude; It. Preludio) is a short piece of music, the form of which may vary from piece to piece.[1][2] While, during the Baroque Age, for example, it may have served as an introduction to succeeding movements of a work that were usually longer and more complex, it may also have been a stand alone piece of work during the Romantic Era. It generally features a small number of rhythmic and melodic motifs that recur through the piece. Stylistically, the prelude is improvisatory in nature. The prelude can also refer to an overture, particularly to those seen in an opera or an oratorio.

The prelude can be thought of as a preface. It may stand on its own or introduce another work.

The Six Suites for Unaccompanied Cello by Johann Sebastian Bach are acclaimed as some of the greatest works ever written for solo cello. They were most likely composed during the period 1717–1723, when Bach served as a Kapellmeister in Cöthen.

The suites contain a great variety of technical devices, a wide range of emotionally soothing content, and some of Bach's most compelling voice interactions and conversations. It is their intimacy, however, that has made the suites amongst Bach's most popular works today, resulting in their different recorded interpretations being fiercely defended by their respective advocates.[/quote]

Johann Sebastian Bach Toccata and Fugue in D minor

[quote author=Wikipedia]Toccata (from Italian toccare, "to touch") is a virtuoso piece of music typically for a keyboard or plucked string instrument featuring fast-moving, lightly fingered or otherwise virtuosic passages or sections, with or without imitative or fugal interludes, generally emphasizing the dexterity of the performer's fingers.

Fugue The English term fugue originates in the 16th century and is derived from either the French fugue or Italian fuga, which in turn comes from Latin, also fuga, which is itself related to both fugere (‘to flee’) and fugare, (‘to chase’)

(in music) a type of contrapuntal composition or technique of composition for a fixed number of parts, normally referred to as "voices". . . Since the 17th century, the term fugue has described what is commonly regarded as the most fully developed procedure of imitative counterpoint. A fugue opens with one main theme, the subject, which then sounds successively in each voice in imitation; when each voice has entered, the exposition is complete; this is occasionally followed by a connecting passage, or episode, developed from previously heard material; further "entries" of the subject then are heard in related keys. Episodes (if applicable) and entries are usually alternated until the "final entry" of the subject, by which point the music has returned to the opening key, or tonic, which is often followed by closing material, the coda. In this sense, fugue is a style of composition, rather than fixed structure. Though there are certain established practices, in writing the exposition for example, composers approach the style with varying degrees of freedom and individuality.[/quote]

Johann Sebastian Bach Matthaeus Passion 1st part

[quote author=Wikipedia]The St. Matthew Passion, BWV 244, also known as Matthæus Passion (German: Matthäuspassion), is a musical composition written by Johann Sebastian Bach in 1727 for solo voices, double choir and double orchestra, with libretto by Picander (Christian Friedrich Henrici). It sets chapters 26 and 27 of the Gospel of Matthew to music, with interspersed chorales and arias. It is widely regarded as one of the masterpieces of classical sacred music.[/quote]
 
MC said:
The motor is regarded as one of the centers of consciousness, and in music it expresses itself, with the ability, often noted, to speak transcendentally to the soul.

I think the order of the latter part of the above statement should be reversed. In composers who are sufficiently gifted (or perhaps, attuned) the soul speaks transcendentally to the motor centre.

If the motor centre is left to its own devices it cannot develop, by itself, the ability to ‘speak transcendentally to the soul’, at least that is my current understanding. The motor centre needs to be utilised by the higher consciousness as an instrument, in order for the soul (or higher consciousness) to speak transcendentally to the lower being. Perhaps this is the source of the nobility you mention.

Considering Mozart and Beethoven, I have often thought that Mozart’s music comes from ‘above’, while Beethoven’s music is about the struggle to rise above the lower.
 
mada85 said:
Considering Mozart and Beethoven, I have often thought that Mozart’s music comes from ‘above’, while Beethoven’s music is about the struggle to rise above the lower.

Maybe you meant this already in your post...but I remember reading that Beethoven really had to struggle in finding those melodic themes of his, while Mozart just kind of drew them out from his head in an instant. I agree with you that this can be heard also in their musical styles. Mozart is brilliant with that "beginners luck" where everything fits, while Beethoven does The Work and finally, after reworking the theme exhaustively, finds closure.

I've always thought that the work of a composer is probably some sort of channeling...
 
mada85 said:
I have often thought that Mozart’s music comes from ‘above’

Aragorn said:
I've always thought that the work of a composer is probably some sort of channeling...

I've been told by a music teacher that she noticed that little children were strangely responsive to Mozart's music, as if there were something in his compositions they understand instinctively. Her explanation was that as he started to compose very young, he possibly maintained a sort of connection with his inner child as he grew up?
 
Here's what the P's had to say:

Bringers of the Dawn said:
Sound carries a certain frequency, and the body recognizes the
frequency. The body is keyed to respond to the acceptability of the
frequency.

The great master musicians such as Beethoven and Mozart were
coded to bring in information of a stable nature, for they received the
harmonics of sound at the time when there was great darkness over the
planet.

In order to keep a certain remembrance open in the minds of the
human race, lower vibratory rates of sound were translated into the
minds of these masters.
 
Aragorn said:
mada85 said:
Considering Mozart and Beethoven, I have often thought that Mozart’s music comes from ‘above’, while Beethoven’s music is about the struggle to rise above the lower.

Maybe you meant this already in your post...but I remember reading that Beethoven really had to struggle in finding those melodic themes of his, while Mozart just kind of drew them out from his head in an instant. I agree with you that this can be heard also in their musical styles. Mozart is brilliant with that "beginners luck" where everything fits, while Beethoven does The Work and finally, after reworking the theme exhaustively, finds closure.

I've always thought that the work of a composer is probably some sort of channeling...

It's a mistake to hold that Mozart didn't have to work very much when composing. The main difference is he did it all in his head before writing it down. This is not meant to diminish his talent for ease in generating musical ideas which has been used in contrast to Beethoven's brilliant devlopment sections of fewer motifs.

[quote author=mada85]Considering Mozart and Beethoven, I have often thought that Mozart’s music comes from ‘above’, while Beethoven’s music is about the struggle to rise above the lower.[/quote]

Considering how prolific each composer was, this seems too general of an idea - however nice it sounds.
 
As a slight diversion from the main thrust of this topic, and as a committed rocker of the late 50's and early 60's, I'm seeking advice.

I'm currently working on overcoming Adrenal Fatigue, and specifically looking for help in getting a good night's sleep, deep and restorative.

On top of the supplements that I'm taking, it is recommended that the last half an hour or more of the evening is spent relaxing, listening to 'soothing music'. For a 'rocker', this is a little outside of my repertoire. I am open to recommendations of what to listen to, and, if it includes beneficial 'coded information' that would be a bonus. Thanks.
 
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