Please ask Cs the question of the century: Does Hard Work beat Talent?

No need to ask the C's. I think it's pretty evident. Nobody comes to Earth with their lessons complete, therefore hard work is a must. Otherwise if we had 100% talent, there would be no learning and it would be too easy. Talent counts for something, and may come from past life experience, but for the most part we start from scratch with a lesson profile each life. The saying, "10% inspiration, 90% perspiration." seems to be related to this as well.
 
To add on to what 3DStudent said, a talent was originally a unit of weight, before it became what it means today - a measure of someone's ability to provide value to an organization, endeavor, himself, and so on. I have been looking into the idea of "Talent Management" for my company, as part of a "task force" they have set up to look into "future work culture". This was started as a way to keep active in contributions to the company. It was initiated in view of the Coronavirus scare campaign that had created this economic "slump" with an uncertain trajectory.

I suppose it would be worthwhile to just think about what one's own innate talents are. I would like to recall a post from Ollie in the new Romance reading thread where he described how the characters innate or true strengths were brought up after getting into relationships with their counterparts. Perhaps the reading could help us also understand at a deeper level who we are as people, based on living out the loving/scary/absurd/humorous/etc. romantic relationships being displayed in these novels?

Just finished reading Anne Gracie's Marriage of Convenience series of four books.

The formula seems to be the same for each. The surface, or world face, portrayed values, are underpinned by other, more hidden, natural strengths (that are unknown) by both partners. As time progresses in the relationship, often after a rocky start, each partner brings out the hidden strenghts in the other. The surface values are subsumed by each. By the time of the last chapter or so, tears are brought to my eyes (in each of the four books) with reading how the two partners have blossomed together with the once hidden, new, strengths fully to the fore and the bond between the two partners deepened and strengthened.

So maybe it would be wise to try out the above reading exercise, keeping in mind your question about talent and natural strengths. It would be great to be able to know who we are on a deep level so that we are able to make better choices based on that self-knowledge. Perhaps that would also answer your question about where hard work would be required, and where you can rely on your own abilities more readily, i.e. knowing your strengths and weaknesses. I'm not sure if you've read Parable of Talents but that could also be instructive in terms of understanding how to use our talents wisely.

Parable of the Talents – Matthew 25:14-30
"Again, it will be like a man going on a journey, who called his servants and entrusted his property to them. To one he gave five talents of money, to another two talents, and to another one talent, each according to his ability. Then he went on his journey. The man who had received the five talents went at once and put his money to work and gained five more. So also, the one with the two talents gained two more. But the man who had received the one talent went off, dug a hole in the ground and hid his master's money.

"After a long time the master of those servants returned and settled accounts with them. The man who had received the five talents brought the other five. 'Master,' he said, 'you entrusted me with five talents. See, I have gained five more.'

"His master replied, 'Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master's happiness!'

"The man with the two talents also came. 'Master,' he said, 'you entrusted me with two talents; see, I have gained two more.'

"His master replied, 'Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master's happiness!'

"Then the man who had received the one talent came. 'Master,' he said, 'I knew that you are a hard man, harvesting where you have not sown and gathering where you have not scattered seed. So I was afraid and went out and hid your talent in the ground. See, here is what belongs to you.'

"His master replied, 'You wicked, lazy servant! So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed? Well then, you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest.

"'Take the talent from him and give it to the one who has the ten talents. For everyone who has will be given more, and he will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him. And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'”

Jesus gave each of his servants a set number of talents, two of them produced more and were commended for it while the last one had not and in fact, had buried it in the ground. It reminds me of being able to utilize knowledge to the best of our abilities to help others, because as we help others, we also help ourselves, multiplying our "talents". If you check the link above, there is a more detailed interpretation of the parable which might be useful to read as well.

Additionally, if you read the sessions regarding "gravity collection and gravity dispersal" you may be able to get additional clues on how this process of multiplying talents could work on a deeper level:

Session 14 July 1996

[...]

Q: (L) One thing, previously when we were talking about unstable gravity waves, and I asked what caused them to become unstable, you said 'utilization,' and that STO was dispersion, and STS was 'collection' of gravity. I have made a few conjectures about this and would like to ask, does this mean that in giving to others, even if what you are giving is a withholding of assistance because you know that assistance would only prolong the lesson, is dispersing gravity, and exerting mental or other control over others, even if one is unaware that they are attaching energy drains to another, is collecting gravity?

A: Close.

Q: (L) So, when you collect gravity, you become like a black hole, you cave in on yourself?

A: Ultimately.

Q: (L) And it seems to me that one of the objects of what we are doing is releasing the gravity collected in ourselves?

A: If that is your choice, or if that is your path.

Q: (L) Is choice as intimately connected with the path as I am understanding it? Is it just simply part of how you are configured in your soul essence?

A: Close.

Q: (L) And there are people for whom STS is simply their choice. It is their path.

[...]


I hope this is helpful input for you, Ancient of Lore!
 
Does hardwork really beat talent?

Surely you can see the answer for this one, yes?

Let's look at a famous example that some might be familiar with. Ronaldiho and Messi, both incredibly talented players. Both probably born with this talent. One of them continues at peak performance and the other one was just released from jail.

The difference? one of them works hard everyday, while the other one relied simply on his immense talent. Sure there's an age difference but it was the lack of discipline and hardworking that decided how their lives went. Another good example is language, I know non native language speakers who speak better than some native speakers, the difference is one of them needed to put in the work to learn it and the other one simply grew up with it.

The other one is the famous story about the race between the rabbit and the turtle, talent vs. hardwork and discipline.

I'd say natural talent gives you an amazing launching platform, but you have to launch otherwise your talent will be spent fruitlessly.
 
Does hardwork really beat talent?
In my opinion, there is nothing really like "talent". "Talent" is just slight misconception, that covers certain things.

As I see it, that is really in "game" are:
1) Soul/Consciousness - from this comes first insights about what people think they should do in life, the "chemistry", the subconscious will to learn this or that; we can see that people just choose one or another thing in their several or several dozen years of life;
2) Genetical predisposition - all the inborn capabilities (the "tools" - for instance, that tool can be intellectual center that possessed particular features) that are in the specific individual, that allow for the development of certain skills and that they can be "settle" in their being and, of course, use of that "tools" mentioned by me;
3) Work - gaining knowledge, achieving experience, making conclusions, practicing, improvement - all the struggle that make things real;

So what I want to show you is that, that even in the very beginning, what is important is work. In my understanding, it is always about the work. Difference between talent and work does not exist, this is always working at any given stage. HOWEVER, the talent, if we stretch things a bit, we can say that "talent" is something that is point 1 and 2 in my writing. But this is not what directly has a postponement for results. These are just fundaments, and nothing come from it, without the work.

However, it doesn't mean that the work is super important and everything is around it. No, without 1) and 2) - without this foundation, work will only give results at the low, basic level, never make a champion of somebody. So, what is needed is 1), 2), 3), all these things should work and should be balanced.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
No need to ask the C's. I think it's pretty evident. Nobody comes to Earth with their lessons complete, therefore hard work is a must. Otherwise if we had 100% talent, there would be no learning and it would be too easy. Talent counts for something, and may come from past life experience, but for the most part we start from scratch with a lesson profile each life. The saying, "10% inspiration, 90% perspiration." seems to be related to this as well.
To add to that - if talent comes from past life experience, that means you had to work in a past life to develop that skill without preexisting talent for it to then become a talent later in a future life. All your talents are a result of years of hard work. So I'd say use your talents and develop them if they're beneficial for what you're doing in this life, but always strive to develop your weak points so you can be more well-rounded in your development, and also because those are the things where your lessons tend to be for this life. "Do what it does not like" is a good rule of thumb. If you're avoiding it because it's difficult and/or uncomfortable, but otherwise important - well, that's probably what you came here to work on. Use your talents to be more useful to yourself and others, but keep in mind that those are the things you've already mastered before, and cannot replace the need to develop/master other vital things.
 
I'm going over some 'Truth Perspective' episodes on Ponerology for an upcoming meetup. So this one episode, Harrison is discussing upward and downward adjustment that tends to occur when these pathological types start rising to the top and assigning people to positions they aren't really qualified for. Harrison was giving an example of an orchestra where because of this influence you end up with too many sub par musicians and the orchestra is not what it could be or even bad. To where as normally, the more talented players would find themselves in the orchestra and in lead positions. Harrison made the point that some people without talent can work really hard at learning their instrument and really want to be a great musician, but they're just not that good no matter how hard they try. And I've certainly seen the truth of that myself being a musician. So once again, things are not so cut and dry. But yes, it could very well be that those with natural talent have worked hard at developing that talent in previous incarnations.
 
In my perspective, talent has heart in it. Someone might have a talent in preparing food, drawing, singing, interracting with animals, arranging plant life in a garden and working with the plants, or simply in organizing surroundings. For me talent is a subconscious awareness combined with love. I believe everyone has at least one or even more than one talent. Aquiring the skill for perfecting the talent is like walking a narrow and path of discovering and understanding the source of the talent. The more skilled and proficient the closer to the source of the talent.
 
Hardwork is to eat the same food everyday, talent is to eat different one each day.
One thing sure the hardwork full you, and you can rely on it to keep on going. It's even satisfactory as you see progressing.
I said this because i 'm just digesting my diner in reading this thread.

Talent is a gift, not giving only to yourself but to share with the others.
Hardwork is a talent that you have to train.
Talent have an easywork, doesn't need to train, but to cultivate it, that's a hardwork!

Ancient of Lore are you more hardworking or gifted with talent?
 
Hardwork is to eat the same food everyday, talent is to eat different one each day.
One thing sure the hardwork full you, and you can rely on it to keep on going. It's even satisfactory as you see progressing.
I said this because i 'm just digesting my diner in reading this thread.

Talent is a gift, not giving only to yourself but to share with the others.
Hardwork is a talent that you have to train.
Talent have an easywork, doesn't need to train, but to cultivate it, that's a hardwork!

Ancient of Lore are you more hardworking or gifted with talent?
Gifted with talent (I think). For example back in school and right now in uni. The things people spend weeks to learn, I learn in a few days so I just laze around, daydreaming, playing games and doing nothing. But now since I joined this "Cassiopaean Experiment" I'm planning to start learning stuff from here.

Honestly, I don't remember the last time I was HARDWORKING if I ever was because things just naturally come to me. Even if sometimes the things don't go so easily as they usually are I just apply A BIT OF EFFORT then things go well as usual.
 
Hard work is a sign of talent. Talent is a sign of hard work. The two are inseparable. A study of genius showed that for example a unique band like The Beatles rehearsed longer, learned more songs than any of their rivals, played longer live gigs and individually committed huge amounts of time to personally work on their personal skills that contributed to the whole. The product of this hard work was their talent and their talent grew in line with their hard work. Having worked in the so called creative industries all my life I can say that without exception the most gifted people I have had the pleasure to work with were also those who gave, risked and demanded the most from their process and their time and were never satisfied to rest when others were crying out for a tea break.

What I don't understand, however, is why this simple question warrants its own thread let alone lay claim to being worthy of being the question of the century, especially for the C's. Do you care to elucidate on your thinking on this one Ancient of Lore?
 
Hard work is a sign of talent. Talent is a sign of hard work. The two are inseparable. A study of genius showed that for example a unique band like The Beatles rehearsed longer, learned more songs than any of their rivals, played longer live gigs and individually committed huge amounts of time to personally work on their personal skills that contributed to the whole. The product of this hard work was their talent and their talent grew in line with their hard work. Having worked in the so called creative industries all my life I can say that without exception the most gifted people I have had the pleasure to work with were also those who gave, risked and demanded the most from their process and their time and were never satisfied to rest when others were crying out for a tea break.

What I don't understand, however, is why this simple question warrants its own thread let alone lay claim to being worthy of being the question of the century, especially for the C's. Do you care to elucidate on your thinking on this one Ancient of Lore?
Well I was imagining for example what if two identical brothers were born with the identical sets of genes who were both always living together, lived in perfectly controlled environment therefore all their lifes doing the exact same thing. Nothing different. However, once they were both introduced to football (or chess/art/whatever), it was obvious one had a talent in it and the other one did not. From this point, they will both have the exact same number of training sessions, diet, sleeping schedules, etc. Both will continue to do exactly identical activities. So my quesion at the end who will be better? Will talent prevail or hardwork?
 
Or another quick example. One athlete was born with good physique (long lengs, big lungs, fast reflexes, etc) in other words talent, while another athlete was born average. Will average's hard work prevail doing twice or thrice the amount of exercises compared to talented one who only does the stardard sets of exercises? Or if they put equal amount of effort? Won't the natural talent win?
 
Back
Top Bottom