"presence" & terror

monkee

Jedi
I've had some unusual experiences during my sleep. It happens occasionally but it is disturbing.

Sometime when I was sleeping I suddenly felt a presence accompanied by sheer terror. My body is sleeping and I couldn't hardly move my eyelids. This terror grows stronger but it differs than panic attack. And then I just try to wake myself up by starting to move my eyelids first and then slowly waking up. I always succeed in my attempt to wake up. But this is definitly disturbing.

My question is: Has any of you ever experience similar stuff?
 

Craig

Jedi Master
Hi Monkee - there is something called "sleep paralysis" which sounds exactly like what you are describing. From Wikipedia:

Sleep paralysis is a condition characterized by paralysis of the body shortly after waking up (known as hypnopompic paralysis) or, less often, shortly before falling asleep (known as hypnagogic paralysis). Physiologically, it is closely related to the normal paralysis that occurs during REM sleep, also known as REM atonia.

Sleep paralysis occurs when the brain is awakened from an REM state into essentially a normal fully awake state, but the bodily paralysis is still occurring. This causes the person to be fully aware, but unable to move. In addition, this state is usually accompanied by certain specific kinds of hallucinations. This state usually lasts no more than two minutes before a person is able to either return to full REM sleep or to become fully awake, though the sense of how much time has gone by is often distorted during sleep paralysis. People who are fortunate enough to be facing a clock while having an episode may often be surprised to see how little time has gone by during an episode that seems to last a very long time.

More often than not, sleep paralysis is believed by the person affected by it to be no more than a dream. This is the reason why there are many dream recountings which describe the person being lying frozen and unable to move. The hallucinatory element to sleep paralysis makes it even more likely that someone will interpret the experience as simply a dream, as one might see completely fanciful objects in a room alongside the normal vision one can see.

Many report hallucinations during episodes of sleep paralysis. The features of these hallucinations generally vary by individual, but some are more common to the experience than others:

Most common

* Vividness
* Fear

Common

* Sensing a "presence" (often malevolent)
* Pressure/weight on body (especially the chest). See for example the painting in the beginning of this article.
* A sensation of not being able to breathe
* Impending sense of doom/death


Fairly common

* Auditory hallucinations (often footsteps or indistinct voices, or pulsing noises). Auditory hallucinations which are described as noise instead of hallucinations of legible sounds, are often described to be similar to auditory hallucinations caused by Nitrous Oxide by persons who have experienced both.
* Visual hallucinations such as lights, people or shadows walking around the room

Less common

* Floating sensation (sometimes associated with out-of-body experiences)
* Seemingly seamless transition into full hallucinations or dreaming, also associated with out-of-body experiences
* Tactile hallucinations (such as a hand touching or grabbing)

Rare

* Falling sensation
* Vibration
* Involuntary movements (sometimes the feeling of sliding off of the bed or even up walls).
 

Approaching Infinity

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
[Craig beat me to it!] I have some friends that have experienced milder versions of sleep paralysis. The standard explanation is that your body is still asleep and thus paralysed, while your conscious mind is awake (and you can control your eyes because they are not paralysed during sleep). The terror is supposedly a result of the hypnopompic carry-overs into waking consciousness. Perhaps that's the whole explanation, perhaps not...
 

joeshmoe

The Force is Strong With This One
As a child, I had this as well. I always had this at the end of a nightmare.
Pressure/weight on body (especially the chest). See for example the painting in the beginning of this article.
I had this every time. I cannot think of any conventional explaination for this pressure sensation. I find it intersting later on wikipedia:
Cultural references

* In India, there are two thoughts about sleep paralysis. One of the signs of approaching enlightenment is "witnessing sleep," that is to say, being seemingly lucid in sleep — such as with sleep paralysis. It was also believed within the movement that rakshasas (Hindu demons) may assail those making strides towards their own enlightenment and the good of all mankind. The other thought is a female entity, called Mohini (a demoness from the underworld), comes into the night-time world by means of ascending through a deep well. She is enchantingly beautiful, yet simultaneously horrific, unearthly, and deadly. Like her British Isles counterparts, she also seeks a male lover and human genetic material, presumably for the purpose of bearing a hybrid demon/human child.
* In Japan, sleep paralysis is referred to as kanashibari (金縛り, literally: "bound or fastened in metal": kana: metal, shibaru: to bind, tie, fasten")
* In Newfoundland, as a visit from the "old hag" (Ag Rog)
* In Mexico, as subida del muerto (the dead getting on top)
* In Turkish, as karabasan (black buster) and in Hazaragi, as Syahi Zer Kado (pressing ink)
* In the Southern United States, people have described it as "The witch riding your back"
* In Korea, it is reffered as Gawinullim, literally in english: "To be pressed by Gawi." The meaning of Gawi is unclear but generally known to mean "spirits" or "demons." The word "Gawi" in Korean is a homonym which also means "scissors," which creates confusion for the accurate meaning of the word.
* In Indonesia, Javanese peoples called it "nindih" (To be seated upon)
* In Philippines, Sleep paralysis is often associated with Bangungot.
* In Vietnam, sleep paralysis is known as "ma đè", meaning a ghost or spirit laying on top of or pressing down on the person.
* The common belief in China is that a spirit or ghost is sitting or lying on top of the individual while they were sleeping, causing the sleep paralysis. This is thought to be a minor body possession by the forces from the dead, and usually doesn't cause any harm to the victim.
* In medieval times of Europe, attacks of sufferers of sleep paralysis may have given rise to the belief in mara, incubi, succubi, other demons and witchcraft.
* In traditional Russian belief symptoms reminiscent of sleep paralysis were attributed to the anger of domovoi, the home spirit, punishing people for bad husbandship or betrayal.
* Some scientists believe that many supposed occurrences of alien abduction, out-of-body travel, and other seemingly paranormal events may actually be due to misinterpreting the sensory effects of sleep paralysis.
* Others have argued that sleep paralysis might be the point of separation of the "dream body" from the physical body and out-of-body travel then begins.
Could there be more to this than a physical interpretation. Above, I see both spiritual progression and interference by malevolent beings, such as demons and alien abductions. :/
 

monkee

Jedi
joeshmoe said:
As a child, I had this as well. I always had this at the end of a nightmare.
Do you still experience this? Basically I am able to wake myself up very quick. So I've never experienced pressure sensation.

Could there be more to this than a physical interpretation. Above, I see both spiritual progression and interference by malevolent beings, such as demons and alien abductions. :/
Very interesting indeed. Makes me wonder too.
 

Ben

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
"Could there be more to this than a physical interpretation. Above, I see both spiritual progression and interference by malevolent beings, such as demons and alien abductions."

Sleep paralysis may be what is occurring, but it may not be the whole story. I've had many experiences recently with malevolent, albeit relatively weak, entities. They can manipulate physiology and psychology to a great extent, ranging from subtle sensations and urges to full blown possession.

You say you felt a presence and feelings of terror. Now, you can't be certain, but the body is very good at detecting negative entities in its vicinity. I usually wake up from nightmares or 'half awake states in which I am attacked' with an unmistakable feeling all over my body which tells me something is amiss. Negative emotions, stimulated in a variety of ways, are one technique these entities use to penetrate our psychic defences and achieve their aims.

I strongly suggest (and this probably goes for anybody who is starting to wake up and attract attention) that you read Robert Bruce's book "Practical Psychic Self Defence". It may be the most comprehensive study available of negative entities, or 'negs', and how to counteract them. It is based on the work of a man who may understand the workings of these beings more than anyone on Earth, and his experiences with them and proficiency at dealing with them certainly reflect this. If anything, it is extremely interesting (particularly his accounts of self-exorcism). Some of it is disturbing, but as we all know:

Knowledge Protects

and

Always expect attack. Know modes of same. Learn how to counteract same.

Then you need never fear these things, I actually find their efforts really interesting, even entertaining. Obviously I'm not talking about the true nasties involved in things like possession, here....
 

Ben

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
"I do wonder why the majority of sleep paralysis associated hallucinations are terrifying, such as the “Hag phenomenon”, rather than pleasant or neutral. None of the sites I visited elaborated at all upon this question."

I'm not sure that those who propose this an explanation for all 'anomalous' events such as abductions and attacks are particularly interested in finding a real explanation. Rather they seek to preserve the status quo, like so many in 'material science', by providing speculation which serves as a 'expert explanation' for those who are curious that there may be something more.
 

Green_Manalishi

Jedi Master
All i can add here is my personal experience. I had some, let’s say, “minor” sleeping paralysis a few times during the day (sometimes a quick nap after lunch feels good :), and i found that it helps to sleep a bit before studying hard when I’m on an exams season), but never felt nothing bad, or “attacking” me, just the terror of not being able to move in the first few times.
During night time I only experienced one, it lasted more than the ones during day time, and again during it I never felt a weight on top of my chest, didn’t see nothing, didn’t feel nothing bad. It was only after I regained control of my body and realize what had happened (I don’t recall, it was some time ago, I believe I even went to the bathroom) that I started feeling something was in the farthest corner of the room, it was like my mind kept saying, “there’s something there, and it isn’t pretty” over and over again.
From my experience I believe the ones during day time could be explained by the “physical interpretation”, because one is more bond to wake up during day time than night time (more noise, more light, your body isn’t accustomed to sleep in that hour), so there’s more chance of waking up in the middle of REM sleep, and thus suffering from sleep paralysis. About the one in the night time I believe it can be explained by the same reason, the thing is, the “after match” was different from the one in day time.
I remember being more afraid during the actual paralysis in the night time just because it was night and it was dark, because I just couldn’t perceive more accurately (than in day time) what was, or could be, around me. So maybe the presence I felt was just my mind playing tricks on me in consequence of being night and dark. And then again, like Ben said, that might not be the whole story.
 

Ben

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
Well I have experienced sleep paralysis before and it was completely mundane, I didn't see anything or feel anything other than "I have sleep paralysis". Maybe fear of it through lack of understanding triggers negative experiences, maybe not. There may be many things happening here which are interconnected. Of course the body becomes paralysed during sleep, but it seems that this also happens during abductions and attacks. I think many things need to considered - weight on the chest and grabbing hands, for example, are common 'hallucinations' and are also frequently associated with certain entities through historical and cultural anecdotes and also the work of people like Robert Bruce who have much experience observing these things.

In this, as in so many things, all is probably not black and white.
 
K

Kev-o

Guest
I have had many nights where i have experienced sleep paralysis (or i think from what i read above). I have had them for as long as i can remember. but I'm sure i might just be confusing some with ordinary nightmares. None the less i have had about 25 to 30 that i can remember.

When i was real young i had a recurring one where i had the sensation of falling or i was falling down stairs ( not tumbling but more like taking a huge jump to the bottom of the stair case. ). But now its mostly the same.

I feel allot of pressure and vertigo. It feels like I'm caught in a hydraulic of a rapid, or like being caught up in on ocean wave. Its sounds like it too. A huge surging ( best i can describe it in one word ) with no seance of direction. these sensations are accompanied by a deep fear.

Once i slip into this state it takes me a while to remember that it is not real. Once i get this thought then i lock my eyes on something i know is real like my TV or window ( I'm totally screwed when I'm facing the wall ). then from there i can usually force myself to fully wake up. but if i don't actually get out of bed or move around then i will usually fall back into the same state and forgot that it just happened tell i lock my eyes on something again and get my self awake.

One of the worst instances of this was during the summer after my first year at college. I was home for the summer. One night I had a nightmare and when I woke I slipped in and out of the paralysis 3 times, each time was accompanied by different hallucinations.

So am I going crazy ore something? Does this happen to other people as much as me?
 

monkee

Jedi
Kev-o said:
One of the worst instances of this was during the summer after my first year at college. I was home for the summer. One night I had a nightmare and when I woke I slipped in and out of the paralysis 3 times, each time was accompanied by different hallucinations.

So am I going crazy ore something? Does this happen to other people as much as me?
It does happen to me that I experience 2-3 sleep paralysis in a row. And I always manage to force my self to wake up. But I only remember 1-2 cases where I saw visual halucinations. But I wasn't paralysed back then. The odd thing is that a few years ago even the most potent psychedelic drugs (LSA, Slavia Divinorum, various type of mushrooms) couldn't produce visual halucinations. Just mind trips whenever I close my eyes.
 

Redrock12

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I've experienced sleep paralysis probably 6 times in my life. The last one occurred about 5 years ago. On every occasion I wake up and find I can't move for a significant period of time. or so it seems. I live by myself so I have no way of confirming whether it's 15 minutes or 15 seconds.
In any case, the night following the last incident I was listening to Art Bell and the guest host ironically was talking about sleep paralysis. She said that it happens after you have an out of body experience and you are in the process of entering your 3D body.
 

Craig

Jedi Master
Found these two strange stories of the "hag experience" while researching an author, Tom Slemen. I have a small book (part of a series) of his called Haunted Liverpool and some of the stories and old Forteana in there are fascinating, or should I say entertaining. I'll post some excerpts tomorrow. Here is something from the website:

In March 2003 I investigated four sinister cases of 'Old Hag Syndrome' across Liverpool. The syndrome has been recognised by psychologists for many years, but no one is sure whether the cause is supernatural or simply the product of a half-awake mind. Victims wake up in bed to find that they cannot move, even though they can see, hear, feel and smell. They often experience the feeling of a great weight on their chest and sense that there is a sinister or evil presence in the room. This presence sometimes manifests itself as an old hag with evil-looking eyes, hence the name of this syndrome. A fortnight ago, a 27-year-old man named Tony woke at his home in Kensington at three in the morning and found himself unable to move a muscle. He panicked, as he struggled to breathe, then he opened his eyes - and saw an old woman with a black shawl leaning over him. She started to cackle, and she started to stroke Tony's face with what felt like bony fingers. The face of the night visitor looked very sinister, and the woman muttered something unintelligible. She leaned forward and began to kiss Tony, and a terrible stench filled his nostrils. He tried desperately to regain the power of movement, and he suddenly screamed out and pushed away the eerie figure. The old hag was nowhere to be seen.

Six days after that report, in the leafy neighbourhood of Calderstones, a 45-year-old man living on Booker Avenue named George retired to his bedroom at 10 pm. His wife remained downstairs ironing clothes. She said she'd be coming up to bed in about an hour. However, at around 11 o'clock that night, George was awakened by someone climbing into the bed. He turned to cuddle his wife and found no one there. George thought perhaps he'd been dreaming, and he laid back to relax. As he was about to drop off asleep, George felt something heavy pushing down on his chest. He opened his eyes - and found himself paralysed from head to toe. A dark shape was on top of him. George felt as if the presence was stealing the life out of him, and that if he didn't fight it he'd die. An unsightly face leaned over his face. It was the face of a very old woman with evil staring eyes. George could see a flickering golden light in those eyes. The woman put her mouth to George's mouth and her breath smelt rancid. The putrid breath seemed to fill his head. George had classed himself as an atheist, but that night he called upon God to save him from the evil hag. The wrinkled face grimaced as if in great pain, and then the eyes turned completely white.

The weight was lifted from George, and the hag had vanished into thin air. George felt movement return to his big toe, then the whole of his leg and the rest of his body in turn. He raised himself up and leaned against the bed's headboard, gasping for breath. His heart pounded. He looked about, and saw the room was empty. George then ran down the stairs to tell his wife about the ghastly experience. She immediately noticed a strong putrescent odour, and sniffed his mouth. George then realised the hag had been no dream. He gargled with a mouthwash and brushed his teeth repeatedly until the horrid vestiges of the hag's kiss had gone.

These are just two of the four cases that have been reported to me. The other two incidents occurred in Aintree and Garston, and both victims gave a carbon copy description of the old hag who terrorised the men in the aforementioned cases. They also mentioned smelling an unpleasant odour during the 'assaults'. Until I know more about the old hag phenomenon I will be unable to offer a theory. In the meantime, sleep well, and don't have nightmares.
Well obviously, an exact same description given in two separate cases is somewhat unusual. Here is what the C's had to say in reference to this phenomena (the "hag experience" more specifically that is):

19th November 1994

Q: (L) Who abducted Betty Andreasson.
A: Grays.
Q: (L) Was the information that Betty Andreasson was given
by these beings who abducted her, screen information or false
information of information for disinformation?
A: All of the above and some factual.
Q: (L) In the Ann Haywood case which is supposed to be a
case of demonic possession or obsession, who or what are
the beings that are afflicting this woman and her family?
A: 3rd density section "B" energy anomalies same as
"poltergeist."
Q: (L) The case that is described in the book The Haunted,
about the Smurl family, with quite a bit of phenomena
occurring in their house including the sighting of a big- foot
type. Creature, what is the source of the phenomena in that
case?
A: Same.
Q: (L) So, neither of those cases are "alien" related?
A: Correct.
Q: (L) Why are there such marked similarities between those
two cases and the case described by Karla Turner and other
alien abductions?
A: Similarities are open to interpretation. Turner household
was opened to multiple types of phenomena due to interaction
with Grays and others.
Q: (L) Does that occur frequently in interactions with Grays?
A: When there is excessive activity of this sort it leaves open
channels or "windows" which allows all sorts of things to
come through.
Q: (L) Well, who are these old hags who have sex with
people...?
A: Poltergeistal entities.

Q: (L) What is a poltergeist entity?
A: Self explanatory.
Q: (L) Is the poltergeist entity generated by the subconscious
energy of the individual to which the poltergeist effect occurs
or takes place?
A: Interaction just like everything else between perceived and
perceiver.
Q: (L) And what is, in this case, being perceived? Is it an
energy construct or is it an actual being?
A: Both. Remember, Laura, you too are an energy construct.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Craig said:
In March 2003 I investigated four sinister cases of 'Old Hag Syndrome' across Liverpool. The syndrome has been recognised by psychologists for many years, but no one is sure whether the cause is supernatural or simply the product of a half-awake mind. Victims wake up in bed to find that they cannot move, even though they can see, hear, feel and smell. They often experience the feeling of a great weight on their chest and sense that there is a sinister or evil presence in the room.
I had many Hag experiences when I was little and even after puberty. There was one situation when was 19. College was out for the summer and I went with a friend to an old house in Johnstown PA. This house was a ruin since the flood, so sleeping in it was a lot like camping out.

I was wrapped in my sleeping bag when I woke up at the sound of a loud cackling disctintly like an old woman's. I was sleeping face-down with me head turned to the right and on the right side of my body as the cackling was going on I felt a painful series of stabs in my ribs timed with the cackling as if a boney finger was prodding me. It hurt.

I was paralyzed, but after what seemed like an eternity (but probably lasted only a minute or two) I was able to move. I was already awake and with that poking there was no way I would be asleep. My ribs still hurt where the "finger" poked, and I got up looking for loose springs in the bed or any object that may have been poking me. There was none. I asked my friend if any old women had died there, and he said there were many deaths but all had been babies that died at birth.

A few years ago I learned about the sorceress tradition in my grandmother's village. Last year the last of the line died. This woman would take advantage of the custom of kissing on the cheek when greeting friends and relatives and try to stick some tongue in it when men were involved.

At one point I learned that one of the "secrets" of the magic these elderly women practiced was to visit men in their dreams and molest them. Sometimes the innocent grandmother down the street may not be so innocent indeed.:/
 
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