Question about Beliefs

[know_yourself_1234]

Dear all,

I just wanted to manifest my joy to be still 'there' :)

Actually, I am currently reading the Wave in a 'more implicated' way, and I wanted to thank all the persons responsible for the achievement of such a task.

It is hard for me to find the words...

All the text I have been through the first time is now seen and understood differently, more deeply, and I am clearly looking forward on to reading the whole texts a third time

I wish to express how deeply and 'positively' these readings affect me.

I have been suffering from a double scoliosis for now more than 10 years, and last summer was the highest 'distortion' patterns I had ever met. I have been experiencing all kinds of blocks in all kind of 'places' due to the scoliosis, and the spine distortion affects the whole being until the toes. That is why I cannot just consider it just as a 'double-scoliosis'.

I found out that the core of the pain was related to the misuse / manipulation / no use / depossession of my FREE WILL - and that all kind of past events, traumas, patterns, etc... have been 'stored' inside /around (?).

But in order to 'reach' and 'integrate' this understanding - for becoming able to apply it in daily life - I have to integrate other key concepts..

But... This 'key concept integration', in the first place, has more to deal with 'disintegration of beliefs'?

Are there any belief to 'keep'?

If I understand the beliefs as 'stored' in the left brain, and the 'correct' use of the left brain as 'working in harmony with the right brain' for calculation, strategic means, but providing 'IN THE MOMENT' help, it seems that there are no reason for 'beliefs to be stored'.

If I carry on further, the belief is somehow related to a 'proof' for justifying it. So there is no free will in this play - we might use it for observing the manifestation of something we would apply a belief to, and think that 'this is so now, but it can be different', so there is no need to apply a belief.

Do beliefs relate directly to the control system? Are beliefs something 'natural for 3D' as 'STS is the functionning 3D existence on earth' ?

In which way should I apprehend my daily life, regarding to beliefs? Should I try to be as free of them as I can?

But the fact that I need to self-recall 'free will now' helps me a lot to shift attention and be more present.. So there is a place where the message 'do not forget to center yourself and use your free will to be experience fully' is stored, like a buffer or a temporary place, remaining there until integrated.

May I ask how does this relate to beliefs, I mean regarding their legitimity?

 

[Cosmos]

try to hold your believes as low as you can.(It's almost impossible not to believe, but it is possible to tune it down )
put the "I want to know" part of you as high as you can.

something that might help you:

"don't" believe ----> open mind ---->want to know ---->networking---->see the reality as what it is ("truth")---->
use the knowledge(in order to have true knowledge)----->spiritual growth
(it's just a rough description, many possible steps between)

 

[Palinurus]

Hi know_yourself_1234,

Quite some questions did you pose. I won't pretend to know much about this, but I'll give it my best shot. Hope this helps a bit.

Very little can be said about beliefs in general terms. A belief consists of a system of assumptions condensed into a doctrine about some topic. It's a form of surrogate knowledge for lack of better understanding, mostly based on hearsay and on conventions or truisms. It takes the place of real knowledge in order to cope with unbearable uncertainties. Beliefs can be prejudicial as well.

Since hindsight can sometimes be very helpfull I would suggest you try to follow the track back all the way to the origins of your specific beliefs. Who told you so, why did you accept their take on things, when did you start to doubt anything you believed before and why, what did you find to replace the old beliefs with, and so on... It's like a specific and limited form of recapitulation entirely focused on your own specific beliefs, their history, their functions, their prospects, their vanishing point. This will be hard work, I think.

Once I heard a marvelous paradox: "I believe there is nothing in which I really believe" - just indicating how difficult it is (near to impossible) to get rid of all our assumptions.

Please remember that real knowledge is very hard to come by (as the example of Laura clearly shows) and that we all have to settle for less than the real thing in a whole lot of fields of endeavour a lot of times. Which isn't all that bad, provided you are always acutely aware you don't have 'the whole banana' on many topics and don't pretend to either.

The real difficulty lies in prohibiting judgements based on beliefs - to postpone final verdicts about the state of affairs almost indefinitely for lack of sufficient data. In stead you formulate a 'working hypothesis' about it (as Ark always reminds us) in which you have no emotional investment nor sentimental attachment about. It forces you to allow for ever more uncertainties about ever more topics, which is a simple way to enlarge your scope of freedom incrementally, to make room step by step for truly free will. fwiw.

 

[Sirius]

Hi know_yourself_1234,

Don't forget to always take a look at the Cassiopaea Glossary (if you are able to access these pages, because the site is down at the moment) which has many entries that cover all fundamental concepts and terms used throughout the forum and the QFG books.

There is an entry called "Beliefs vs. Faith" or similar. It describes many interesting aspects of this matter. You should read it and also related concepts (mostly dual in nature) like Subjectivity/Objectivity, Service-to-Self/Service-to-Others.

[quote author=know_yourself_1234]Are there any belief to 'keep'?[/quote]I think, it is not that simple, like buying a red car instead of blue one.

[quote author=know_yourself_1234]Do beliefs relate directly to the control system? Are beliefs something 'natural for 3D' as 'STS is the functionning 3D existence on earth' ?[/quote]Doesn't the whole condition of humankind relate to the Control System in one way or another, including DNA modifications, brain's division into hemispheres, Predator's Mind, programming of all kinds? Yes, it could be to some degree be natural in 3D like emotions, as the Cs once said, but the many manipulations certainly dominate in one's life without doing the Work. And beliefs are used by the Control System as a means to hold men in prison, because it works.

 

[Mountain Crown]

In which way should I apprehend my daily life, regarding to beliefs? Should I try to be as free of them as I can?

The English word belief simply means something that is held to be true.

If one desires to live according to the way things really are, it's necessary to investigate everything one regards to be true, because, after all, one could be mistaken.

For example, at one time it was widely held to be true that the earth was flat. We now know those people were mistaken.

When I was a child I regarded America as the land of the free and home of the brave. I've known for a quite a while that I was mistaken back then.

It's not that we want to dispense with holding things to be true, but rather developing the attitude that we could be mistaken and to let go once the evidence shows it.

Imagine, if you will, someone raised to regard crocodiles as harmless animals who always enjoy human caresses. . .

 

[know_yourself_1234]

Hi back,

Sorry for the delay. My cat ate my (...)




Thank you all for these guidelines

It helps me to read you because it is with your words..

Pashalis, thank you for the schema.

Contemplating any question through different 'lenses' allows me to reach my belief system by confronting it with other perspectives - moreover, it shows me what I tend to forget : I do not know and I am asleep!

A belief consists of a system of assumptions condensed into a doctrine about some topic.

The English word belief simply means something that is held to be true.

So, beliefs seem to fall in a kind of 'pre-integration' category, 'assumptive' state..

This reminds me of an interview of a French Actor, Thierry Lhermitte, who was saying:
'...every idea, belief is going through a kind of 'peage' before reaching our brain...'
'...it is there that we decide if an idea becomes valid (or not) to us...'

I cannot recall myself yet of his next words, but he was more or less saying that many people had kind of 'defective ways of dealing with an idea passing through the peage ...' and that '... there are some ideas that ought better for us to stay at the peage ...'

What strucks me today is how much blind I am and how much will it takes to shift towards a different way of dealing with life (and not things!).

In a way I feel that I am restoring my free will and in an other way I feel an increasing pressure. But this time these are the BIG 'demons' that I am facing, not the 'top o'the iceberg' ones.

But I have seen this in close people too these days. May I ask...sorry to ask this... but.. is it 'in the air' or is it something totally subjective?

I feel a kind of 'call to sort out past events', not in every person but a few ones.. May I ask for your opinion?

In stead you formulate a 'working hypothesis' about it (as Ark always reminds us) in which you have no emotional investment nor sentimental attachment about.

Thank you very much for sharing this.

Don't forget to always take a look at the Cassiopaea Glossary

Thank you for reminding me about this database!

 

[Palinurus]

But I have seen this in close people too these days. May I ask...sorry to ask this... but.. is it 'in the air' or is it something totally subjective?

As far as I know, when you are utterly busy with something (anything) and totally engrossed in it, it always seems as if everybody around you is doing the same or something similar. Compare it with considering buying a car and suddenly the car you fancy seems to be everywhere - as you just didn't notice them beforehand without the emotional rapport. So chances are that this is mostly subjective projecting. Nevertheless, most developments occur in waves so it might just be 'in the air' as well. Difficult to say, really. You could be surrounded with people in a similar stage of development as you are...

I had to look up 'peage' (in French) to understand you meant something like 'turnpike' or tollbooth'. I gather your spokesman meant something like a sieve. Some ideas make it through that and others don't. The real problem remains to discover why they do or don't. When it comes to weighing up your beliefsystem, it might help when you confront your beliefs with the Statement of Principles of the Fellowship (see: http://paleochristianity.org/statement-of-principles/). When you scroll down you discover that there is a French version of them as well. You could benefit from comparing the French version with the English one, would you want to brush up on your language skills too... Just a thought. Wish you well.

 

[taitai]

Hi know_yourself_1234,

Quite some questions did you pose. I won't pretend to know much about this, but I'll give it my best shot. Hope this helps a bit.

Very little can be said about beliefs in general terms. A belief consists of a system of assumptions condensed into a doctrine about some topic. It's a form of surrogate knowledge for lack of better understanding, mostly based on hearsay and on conventions or truisms. It takes the place of real knowledge in order to cope with unbearable uncertainties. Beliefs can be prejudicial as well.

Since hindsight can sometimes be very helpfull I would suggest you try to follow the track back all the way to the origins of your specific beliefs. Who told you so, why did you accept their take on things, when did you start to doubt anything you believed before and why, what did you find to replace the old beliefs with, and so on... It's like a specific and limited form of recapitulation entirely focused on your own specific beliefs, their history, their functions, their prospects, their vanishing point. This will be hard work, I think.

Once I heard a marvelous paradox: "I believe there is nothing in which I really believe" - just indicating how difficult it is (near to impossible) to get rid of all our assumptions.

Please remember that real knowledge is very hard to come by (as the example of Laura clearly shows) and that we all have to settle for less than the real thing in a whole lot of fields of endeavour a lot of times. Which isn't all that bad, provided you are always acutely aware you don't have 'the whole banana' on many topics and don't pretend to either.

The real difficulty lies in prohibiting judgements based on beliefs - to postpone final verdicts about the state of affairs almost indefinitely for lack of sufficient data. In stead you formulate a 'working hypothesis' about it (as Ark always reminds us) in which you have no emotional investment nor sentimental attachment about. It forces you to allow for ever more uncertainties about ever more topics, which is a simple way to enlarge your scope of freedom incrementally, to make room step by step for truly free will. fwiw.

I just want to thank you - that was the best summing up of beliefs I have read in a long time.