Robert Monroe's OBE techniques

[Εἰρήνη]

I would like to ask C’s a question about Robert Monroe’s techniques, particularly OBE ones. I personally find them very useful to explore different levels of existence. I managed to separate from my body a few times and that was quite an experience! And I was very moved by Monroe’s participation in helping newly discarnate souls.

However, I am aware of Robert Monroe’s ties with the CIA.
Thanks to Laura, Ark and our forum members, It is discussed here: http://cassiopaea.org/2012/11/21/1974/
here: https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=5434.0
and here: http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/cosmic_cointelpro_1981.htm

I would like to ask the Cs these questions:

Are all the gateway experience CDs that are being produced today by Monroe Institute for the general public corrupted?

Is it relatively safe and/or beneficial to some people to practice OBE/ astral projections?

Thank you.

 

[goyacobol]

Εἰρήvη​,

Actually, the Cs have already commented on the OBE experience by answering a question that Laura had about it here:

Session 18 November 1995

Q: (L) Okay, I want to ask about the experience I had the other night - are you still there?
A: Why do you always ask that, do you expect us to take a coffee break?
Q: (L) Okay, I had what seemed to be an OBE the other night. Was I actually having one?
A: Was an "all intensive ooze" of the solar realm.
Q: (L) What? (T) You asked! (F) Well, now THAT'S completely clear! (L) Sarcasm will get you nowhere,
guys! (T) That's about as clear as ooze! (L) Okay, what is an "all intensive ooze" of the solar realm?
A: Realms are compartmentalized at graduated levels, like everything else. The root basis of the study
of Astrology is the "unified entity realm," which relates to the effect that local cosmic bodies have upon
the body and soul of third density beings in any given locator.
Q: (L) So, what does this mean in terms of what I experienced? I felt that I was moving in and out of
my body over and over, sort of like doing an exercise.
A: Solar activity occurring when your experience took place was such that, based on your "solar
return," had the effect of partially separating your soul from your body. Now, just for fun, why not
check your chart for that day, and see if the aspects were a little more favorable for expiration of the
body potential than usual?
Q: (L) Now that I have been able to play with it a little, will I experience it again, or can I?
A: Well, it is always experienced at least once in the lifetime of a human being, but for most people, it
occurs at the conclusion.
Q: [much laughter] (L) You mean I died? Or was this what people experience when they die?
A: Yes, but you got to come back in time for dinner!
Q: (F) I guess that's mirth! (L) So, that wasn't just an OBE, it was a separation of the soul from the
body? Is that the same as astral projection?
A: No.
Q: (L) Do people who have OBE's experience this?
A: With "astal projection" the consciousness level is not as intense because of "the silver cord" and the
shroud of third density awareness.
Q: (L) You guys just don't know how intense this experience was. I was SO conscious of EVERYTHING.
(T) More conscious than you have ever been before, right? (L) I have to say yes. I was playing with
what was happening to me and having fun. I noticed every little sensation. The separating from the
body produces a sizzling sound, a sort of electrical sizzle, and it changes as you move in and out of the
body. I knew what I was doing. (T) In astral projection, the soul is still connected to the body. In this
case, was Laura's soul completely separated from her physical body?
A: Not completely, but the part that was, was.
Q: (L) Well, I did sort of keep a toe in. (T) This is almost the same thing that Dannion Brinkley
described in his book. So, if Laura had lost complete connection, would she have died at this point?
A: Yes.

Personally, I don't have the urge to have an OBE more than once. They do make a distinction between "astral projection" and an OBE but I'm not so sure about the usefulness of it.

The Cs also talk about "bilocation" and it sounds very similar to the OBE experience here:

Session 5 October 1996

Q: (L) Anything else about it? No. All right, Marcie took a particular type of Reiki initiation or
attunement today, and I’d like to know, what was the... she had an event occur during the
attunements. I would like to know what this event was. What this condition was that she experienced.
A: She should be careful not to “spread her self too thin.”
Q: (L) And what does that mean?
A: One does not need to cram learning, “steady as she goes.”
Q: (V) They’re punctually correct, aren’t they? (L) Yes, they are! So, is that in a sense a caution? {V
was referring to punctuation, not punctuality.}
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Can you describe what it was that was taking place with her? Or define it?
A: Soul bilocation.
Q: (L) So, it was not exactly a state, as the Sufis describe?
A: No.
Q: (L) And where did she bi-locate to?
A: Not easily explainable.
Q: (L) Was it to another density or dimension? Or parallel universe or spiritual domain? (T) Norfolk
Naval Station? [Laughter] Destination of bilocation! (L) Was this a beneficial event for her?
A: No. She has been ripping open the fabric too much.
Q: (V) Do you know what that means? (TM) The fabric of this dimension? (L) Is T correct? The fabric of
this dimension?
A: Close. Each soul has its own patterning, which is held in place by the three bodies of existence
[planchette swirls a few times] ... “thought center, spirit center and physical center,” there are specific
methodologies for adjusting these, and travelling into or out of other planes of existence. When one
does not properly utilize these, one tears the fabric of their trilateral continuum when they seek to
travel. This can be very problematic, and may lead to the soul being unable to reconnect with the body,
thus causing the physical center to perish!!!

Again, this is not something to take lightly I think.

You seem to find this exhilarating:

I personally find them very useful to explore different levels of existence. I managed to separate from my body a few times and that was quite an experience!

Hopefully you always "come back in time for dinner". ;)

 

[trendsetter37]

Hey Εἰρήvη​,

I would advise against playing around with OOBEs in general. Your post reminded me of something the C's said to me a couple of years ago.

http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,34616.msg488746.html#msg488746

Q: (Menrva) Talk him through? (Odyssey) You have to tell him what happens when you die. (Approaching Infinity) Talk him through the process. (Menrva) Oh, okay. (trendsetter37) So, on April the 18th, I had another experience that I dunno if it's an out of body experience or not, but... But after reading Thirty Years Among the Dead, I was wondering is that just... hallucinatory, or similar being out of body, or... What was that? I've had them more than once, but I'm not sure, and I don't want to put too much stock in it, or let it distract, I guess...

A: Did you feel an electrical shock?

Q: (trendsetter37) I felt an electrical buzzing, and I could feel different distinct frequencies of vibrating. However I have felt shocked before while meditating.

A: You might want to limit such activity in the present time when staying in the body can be problematic.

Q: (trendsetter37) So, limit the out of body... (Menrva) Well, when you're having problems, limit it. (trendsetter37) Okay. I remember how to stop it. So, car alarms... Sometimes, if I'm out really early in the morning, I notice car alarms going off, but they're not really close to me. And it's at times when no one else is awake. I do notice sometimes that psychic phenomenon come from yourself, but... What does the car alarm phenomenon mean?

A: Relate back to your previous question: an alarm.

I am familiar with Monroe and read a couple of his books. But I would say meddling in things of this nature is just too risky. Yes it may be novel on the surface but there are just too many unknowns involved, and what's more, if you become addicted to the experience then that is taking more than two steps back from what we all are trying to accomplish here on the forum. Seeing objective reality consciously and consistently.

I would say to try and learn as much as possible about the reality you are rooted in before attempting to explore others.

 

[Nienna]

Whenever I see people wanting the OOBE experience, or astral projection, I always remember what was said in The Sufi Path of Knowledge:

Nowadays most people interested in the spirituality of the East desire the "experience," though they may call what they are after "intimate communion with God." Those familiar with the standards and norms of spiritual experience set down by disciplined paths are usually appalled at the way Westerners seize upon any apparition from the domain outside of normal consciousness as a manifestation of the "spiritual." In fact there are innumerable realms in the unseen world, some of them far more dangerous than the worst jungles of the visible world. No person familiar with the teachings of Sufism would dare lay himself open to such forces... [Chittick, The Sufi Path of Knowledge]

 

[Εἰρήνη]

Thank you, friends, for your responses, warnings, and for posting the related sessions here.

My first OBE happened spontaneously without me doing anything special to get into the state. I found myself at a place where the souls went immediately right after death. Each was in a separate room contemplating. I saw a lonely little girl there, she was sort of in distress and I felt compelled to help her, to talk to her, to comfort her. But a thought about my physical body slipped through my mind and I was immediately back. I felt that maybe I need to return to help.

I was aware of some dangers after reading Monroe books, but the C's said

A: You might want to limit such activity in the present time when staying in the body can be problematic.

At the time I read that session I thought that C's meant that Laura should not attempt OBE at that time due to an attack on her physical body.

Maybe that could mean that sometimes for some people for some reasons it is OK to do this for helping others and learning something out of the experience?

Nienna, thank you for bringing up The Sufi Path of Knowledge. After all, It was ignorant on my part to "travel" to places without having sufficient knowledge about it.

 

[Persej]

My first OBE happened spontaneously without me doing anything special to get into the state.

So if it happened spontaneously how do you know that you can do it again?

 

[Εἰρήνη]

My first OBE happened spontaneously without me doing anything special to get into the state.

So if it happened spontaneously how do you know that you can do it again?

After I had my spontaneous OBE I have learned how to do it from Monroe's books. Monroe Institute also sell recordings that help a person to get into the right state. But I am very suspicious about them. Based on what we know about the Institute connections with the intelligence, "they" would probably not pass on the opportunity to add "jellifying" signals to Monroe's original recordings.

Session 13 June 2015

What is more important in determining a song’s value: the lyrics or the sound/mood/feeling?


A: The sound opens the door for the lyrics to enter for good or ill.

Q: (L) Does that mean that a song that sounds really horrible and mechanical and like somebody just beating on a pot or clanging on the hood of their car or something, and if that's the kind of music the person likes, but it also has good lyrics, then that's okay?

A: Not exactly. The sound can open gates at - or of - different levels and parts of the internal makeup.

Q: (L) Okay, next forum question:


Quote

Is the NSA using musical tastes and downloads to track and identify certain 'types'?


A: Of course.

Q: (L) Next:


Quote

Is the song "Somewhere Over the Rainbow" really used as a mind-control programming tool like Catcher in the Rye?


A: Sadly, in some circles, yes.

Q: (Galatea) So, if people like anarchy music about hating the government and law, then they're gonna stir up some trouble?

(L) I dunno. Maybe they would track somebody like that and think that they could turn that person to their own uses.

(Perceval) They said there are some types of music that are listened to by certain types of people... Certain types of emo music or whatever that certain types of young people listen to, like outsiders or loners and that kind of thing, and those people could be tracked as candidates for "use"...

A: The 70's were the time of development of such concepts and technologies. The 80's were the period when implementation became more widespread. At present 90 percent of broadcast music has corrupting elements.

Q: (Pierre) So we have to listen to old music. Music from before the 70's. Or classical music.

Also Session 19 November 2005

-Q: (Perceval) They’re going to use it for black ops to start Armageddon. (Galahad) I can see the front page of the Signs page Monday. [Laughter] (Atriedes) We’re going to have to install a filter! (L) Well, just think about all the predicted mass landings. What about Bubble's questions (Perceval) Bubbles wants to know what’s up with her memory loss?

A: Too much TV and too much music with encoded brain jellifying signals. Learn to sleep properly and cut way back on the music. It is better to listen to music of that type only when physically active.

Q: [Bubbles enters the room] (Mr. Scott) Speak of the devil (Bubbles) What? (Atriedes) Literally. We got an answer. (Bubbles) You got an answer? What? (Galahad) You’re not going to like it. (Perceval) I need to ask her second question. What is it that she perceives in her room in terms of, in her words, “the green monster thing” and scary sensations when she wakes up?

A: By-products of previous mentioned issue.

Q: (Perceval) So, your memory loss is the result of “too much TV and too much music with encoded brain jellifying signals. Learn to sleep properly and cut way back on the music. It is better to listen to music of that type only when physically active”. And the scary monsters you’re seeing are the results of that. (L) So there are signals being sent into your brain through this music, and it’s causing your brain to be jellified so it can be used by external forces to come into your reality and haunt you. (Mr. Scott) So you can listen to it when you’re exercising. (Perceval) But it’s probably better not to have it right in your ears.

A: That’s it in a nutshell!

Q: (Perceval) It’s frying your brains and making you see things. (Ar) It all started at a particular time, two years ago. (Perceval) You had built up years of brain frying. Your brain will work OK and then at a point where you’ve fried it too much it’ll go bonkers. It’s like when you fry a steak. It looks the same for awhile, but eventually it starts to... (L) This is your brain, and this is your brain on drugs. (Andromeda) This is your brain on too much music. (Bubbles) I don’t listen to too much music. I only listen to it when I’m going to sleep. (L) That is probably the worst thing you could do before you go to sleep because that stuff does things to your brain and then it continues to operate while you’re sleeping. (Galahad) Because it says “you need to learn to sleep properly and cut way back on the music”. So there’s a relationship between the fact that you’re listening to the music and you’re not sleeping properly. (Bubbles) I have this thing. I listen to music, and then I go to sleep. (Perceval) You could change the type of music you listen to before sleeping. There are certain kinds of music that aren’t encoded with the signals. (L) Listen to classical before going to bed. (Bubbles) Sometimes I do! (Perceval) Well, you need to do it more and less music music with freaky messages encoded into it. (Atriedes) Is Eminem a complete tool of the powers that be? Sometimes it seems to have a good thing; sometimes it doesn’t.

A: If it is popular and/or widely sold, it is part of the “program.”

 

[Thor]

Whenever I see people wanting the OOBE experience, or astral projection, I always remember what was said in The Sufi Path of Knowledge:

Nowadays most people interested in the spirituality of the East desire the "experience," though they may call what they are after "intimate communion with God." Those familiar with the standards and norms of spiritual experience set down by disciplined paths are usually appalled at the way Westerners seize upon any apparition from the domain outside of normal consciousness as a manifestation of the "spiritual." In fact there are innumerable realms in the unseen world, some of them far more dangerous than the worst jungles of the visible world. No person familiar with the teachings of Sufism would dare lay himself open to such forces... [Chittick, The Sufi Path of Knowledge]

Nienna,
That is such an important quote and one that so many people would benefit from keeping in mind.

There's an interesting Buddhist book called "Cutting through spiritual materialism" that deals a lot about the same topic about the dangers of becoming materialistic and greedy in obtaining "spiritual" experiences as part of their development. And that the more you experience the more spiritual you are. It's a well written and both enjoyable and very interesting read although at the end it becomes very focused on the Buddhist path. It can be found here: http://www.amazon.com/Cutting-Spiritual-Materialism-Shambhala-Classics/dp/1501221485

FWIW

 

[Persej]

After I had my spontaneous OBE I have learned how to do it from Monroe's books. Monroe Institute also sell recordings that help a person to get into the right state. But I am very suspicious about them. Based on what we know about the Institute connections with the intelligence, "they" would probably not pass on the opportunity to add "jellifying" signals to Monroe's original recordings.

Well I wouldn't trust the original recordings either. I recommend watching this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOQzmtU1SjM
It's about Scientology, but I believe the same principles apply to OBE scene.

Ok, so you are doing astral projection. And what are you doing with that?

I interacted with many people who claimed to be doing astral projection but I never saw that they brought anything useful after their experiences.

 

[no-mans-land]

I interacted with many people who claimed to be doing astral projection but I never saw that they brought anything useful after their experiences.

Me too. It's like they search for a thrill with a spiritual touch. In fact, all people I know claiming doing astral projection or engage in OOBE's, didn't changed a bit in years, gained no usefull knowledge whatsoever and their lives remain the same.

 

[axj]

I think that the only benefit of astral projection or OBE is that you get a direct experience that you are more than just your body. This can be quite a beneficial shift in perception. Other than that, there is not much benefit to it.

But it sure is interesting to read about, such as Robert Monroe's adventures in "Far Journeys" and "Ultimate Journey". He also used the OBE's to find a sort of guide in the astral realm.

 

[Εἰρήνη]

As we know, learning is fun! My natural curiosity made me explore.

After going through the steps to achieve OBE several times my ajna chakra started to tremble. Maybe these activities somehow activate the third eye chakra.

But I agree with the statement above, that we should be very careful with what we put ourselves into. We should not enter something without knowledge.

 

[Beorn]

If there are no limits to the mind could we not explore the imaginal world with our minds without the need to separate spirit from body? IMO there is enough magic in the world without the need for an OBE just for the sake of it.

When one has a spontaneous OBE one tends to be aware of it but what about dreaming, meditation or sending one's consciousness out? How is the soul involved? Where are the boundaries between consciousness and spirit or soul?

For me it's more about consciousness. Meditating on this or that, dreaming of this or that... but how exactly the spirit is involved in all of this I'm not really sure.

 

[axj]

Well, the whole idea of OBE, as presented by Robert Monroe and others, is that what the experience during an OBE is pretty similar to what we experience between lifetimes when we are not incarnated in a body. In fact, an in-body-experience seems to be something out-of-the-ordinary and not quite common.

 

[Εἰρήνη]

Well, the whole idea of OBE, as presented by Robert Monroe and others, is that what the experience during an OBE is pretty similar to what we experience between lifetimes when we are not incarnated in a body. In fact, an in-body-experience seems to be something out-of-the-ordinary and not quite common.

Yes, axj,
astral is not a realm of the highest emanations. Everything I saw there is pretty earthly and "normal".
I don't have much experience with it, but based on what I saw, everyone right after death is surrounded by the reality that he/she chooses according to the level of consciousness/understanding. For example, a little girl was sitting in a "waiting room" watching cartoons - the habit that comforts her. The departed spirits for some time seem to keep the same character and "appearance", and even behavior. For example a departed alcohol addict would act just like an alcohol addict right after death, even though technically he is not attached to his intoxicated body. Perhaps the reason why everything looks pretty "normal" to the newly departed is to ensure a smooth transition.

But to our souls, physical life in a physical body feels pretty artificial I would think.