Session 20 August 2011

Laura said:
the better ways to understand one's own culture is to get immersed in another one and observe and compare in your own mind until you distill out some things.

Well, I forgot this way, better, no doubt about it in my mind.

In fact I wanted to underline how is difficult to do critical self-anlysis because of subjectivity, this could be a good exercice however.

To be be clearer: what posted Belibaste and Adaryn on French conduct sometimes extrapolate things from their own life experience to say this is general...


Belibaste mentions 'The Importance of Maths' in France, and I think this is really a powerful thing (which is even 'poetic') but he forgets the Importance of Art (not part of education however) - concrete example : I think in France (not only) we like to add esthetic value to things which are supposed to be practical (and sometimes Us people find that funny and say: why they do that??, we just need a practical stuff !... [just an example, and not one of the most important points]
 

Odysseus

Jedi
Thanks for this newest exciting session :clap: :flowers:

Very interesting connections here about diet schizophrenia and shamanism (though if I remember right, for shamanism additional rare, genetical
predispositions are necessary).
I just finished The Vegetarian Myth, Life Without Bread is up next (as well as the corresponding long thread here in the forums).
 

sitting

Dagobah Resident
Apple CEO Steve Jobs announced his resignation yesterday...obviously over health issues. In the articles linked below, it's clear that he borders on the fanatical when it comes to his food. You guessed it. Fruits and vegetables. That's it! And he's been doing this for a LONG time. Given what the C's have said repeatedly, one has to wonder if there is indeed an element of cause and effect.

http://www.fredericpatenaude.com/blog/?p=193

http://www.forbes.com/2008/07/24/steve-jobs-diet-tech-personal-cx_bc_0724jobs.html
 

Mrs.Tigersoap

The Living Force
I must say I am relieved that French culture is being put under the microscope here. I have been frustrated sometimes at how France has been put forward as better knowing when it was in total constrast to my experience with it. I’ve lived half my life on the French border (like literally ON the French border, I just had to take 10 steps and I was in France), half my family is French and I’m in contact with French people on a daily basis through my job. Belgium culture is very much influenced by French culture and TV, so there are some similarities (and so I recognize myself in some of the traits that have been put forward in this thread). But Belgians and French are very different.

When the French way of raising kids was discussed in Is Maman mean or magnifique (http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,16494.0.html), I was frustrated (I think it showed in my posts) because I could see what this way has done to my father, his brothers, my family. And to some extent, me. But it was then difficult for me to put it into words, I now realize. I could not make the difference between what was typically French and what was typically my French family. It raised a lot of emotional issues and then of course it’s difficult to think (and post) straight. I wanted to say all that was wrong with how the French raise their kids, with how they see marriage, how they see women but I was second-guessing myself: maybe I was not seeing things clearly, maybe I was biased because of my negative experience with my father, etc. And also, I value what Laura thinks. And Laura seemed to think highly of the French. So I was at a loss. All I could come up with in that thread was that the ‘civilized’ kids the French were raising were in fact repressed and that you could see that in the fact that the French are the largest antidepressant consumers in the world.
Sometimes you need another person to say simply something that you have always thought and the fog directly lifts from your brain.

So I am grateful for Laura’s, Belibaste's and Adaryn's explanations of the French. They concur with my experience but still, it is all clearer now.

Since this conversation has been so enlightening for me (and apparently for others as well), I was wondering if having a thread (or section) dedicated to this kind of deprogramming for different nationalities might help? It’s easier when ‘foreigners’ say what they see about a country/culture, but maybe people can have a go at their own country as well?

Just a thought.

edit: plural
 

Lan8r

Jedi Master
I just want to say that I am finding this discussion about the French very interesting. From a cultural understanding perspective that is.

Laura posted:
I started out thinking that France MUST be superior to the U.S. simply because I was so disgusted with the U.S. warmongering and, at the time, France was refusing to get involved in taking down the Iraqi regime. I didn't see that as being "cowardly surrender monkeys" but rather as taking a reasonable, moral stance with courage in the face of enormous pressure from the immoral U.S.

So, naturally, I saw everything the French did as better and superior.

I felt the same way, for the same reason. I was also impressed with the healthcare system and the access to education. Definatley superior to what I see here in the US. I have always been impressed with European culture in general, however being educated in the US, the greatest nation on earth under God (gag), I have no true knowledge of other cultures.

The only real experience I have is a summer visit to Germany in my early teens.
I was young and it was an exicting adventure, but I was so impressed. Everywhere you look there is History, there is Culture. It occured to me then that to find Culture in the US you would have to look to the Native Americans. Of course I was only 14 years old and it was 34 years ago.

I can so relate to the 'Yankee thing' too. Although I am a 'Yankee' born in Conneticut, I was raised in Florida from the age of 5. In a little town that was dubbed 'The City in the Country' (more like the Everglades!). There were cows and horses and pastures all over the place, I was sure that one day I would be able to have a horse of my own. It did not take long before the pastures were replaced, and you could find a bagel shop on every corner. As much as those Yankees complained, they would not take the road home!!

Anyway, I confess, I am an American, born, raised and educated. I feel that as such, in the current times, I am probably hated and ridiculed by the normal, common folk of other cultures (and the French would probably spit on me!!). And for good reason. However, I am not a "Proud American", I am ashamed. I am an individual, a work in progress (as we all are), and hopefully as Belibaste posted
Step by step, becoming a bit more who we really are.

It is very enlightening to delve into specific cultures/nationalities and to learn how different societal expectations shape us all as individuals.
 

Laura

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
Freya said:
It is very enlightening to delve into specific cultures/nationalities and to learn how different societal expectations shape us all as individuals.

Probably one of the best books I've ever read on how child rearing shapes a society is Erik Erikson's "Childhood and Society." A worthy read.
 
Francois, I meant no harm, nor foul, to you , or any others, in my earlier post. I was under the impression that the discourse had taken a "tangent", that , regarding the original topic, was perhaps , "off-topic". As seen below in my response to Laura. I will refrain from that type of post in the future. My post was intended as a opinion, or perhaps, better termed a "suggestion". Since, as it seemed to me, ( other than the personal items that were discussed, such as folks probable maladies , such as Morgellons",etc), that diet, mirrors/ghosts , ELF/Em frequency & changes, etc., seemed to be the original main topic of the session. I, mistakenly thought that the further discussion of your situation of your being French & the discourse from having your studies in France being part of the session involving the Sessions' contents, & the responding posts from others. ( The part involving the French appearing to involve approximately 10-12 entries, with a resulting approximately 3+ pages of posts/responses) was not entirely "on topic.
I was mistaken , it seems.
Not the first time that I have been mistaken, & I will remember.
I am doing research to further my "education". A search for more"knowledge" , you could say. Your discourse with the others, seemed a bit of "distraction" to me, from what I thought was the "jist"(sp?)/main direction of the session.
Thank you for responding to me directly.
I wish you well.

:)


Laura said:
MnSportsman said:
Perhaps I may be chastised for posting this , but, I feel as though the discourse with francois & discussing the french manner of debate , just may, have "hijacked" the whole Original posts' topic.

Perhaps a topic with a new subject might be more appropriate to discuss Francois' views & the responses pertaining to his views, rather in this topic would be a better thing to do.
and a return to the seesion would be more interesting to many, ...
just my "opinion.

;)

JB/MnSportsman

Actually, since the Cs made the remark they did about the French educational system, it is entirely on topic to discuss that in this thread.

Laura,
In regard to your respose to my post..
You have my respect. I will remember your words.
I stand corrected. I realize that the session had included part of the French system. Although, after reading several pages directed at Francois, & his 'mindset', & the resulting posts & no mention of the other possible items of interest. It seems I was mistaken that perhaps the topic had been waylaid.
I will remember to consider this as I continue my path towards more information & knowledge.

My respects to all,
JB/MnSportsman
 
Don't worry, I was just caring on any potential embarrassment regarding too much French stuff in previous posts (you know I am a typical French sick accepting his sickness, so believe me nothing more can hurt me)
 

A.K.

Padawan Learner
Thank you for the latest session Team Cass.

As i remember in Chinese tradition, grandma always told us not to place mirror that faces both the door or window. It'll
attract spirits. Guess as linear days are numbered, for the old world. We start to see stuff that normally unseen to the naked eye.

And to see the unseen is a requisite to 4th density transition. More like doing the 3rd threshold.

Have an enlightening day to all.

:)
 

Lan8r

Jedi Master
Probably one of the best books I've ever read on how child rearing shapes a society is Erik Erikson's "Childhood and Society." A worthy read.

Thank You Laura, it is now on my reading list. Right under Primal Body, Primal Mind.

If I might also add to this thread, the Mirror/Window thing has really got me thinking. There was a time when I was napping on the couch after a hard day of physical work. It was the kind of sleep that you would really have to pull yourself out of. I semi woke up and saw the figure of a Man standing at the foot of the couch watching me. I could see him very clearly and I knew that he was not a real man in my house watching me sleep. But to this day I can tell you that he was tall, slender with grey hair and a button up collared shirt. I remember that I did not feel scared or threatened by this, or maybe I just couldn't pull myself out of sleep, but I rolled over and slept awhile longer. Thinking back, there was a large mirror on the wall that faced the front of the house where there was an entire wall of windows.

My sister, while living in the same house and napping in a bedroom with my neice, saw a figure of a man whose discription was exactly the same. In the bedroom was a huge mirror attached to her dresser, also facing the front of the house and an entire wall of windows.

The man who previously lived in this house had died there. His Wife had passed away and he lived there alone for a while before he passed on. They found him one day there in the house. We thought that maybe he was the man we saw. We called him Frank, and everytime we heard a strange noise, you know like houses make, we said hello to Frank and thanked him for watching over us.

Maybe our imaginations, I don't know. But I saw this man as clear as day, I knew that it wasn't a real life person standing there and I don't think I was dreaming it. Reading about the Mirror thing makes me feel a little more sane!

He and his wife built that house and lived there together for about 30 years. Even if it was just our imaginations, we were comfotable with Frank's presence! My brother and his wife live in the house now and haven't reported any Frank sightings, but they don't have any mirrors!
 
Thank you Laura and crew for another insightful session.

The part about schizophrenia/shamanism and diet gives me pause, to think whether this is happening in my own case, and whether this means I should seek a purely animal protein/fat based diet. Like, should I not eat any vegetables at all, not even leafy greens like spinach or kelp?

I know I've felt crazy/out of control at many times in my life, and have wondered "how could I have been so stupid" after some life-shattering lesson. It's happened so many times in my life I can't even count. Maybe there is the potential for me to "see", but the signal is getting scrambled due to physical and psychological junk? I think that maybe I fit this profile... I've had precognitive dreams, and get deja vu so often I almost expect it to happen. But how do I know what to eat?

Narcissism from childhood emotional trauma could be another major factor in my case.

Another possibility is that my predator's mind wants the former to be true as an excuse.
 

Pierre

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
François said:
Belibaste mentions 'The Importance of Maths' in France, and I think this is really a powerful thing (which is even 'poetic') but he forgets the Importance of Art (not part of education however) - concrete example : I think in France (not only) we like to add esthetic value to things which are supposed to be practical (and sometimes Us people find that funny and say: why they do that??, we just need a practical stuff !.

Art is a very interesting topic, as well as conformism, chauvinism, etc. There are so many things to say about France!

Indeed Art is not part of the education / evaluation French system, but the worse is that creativity is totally absent.

Art is very present in France, because from my observation it's an external sign of wealth / intelligence / distinction. As mentioned in my previous post, appearances are extremely important in France but not in a bling bling way.

So instead of displaying a gold plated Rolls Royce, a wealthy French will display a Monet. Instead of showing off on a jet ski, a wealthy French will attend a trendy art expo in Venise.

That might explain why, in France, investing money on art is totally tax free (while all the rest is heavily taxed).

You're right, French people give importance to esthetics. What's the reason? French people like to think it's because they have a superior sense of beauty, a superior sensitivity.

Maybe the explanation is less poetic, the importance given to esthetics is related to the importance given to appearances.

French people prefer appearances : be beautiful, have nice items, speak nicely, to reality : truth in who you are, in what you say, in the way you interact with others.

By the way, I love France, I love France very much. I've lived overseas and I chose to come back to France. But it's not because I love France that it's a perfect country.
 
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