The Celtic Gods

shijing

The Living Force
I just wanted to give a brief plug for a book that Laura recommended recently, The Celtic Gods by Patrick McCafferty and Mike Baillie:

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The Celtic myths, involving heroic warriors such as Finn and CuChulinn, can be read as simple primitive stories, but closer examination reveals strange descriptions and relationships.

The authors of this ground-breaking book argue that all the principal characters are aspects of the one Celtic sky god, Lugh, who was a comet. Against the background of a comet scenario this re-interpretation of about ten key Celtic myths shows how many of the descriptions in the myths fit the appearance of comets. The fact that these comets on occasions produced abrupt environmental changes, that can be traced in the tree-ring and ice-core chronologies, pins the stories to a central reality.

With a novel twist this original book confirms the widespread belief that these stories must contain a "core of truth."

In addition to the above, the authors also discuss the Arthur cycle, arguing that it originates from the same cometary motif. Arthur and comets in one package -- it's quite a treat :) And as books go, it's also relatively affordable (about USD $25).
 
Shijing said:
I just wanted to give a brief plug for a book that Laura recommended recently, The Celtic Gods by Patrick McCafferty and Mike Baillie:

... the authors also discuss the Arthur cycle, arguing that it originates from the same cometary motif. Arthur and comets in one package -- it's quite a treat :) And as books go, it's also relatively affordable (about USD $25).

I agree with Shijing, this is an interesting book to read. A real 'treat'. :)
 
there are still two available on british amazon around 20£ (32$) not including shipping
_http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/0752434446/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used
 
Like RyanX, I'm finding this book priced well out of reach on amazon (200 USD) and used it is even more; AbeBooks.com lists it at over 400 USD.

I'll keep looking. ;)
 
Here's a possible resource for everyone here: http://www.paperbackswap.com/index.php

Blurb from website:
We help avid readers Swap, Trade & Exchange Books for Free.

* It's easy: List books you'd like to swap with other club members.
* Once a book is requested, mail it to the club member.
* In return, you may choose from 4,997,071 available books!

- Books you request are mailed to you for free.
- No late fees. No hidden charges.

Its possible to request The Celtic Gods, and other books here. Its a long shot in some cases, but it might come in handy. :D

Perhaps this can be a way to share books amongst the Fellowship etc?
 
treesparrow said:
Hi RyanX

You might like to try Amazon in the UK. 1 second hand copy available for about 41 or 42 dollars ( incl international shipping)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/0752434446/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1298392500&sr=1-1&condition=used

Thanks treesparow. I tried ordering it, but when it came time to check out it said it couldn't ship to my address, even though it lists international shipping rates :huh: Maybe I'll send them and email and see what's up.

Gimpy said:
Here's a possible resource for everyone here: http://www.paperbackswap.com/index.php

Very interesting! I may have to give this a try. I have a bunch of books I've been looking to get rid of too, but haven't had the inclination to sell. This might be perfect.
 
For those who still have TV :evil: and have the "Smithsonian Channel", Patrick McCafferty and Dallas Abbott are featured in a documentary to be aired on Friday, July 11 :
_http://www.smithsonianchannel.com/sc/web/show/3408479/sacred-sites-ireland
 
Gimpy said:
Like RyanX, I'm finding this book priced well out of reach on amazon (200 USD) and used it is even more; AbeBooks.com lists it at over 400 USD.

I'll keep looking. ;)


:lol: http://www.amazon.fr/gp/offer-listing/0752434446/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new 898.36€ !!! record broken !
 
I've come across what is clearly a Welsh comet story but one which has enormous cross over to Irish Comet God stories - in fact so much so that it journeys back and forth between both lands as well as England - plus is arguably the first or earliest story to have Arthur and his Knights at its centre (some scholars date its earliest written form to 11th century AD).

From Wiki:

Culhwch and Olwen
( Welsh: Culhwch ac Olwen) is a Welsh tale that survives in only two manuscripts about a hero connected with Arthur and his warriors: a complete version in the Red Book of Hergest, c. 1400, and a fragmented version in the White Book of Rhydderch, ca. 1325. It is the longest of the surviving Welsh prose tales. The prevailing view among scholars was that the present version of the text was composed by the 11th century, making it perhaps the earliest Arthurian tale and one of Wales' earliest extant prose texts, but a 2005 reassessment by linguist Simon Rodway dates it to the latter half of the 12th century.

... Besides the quality of its storytelling it contains several remarkable passages (including) the fight against the terrible boar Twrch Trwyth certainly has antecedents in Celtic tradition...


I'm currently tracking boar imagery for another project and its clear that in the myths of Wales/Ireland/England the Boar - among other profound meanings - symbolized a rampaging cometary force.


Again from Wiki:


Twrch is named as the son of Prince Tared (or Taredd Wledig), cursed into the form of a wild creature; he has poisonous bristles, and carries a pair of scissors, a comb and a razor on his head between his ears. In French romances such as by Chrétien de Troyes, Ares is the father of a knight called Tor. Some scholars consider that Tor son of Ares is the Twrch son of Tared of Culhwch and Olwen and that the authentic name is probably Ares.

Very interesting indeed - Ares... the Great Boar... the killer of men and the bringer of war... in north west Europe...


As for the story...


Synopsis
Culhwch's father, King Cilydd..., loses his wife Goleuddydd after a difficult childbirth. When he remarries, the young Culhwch rejects his stepmother's attempt to pair him with his new stepsister. Offended, the new queen puts a curse on him so that he can marry no one besides the beautiful Olwen, daughter of the giant Ysbaddaden Pencawr.

Though he has never seen her, Culhwch becomes infatuated with her, but his father warns him that he will never find her without the aid of his famous cousin Arthur. The young man immediately sets off to seek his kinsman. He finds him at his court in Celliwig in Cornwall; this is one of the earliest instances in literature or oral tradition of Arthur's court being assigned a specific location and a valuable source of comparison with the court of Camelot or Caerleon as depicted in later Welsh, English and continental Arthurian legends.

Arthur agrees to help, and sends six of his finest warriors … to join Culhwch in his search for Olwen. The group meets some relatives of Culhwch's that know Olwen and agree to arrange a meeting.

Olwen is receptive to Culhwch's attraction, but she cannot marry him unless her father agrees, and he, unable to survive past his daughter's wedding, will not consent until Culhwch completes a series of about forty impossible-sounding tasks. The completion of only a few of these tasks is recorded and the giant is killed, leaving Olwen free to marry her lover.

The story is on one level a typical folktale, in which a young hero sets out to wed a giant's daughter, and many of the accompanying motifs reinforce this (the strange birth, the jealous stepmother, the hero falling in love with a stranger after hearing only her name, etc.).

...the majority of the writing is taken up by two long lists and the adventures of King Arthur and his men. The first of these occurs when Arthur welcomes his young kinsman to his court and offers to give him whatever he wishes. Culhwch, of course, asks that Arthur help him get Olwen, and invokes some two hundred of the greatest men, women, dogs, horses and swords in Arthur's kingdom to underscore his request. Included in the list are names taken from Irish legend, hagiography, and sometimes actual history.


What actually strikes me about the myth is that it is yet another classic example of the hero who must go away on adventure so as to over come terrible dark forces by undertaking a series of impossible tasks to win the beautiful princess who is held thrall by a terrible monster ... think Perseus, think Theseus, Think Jason, etc... strong hints of Hercules and Gilgamesh as well..

Despite the detailed surviving translation the text itself has clearly only partially survived but the forty tasks are well worth a read alone (the second 20 detailing the tasks/tools/masters required to take down the Boar king comet) - a lot of mythic code embedded in them.

However the story of the hunt appears to have come down to us entire (see below) and is fundamentally the story of the path/battle of a great 'Boar' comet and its 7 'piglet' sons vs other celestial rivals) with specific geographical/topographical description of its journey/path, mapped onto the Welsh, Irish and English landscape - culminating in it crashing into the River Severn and 'dying (or perhaps passing over the horizon for good into the great 'sea' of the sky/the underworld below.

Its a great read full of amazing detail, some of it very obvious in interpretation to comet watchers. I'll post the full tale in the following to stop this from being too long a single item:
 
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Culhwch and Olwen


THE BOAR HUNT

After that, Arthur went over to Brittany with Mabon son of Mellt and Gware Gwallt Euryn to seek the two dogs of Glythfyr Ledewig. After getting them, Arthur went over to the West of Ireland to look for Gwrgi Seferi and Odgar son of Aedd King of Ireland along with him. From there Arthur went to the North and caught Cyledyr Wyllt and went to seek Ysgithrwyn Pen Baedd. And Mabon son of Mellt went with the two dogs of Glythfyr Ledewig in his hand, and Drudwyn the whelp of Graid son of Eri. And Arthur himself went to the hunt with the dog Cafall in his hand. And Caw of Pryden mounted Lamrei, Arthur's mare, rushing forward at the sound of the barking. And there Caw of Pryden picked up a hatchet and came at the boar with fierce brilliance, and split his head in two halves. And Caw took the tusk. It was not the dogs which Ysbaddaden had named which killed the boar, but Cafall the dog of Arthur instead.

And after the killing of Ysgithrwyn Pen Baedd, Arthur came with his host over to Celli Wig in Cornwall. And from there he sent Menw son of Teirgwaedd to see if there were treasures between the ears of Twrch Trwyth, as it would have been so demeaning to go and get into a fight with him if he did not have the treasures. It was certain, though, that he was there: a third of Ireland had been destroyed by him. Menw went to seek them out. It was in Oerfel Ridge that he saw them in Ireland. And Menw transformed into the form of a bird, and landed over his lair, and tried to snatch on of the treasures from him. And he got nothing, however, apart from one of his bristles. This made him spring upin full fury, shaking himself so that some of his poison splashed onto him. From that Menw never fully recovered.
After that, Arthur sent a messenger to Odgar son of Aed king of Ireland to ask for the cauldron of Diwrnach Wyddel, his steward. He was asked by Odgar to give it.

Diwrnach said "God knows, [even] if he would prosper by seeing a single glimpse of it, he would not get that."

[So] the messenger came with a no from Ireland. Arthur set out with a light retinue and went in Prydwen his ship. They came to Ireland and made straight for the house of Diwrnach Wyddel. The retinue of Odgar saw took note of their strength. And after they had eaten and drunk their fill, Arthur asked for the cauldron. [Diwrnach] said that if he were to give it to anyone, he would have given it at the word of Odgar king of Ireland. After they were told no, Bedwyr got up and seized the cauldron, putting it on the back of Hygwydd, Arthur's servant (he was a half-brother on his mother's side to Cacamwri, Arthur's servant). It was his job to carry around Arthur's cauldron and light the fire beneath it. Caledfwlch was seized by Llenlleog Wyddel who swung it in a circle, killing Diwrnach Wyddel and his retinue entirely. The hosts of Ireland come and fight with them. And after all the hosts had fled, Arthur and his hosts went on board their ship right in front of them, and the cauldron full of the wealth of Ireland with them. And they land at the house of Llwydeu son of Cel Coed in Dyfed, and Mesur-Y-Pair is there.

And then Arthur gathered all the armed men that there were in the three regions of Britain and its adjacent islands, and what there was in France and Brittany and Normany and the Summer Country, and what there was of prize dogs and famous horses. And he went with all those hosts over to Ireland, and there was great fear and trembling before him in Ireland. And after Arthur had landed in the country, the saints of Ireland came to him to ask his protection. And he gave them protection, and they gave him their blessings in return. The men of Ireland came over to Arthur and gave him food-tribute. [Then] Arthur came over to Oerfel Ridge in Ireland, to the place where Twrch Trwyth was, and his seven young pigs with him. Dogs were set loose on him from every side. That day until the evening the Irish fought with him, but still he laid waste to a fifth of Ireland. The next day the host of Arthur fought with him: they only got harm from him, and nothing good. On the third day Arthur himself fought with him for nine days and nine nights. He did not kill [any] of the pigs apart from one pigling. [Then] the men asked Arthur what was the origin of that swine.

He said "He was a king, and because of his sins God turned him into a swine."

Arthur sent Gwrhyr Gwalstawd Ieithoedd to parley with him. Gwrhyr went in the form of a bird, landing over the lair of him and his seven young pigs.

And Gwrhyr Gwalstawd Ieithoedd asked him "For the sake of the one who made you into this shape, if you can speak, I ask one of you to come to speak with Arthur."

Grugyn Gwrych Eraint - like wings of silver were all his bristles, the path he would follow through the wood and the meadow could be seen by the glitter of his bristles.

This was the answer which Grugyn gave: "By Him who made us in this shape, we will not do or say anything for Arthur. It was grievous enough what God has done to us, without you coming to fight with us."

"I tell you, Arthur [is only] fighting for the comb and the razor and the shears that are between the ears of the Twrch Trwyth."
Grugyn said "Until his life is taken, those treasures will not be taken. And tomorrow morning we will get up from here and go to Arthur's country, and we will make as much evil as we can there."

They set out on the sea towards Wales
, and Arthur went with his hosts and his horses and his dogs in Prydwen, and caught a brief glimpse of them. Twrch Trwyth landed at Porth Clais in Dyfed. Arthur came over to Mynyw that night. The next day Arthur was told they had gone past, and he caught up with him killing the cattle of Cynwas Cwrfagyl, and after killing the people and animals that were in Dau Gleddyf before Arthur's arrival.

When Arthur came, the Twrch Trwyth veered towards the Preseli Hills. Arthur came over there with the hosts of the world. Arthur sent his men to hunt: Eli and Trachmyr, and Drudwyn the whelp of Graid son of Eri in his own hand, with Gwarthegydd son of Caw [at] the other wing with the two dogs of Glythfyr Ledewig in his hand, and Bedwyr with Cafall in his hand. And the warriors ranged along both banks of the Nyfer. [Then] the three sons of Cledyf Difwlch arrived, men who had got great fame from killing Ysgithrwyn Pen Baedd. And then [the Twrch Trwyth] set out from Glyn Nyfer and came to Cwm Cerwyn, and there he stood at bay. And then he killed four of Arthur's warriors - Gwarthegydd son of Caw, Tarog Allt Clwyd, and Rheiddwn son of Eli Adfer and Isgofan Hael. And after killing those men he stood at bay before them, holding his ground, and he killed Gwydre son of Arthur and Garselyd Wyddel and Glew son of Ysgawd and Isgawyn son of Panon. And [the Twrch Twyth] himself was wounded there.

And the next day, as dawn was breaking, some of the men caught up with him. And then he killed Huandaw, Gogigwr and Penpingion, the three servants of Glewlwyd Gafaelfawr so that, God knows, there was not a servant in the world in his possession except Llaesgymyn himself, a man who was no use to anyone. And along with those he killed many of the men of the country and Gwylddyn Saer, Arthur's chief builder. And then Arthur caught up with him at Peuliniog, and then [the Twrch Trwyth] killed Madog son of Teithion, and Gwyn son of Tringad son of Neued, and Eiriawn Penlloran. And from there he went to Aber Tywi. And there he stood at bay before them, and then he killed Cynlas son of Cynan and Gwilhenin king of France. From there he went to Glyn Ystu[n], and then the men and dogs lost [track] of him.
Arthur summoned Gwyn son of Nudd to him, and asked him if he knew anything about Twrch Trwyth. He replied that he did not know [anything]. All the huntsmen went to hunt the pigs then, as far as Dyffryn Llychwr. And Grugyn Gwallt Eraint and Lwydog Gofyniad charged at them, and killed all the huntsmen so that not one of them escaped alive except one man. What Arthur did was come with his hosts over to where Grugyn and Llwydog were, and release all of the dogs that had been selected onto them. And because of the clamour and the barking that arose then, Twrch Trwyth came to defend them. From the time when they had come across the Irish Sea, he had not set eyes on them until now. He was set about by men and dogs, and he did his best to get away over to Mynydd Amanw, and then a pigling was killed from his pigs. And then it became a life-or-death struggle for him, and at that point Twrch Llawin died. And then another of his pigs was killed: Gwys was his name. From there he went to Dyffryn Amanw, and there Banw and Bennwic were killed. None of his pigs went from there with him alive except Grugyn Gwallt Eraint and Llwydog Gofynniad.

From that place they went over to Llwch Ewin, and Arthur caught up with him there. Then he stood at bay, and then he killed Echel Forddwyt Twll, and Arwyli Eil Gwyddog Gwyr, and many men and dogs besides. And they went from there to Llwch Tawy. Then Grugyn Gwrych Eraint separated from them and went from there to Din Tywi. And from there he went over to Ceredigion, along with Eli and Trachmyr and a multitude together with them. And he came to Garth Grugyn, and there Grugyn was killed in their midst, and he slew Rhuddfyw Rhys and many others along with him. And then Llwydog over to Ystrad Yw, and there the men of Llydawmet with him, and there he killed Hir Peissog, king of Llydaw, and Llygadrudd Emys and Gwrfoddw - uncles of Arthur, brothers of his mother. And there [Llywdog] himself was killed.

Then Twrch Trwyth went between the Tawy and Ewias.
The men of Cornwall and Devon were summoned to meet Arthur at the mouth of the Severn.

Before the warriors of this island, Arthur said "Twrch Trwyth has killed many of my men. By the might of men, he will not go into Cornwall while I live. I will not chase any further, but rather meet him here for a fight to the death. You do what you will."
The decision of their council was to send out a band of horsemen, [the] dogs of the Island with them, over to Ewias. And coming back from there to the Severn, [Twrch Trwyth] was then waylaid by the veteran warriors of this island, and he was driven by sheer force into the Severn. And Mabon son of Modron went with him on Gwyn Myngddwn, Gweddw's horse, into the Severn, with Gorau son of Custennin and Menw son of Teirgwaed, between Llyn Lliwan and Aber Gwy. And Arthur closed in on him, along with the warriors of Britain. Osla Gyllellfawr approached, with Manawydan son of Llŷy and Cacamwri, Arthur's servant, and Gwyngelli, and closed in on him. And first they seized hold of him by his feet, and [then] ducked him in the Severn, until it was washing over him. Mabon son of Modron spurred his steed from one side and got the razor from him; Cyledyr the Wild, on another steed, went for him from the other side of the Severn and took the shears from him. Before the comb could be taken from him, he got onto [dry] land with his feet, and as soon as he made landfall neither dog, nor man nor horse could keep up with him until he went into Cornwall. However much trouble had been got while trying to get those treasures, worse [still] was the trouble that was got trying to save two [of the] men from drowning. Cacamwri, as he was being pulled up, two millstones were pulling him [back] down into the depths. While Osla Gyllellfawr was running after the boar, his knife fell from its sheath and he lost it; and after that the sheath itself filled up with water. As he was being pulled up, it was pulling him [back] down into the depths.

Thereupon, Arthur went with his host until they caught up with him in Cornwall. The trouble that had been got before was child's play compared to the trouble that was got then while trying to get the comb. [But] from one trouble to another, the comb was [finally] got from him. And thereupon he was routed from Cornwall and driven right in to the sea. From then on, no-one ever knew where he went from there, along with Anet and Aethelm. And Arthur went thence to Celli Wig in Cornwall to bathe himself and cast off his weariness.
 
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