The Vegetarian Myth

Claus

Jedi Master
A week ago I accidentaly have eaten a bit of a tuna spread and my stomach begun to hurt mildly.
I havn't felt ready yet for that :P
But somehow I think I should start with not so processt food.
Oh and last time I havent tolled you that I eat eggs, so maby then I should start with chicken or something? 🙃
My wife toled me to start with a higher quality meat will be better than that one from the supermarket.
So I think she is right about that, but we only can get such quality next time when we will visit our relatives.
 

Ant22

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I understand, I am sorry for your digestive problems.
Otherwise I think it is a simple difference in approach, after all Claus was wondering how to go back. Between veganism and vegetarianism (low grain, basically raw even) I spent more than 20 years of my life. Being well. And it was never a sacred cow. Traveling a lot, in places where I couldn't choose what to eat, I always adapted, and before I left. So my personal focus is on flexibility in the system, with a little extra attention to parasites. A pizza has never killed me or caused problems. I've been on a keto diet in the winter and paleo in the summer for a few years now. And pizza, if it happens, continues not to kill me or cause me problems. I'm not exactly a hunter (for now at least, I buy the meat that I eat ) but I'm certainly a gatherer. Practically all the vegetables I eat I find in the meadows. And the only fruit I eat is what I pluck off the branches in the warm season.

Your experience does not invalidate mine, neither does mine invalidate yours. As has been pointed out in this thread a few times, there are people who do in fact do well as vegans, but they are a small minority. A vast majority of people do not do well on a meat-free diet long term and most indicate health issues as a reason they returned to eating meat. This includes celebrities, so it's not just a rumour I heard. It also explains why according to a study 84% of vegans and vegetarians return to eating meat. This number seems quite accurate in my own milieu: I know plenty of ex vegans but only a few current ones. And although they always say they're doing great on their vegan diet, with depression and mood swings being very common alongside physical symptoms.

It has also been noted that some people can eat pretty much anything and never experience any negative symptoms, physical or mental. At least not when they're young, I'd say there's a reason why people's health starts to deteriorate quite rapidly around 50 pretty much as a rule.

All in all, many members here, myself included, are former vegans and vegetarians and so far those who returned to eating meat report feeling better. So although you may in fact be doing outstandingly well on a vegan diet you are an exception to the rule. And the rule is that most people do much better on meat and fat based diets.
 

Ant22

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
A week ago I accidentaly have eaten a bit of a tuna spread and my stomach begun to hurt mildly.
I havn't felt ready yet for that :P
But somehow I think I should start with not so processt food.
Oh and last time I havent tolled you that I eat eggs, so maby then I should start with chicken or something? 🙃
My wife toled me to start with a higher quality meat will be better than that one from the supermarket.
So I think she is right about that, but we only can get such quality next time when we will visit our relatives.

As I said in my previous reply, you may need to add digestive enzymes to your diet while you transition. Over the years your body's ability to digest meat has deteriorated, something that's often linked to excess copper that many vegetarians / vegans develop as a result of not enough zinc in their diets (zinc mostly comes from meat).

Also, you may want to consider joining a support group for ex-vegans, here's a FB one I can recommend: Restoration health: Recovery group for former vegans and vegetarians | Facebook

Members there have either gone through transition and now advise others, or they're still going through it. All in all it's a useful source of information. Apparently it was created by Shawn Baker.
 
A week ago I accidentaly have eaten a bit of a tuna spread and my stomach begun to hurt mildly.
I havn't felt ready yet for that :P
But somehow I think I should start with not so processt food.
Oh and last time I havent tolled you that I eat eggs, so maby then I should start with chicken or something? 🙃
My wife toled me to start with a higher quality meat will be better than that one from the supermarket.
So I think she is right about that, but we only can get such quality next time when we will visit our relatives.
Minority report. maybe I'm wrong. but it seems to me that you have not yet made a decision about resetting your diet. as if the need/desire/curiosity is still at the wave level (it's there but I don't know where and when) and not at the particle level (it's here and now). There is nothing wrong with that. After all, the planetary aspect of the soul here does experiments, from the smallest things to the biggest, and each individual configuration has its own times and spaces for decanting evaluation and decision-making. As I have already told you, perhaps a bit too much between the lines, as I see it, it is in any case always better to travel light. sometimes changes come unexpectedly, and if you are weighed down by "old junk" it becomes more difficult to adapt to the new. Personally, even as a vegetarian or vegan, I have always been full fat and low grains. High Grains (and sugar) make us dull. and slow and stuck in the routine (and it's nothing new, to put it quaintly with historical hygienists, they produce "glue" which causes bugs to proliferate out of balance and traps cellular wastes and toxins preventing their normal evacuation) . If you put their consumption boom in historical context, you will see that they are related to control mechanisms. So I suggested you get rid of this "glue," also because in respect of internal decision-making processes, the dissolution of brain fog allows us to shorten the time of acting out.
 

Claus

Jedi Master
You are right @fifty_five, I was and am not commitet enough now, but, this week I tried to eat a mini pizza with ham pices on it.
And just bekaus I wantet to know, I have done this without digestive enzymes.
I felt kompletely normal aufterwards. So maybe it was because of the small ammount, but if that is the case, than it sould be possible for me to start with small ammounts and add more in stepps.
So we will see, I will report 😁
 

Michael B-C

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member

What I can't get my head around is how the media covering this trial has had no problem amplifying and headlining that it was essentially her vegan ideology that was on trial here - and found guilty. They have no problem burying race issues when it comes to crime patterns or terror events yet here is one of the systems favourite promotional fabrications being openly trashed, especially as the first defendant put on trial was the mother not the father. It also makes me wonder because I'm sure she is not the first vegan fanatic to seek to brink up her infants this way, but I can only recollect one other such incident going to trial in the past decade and you don't hear about other deaths publicized in this manner - assuming it happens more commonly than is known on the basis that such an absolute diet would place any human infant's health at risk. Maybe I'm missing something?
 

Laurs

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
Hopefully this will set a precedent for other reckless parents out there, at least in Florida, who force feed their babies and little kids on vegan diets and the like.

In Europe, in 2016 in Italy, politician Elvira Savino, a member of Berlusconi´s party at that time, proposed a bill making it possible to punish “reckless” vegan parents with jail time for raising their children on restrictive diets. This was based on some cases coming to light where children were hospitalized with malnutrition.

Everybody and his dog fell over her and it goes without saying that the bill didn´t make it into law. The reason, as i understand, was that the door would be open for stigmatizing other parents — those who have overweight children for instance. So parents must not be made to feel bad, nothing to do with protecting the health of vulnerable little kids. Where have we heard that before?

Some cases i found in Europe go to show that there really is not much legal punishment for severely abusing/causing death of your children in this way.

In 2019 in Sweden an 18 month old baby almost died after having been force fed a vegan diet by her parents. Doctors said if the baby had been brought to hospital only hours later, she would have been dead. Prosecutors asked for 3 years in jail on the basis of ´severe neglect´and putting the child in ´life-threatening situation´. They got 3 months in jail and the child went to a foster home. The parents had very strange views of reality, according to the judge, but had had no harmful intent toward her.

In 2017, a Belgian court "convicted" parents with the minimum of 6 months suspended, over the death of their 7 month old baby who died of malnutrition and dehydration with organs shrunk to half their size and without any fat around them. Imagine that! Judge Mieke Butstraen said the demise of the baby was “the result of the systematic offer of food that was not suitable.” But, in the opinion of the judge their sentence of 6 months suspended was more than enough, because “It is clear that the defendants have already been severely punished because they need to proceed with life in the knowledge that they are responsible for the death of their son, who they truly loved,” Butstraen said.

In Australia, parents avoided jail but got 300 hours of community service after their toddler was so malnourished that her bones fractured and teeth fell out.

Unlike the Florida court, the states featured above certainly do not seem to take their role as protector of the vulnerable minors very seriously when parents frightfully fall short.
 

Magnolia

Jedi
Where's the logic in this? Destroy animal farming, reduce animal feed availability via a multiplicity of methods, burn down meat processing plants, propose meat taxes, tell farmers to eliminate 30% of their herds, promote plant-based "foods," inform the public they will have to give up meat and eat ground up cricket exoskeletons and dead bugs instead, indoctrinate people that meat causes heart disease and animal fats will kill you, etc., etc. So, you follow their advice with your children (who will be devoid of meat under their "utopian" plant-based vision anyway) and you get thrown in jail.
“How many fingers am I holding up, Winston?”
 

Il Matto

Jedi
"Grenoble: in school canteens, only vegetarian dishes will be offered to students by the town hall led by the Green Party, it will be necessary to make an explicit request to eat meat"
And no doubt that those who are sensible enough to request the meat will be vilified in some way. That aggressive imposition of ridiculous ideologies should become part of the school system is very sad, but really not surprising.
 
Top Bottom