Travel vaccines for unvaccinated adult? HELP!

Skyfarmr

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
I posted in the vaccine thread about an hour ago, but noticed that with the new forum, unless you uncheck in the drop-down menu under "what's new", read threads won't display. I'm not sure everyone has caught this new feature; I realized when trying to go back to my post and didn't find in the recents/What's New.
This subject is a matter of urgency for someone in my family, OSIT, so I decided to start new thread in hopes that more members will see this and can reply.
My 23 yo son is traveling to Rwanda in a couple of months for educational purposes. He has been un-vaccinated since birth, a choice that came with a lot of education on how to keep himself healthy and learn natural remedies, something he has embraced, fortunately. He did receive a tetanus shot after losing a battle with a planer/edger last summer. (He's lucky he didn't lose his finger!)

Now that he is traveling abroad, I'm kind of freaking out about all the vaccines that the school is requiring, or at least strongly suggesting that he would need to receive in a very short amount of time. He may choose to waive the vaccines, but Rwanda can apparently use their discretion about allowing him into the country if he doesn't have proof of receiving the yellow fever vaccine, at the very least. It seems that the program coordinator is assuming his childhood vaccines are up to date, when they aren't.

And then there's the issue of him re-entering the US if he remains un-vaxxed, should he happen to pick up something a vaccine is available for.

He has been on the iodine protocol for a few months, and convinced him that a small bottle of Lugol's will go a long way at avoiding some of the nasty pathogens that there are no vaccines for.

Does anyone have any suggestions, experience or at the very least, some reassurance, for this situation?
Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
 

loreta

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I just can give you one advice because I lived the experience when I went to Africa: if it is possible no Hepatitis B vaccine, a very dangerous one that gave MS to my husband. And he is not the only one. But I think this vaccine is not necessary to enter Rwanda. Very important not to have sexual relations with natives, . always drink bottle water and also take everyday one pill of activated charcoal. The Activated charcoal is fantastic and protect against bacteria. I started to take it one week before going there. Really I am not experience to give advice of any kind concerning the Yellow fever, but I just read in a Canadian government page that the risk to contract the Yellow fever in Rwanda is low. But surely a more experience member of the forum will be able to answer to your doubt. I think that your son is protected and strong because he is not vaccinated of any kind. If he takes care and is prudent everything will be ok.

When you travel the schools and government always push the idea of vaccines, make fear about how dangerous is to travel in these countries. But the reality in some countries is different, it is just very important to take care of what we do, always drink bottle water, take Activated charcoal, and be present, prudent. Here is the Canadian page that give some information about to travel to Rwanda.
_https://travel.gc.ca/destinations/rwanda

Good luck and good travel for your son! He is lucky to go to Africa!
 

aragorn

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Do you know what kind of proof is required to convince the authorities in both countries? Do you need a signed document by a doctor or something? A good and open minded doctor might help you to decide on the issue, and provide you with the paper work. However, that kind of doctor is probably very hard to find.
 

BHelmet

Jedi Master
I used to be a travel agent for a big student exchange company. What can I offer? It is wise not to eat anything washed in the water you would not drink that is not also cooked (like salad or strawberries and I know the tomatoes in India can 'get you' for that reason).

It looks like there is no yellow fever requirement unless coming from an infected area but you should verify that yourself. My kids are pretty much "organic" when it comes to vaccines. I always tried to keep a low profile and not bring attention to me or my kids. I would not say "HEY!! I have not vaccinated my son...You got a problem with that???" You are wandering through a maze of petty tyrants. Whenever I was forth-righteous and engaging the bureaucrats by asking questions and trying to be above board, I had a major crusade on my hands. Finally I started playing dumb and things went much easier. ("Gee, my dog ate my vaccine records....") In other words: Don't make waves on purpose if you don't want to be noticed. I know that sounds sleazy. I guess it all depends on your relationship with the universe.

The bottom line is that you and your son are taking responsibility for your own health and making choices that you believe in. It is an adventure. And this world is fraught with uncertainty. And risks. Who knows what might happen? At a certain point in the process, no amount of advice one way or the other really matters. It is a choice you have to be willing to make and be responsible for (come what may).
 

Konstantin

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Sorry to hear that you are in such situation Skyfarm. To be honest I don't know how you can avoid all those vaccines for your son.
There must be some way to avoid at least some of them and as BHelmet said, try not to make waves and to get attention.

In the end, if he is unfortunately forced to get some shots, there are some protocols and medications that can help.
A few years ago even my homeopath recommended this method for my son if I have to take him to get some shots. Lucky for us we never have to use this method so far.
-www.post-vaccination-syndrome.com/3895/prevention.aspx
Also, I think that I read in the vaccines thread that large doses of Vit C can help the body to detox more quickly and more efficiently from vaccines.

I haven't tried any of this by myself. I am just giving you some choices that you can think about if you find in a situation where he will be forced to get some shots.

I hope the this will end without to much trouble for you.
Take care
 

loreta

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
You can also take Homeopathy before and after taking a vaccine, in case he takes one . Thuya occidentalis, 9CH, Silicea 15 CH. 3 days before, 3 days after, 5 granules by day.

I agree with Bhelmet. We are responsible of our health and our decisions. We can make mistakes. But the final decision is ours. And always be prudent, be wise and try to see the 2 sides of a situation. Knowledge protects, as you know.

Take care!
 

Mari

Padawan Learner
Hi,

Here is the thread with some advice in case you have to vaccinate your child
Forced to vaccinate 2 year old - how to reduce risks?
In short what was discussed for preventive and reducing of the damage is: large amount of Vit.C, Homeopathic Remedy Thuja 30c and iodine.

I know that trip to Rwanda is not a small issue.
So, yes, do a really big research on diseases and vaccines and perhaps see what is going on in neighbor countries because Rwanda is very small comparing to Kongo, Tanzania and Kenya.

This reminds me of a similar thread where it was discussed whether to have some hard antibiotics or not.
Antibiotics - to take or not to take
I know this is not the same issue, but in the end, we are not talking here whether to vaccinate 6 months old child with unnecessary vaccinations.

Nobody can tell you whether you should or shouldn´t vaccinate your child.
It is a hard decision, especially because now we are talking about a country where some diseases are very much alive and active and the same are not in other parts of the world because there you have a cure and in Rwanda you don´t or is hard to get. So I hope this helps in case you decide to do partial vaccination.

Hope it all ends perfect for you and your child. :-)
 

Ant22

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Hi Skyfarmr, I can see the FOTCM logo under your avatar so you must be a member of the FOTCM church. What about your son? Is he a member in good standing?

If he is, there are sections in the Statement of Principles that may help him refuse to get vaccinated on religious grounds:

https://paleochristianity.org/documents/FOTCM_Statement_of_Principles.pdf

In constant struggle with ourselves, we strive towards the Good, towards understanding and serving others on the ascending way. But just as water must be cleansed of toxins in order to sustain life, the mind, body, and spirit must be cleansed in order to align with the forces of Creation. On the level of the mind, these toxins include false ideas and beliefs, which are countered by discernment and critical thought. On the level of the body, these toxins enter the body through various impure or injurious foods, pharmaceuticals (which includes certain vaccines), and environmental toxins, and must be cleansed by a process of proper diet, detoxification and by diminishing as far as is possible their entry into the body.
We recognize that PaleoChristianity is founded on Free Will and the elimination of physical, psychological, and spiritual toxins from our bodies, communities, and souls. As such, we recognize our right to be exempt from compulsory, impure and/or injurious vaccinations and/or medications (see 6.1. On the Law of Exclusion)
However, this does not solve the problem of the Rwandan government reserving their right to refuse to let him enter the country - or the US government making reentry problematic if he does catch something there is a vaccine for.

He does take iodine so a lot of those toxins will be removed. But he may experience unpleasant detox symptoms after he receives a vaccine due to an increased amount of toxins in the system.

Going to Rwanda seems to be a great opportunity in terms of experience but personally I would chose not to go. The price is simply way too high. We're all different of course and your son may decide that the price is worth it.

I hope someone here does know a way to avoid vaccines and travelling limitations and will be able to assist you!
 

Skyfarmr

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
Thank you loreta, Constantin, Ant22, Mari and BHelmut for your thoughtful replies. Since posting, I learned some of the suggestions have been considered and even my son's program coordinator mentioned drinking only bottled water and avoiding "street food" and taking the "anti-malarial pill"...someone from last year's program contracted malaria, which was resolved with treatment.

Something I neglected to include is that he'll be in the capital city of Kigali for about a month, learning how to diagnose/repair medical equipment, then sent out to rural community hospitals for on the job training, from what I understand. The fact that he'll be working around sick people, not directly, but definitly in an environment where exposure to pathogens is possibly greater, OSIT, adds even more importance on prophylaxis...
(why he can't get this sort of training in the US is still confusing to me; raise any red flags for anyone out there?)

The bottom line is that you and your son are taking responsibility for your own health and making choices that you believe in. It is an adventure. And this world is fraught with uncertainty. And risks. Who knows what might happen? At a certain point in the process, no amount of advice one way or the other really matters. It is a choice you have to be willing to make and be responsible for (come what may).
And that's it in a nutshell, BHelmet. My son is my youngest, and most adventurous (he's an avid Hobbit/Lord of the Rings fan) but also self-aware and inquisitive. For example, I found out last Winter that he was seeing his school's psych counselor about depression for two years! The only reason I found out is because his counselor called about putting him on anti-depressants and said my son was concerned about "hurting my feelings" because he knew how opposed I was to medication. What I told her was that I thought it would be more prudent to make sure he wasn't feeling the affects of SAD(seasonal affective disorder), or a nutritional deficiency, you know, ruling out corrective issues first. Then, after talking to son, he agreed to try blue-blocking glasses for evening screen time, using a "happy"light in morning, taking Vit D/getting more sun... suggestions I thought his student life could easily include. Since then, he has taken it even further by changing his diet to what sounds like a modified ketogenic diet... no wheat, sugar, carbs, more healthy fats, etc. Since then, my husband and I have noticed a big difference in his voice and attitude when talking on phone and he says his concentration and focus have greatly improved.

I realize this is going a bit off-topic, but wanted to give a little scope into his character and diet. Personally, I was impressed with his fortitude for recognizing that something was off and sought help. So many young adults look toward other health robbing coping methods.

Sorry to hear that you are in such situation Skyfarm. To be honest I don't know how you can avoid all those vaccines for your son.
There must be some way to avoid at least some of them and as BHelmet said, try not to make waves and to get attention.

In the end, if he is unfortunately forced to get some shots, there are some protocols and medications that can help.
A few years ago even my homeopath recommended this method for my son if I have to take him to get some shots. Lucky for us we never have to use this method so far.
-www.post-vaccination-syndrome.com/3895/prevention.aspx
Also, I think that I read in the vaccines thread that large doses of Vit C can help the body to detox more quickly and more efficiently from vaccines.

I haven't tried any of this by myself. I am just giving you some choices that you can think about if you find in a situation where he will be forced to get some shots.

I hope the this will end without to much trouble for you.
Take care
Thought of this, but I'm not experienced with using homeopathics, mostly because I smoke and read that nicotine nullifies homeopathics. Maybe that's wrong, but figured i wasn't going to waste the money. I have read "The Field", by Lynne McTaggart and understand the fascinating science behind it. My son doesn't smoke, so would be a great option for him, especially since those bottles are very small and easily portable for air travel. Any recommendations on manufacturers? Our co-op carries Boiron homeos, not sure of their efficacy, though. Following the pre- and post-vaccination recommendations should help with some of concerns about reactions; my biggest concern was how many he may have to receive in such a short amount of time, so homeopathics should definitely be on the menu. Thank you for sharing the link, Konstatin; I'll pass it along to him.

Hi Skyfarmr, I can see the FOTCM logo under your avatar so you must be a member of the FOTCM church. What about your son? Is he a member in good standing?

[.snip..]
Going to Rwanda seems to be a great opportunity in terms of experience but personally I would chose not to go. The price is simply way too high. We're all different of course and your son may decide that the price is worth it.
No, he isn't a member, but I feel he would be a wonderful candidate. We didn't raise our children within a specific religion, but he has the character hallmarks of a PaleoChristian and a healthy dose of curiosity.

Personally, I wouldn't go to Rwanda either, and the "price" is high, not just from the vaccination aspect either. Was just discussing these topics with a long time friend. She freaked out and proceeded to tell me of how her friend's husband, a doctor, was over in Rwanda as a member of volunteer medical team. They were supposed to depart for home this past Friday (Good Friday) when there was a siege on the airport. She wasn't sure of the reason for the siege, but apparently it was a very stressful weekend for all involved, and while her friend's husband finally made it home safe and sound, his arrival home had been delayed a couple of days. Needless to say, they were definitely rattled by the events, and admit that was my first concern when my son first told me about this "educational opportunity". Most people have heard of the Rwandan genocide (1994) and apparently, there are still situations, to put it lightly, that flare up from time to time. So timing of these skirmishes, should they arise, is going to be an unknown risk of a different nature.

I do realize that all I am able to do is provide as much information as I can to help him prepare for things he may not have considered to help minimize harm and risk. And then hope and pray a LOT that he makes smart choices and stays out of harm's way.

Thank you again to all for your valuable contributions to this concern.
 

Skyfarmr

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
Do you know what kind of proof is required to convince the authorities in both countries? Do you need a signed document by a doctor or something? A good and open minded doctor might help you to decide on the issue, and provide you with the paper work. However, that kind of doctor is probably very hard to find.
Still checking all that out. We found a "travel clinic" close to where he is attending school in Milwaukee. According to the person I talked to, he goes in with his ID, they do a search for immunization records, cross it with where he is traveling to, including any layovers, and they get the results with the shots he needs. From what I could tell, this is the only nearby clinic where yellow fever vaccine is dispensed to travelers. Apparently, there is a shortage of it so it's only given to travelers going to known countries with history of yellow fever outbreaks. With that much information on hand, I would assume that they provide the appropriate travel docs for immunization.

Here in Wisconsin, I've never had big issue with waiving immunizations for the kids. We have religious and personal conviction exemptions, but still got plenty of lectures from bot-docs. But this situation?...did not see this coming. This is more about WHO/CDC policies. US Embassy in Rwanda has some more current information regarding this issue. It was on their site that mentioned Rwanda's right to refuse entry for lack of immunization, or proof of same.

Isn't that interesting though? A database that's keeping track of those who are immunized, and those who are not (by default).
Wouldn't surprise me at all if a global data base for the immunized were in the works.
 

hlat

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I think one of the basic principles is that we can only help people if they are asking for help and that we have to respect the free will of others. As applied to your adult son, has he asked you for help or advice regarding vaccines and travel to Rwanda? Maybe he should register on the forum and ask the question himself?

Aside from vaccines, I would research the public safety and personal safety aspects of going to Rwanda. My default is not to go unless research showed it is safe. I don't want to go there and then learn it is not safe.
 

Keyhole

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
If he is forced to get the vaccine, I would probably do the following:

Large dose liposomal vitamin C BEFORE and AFTER the shot - 15-20g doses
High dose NAC - 5-10g before and after
Liposomal glutathione before and after
Milk thistle before and after
MSM 2-5g before and after
Iodine 5 drops of 12.5mg solution the morning of the shot
R-Alpha Lipoic Acid before and after
PQQ and CoQ10
Perhaps even some Vitamin E - maybe 100mg

Consider Activated charcoal and bentonite clay taken in the evening of the day the vaccine was administered.

The above is extensive, and some might say I was overdoing it. However, when there are vaccinations involved, I think there should always be a "no messing around" policy! Better to load up on antioxidants and face the potential consequences of that than to deal with metal toxicity further down the line.
 

Skyfarmr

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
I think one of the basic principles is that we can only help people if they are asking for help and that we have to respect the free will of others. As applied to your adult son, has he asked you for help or advice regarding vaccines and travel to Rwanda? Maybe he should register on the forum and ask the question himself?
Hlat, thank you for your reply, and I understand abridging the free will of people and have learned from experience the importance of asking for help.
However, my son didn't make the choice to waive vaccines as a child, I did, so there's a sense of responsibility for his health in THIS respect. This travel situation IS forcing him to look in to it for himself, and if he had the time apart from his studies to get up to speed on the vaccine issue in the next few weeks, I'd take a step back and wait for the asking part. Even so, we have the most useful tool for learning, the internet, yet we on the forum know how fraught with confusing disinformation it can be, as well. I don't think that mentoring my son's health decisions regarding the VAST subject of vaccines, is not disrespecting his free will. . .it's taking responsibility for mine and the choice I made 23 years ago for him. Until he learns more about it, I'm his teacher, and a good teacher encourages and inspires the student to ask questions.
Is suggesting to him the questions he should be asking interfering with free will?
In the meantime, this teacher needs to brush up on the answers, cause this is unfamiliar territory.

As far as him coming on this forum to ask his own questions? He has the free will to do so ;-)
 
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