Woman in a mental institution

Persej

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I had another interesting dream.

In the dream I had a brother, and me and him were owners of some kind of mental institution. But he was the one who was really running things there.

And in the dream I was in the tour of that institution, but I didn't like it at all. I was thinking how I don't want to be in the proximity of all those crazy people.

But then I stumbled upon a woman who was watching something on a TV and could understand a Russian language. And I was thinking how that woman cannot be completely mad because she knows Russian. I decided to speak with hear to see how crazy she was. And I was surprised to see that she is actually a very intelligent person, but that she just has some mental problems.

So I looked at my brother at told him that I was wrong, and that I understand now why he wants to help those people. Then I looked at this woman and told her that I will do my best to help her but that she will have to allow me to experiment with different things, like changing her diet and things like that. She agreed and then I woke up.
 

Persej

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Interesting thing happened yesterday, just one day after the dream.

I was outside the doctor's office when a young man exited from the doctor's office looking like he doesn't know where he is. He was looking at the paper that doctor gave him and he didn't know what to do.

Right away I saw that he is not completely normal. He approached one couple and asked them what he should do now. They looked at the paper and told him that he should go to his GP with that paper. And he said to them: "But I never had a GP".

It was obvious that he doesn't even know how the health system works. The couple looked at each other and realized that they are not dealing with the normal person. He looked at them for some more time and then walked away.

I was also observing my emotions at that time. I could clearly feel the running of a certain program inside me that was telling me to stay away from people like him because I saw that he was not quite a normal person.

And that actually can be a very useful program because you can run into a lot of strange people in a big city so you must learn how to spot them very fast and how to avoid them so them you won't get into some trouble.

But maybe that dream was telling me that I should be more attentive to what I'm observing so that I don't misjudge some people just because they don't behave quite normal on the surface.
 

Chu

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FOTCM Member
Persej said:
But maybe that dream was telling me that I should be more attentive to what I'm observing so that I don't misjudge some people just because they don't behave quite normal on the surface.

Yes, maybe. In this case, I think I would have gone to the secretary or knocked on the doctor's office to get him to give him more directions. From your account, that man wasn't really doing anything bad. He was lost. I think it's good to help in situations like that. But that's just my opinion. It depends on many factors.

And many "crazies" in this world get that bad because reality is tough, I think. Maybe they see too much? Not all of them, for sure.

It reminds me of my ex-boss's son. I was working at a language school at the time, and he was one of my students, a very normal and intelligent guy, with no apparent "issues". One day he came to class and started talking about "ducks he had seen in the street", and how there were "evil people in the world", and how "everything is going to be alright after the ducks leave". I'll never forget him. He was sent to a psychiatric institution overnight. The thing is, I had known him to be pretty insightful, intelligent, critical about the world, rational. I always wondered WHAT had made him switch like that. His parents told me they couldn't understand either, other than he used to take life very seriously. So, when I see a "crazy" person, I think about him.

You may want to read Operators and Things, and I never promised you a Rose Garden, if you are interested. Those "crazy" people can sometimes describe our reality as being surprisingly similar to what we suspect already thanks to the Cs and Laura's research. It was just too much for them to handle, I guess.
 

RedFox

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Chu said:
You may want to read Operators and Things, and I never promised you a Rose Garden, if you are interested. Those "crazy" people can sometimes describe our reality as being surprisingly similar to what we suspect already thanks to the Cs and Laura's research. It was just too much for them to handle, I guess.

This might be a useful reminder (especially considering the dream mentioning diet).

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,24722.0.html
Q: (L) Okay. What's the next question? (Psyche) We were checking some statistics and we realized that full siblings of schizophrenics are nine times more likely than the general population to have schizophrenia, and four times more likely to have bipolar disorder. Is {name redacted} affected by this genetic tendency?

A: Oh indeed! However this requires explanation. First of all, the genetics that are associated with schizophrenia can be either a doorway or a barrier. Second, the manifestation of schizophrenia can take non-ordinary pathways. That is to say that diet can activate the pathway without the concomitant benefits.

Q: (Burma) I think that they're saying that schizophrenia could essentially be a way to be open to seeing other aspects of reality but diet can make it so it basically just makes you crazy without actually seeing anything.

A: Primitive societies that eat according to the normal diet for human beings do not have "schizophrenics", but they do have shamans who can "see".

Q: (Perceval) So a schizophrenic on animal fat is a shaman. (L) Well, wait a minute. There's something real subtle here. What I think you're saying is that when these genetic pathways are activated through wrong diet, it screws up the shamanic capacity?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) So, schizophrenia as we understand it or have witnessed it is a screw-up of something that could or might manifest in a completely different way on a different diet? Is that it?

A: Yes

Q: (L) And that's what you meant by not only a doorway, but also a barrier because the person who is on the wrong diet and has schizophrenia is barred from being able to be a bridge between the worlds. They kind of get lost. They're barred from having a normal life, and they're also barred from coming back from their delusions or whatever they're seeing even if they're not delusions. Maybe they’re seeing, but they're unable to help or do anything.
 

Oxajil

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Thanks for sharing Persej.

Chu said:
And many "crazies" in this world get that bad because reality is tough, I think. Maybe they see too much? Not all of them, for sure.

It reminds me of my ex-boss's son. I was working at a language school at the time, and he was one of my students, a very normal and intelligent guy, with no apparent "issues". One day he came to class and started talking about "ducks he had seen in the street", and how there were "evil people in the world", and how "everything is going to be alright after the ducks leave". I'll never forget him. He was sent to a psychiatric institution overnight. The thing is, I had known him to be pretty insightful, intelligent, critical about the world, rational. I always wondered WHAT had made him switch like that. His parents told me they couldn't understand either, other than he used to take life very seriously. So, when I see a "crazy" person, I think about him.

At the store I work at, I sometimes meet people who voice their frustrations about the governments' actions in different ways. Some people would look at them in a strange manner, as if they're ''crazies'', but I think, like you said, reality is tough, and they know something isn't right. I always try to be a listening ear, but of course within limits. I'm reminded of a passage from Political Ponerology, in which Łobaczewski describes how he helped treat a woman who raised her children with an iron fist (in an unhealthy manner). It is interesting how growing up in a ponerized society influences us in different ways, but also sad in a way. It's also interesting I think how Łobaczewski's way of treating this particular patient with explanations of why things are the way they are, using data, helps a lot with becoming more ''sane'' in an insane world. I wonder if this same treatment could also be helpful to people who may show some crazy/unusual behavior.

Political Ponerology said:
In countries subjected to pathocratic rule, this knowledge and language, especially human experience, create a mediating concatenation in such a way that most people could assimilate this objective description of the phenomenon without major difficulties with the help of active apperception. Difficulties will only be encountered by the oldest generation and a certain proportion of young people raised in the system from childhood, and these are psychologically understandable.

I was once referred a patient who had been an inmate in a Nazi concentration camp. She came back from that hell in such exceptionally good condition that she was able to marry and bear three children. However, her child rearing methods were so extremely iron-fisted as to be reminiscent of the concentration camp life so stubbornly persevering in former prisoners. The children’s reaction was neurotic protest and aggressiveness against other children.

During the mother’s psychotherapy, we recalled the figures of male and female SS officers to her mind, pointing out their psychopathic characteristics (such people were primary recruits). In order to help her eliminate their pathological material from her person, I furnished her with the approximate statistical data regarding the appearance of such individuals within the population as a whole. This helped her reach a more objective view of that reality and reestablish trust in the society of normal people.

During the next visit, the patient showed to me a little card on which she had written the names of local pathocratic notables and added her own diagnoses, which were largely correct. So I made a hushing gesture with my finger and admonished her with emphasis that we were dealing only with her problems. The patient understood and, I am sure, she did not make her reflections on the matter known in the wrong places.

Parallel to the development of practical knowledge and a language of insider communication, other psychological phenomena take form; they are truly significant in the transformation of social life under pathocratic rule, and discerning them is essential if one wishes to understand individuals and nations fated to live under such conditions and to evaluate the situation in the political sphere. They include people’s psychological immunization and their adaptation to life under such deviant conditions.

The methods of psychological terror (that specific pathocratic art), the techniques of pathological arrogance, and the striding roughshod into other people’s souls initially have such traumatic effects that people are deprived of their capacity for purposeful reaction; I have already adduced the psychophysiological aspects of such states. Ten or twenty years later, analogous behavior is already recognized as well known buffoonery and does not deprive the victim of his ability to think and react purposefully. His answers are usually well-thought-out strategies, issued from the position of a normal person’s superiority and often laced with ridicule. When Man can look suffering and even death in the eye with the required calm, a dangerous weapon falls out of the ruler’s hands.

We have to understand that this process of immunization is not merely a result of the above-described increase in practical knowledge of the macrosocial phenomenon. It is the effect of a many-layered, gradual process of growth in knowledge, familiarization with the phenomenon, creation of the appropriate reactive habits, and self-control, with an overall conception, and moral principles, being worked out in the meantime. After several years, the same stimuli which formerly caused chilly spiritual impotence or mental paralysis now provoke the desire to gargle with something strong so as to get rid of this filth.

There was a time when many people dreamed of finding some pill which would make it easier to endure dealing with the authorities or attending the forced indoctrination sessions generally chaired by a psychopathic character. Some antidepressants did in fact prove to have the desired effect. Twenty years later, this had been forgotten entirely.

Fwiw.
 

Persej

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Chu said:
In this case, I think I would have gone to the secretary or knocked on the doctor's office to get him to give him more directions. From your account, that man wasn't really doing anything bad. He was lost. I think it's good to help in situations like that. But that's just my opinion. It depends on many factors.

The moment I realized that something is wrong with him was when I saw that the doctor was escorting him from her office and telling him where to go for check-out. This doctor never did this for anyone else. When I realized that he doesn't even knows what a GP is, I was thinking how could I help him with some explanation and I concluded that I couldn't, and that I would have to go with him to his health centre to find him a GP. But that sounded like a too much responsibility for me.

He wasn't doing anything bad, he just looked really lost. He spent a lot of time in the doctor's office and she couldn't explain him what to do, then he went to the check-out desk and they also couldn't. He was really lost. But if he knew how to get here maybe somebody who sent him knows what to do next.

Another interesting thing is that another part of this building (the part where I was is the center for dermatology) is the mental institution. So maybe they sent him from there. That would explain why he "never had a GP".

And many "crazies" in this world get that bad because reality is tough, I think. Maybe they see too much? Not all of them, for sure.

Yes, some are born crazy, but some become "crazy" because of many negative outside factors. And this world certainly have a plenty of them.

It reminds me of my ex-boss's son. I was working at a language school at the time, and he was one of my students, a very normal and intelligent guy, with no apparent "issues". One day he came to class and started talking about "ducks he had seen in the street", and how there were "evil people in the world", and how "everything is going to be alright after the ducks leave". I'll never forget him. He was sent to a psychiatric institution overnight. The thing is, I had known him to be pretty insightful, intelligent, critical about the world, rational. I always wondered WHAT had made him switch like that. His parents told me they couldn't understand either, other than he used to take life very seriously. So, when I see a "crazy" person, I think about him.

Interesting. He seems to be in this second category of people who are born normal but something happened to them that they couldn't bear.

You may want to read Operators and Things, and I never promised you a Rose Garden, if you are interested.

Thank you Chu. I heard about the first one, but didn't know about the second. I would love to read them.

Those "crazy" people can sometimes describe our reality as being surprisingly similar to what we suspect already thanks to the Cs and Laura's research. It was just too much for them to handle, I guess.

Yes. Maybe that's why its better for us to not be able to see some things because who knows how would we react before we become ready for them. Maybe ability to see things comes naturally and something accidentally happened with those people before they were ready.

RedFox said:
This might be a useful reminder (especially considering the dream mentioning diet).

Yes, it could be the answer why many people become crazy overnight. Thank you RedFox.
 

ARC

Padawan Learner
Quote

"It reminds me of my ex-boss's son. I was working at a language school at the time, and he was one of my students, a very normal and intelligent guy, with no apparent "issues". One day he came to class and started talking about "ducks he had seen in the street", and how there were "evil people in the world", and how "everything is going to be alright after the ducks leave". I'll never forget him. He was sent to a psychiatric institution overnight. The thing is, I had known him to be pretty insightful, intelligent, critical about the world, rational. I always wondered WHAT had made him switch like that. His parents told me they couldn't understand either, other than he used to take life very seriously. So, when I see a "crazy" person, I think about him."

Sometimes when someone says things you don't understand it may not necessarily mean they're crazy or schizophrenic. I don't know if you've ever seen the movie "The Gift" with Cissy Spacek as a psychic spiritual adviser. One character, a young man called "Buddy" asked her if it was true that he would die if he stared into a "blue diamond". She didn't know what it meant but she tried to reassure the young man because he was clearly upset. She later found out that Buddy's father had a blue tattoo of a diamond on his navel area and he had molested Buddy when he was little.

It's actually a fairly common tactic for abusers to provide misinformation so that when a child victim tries to confide in an adult about the abuse, the adult is unable to perceive what the child is saying and recognize it as a cry for help. I heard of at least one victim who talked about a "turtle poking it's head out". That was what I thought of with regards to the "ducks in the street" and "evil people in the world".
 

Chu

Administrator
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ARC said:
Sometimes when someone says things you don't understand it may not necessarily mean they're crazy or schizophrenic. I don't know if you've ever seen the movie "The Gift" with Cissy Spacek as a psychic spiritual adviser. One character, a young man called "Buddy" asked her if it was true that he would die if he stared into a "blue diamond". She didn't know what it meant but she tried to reassure the young man because he was clearly upset. She later found out that Buddy's father had a blue tattoo of a diamond on his navel area and he had molested Buddy when he was little.

It's actually a fairly common tactic for abusers to provide misinformation so that when a child victim tries to confide in an adult about the abuse, the adult is unable to perceive what the child is saying and recognize it as a cry for help. I heard of at least one victim who talked about a "turtle poking it's head out". That was what I thought of with regards to the "ducks in the street" and "evil people in the world".

Yes, but if I understood you correctly, here you are talking about cases of personality fragmentation due to severe trauma (and we have several other threads about the topic. See here, here and here for examples of this. The possibilities are practically infinite depending on each individual and their internal makeup and life experiences). Vulnerable children who are abused develop dissociative states, or narratives to explain what is happening to them (interpretations not necessarily "provided" by the abuser), for the purpose of surviving. That causes serious damage in their psyche. So, indeed, they may not be schizophrenic, but they unfortunately have some kind of trauma and psychological issue as a consequence (but this is not really the subject being discussed in this thread).

In some cases, the trauma from childhood is buried and then manifested in strange ways much later in adulthood, or earlier. In others, I think that something else is at play, a combination of genetics and perhaps a "weak" internal structure that can fracture if the person sees too much at once, regardless of past trauma. We were discussing this type of hypothesis, as you can see in other people's replies.
 

Persej

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
This last session is also very interesting in the light of this topic:

Session Date: August 8th 2015

Q: (Tiffany) In the last session, you said that some people are resistant to parasitical manipulation or can compensate. What are the compensatory conditions that protect against parasitical infection?

A: Strong mind and will. Doesn't necessarily protect against infection, but allows for mental stability in spite of.

You could probably say that we all have some sort of parasitical or psychological problems inside of us, but some people do not have the mind that is strong enough to defend against such issues, and at one moment they just snap and they become what we call "crazy people".

If I didn't have a very strong mind and will to survive my years of nightmares I would probably also become one of them. And nobody would know what happened to me. And they would wonder the same way Chu wonders about her ex student.
 
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