Gold

[go2]

The planet has entered a period of monetary and economic collapse. The PTB intending a New World Order, probably a lot like the Old World Order, have arrived at the endgame of the collapse of the current world fiat money system. The slavemaster has two methods of control. Violence and lies. Naomi Klein's Shock Doctrine describes the transition from control by deception of fiat money, to a world wide qulug controlled by direct violence. It is likely nothing can be done to resist this collapse. The system is designed to self destruct, thereby robbing another generation of humanity of their energy and creativity. The destructive process is gaining speed as even those with little attention to economics and geopolitics must now realize. Most people have little knowledge of money, it history and function. Gold has an ancient role as an inflexible measure and store of capital. The websites I have linked and quoted are an advanced course in monetary science. The backwardization of gold on the Comex marks the flight of "smart money" out of promises to pay, to gold, the ancient store of wealth and capital that is no one's promise to pay. Fiat money's promise to pay is the lie of the economic control system. There is a battle on the STS food chain, and gold is one of the weapons being used. The sites and essays are maintained by men who have a vested interest in gold as money. I leave it to the moderators to determine whether the links should be hot. I have followed these writers for nearly a decade, as I began to look deeper into the nature of money and the world wide system of slavery fiat money enables. I also recommend Jacob Needleman's Money and The Meaning of Life for one interested in studying this subject. It is a little late in the day to study gold as money to escape the unrushing calamity, but there are lessons to be learned in the study of money on this savage planet.

http://www.honestmoneyreport.com/archives/2006/0319.php

Functions of Money:

1. Medium of exchange

2. Measure of value

3. Standard of value

4. Store of value

http://www.financialsense.com/editorials/fekete/2008/1205.html

December 2, 2008, was a landmark in the saga of the collapsing international monetary system, yet it did not deserve to be reported in the press: gold went to backwardation for the first time ever in history. The facts are as follows: on December 2nd, at the Comex in New York, December gold futures (last delivery: December 31) were quoted at 1.98% discount to spot, while February gold futures (last delivery: February 27, 2009) were quoted at 0.14% discount to spot. (All percentages annualized.) The condition got worse on December 3rd, when the corresponding figures were 2% and 0.29%. This means that the gold basis has turned negative, and the condition of backwardation persisted for at least 48 hours.

According to the December 3rd Comex delivery report, there are 11,759 notices to take delivery. This represents 1.1759 million ounces of gold, while the Comex-approved warehouses hold 2.9 million ounces. Thus 40% of the total amount will have to be delivered by December 31st. Since not all the gold in the warehouses is available for delivery, Comex supply of gold falls far short of the demand at present rates. Futures markets in gold are breaking down. Paper gold is progressively being discredited.

The gold basis is the difference between the futures and the cash price of gold. More precisely it is the price of the nearby active futures contract in the gold futures market minus the cash price of physical gold in the spot market.

Backwardation in gold is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon: it is a reminder of the incurable pathology of paper money. It dramatizes the decay of the regime of irredeemable currency. It can only get worse.

Once entrenched, backwardation in gold means that the cancer of the dollar has reached its terminal stages. The progressively evaporating trust in the value of the irredeemable dollar can no longer be stopped.

Negative basis (backwardation) means that people controlling the supply of monetary gold cannot be persuaded to part with it, regardless of the bait. These people are no speculators. They are neither Scrooges nor Shylocks. They are highly capable businessmen with a conservative frame of mind.

This is a financial earthquake measuring ten on the Greenspan scale, with epicenter at the Comex in New York, where the Twin Towers of the World Trade Center once stood. It is no exaggeration to say that this event will trigger a tsunami wiping out the prosperity of the world.

http://www.jsmineset.com/

There is only one kind of HONEST MONEY and that is GOLD.

Gold has no liability attached to it.

Gold has no hidden agenda.

Gold is universally accepted.

Gold is a time tested and proven storehouse of value.

Gold by being a proven storehouse of value is a reliable measure of value.

Paper currencies have never survived the test of time.

Paper currencies have always had a hidden agenda inherent in central banks.

Paper currency has a poor record as always acceptable, as a storehouse of value, and as a measure of value.

Good Money always forces out Bad. This is "Gresham’s Law."

So it has always been, so it will always be.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/109210-the-manipulation-of-gold-prices

 

[Myth of Myself]

I see what your saying about gold being a global currency but since one cannot eat, wear or collect enough gold to build a decent shelter, how would it come in handy in the event of total collapse of the dollar?

As of now there are zero trading posts or local stores for me to stroll into and pass an oz of gold for flour, beans, butter, milk and eggs. And I also feel that in the midst of a "theoretical" total financial collapse, (which I feel we are in the middle of now) the idea that there would be merchants setting up booths along the road to sell you precious precious food for your gold bar is really rather slim. I think tangible goods and or services in the form of "know-how" on producing goods would be much more valuable than gold. I feel this is valid regardless of whatever future events may occur.

"(Sorry just a a bit of an aside, I just had a vision of a commercial for buying gold......
A Lumberjack walks into a kitchen wearing a flannel shirt with suspenders, an axe over one shoulder and a smudge of dirt on his cheek
LUMBERJACK: After a hard days work splitting firewood, nothing fills me up like a piping hot bowl of gold" ;)

I feel that we Americans especially have a wacky idea of what real wealth is.

As long as we're considering a total monetary collapse (which is in full effect), wouldn't growing and producing your own food be the most logical thing to do instead of worrying about buying gold? Even having gold to spend means you would have to seek out someone to sell you food they have grown. And as few people who grow their own food these days, I would bet it would be rather expensive even if you found someone to sell it to you or you have gold to spend. Why not work on cutting out the middle man altogether? It is exactly why vegtable gardening isn't a basic skill taught in public school, such a basic thing empowers the public too much.

I guarantee that when the dollar finally folds, one would be able to trade food goods for other necessities and if you can't then you can eat them, drink them or can them for later.

:)

 

[Rabelais]

I see what your saying about gold being a global currency but since one cannot eat, wear or collect enough gold to build a decent shelter, how would it come in handy in the event of total collapse of the dollar?

As of now there are zero trading posts or local stores for me to stroll into and pass an oz of gold for flour, beans, butter, milk and eggs. And I also feel that in the midst of a "theoretical" total financial collapse, (which I feel we are in the middle of now) the idea that there would be merchants setting up booths along the road to sell you precious precious food for your gold bar is really rather slim. I think tangible goods and or services in the form of "know-how" on producing goods would be much more valuable than gold. I feel this is valid regardless of whatever future events may occur.

Can you eat, wear or collect enough dollars to build a decent shelter?

There are many who ignore, or are ignorant of the past few thousand years of human history and gold and silver's role as the currency of choice. The fiat currency crowd depends on them to insure the continuity of their scam. Gold will always find willing partners to exchange it for whatever the "official" currency du jour happens to be, with which one can transact for whatever is needed.

Obviously your statement about "know-how" is a valid consideration, but when the local currency becomes valueless, what method do you propose as exchange for the products or services of this know how?

You state: "As of now there are zero trading posts or local stores for me to stroll into and pass an oz of gold for flour, beans, butter, milk and eggs."

Ever heard of a coin shop? They will gladly take your gold, today, and pay you a premium (up to $200 an ounce) over the current COMEX spot price for it... in Bushbux, with which you can then purchase all of the above commodities that you wish. If you have been paying attention, you will know that there is a global shortage of gold and silver coins and bullion. This is by design. It welds shut the fire escape doors of the burning economy. In the meantime, the dealers for this metallic currency are desperate for inventory and will pay handsomely for any metal that anyone might want to sell. Which they in turn will mark up and resell, probably the same day, to someone who has recently awakened to the horror of the objective reality of the situation.

If you bought that gold a few years ago, it is now worth considerably more than what you originally paid for it. Had you instead taken that money with which you hypothetically purchased that gold - and squirreled it away for a rainy day, its buying power in real things would have been eroded greatly by the inflation which has since occurred.

The argument which you present is a program. It is part of the "gold is a barbaric relic" program that has been used to wean people away from objective monetary realities. You would do well to maybe consider that aspect of your reasoning - and how it came into being. Your current illusion likely will not serve you well in the future.

I might also suggest that you look over the archives at the Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee (GATA) website. www.gata.org There is much material available there which clearly explains how we arrived at the economic disaster which confronts us today - and what each of us can do personally to ease the effects of the now unfolding train wreck.

Knowledge Protects - Ignorance Endangers

I feel that we Americans especially have a wacky idea of what real wealth is.

That certainly seems to be the case.

 

[go2]

I feel that we Americans especially have a wacky idea of what real wealth is.

What you say is true, many think money is wealth. Gold is not wealth, it is money. Money is a tool to transfer energy through time and space. Wealth is the capacity to satisfy our physical, spiritual, social, and emotional needs. Money facilitates wealth, it is not wealth. Gold is a tool which has served the money function for thousands of years. There are other misconceptions of gold, money, and wealth, and not just by the man on the street, but by academics and pundits. The PTB have made a great effort to distort mankind's understanding of the money function. They use money to enslave. We must study the chains if we are to be free.

Growing food is a valuable skill, but impractical for most of the millions living in L.A. How will these millions survive with a simple barter system? The world has a population of six billion and a complex system of production and distribution necessary to provide their physical needs. A money system is necessary to distribute energy throughtout this system. The problem humanity now faces is the collapse of the current fiat money system. This may mean a collapse of the production and distribution system. This threatens the lives of billions of human beings who cannot grow their own food. Using paper money as the life blood of the production and distribution allows a few to loot the many. Gold makes this more difficult. Gold allows humanity to store skills and production of food across the years and around the globe and limits the looting by legal counterfeit.

Douglas Gnazzo's archive provides a very readable history and theory of money if you are interested in further examining the function of money, it uses and abuses.

 

[mamadrama]

Gold is a tool which has served the money function for thousands of years. There are other misconceptions of gold, money, and wealth, and not just by the man on the street, but by academics and pundits. The PTB have made a great effort to distort mankind's understanding of the money function. They use money to enslave. We must study the chains if we are to be free.

I could be way off here but I get the sneaking suspician that gold is going to remain suppressed, even as the old fiat system collapses and is replaced with global credits or whatever is in the works. Although gold has been the basis for money for thousands of years, if we are to take into account these are extraordinary times and extraordinary controls are in the works, I would not be surprised if gold does not attain the value that it would have otherwise.

 

[Bernhard]

As long as we're considering a total monetary collapse (which is in full effect), wouldn't growing and producing your own food be the most logical thing to do instead of worrying about buying gold?

That's all fine and good, but you're maybe here not seeing objectively how this is simply not possible for everyone, so the logic you speak of maybe lacking perspective here or objectivity.
Not everyone has the possibility to own/rent land where he/she can grow food. Take Europe for example. Where I grew up in Germany, it is quite a luxury to live in a house with a garden. All my life I lived in an apartment with my parents. There was no way we could afford a house, let alone some land. It is not as easy/cheap as here in the States, nor is there enough space/land for everyone to live on land and grow their own food. I'd also say that it is rather unrealistic for everyone in the US to do this or in the world for that matter.

On another note, what about the portion of the population who are simply not able to do this physically? The sick and the elder for example?
Money or gold are not evil or bad. It's always what man makes out of it. In the end they are just a universally accepted method for barter with gold being the more stable one, I suppose. As you said correctly, Americans (well the whole world actually) have a wacky idea of what real wealth is.
But I don't think anything will change by going to a "barter/tribal" society where people just grow their own food. It seems rather utopian to me. Some sort of a new age fantasy, where people just live happily next to each other trading goods and food.
If the ponerization of society is not addressed and dealt with, it will also come out in a money-less society and the same "crimes" will be committed just with different means, in this case resources and food. And we can see that already happening now. That's the whole issue with the film Zeitgeist Addendum for example, providing solutions without getting to the core of the issue/problem here: Psychopathology and the overall sickness of society. The monetary system and the "evil dollar" is not the reason for it. Any form a barter/trade will eventually turn "evil" if the root problem is not confronted: man himself and his egocentric self-serving programs.

So the issue here is not just about growing your own food. The issue is man himself and if here is no change in himself, confronting the predator in him, then no outward solution will bring any change, be it gold or everyone growing their on food. On the other hand, if man has a grip on his own predator/programming and conditioning, hence on the way of realizing his true self, then he will do exactly what he "ought to do" according to his inclinations and talents in relation to Service, not predominantly concerned with oneself. As Ra would say, that is different for everyone. Some become workers (who grow food), some teachers, some healers, etc....

So in that case you may be projecting your own subjective talents/inclination of how you live or would like to live your life on to everyone else, without considering that not everyone is like you or has the same talents or inclinations.

A healthy working society would consist of people who using their talents and give to each other in STO ways. However, no one is fully STO at this point. Nor are many folks in touch with themselves to the point that they do or know as they "ought to do" without conditioning/programming. Everyone is very much STS and more concerned with the Self than Others, hence the subjective projections according to what one think is best for all or the other. That is a sense is STS, to determine the need for another or how things "should" be done according to one's own subjective(programmed) world view.

[quote author= Ra] 15.6 Questioner: What is the greatest service that our population on this planet could perform individually?
Ra: I am Ra. There is but one service. The Law is One. The offering of self to Creator is the greatest service, the unity, the fountainhead. The entity who seeks the One Creator is with infinite intelligence. From this seeking, from this offering, a great multiplicity of opportunities will evolve depending upon the mind/body/spirit complexes' distortions with regard to the various illusory aspects or energy centers of the various complexes of your illusion. Thus, some become healers, some workers, some teachers, and so forth.

17.30 Questioner: If an entity wants to be of service to others rather than service to self while he is in this third density, are there "best ways" of being of service to others, or is any way just as good as any other way?
Ra: I am Ra. The best way to be of service to others has been explicitly covered in previous material. We will iterate briefly. The best way of service to others is the constant attempt to seek to share the love of the Creator as it is known to the inner self. This involves self knowledge and the ability to open the self to the other-self without hesitation. This involves, shall we say, radiating that which is the essence or the heart of the mind/body/spirit complex.
Speaking to the intention of your question, the best way for each seeker in third density to be of service to others is unique to that mind/body/spirit complex. This means that the mind/body/spirit complex must then seek within itself the intelligence of its own discernment as to the way it may best serve other-selves. This will be different for each. There is no best. There is no generalization.[/quote]

 

[go2]

I could be way off here but I get the sneaking suspician that gold is going to remain suppressed, even as the old fiat system collapses and is replaced with global credits or whatever is in the works. Although gold has been the basis for money for thousands of years, if we are to take into account these are extraordinary times and extraordinary controls are in the works, I would not be surprised if gold does not attain the value that it would have otherwise.

Hi Black Swan, If the fiat system collapses, it is likely gold will resume a function in a new monetary system to give credibility. The on going collapse will destroy mankind's trust in promises to pay, which is all any global credit system would be. Read the following link for a look at Ben Bernanke's stated admiration for FDR devaluation of the dollar against gold in 1934.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/109210-the-manipulation-of-gold-prices

Anyone who reads the written works of our Fed Chairman knows that Bernanke’s long term plan involves devaluing the dollar against gold. This is the exact opposite of most prior Fed Chairmen. He has overtly stated his intentions toward gold, many times, in various articles, speeches and treatises written before he became Fed Chairman. He often extols the virtues of former President Franklin Roosevelt’s gold revaluation/dollar devaluation, back in 1934, and credits it with saving the nation from the Great Depression. According to Bernanke, devaluation of the dollar against gold was so effective in stimulating economic activity that the stock market rose sharply in 1934, immediately thereafter. That is something that the Fed wants to see happen again.

A ten to one devaluation of the dollar to gold buries all the Feds problems, because it wipes out the old debt and resets the program with renewed confidence of gullible humanity. The PTB have been privatizing gold for just such a windfall. This simple trick strips 90% of the savings and assets of this generation, consolidating the system for the same old game of usury and fraud, legal of course. That is why this subject is worthy of study, it will be used again, unless extraterrestrial forces change the gameplan.

 

[Myth of Myself]

Can you eat, wear or collect enough dollars to build a decent shelter?

No, one cannot eat, wear or collect enough dollars to build a decent shelter. Dollars are as worthless as gold in a tangible way, other than building a fire.

Obviously your statement about "know-how" is a valid consideration, but when the local currency becomes valueless, what method do you propose as exchange for the products or services of this know how?

Community food production and a transference of tangible life skills in the process. Along with the knowledge of canning, composting, beer making etc., etc. Make the learning of tangible life skills available to others in exchange that they teach 10 others the lessons they have learned. As far as trading goods goes, it gets worked out rather easy. I trade a pint of canned cinnamon pears for a dozen eggs with my neighbor without a referee or a broker.

You state: "As of now there are zero trading posts or local stores for me to stroll into and pass an oz of gold for flour, beans, butter, milk and eggs."

Ever heard of a coin shop? They will gladly take your gold, today, and pay you a premium (up to $200 an ounce) over the current COMEX spot price for it... in Bushbux, with which you can then purchase all of the above commodities that you wish.

Trading gold for cash is just plain silly. I view cash more worthless than gold when it comes to tangibility. Why would I want to trade gold for cash? To buy food? Why buy food at all if I can grow it?

As far as lessening the effect of this train wreck by purchasing gold, good luck.

 

[Beau]

Trading gold for cash is just plain silly. I view cash more worthless than gold when it comes to tangibility. Why would I want to trade gold for cash? To buy food? Why buy food at all if I can grow it?

As far as lessening the effect of this train wreck by purchasing gold, good luck.

What do you think is going to happen when the dollar sinks and we have to go back to a barter system? Gold will surely hold value then. As for the comment,

Why buy food at all if I can grow it?

This is where you are only considering yourself. Not everyone can grow food. Try to put yourself in someone else's shoes. Some people have no choice but to use currency to buy food.

 

[gwb1995]

Growing your own food is a great idea for those who know how and have the land to do so. I also agree with the thought of bartering as well. When the economy totally crashes, we will all need to be as resourceful as possible. Creating a network to make such ventures possible is another great idea. I am seeking any and all possibilities myself, as it only makes sense to me. I see gold as another viable resource, as it will be another source of obtaining the things necessary to survive. Any precious metal will be of value in the coming future(imo). In my mind, it is all about being open to what the universe has to offer and doing all things possible to obtain what is offered. Since I am limited to 3D STS thinking at this point, I feel the need to push my thinking as far as possible and try to be as objective as possible.

I have one question for you, Myth of Myself. Have you considered such scenarios as say this one? It is winter and I have just lost my job. I don't have enough cash to make it for more than a few weeks. During this time, I can't grow any food as it is to cold to grow anything. How do I feed myself? What if I have some gold that I can cash in for food and supplies. I might be able to make it a little longer.

What if the currency crashes during this time and all I have to offer is gold or other precious metals? Do you think people will not accept gold or other precious metals in trade? I would suggest being open to all possibilities in a situation like this one.

I think we all need to think about these types of things in a broader sense, and build up as many possibilities to survive as possible. It will take a combination of several methods to make it, or so I think. I just can't see letting myself dismiss any real possibility to survival. It would be subjective at best.

FWIW,

gwb

 

[Myth of Myself]

I have one question for you, Myth of Myself. Have you considered such scenarios as say this one? It is winter and I have just lost my job. I don't have enough cash to make it for more than a few weeks. During this time, I can't grow any food as it is to cold to grow anything. How do I feed myself? What if I have some gold that I can cash in for food and supplies. I might be able to make it a little longer.

What if the currency crashes during this time and all I have to offer is gold or other precious metals? Do you think people will not accept gold or other precious metals in trade? I would suggest being open to all possibilities in a situation like this one.

Use gold to survive while you can of course. If it makes you feel better having gold lying around, if it puts you at ease and makes you feel secure, then I say go for it.

I am saying however that if you are fit enough to garden and really want to, you can find a place to do it. If you live in a city then you may have more trouble finding a plot of land to do it in than in the country, but it is not impossible to garden in a city.

For those who live in the cities and feel they cannot leave to garden I would suggest looking into how Cuba was reshaped with urban gardening programs.

http://www.cityfarmer.org/CubaGreen.html
"Some neighborhoods produce up to 30 percent of their food. More than 540,000 tons of food were produced for consumption by Havana residents last year."

One could try organizing such things in your own neighborhood or apartment building, build an apartment access garden on the roof with raised beds, and compost bins etc., etc. There are ways to grow your own food without having acres and acres of rolling hills and a combine tractor.

 

[rrraven]

I am saying however that if you are fit enough to garden and really want to, you can find a place to do it. If you live in a city then you may have more trouble finding a plot of land to do it in than in the country, but it is not impossible to garden in a city.

i agree with that rather than stockpiling 'currency ' start collecting potting mix,seeds, containers, start a worm farm in a box... there is lots of ways

from what i remember my mum telling me about the black market barter system that sprung up 'last time this happened" cigarettes and alcohol are handy to have in quantity ( especially if you don't drink :P ) there is always people willing to trade for them and smokes and grog don't go 'off' ,some like wine and wiskey even get better with age
RRR

 

[gwb1995]

Hi M of M,

I may be misunderstanding you and your comments on this thread. I am not questioning your views of growing your own food, setting up a network for bartering, etc. I thought I was making myself clear on that in my last post. If not, then I need to work on my communication skills.

What I am trying to suggest to you, is that I think one will need as many tools as possible to survive a economic collapse of the magnitude being discussed here.

i agree with that rather than stockpiling 'currency ' start collecting potting mix,seeds, containers, start a worm farm in a box... there is lots of ways

from what i remember my mum telling me about the black market barter system that sprung up 'last time this happened" cigarettes and alcohol are handy to have in quantity ( especially if you don't drink :P ) there is always people willing to trade for them and smokes and grog don't go 'off' ,some like wine and wiskey even get better with age
RRR

rrraven has another great idea of stocking items that will possibly be of value for bartering in bad times. I think that gold and precious metals will also be of value in such a situation. I am personally working on acquiring the equipment necessary to survive outdoors long term. I could go on, but that would be redundant. I am just trying to think of all the possibilities that one might encounter. On my list of necessary items is obtaining hard copies of all the material on this site, all associated books, etc. My biggest concern is being cut off from this site and the information available here and on the net. This network is invaluable to me, and I feel the need to at least be able to have as much material available as possible if/when this source is cut off.

I am not suggesting that you, or anyone agree with my views. I am saying that it is easy to be blinded by subjectivity and not stopping to look at ones own situation objectively. FWIW, I find a ton of holes in my current plans on a regular basis, and continue to refine and adjust as necessary. Funny thing is, I don't think there is any plan that will actually work long term. Therefore, I am only trying to plan for survival in the sense of being available to transition to 4D, if I am ready when that moment comes.

I would appreciate any and all input on my thoughts.

gwb

 

[Myth of Myself]

Hi gwb1995,

I didn't view your post as questioning the value of growing ones own food and I agree with you that versatility and adaptability are essential to life as a whole, whatever the situation or outcome may be in the times to come.

I feel that realistically one cannot prepare for all of the possible scenarios that may unfold in ones lifetime and that there will always be that X factor in attempting to do so. All is learning and I am simply passionate about the rediscovery of self-reliant skills that can be imparted to others that can lower the level of dependency one may place upon a broken and corrupt system for the common sustenance of our bodies.

In this post I was just commenting on the differences between tangible wealth and idealistic wealth (i.e, the difference of a well stocked pantry and a bank balance in a database)

Gold is a form of currency that has been used since the dawn of recorded history. I am not looking to disregard or ignore this fact. I was looking to shed light on the point that gold in and of itself only has value if someone is willing to trade it for tangible goods. Whereas say a carrot has direct tangible value in the application of its direct usage.

I honestly have difficulty in communicating through this method using 2d words on a screen with the small condolence of smileys as a means for conveying emotion as opposed to speaking in person with the benefits of volume, tone, inflection, body language, harmonic resonance, etc. etc. There seems to be so much space left open for misinterpretation and mis-communication.

I apologize if I am not always clear in my communications on this forum. It is always a learning experience to communicate this way because of the limitations it imposes.

 

[mamadrama]

If the fiat system collapses, it is likely gold will resume a function in a new monetary system to give credibility. The on going collapse will destroy mankind's trust in promises to pay, which is all any global credit system would be. Read the following link for a look at Ben Bernanke's stated admiration for FDR devaluation of the dollar against gold in 1934.

Yes, that certainly would seem the smarter more rational way to go about things. Strategically it may be like the Obama "win" which provided a way to let off the steam of the populace while putting a new face on the machine. And interesting that "win" was so easy, almost too easy. Maybe that will be the way of gold, too.

Thanks much for the link, very informative. :)