Cosmological Questions

[axj]

In the August 16, 2014 session the C's recommended becoming more aware of the cosmos, among other things:

Q: (L) Okay, is there any final bit of advice, or any last thing to say before we shut down for the night?

A: Just work daily at becoming more aware on three levels
1. Body and immediate environment,
2. Wider world affairs,
3. Cosmos and spirit.

Q: (L) Shouldn't "spirit" go with "Body and immediate environment"?

A: No, it is via the first steps that one achieves cosmic consciousness.

Q: (L) I don't understand.

(Chu) You have to work on the body and environment, and then understand the wider world at first. And then you can develop cosmic consciousness and spirit.

(L) Oooh. So in other words, to achieve cosmic consciousness, i.e. true spiritual advancement, you have to expand your field of vision to be very wide?

A: Exactly. Those who suggest that you must look only within live in a singular bubble.

Q: (L) Alright. Anything else?

A: No. Goodbye.

There is one basic cosmological question that I think has not been asked yet:

Just how big is our physical universe?

What is interesting is that recent measurements show that the universe is "flat", meaning that it is infinite and does not "curve back" on itself to create a ball or some other shape. Yet the measuring of the flatness has a limit, meaning that the physical universe could be curved after all.

The most interesting part is that even if it is curved and not infitite, the universe must be at least 37 trillion light years in diameter. For comparison, our observable bubble has a diameter of about 93 billion light years.

Here is a summary of how the minimum size of 37 trillion light years was arrived at:

Our best measurements indicate that the Universe is spatially flat on the largest scales: it’s neither positively nor negatively curved, to a precision of 0.25%, or about 1-part-in-400. Because we live in three dimensions, 400 times the radius means (400)3 times the volume, or more than 64 million times as much space. If we assume that our current laws of physics are correct, we can set limits on how large, at least, the Universe must be before it curves back on itself.

But, big as that is, it still isn’t infinite. A lower bound of the Universe being at least 18 trillion light-years in all directions is tremendous, but it’s still finite. Assuming that the Universe contains no topological weirdness, like curving back on itself while still being spatially flat (like having a geometry akin to a hypertorus), observations of the cosmic microwave background and the large-scale structure tell us that the unobservable part of the Universe must be at least 37 trillion light-years in diameter.

 

[irjO]

Hi axj not sure what the correlation between the Cs quote is to your question.
Also, what would be any significant to measure the size of the physical universe? Trying to measure it by a diameter or any of our known methods, wouldn’t work in this case, OSIT because perhaps there is no a determining shape or form we can calculate the entirety of it, if there is no end or beginning as stated by the Cs then how would you measure something like that? The physical universe also can be composed by infinite parallel dimensions, or different laws we still are not aware of. Perhaps it really is infinite. Overall, I think the concept or information we have of it, it’s kinda vague.

 

[axj]

Hi axj not sure what the correlation between the Cs quote is to your question.

The size of the physical universe seems to be one of the most fundamental questions as far as becoming more aware of the cosmos and our place in it. I guess the main question is: Is the physical universe infinite or not?

If it is infinite, then everything possible would exist an infinite number of times in all variations at the same time. Which is why it seems more likely that it is not infinite - with true infinity existing at levels above the physical universe.

Trying to measure it by a diameter or any of our known methods, wouldn’t work in this case, OSIT because perhaps there is no a determining shape or form we can calculate the entirety of it, if there is no end or beginning as stated by the Cs then how would you measure something like that?

Was the "there is no end or beginning" referring to the physical universe?

 

[irjO]

Was the "there is no end or beginning" referring to the physical universe?

Well, the overall universe. Physical universe is just an expression of the universe itself, it is how we can perceive it! So, if the universe is infinite, why the physical universe wouldn’t be?

 

[axj]

So, if the universe is infinite, why the physical universe wouldn’t be?

I think it is unlikely because then everything possible would be manifested physically an infinite number of times, "at the same time". That is what infinity means in the case of the physical universe.

Many spiritual traditions talk about a non-physical infinity and eternity beyond time and space, a type of consiousness from which the physical world originates.

 

[ImaPrototype]

it is infinite as far as anyone could verify(6D included afaik) so how do you plan to measure it and what difference it makes?

 

[Nienna]

I don't know if this will help axj, the Cs did say this:

Q: (L) Well, this is beginning to sound like we are in pretty bad shape here. This is like the Siberia of the universe as Gurdjieff said.

A: The Universe is infinitely huge.

Which, to me, means that it is infinite and unmeasurable.

 

[BHelmet]

Was the "there is no end or beginning" referring to the physical universe?

Pretty sure this was as much a reference to “time” as well as physical creation.

It’s comical, to me, to see 3D STS beings speculating on the infinite as if it can be really known in our present state. The bottom line is that the answer doesn’t matter! There are other fish to fry here if we are ever going to grow our souls enough to move on. Mind candy is fun and does open up a sense of awesome mystery if you realize the absolute answers are beyond our reach, but I don’t think it’s the real work that is necessarily a core lesson for humanity until we get to 4D. I mean, wondering about the size and scope of infinity as our physical containers are about to be flushed down the toilet in a grand reset by the 4D overlord bastards is…. Kinda humorous. (To me, anyway)

 

[axj]

It’s comical, to me, to see 3D STS beings speculating on the infinite as if it can be really known in our present state. The bottom line is that the answer doesn’t matter!

So why do you think the C's suggested becoming more aware of the cosmos as well every single day?

A: Just work daily at becoming more aware on three levels
1. Body and immediate environment,
2. Wider world affairs,
3. Cosmos and spirit.

What does it mean for you? For me it implies increasing awareness and knowledge of the universe and our place in it, gaining a broader perspective or maybe even a sense of wonder.

Whether there are infinite physical copies of me and everyone else incarnated in an infinite physical universe also seems quite relevant, in my view.

I don't know if this will help axj, the Cs did say this:

Q: (L) Well, this is beginning to sound like we are in pretty bad shape here. This is like the Siberia of the universe as Gurdjieff said.

A: The Universe is infinitely huge.

Which, to me, means that it is infinite and unmeasurable.

Thanks. Though "The Universe" here probably refers to all of creation and not just the physical universe. I think many mystical traditions say that true infinity exists only beyond time and space (physicality).

 

[irjO]

I would never imagine measuring the physical universe as part of ‘learning about the cosmos’, I think they are referring more to the different realities, such as densities, the influence a superior density can have over us, other example would be knowing about comets, electric properties of the universe, the second sun, gravity; Things that can influence or affect us. Again, I think you are looking the physical universe as something separated from the overall universe, that could be the incorrect approach, the physical universe it’s just basically how we can see and perceive the real universe, since that’s how our brains can process it. So, the answer would be: If we only see the complete universe as “physical” because we are 3rd STS, it would also mean that is in reality infinite physically speaking.

 

[axj]

I would never imagine measuring the physical universe as part of ‘learning about the cosmos’, I think they are referring more to the different realities, such as densities, the influence a superior density can have over us, other example would be knowing about comets, electric properties of the universe, the second sun, gravity; Things that can influence or affect us.

Those are all good examples, though I think that whether the physical universe is truly infinite is one of the more fundamental questions with large implications.

It may not be as practical or directly affecting us as some other questions, though then again, there are many possible ways that it could be. For example, if the physical world is infinite, would all the infinite copies of you have the same soul or different souls? Would you be able to connect with some or all of them, for example in meditation?

There do seem to be parallel realities with "different versions" of ourselves, according to various spiritual or mystical sources. But these seem to be different than infinite copies and variations of you in the same physical universe at large distances from each other.

Again, I think you are looking the physical universe as something separated from the overall universe, that could be the incorrect approach, the physical universe it’s just basically how we can see and perceive the real universe, since that’s how our brains can process it. So, the answer would be: If we only see the complete universe as “physical” because we are 3rd STS, it would also mean that is in reality infinite physically speaking.

The way I see it, we have different bodies that we can use, including the astral body etc. to explore worlds beyond the physical. We seem to use our astral bodies when we sleep, for example. Clairvoyant abilities even go beyond that. So no, the physical world is not the only thing we can perceive.

I don't really see the physical world as separate either, since it is an integral part of the overall whole. And sorry, but I don't understand the reasoning behind your last sentence or what you mean by it.

 

[ImaPrototype]

i thought I'd seen a quote by the C's comfirming that from their point of view the universe was infinite
and why does it matter, well if the universe is infinite it means you can always improve there's no fixed path or finish line

 

[WhiteMountain]

On this whole topic, I read an interesting book many years ago, I think the title was "Beyond the Big Bang" that proposed a theory of Continuous Creation (I think that is what it was called). The book outlined the many ways the Big Bang (originally a joke applied to the theory because people thought it rediculous) is not possible. The distribution of matter in the Universe is not what you would expect from such an explosion, and more importantly if we know anything about stellar evolution the quasars on the "edges" of the observable universe are much, much older than any estimate of the age of the universe extrapolated from the Hubble constant. The theory proposed in the book is that the universe was infinite, but you have local regions of space that under go periods of expansions and contractions over time in a cyclical manner. That would explain red shift observations observable to us, but also explains how there are other regions where there are stars that are impossibly old - they just would not be in our region of expansion / contraction. I thought it was an interesting theory.

 

[PopHistorian]

i thought I'd seen a quote by the C's comfirming that from their point of view the universe was infinite

The following quotes are from just the first few years of transcripts.

24 Nov 1994:

A: [...] All there is is lessons. This is one infinite school. There is no other reason for anything to exist. Even inanimate matter learns it is all an “Illusion.” Each individual possesses all of creation within their minds. Now, contemplate for a moment. Each soul is all powerful and can create or destroy all existence if know how.

26 Nov 1994:

A: The Universe is infinitely huge.

28 Dec 1994

A: The universe is an infinite illusion.

4 Jan 1997:

Q: (L) Alright, then. I think that from a previous session we were told that the number of universes was not countable. Is that correct?
A: Infinite, maybe, but more to the point: variable and selective.
[...]
Q: (L) So, it is like one hard drive, many programs, loading instructions for new programs that are then erased, etc. If there is one “true dimension,” and infinite universes within it, does one particular universe exist, of and by itself, at any given time, until it is merged into a new one, or is there within this one true dimension, multiple universes as real as ours is, to which we could go, and could be there alongside ours, so to speak?
A: Yes to the latter.
Q: (L) And, can infinite numbers of “dimensions” exist within each level of density, even if temporary?
A: Yes. If you want to go back and change “history,” either for individuals or for universal perception, you must first create an alternate universe to do it. Your 4th density STS “friends” have been doing this a lot.
Q: (L) If you, being a general term, create an alternate universe, does the former one continue to exist, or does the former one merge into the new one?
A: Both.

Somewhat related - back in college philosophy class, my first real brain-teaser was to ask myself, "Why is there a universe instead of just nothing?" But one cannot imagine nothing, because you have to be something to imagine anything. Exixtence has no Off switch.

 

[Alma.Innovadora]

What does it mean for you? For me it implies increasing awareness and knowledge of the universe and our place in it, gaining a broader perspective or maybe even a sense of wonder.

Whether there are infinite physical copies of me and everyone else incarnated in an infinite physical universe also seems quite relevant, in my view.

A: Just work daily at becoming more aware on three levels
1. Body and immediate environment,
2. Wider world affairs,
3. Cosmos and spirit.

For me it means, not to start reading a book for the end.

According to the order of these points indicated by Cass, wanting to start understanding something that escapes my understanding, does not fit my immediate reality, so I would already be skipping the first point to be able to understand how the universe itself expresses itself in my environment to learn to know myself, in the face of world events to understand the existential duality and how it influences globally and so then, through the acquisition of that knowledge, to be more aware of everything or at least as far as it reaches me or corresponds to me to be, according to my daily work and the learning point I am at.

Regarding the size of the universe, other members have left cass's answers closer, also about parallel universes and densities, parallel lives and many of those questions end also in "when you are in 4D, you will see".

A: The Universe is infinitely huge.

Mostly words you can use in the search bar, but does it fit the answer you expect or do you want "accuracy" of something? You have statistics of the universe according to the 3D perception and you have the guides, suggestions and answers of Cass, besides that, what percentage of accuracy do you want?