A Recurring Dream Theme

[Wu Wei Wu]

For my first contribution of substance to the board, I would like to share a facet of my sleep life, namely a recurring theme of within my dreams.

How recurring is this theme? Well, it has been a part of every dream that I remember in the last year for sure. A few of my old dream journal entries show that the theme has been present for at least several years, though I do not remember if it was as consistent then as it is now. I suspect it is present every night.

The theme itself is a sense of running away from an entity of some sort, changing from dream to dream depending on the context. I always, without fail, fight the entity as best I can (usually involving some sort of diversionary violence or force) but I never beat it. I just keep running. There is no sense of fear present during the flight or my resistance to the entity. Only a sense of "I can't win this, but I won't stop running". There is an underlying sadness to it, not quite a despair, but a sadness.

To draw a comparison, if anyone has seen the older 'Terminator' movies, the Terminator is portrayed as a near invincible opponent, one whom you can only flee against no matter how hard you try. That would be the comparable feeling.

On the note of the entity, there is no consistency in its form. In on case, it was a gigantic female dragon. In my younger years it was a Tyrannosaurs Rex. It has been an armed mercenary, a martial arts women, and a giant, man shaped shadow creature. The consistency with the entity lies only in its 'flavour', as a frightening (formerly terrifying, but I got used to it, I suppose), evil, and emotionless creature.

The consistency of the dream betrays that it must have some significance, but my analysis and ideas have failed to have any effect on whether or not the dream takes place. I have considered the obvious: Am I running away from what I'm afraid of? But the only circumstance to which I can say yes refers to a social situation, which has little bearing on any of the contexts this dream has been.

I am curious whether anyone else has experienced this theme, what it meant for them, and what they did about it. I don't expect a clear answer, but maybe, just maybe, I'll learn something that will provoke a new area of interest that will hold further clues to this dream theme.

 

[loreta]

I have myself very often that kind of nightmare where I am confronted with psychopaths and with the devil under various forms. Some years ago I was very afraid of those dreams. Then I read a very interesting book about our underworld that permit me to accept those terrible visions: The Dream and the Underworld by James Hillman. And also a very interesting book about how to try to understand what we dream, less complicated than the book of Hillman, Dream Work by Jeremy Taylor.

I think that each part of a dream, each character is a part of ourselves. This is my point of vue and surely others will be more profound in that subject and help you more conveniently. The idea that our underworld is surrounded by gods and entities from the mythology is very interesting and Hillman talks about this. Gods and their world and the study of them help us to understand (in my case) some nightmares and accept their presence in this mysterious world of my dreams and nightmares. Since I read Hillman I have less nightmares. But to remember a nightmare is important, and some people say that we have nightmares because we need to remember them and work on them.

Another thing I do is looking in a good dictionary of symbols some characters of my nightmares. If I dream about a bull pursuing me I try to understand the significance of the bull and ask myself: dear bull, what do you want to tell me?

Here is a link for an interesting reflexion about Hilman's book and dreams. I hope that this can help you.

http://listeningtogolem.blogspot.com/2011/09/dream-and-underworld.html

 

[RedFox]

I use to dream of being chased for years, perhaps 10-15 years or so. I did start fighting back....

This may be a good starting point

[...]
Dark man dreams. See here and here

And the following quote (from the second dark man thread):

While re-reading Laura’s “Riding The Wave – Book 1” in book format, I came across the “Dark Man Dream” on pg.232. Coincidence? I think not.

“…I had a dream that clearly told me that I was in mortal danger if I did not take immediate action. It was the standard “Dark Man Dream” as described by Clarissa Pinkola Estes, a Jungian psychologist, who uses ancient tales as maps to chart our unconscious knowing in her book Women Who Run With Wolves:

The natural predator of the psyche is not only found in fairy tales but also in dreams. There is a universal initiatory dream, one so common that it is remarkable if a person has reached age 25 without having had such a dream. The dream usually causes the person to jolt awake, striving and anxious. The dream usually involves being in a house with danger outside or darkness outside. The dreamer is frightened and frantically tries to obtain assistance. Suddenly they realize the danger is virtually on top of them, or right with them, or cannot be overcome or avoided, or that they have lost. The dreamer awakens instantly, breathing hard, heart pounding. There is a strong physical aspect to having a dream of the predator. The dream is often accompanied by sweats, struggles, hoarse breathing, heart pounding, and sometimes crying and moans of fear. We could say the dream-maker has dispensed with subtle messages to the dreamer and now sends images that shake the neurological and autonomic nervous system of the dreamer, thereby communicating the urgency of the matter. The antagonists of the ‘dark dream’ are, in people’s own words, ‘terrorists, rapists, thugs, concentration camp Nazis, marauders, murderers, criminals, creeps, bad men, and thieves.’ There are several levels to the interpretation of the dream… Often such a dream is a reliable indicator that person’s consciousness is just beginning to gain awareness of the innate psychic predator… The dream is a harbinger; the dreamer has just discovered or is about to discover and begin liberating a forgotten and captive function of the psyche. The dark man dream tells a person what predicament they are facing. The dream tells about a cruel attitude toward the dreamer. Like Bluebeard’s wife, the dreamer can consciously gain hold of the ‘key’ question about this matter and answer it honestly, and can then be set free… The dark man appears in dreams when an initiation – a psychic change from one level of knowing and behavior to another more energetic level of knowledge and action is imminent. The initiation creates an archway that one prepares to pass through to a new manner of knowing and being… Dreams are ‘portals,’ entrances, preparations, and practices for the next step in consciousness. Dark man dreams are wake up calls. They say: Pay attention! Something has gone radically amiss in the outer world… The threat of the ‘dark man dreams’ serves as a warning to all of us – if you don’t pay attention, something will be stolen from you! The dreamer needs to be initiated so that whatever has been robbing her can be recognized, apprehended, and dealt with. In the Bluebeard story we see how a woman who falls under the spell of the predator rouses herself and escapes him, wiser for the experience. The story is about transformation through knowledge, insight, voice, and decisive action. We must unlock the secrets and use our abilities to be able to stand what we see. And then, we must use our voice and our wits to do what needs to be done about what we see. When instincts are strong, we intuitively recognize the innate predator by scent, sight, and hearing … we anticipate its presence, hear it approaching, and take steps to turn it away. In the instinct-injured (i.e., nuts and bolts person) the predator is upon them before they register its presence. We have been taught to be nice, to behave, to be blind, and to be misused. [Laura’s note: We have been hypnotized to give up our flesh and skins.] The young and the injured are uninitiated. Neither knows much about the dark predator and are, therefore, credulous. But, fortunately, when the predator is on the move, it leaves behind unmistakable tracks in dreams. These tracks eventually lead to its discovery, capture and containment. Wild Ways teaches people when not to act ‘nice’ about protecting their souls. The instinctive nature knows that being ‘sweet’ in these instances only makes the predator smile. When the soul is being threatened, it is not only acceptable to draw the line and mean it, it is required."

I've had a few of these dreams reoccur recently, and have now come to understand that there is an emotional trauma element to the dream. That (in essence) you are mortally terrified of some of your emotions.
The first one I realised (with help from the quote above) is that I was terrified of anger - because I saw anger as making me just like the predatory people I had encountered through bullying. It wasn't until I read the above, and finally realised there are two types of anger could I embrace it. There is predatory/manipulative anger - used to gain an advantage over another. And there is defensive/righteous anger, used to defend against predation over us!

This recent dream however made it clear that I was terrified of emotional release (sadness)...that at some level I fear it will consume me to let it out. In the same way cleaning out an infected wound will hurt - but having left it for years you have an irrational fear that it will kill you. It also defines you having lived with it so long, so you fear you will be nothing without it. If the trauma that caused you to learn this happened early enough in life, it can also be linked to the primal survival instinct - so it can literally feel like you are in mortal danger to experience whatever emotions they are.
fwiw

 

[Zadius Sky]

I've had a number of chase dreams myself, and the way that I find out what I am being chased by is looking at what that image of the chaser was and what aspect of myself that I am afraid of confronting. And, further explored those aspects of myself in my journals in relation to my waking life and to the interactions with other people in my life (i.e., my behaviors, attitudes, etc.). When I did that and finding out what those aspects are and working with them, I didn't have "chase" dreams again for a while until something else happened in life that I was unconsciously avoiding and it'll come back again. And, each of these dreams usually have that sense of fear or danger.

On the note of the entity, there is no consistency in its form. In on case, it was a gigantic female dragon. In my younger years it was a Tyrannosaurs Rex. It has been an armed mercenary, a martial arts women, and a giant, man shaped shadow creature. The consistency with the entity lies only in its 'flavour', as a frightening (formerly terrifying, but I got used to it, I suppose), evil, and emotionless creature.

The consistency of the dream betrays that it must have some significance, but my analysis and ideas have failed to have any effect on whether or not the dream takes place. I have considered the obvious: Am I running away from what I'm afraid of? But the only circumstance to which I can say yes refers to a social situation, which has little bearing on any of the contexts this dream has been.

I wouldn't rule out the possibility referring to social situations (since they usually involve energy dynamics in relation to yourself and to others). Dreams can get exaggerated and even have shocking imagery, and these are being done to get your attention via subconscious/unconscious mind. Recurring dreams usually mean that they do hold some importance to you personally because the unconscious or whatever is trying to convey something that is obviously very significant to you on a deeper level.

Running away or being chased is obviously avoiding a situation that you do not think is solvable. Fighting back is an inner turmoil or one aspect of yourself is in conflict with another aspect of yourself (struggle). What's interesting is that you had "no sense of fear" during the fight or resistance to the entity (in contrary to other dreams that I read about that usually involved a sense of fear or danger when being chased). That could mean that you are not afraid to confront the unknown or dark aspects of yourself (including predators) and it'll always be an ongoing battle. You know you can't win, but you won't give up.

fwiw.

 

[Wu Wei Wu]

Another thing I do is looking in a good dictionary of symbols some characters of my nightmares. If I dream about a bull pursuing me I try to understand the significance of the bull and ask myself: dear bull, what do you want to tell me?

Your response is an interesting concept to be sure. I checked the link(and more) regarding the book you suggested, I'll have to add it to my list. I'm especially curious about this last comment, quoted above. Now you say you 'look' for a dictionary. Why not make our own dictionary with our own associations? If there some underlying commonality regarding dream symbols then I would probably come to similar conclusions.

This recent dream however made it clear that I was terrified of emotional release (sadness)...that at some level I fear it will consume me to let it out. In the same way cleaning out an infected wound will hurt - but having left it for years you have an irrational fear that it will kill you. It also defines you having lived with it so long, so you fear you will be nothing without it. If the trauma that caused you to learn this happened early enough in life, it can also be linked to the primal survival instinct - so it can literally feel like you are in mortal danger to experience whatever emotions they are.

This is feasible. I went through an unfortunate phase in my youth where emotions were denied their rightful place and as a result, a number of emotional faculties atrophied. I am still recovering and relearning these emotional faculties, its an ongoing process. The problem is, if the faculty has/was atrophied to the extent that the emotion no longer entered the purview of the conscious mind, how does one handle the releasing?

Or in such a case, should the emotion not be clearly perceptible, is it absent? Thoughts on that.

What's interesting is that you had "no sense of fear" during the fight or resistance to the entity (in contrary to other dreams that I read about that usually involved a sense of fear or danger when being chased). That could mean that you are not afraid to confront the unknown or dark aspects of yourself (including predators) and it'll always be an ongoing battle. You know you can't win, but you won't give up.

Yes, but this facet worries me somewhat. I have done some research into the dark man dream(always nice to see that its an experience many have) and it would appear that my occurrence doesn't match up, in that there is a lack of fear generally. There have been a few fearful instances but by and large I maintain a fairly neutral disposition during the dream.

Perhaps it really is a particular social circumstance or relationship that bothers me thus? I will reflect on the ideas provided.

 

[obyvatel]

Another thing I do is looking in a good dictionary of symbols some characters of my nightmares. If I dream about a bull pursuing me I try to understand the significance of the bull and ask myself: dear bull, what do you want to tell me?

Your response is an interesting concept to be sure. I checked the link(and more) regarding the book you suggested, I'll have to add it to my list. I'm especially curious about this last comment, quoted above. Now you say you 'look' for a dictionary. Why not make our own dictionary with our own associations? If there some underlying commonality regarding dream symbols then I would probably come to similar conclusions.

Jungian psychologist Robert Johnson does not encourage the "dream dictionary" approach to analyzing dreams but coming up with individual associations as you mentioned. There is a thread here which summarizes Johnson's approach to dream work.

I went through an unfortunate phase in my youth where emotions were denied their rightful place and as a result, a number of emotional faculties atrophied. I am still recovering and relearning these emotional faculties, its an ongoing process. The problem is, if the faculty has/was atrophied to the extent that the emotion no longer entered the purview of the conscious mind, how does one handle the releasing?

Or in such a case, should the emotion not be clearly perceptible, is it absent? Thoughts on that.

Have you explored any body-oriented approaches towards emotions? Even if you think that certain emotional faculties have atrophied, becoming sensitive to body postures, muscular tensions, breathing patterns etc would give you clues as to what is going on inside. Most of our emotions are intimately connected to the above mentioned body states - and body awareness is a great tool to explore emotions. You may be interested in taking a look at Peter Levine's work which is discussed here .

I have done some research into the dark man dream(always nice to see that its an experience many have) and it would appear that my occurrence doesn't match up, in that there is a lack of fear generally. There have been a few fearful instances but by and large I maintain a fairly neutral disposition during the dream.

Perhaps it really is a particular social circumstance or relationship that bothers me thus? I will reflect on the ideas provided.

What is your general disposition in real-life situations which would usually incite fear or anxiety in other people? Do you feel these emotions in other situations but not in the dream - or do you not generally experience these emotions at all?

 

[Wu Wei Wu]

Jungian psychologist Robert Johnson does not encourage the "dream dictionary" approach to analyzing dreams but coming up with individual associations as you mentioned. There is a thread here which summarizes Johnson's approach to dream work.

Thanks, will read. I'm not all that familiar with Jungian psychology, its on my list.

Have you explored any body-oriented approaches towards emotions? Even if you think that certain emotional faculties have atrophied, becoming sensitive to body postures, muscular tensions, breathing patterns etc would give you clues as to what is going on inside. Most of our emotions are intimately connected to the above mentioned body states - and body awareness is a great tool to explore emotions. You may be interested in taking a look at Peter Levine's work which is discussed here .

Yes, I have. Years ago I came to the conclusion that my stresses and anxiety had a direct relationship to the tension in my body. It occurred simultaneously(or as a result of?) with my foray into metaphysics and leaving the mainstream. Since then I've tried EFT, Larry Crane, Pranayama, Yoga, and more. I eventually tossed out the garbage practices and now practice qigong with Xingyiquan in conjunction with breathing exercises(including EE) and meditation.

My muscles are largely free of tensions and anxieties and I'm presently working on loosening and strengthening my tendons and joints, but in that process there was certainly a lot of emotional relase. I'll take a look at the thread, as I know for a fact that your correct, the body awareness is an excellent tool to study emotions.

PS. A cursory glance reveals that Levine's work is something I'm not totally familiar with. I will learn more and report back.

What is your general disposition in real-life situations which would usually incite fear or anxiety in other people? Do you feel these emotions in other situations but not in the dream - or do you not generally experience these emotions at all?

I can say that I have largely eliminated fear and anxiety from my life. In the past I was gripped by a near all-consuming mental fear which made me paranoid and resulted in incredible strain and anxiety(which motivated me to seek physical release, as mentioned above).

Anxiety appears only sporadically and almost exclusively in situations where previous associations dominate, such as meeting an old acquaintance with which I had a great deal of anxiety in the past. This anxiety is however, negligible in comparison and has no place in my conscious processes.

Likewise I confidently say that I have conquered mental fear. The only fear I now feel is a physical trepidation in situations of danger, and even this is brushed aside(although in some cases the body still reacts with a certain jitteryness). There is this kind of physical fear in my dreams every so often, the physical. It is completely absent of mental fear, and this is what I meant when I said there was no fear in the dream.

The dream feelings are common to those of reality. They are simply uncommon.

 

[RedFox]

There is this kind of physical fear in my dreams every so often, the physical. It is completely absent of mental fear, and this is what I meant when I said there was no fear in the dream.

The dream feelings are common to those of reality. They are simply uncommon.

Its possibly related to very early (primal physical survival) trauma, in which case Levine's work will be very useful.
Being physical fear however does prompt me to ask if you have read much on the diet/health section (or are up to speed with the diet/health articles on SoTT), and if so how is your diet (is it gluten/dairy free for example)? It could be the t-rex you have no mental fear of, but your body instinctively fears (because it's going to eat you alive) is diet related. fwiw

 

[Wu Wei Wu]

Its possibly related to very early (primal physical survival) trauma, in which case Levine's work will be very useful.

I am not sure what you mean. Are you trying to say that its related to early childhood trauma? If so, I have not explored that path.

Being physical fear however does prompt me to ask if you have read much on the diet/health section (or are up to speed with the diet/health articles on SoTT), and if so how is your diet (is it gluten/dairy free for example)?

How well read am I? Very well read. SOTT was my introduction to the Paleo diet, which I am steadily adopting more and more. My diet is heavy in grass fed meats. Real Heavy. Limited vegetable conjunction, and I'm slowly introducing coconut oil and nuts into my daily diet.

My diet is largely gluten and dairy free. The two are only eaten socially, once a week maximum, and I'm in the process of cutting this down.

Now that I think about it, perhaps there is an anxiety regarding the giving up social eating (and drinking, which has been occuring as well)? Has anyone else found such resistance to be so present?

Considering this line of thought I also feel guilt and a certain anger at myself whenever I indulge in such appetites or accept free food (which almost always consists of products I know are unhealthy). Although it seems unlikely that the dream itself is related as the diet changes were only enacted in the last year, has it been the experience of anyone that such guilt over gluttony has caused dream related or significant health related effects?

Forgive my ignorance where the answer may seem obvious, but previous to my reply it never occurred to me that this guilt over negative habits would have consequences. Hindsight is 20/20 after all.

It could be the t-rex you have no mental fear of, but your body instinctively fears (because it's going to eat you alive) is diet related. fwiw

A fair suggestion and the t-rex would certainly be a good expression of such a fear. Unfortunately this is not the case as the t-rex has been a fear symbol since childhood and its presence tapered off long before my introduction to the Paleo diet. Although it may remain as an instinctive fear symbol due to associations even today... hmm. Food for thought.

Is there consensus that EE is suitable for the releasing of such potentially fearful associations? I have never used it for that before.

 

[SeekinTruth]

Eating ANY gluten or casein will set you back to square one. It can take up to six months to get over the inflammation, including brain inflammation, each time you consume even a crumb of it.

 

[Wu Wei Wu]

Eating ANY gluten or casein will set you back to square one. It can take up to six months to get over the inflammation, including brain inflammation, each time you consume even a crumb of it.

I'll take this to heart, thanks.