Mandatory Intellectomy
Jedi Master
The link you posted says
which is exactly what I'm using.
Also the table in your link shows the same numbers as my table, so what exactly am I calculating wrong?
Coronavirus Pandemic: Apocalypse Now! Or exaggerated scare story?
- Thread starter wanderingthomas
- Start date
Also the table in your link shows the same numbers as my table, so what exactly am I calculating wrong?
things like this
- The number of cases detected by testing will vary considerably by country;
- Selection bias can mean those with severe disease are preferentially tested;
- There may be delays between symptoms onset and deaths which can lead to underestimation of the CFR;
- There may be factors that account for increased death rates such as coinfection, more inadequate healthcare, patient demographics (i.e., older patients might be more prevalent in countries such as Italy);
- There may be increased rates of smoking or comorbidities amongst the fatalities.
- Differences in how deaths are attributed to Coronavirus: dying with the disease (association) is not the same as dying from the disease (causation).
Iceland: (Update 28th March)
Iceland has tested a higher proportion of people than any other country (9,768 individuals), equivalent to 26,762 per million inhabitants the highest in the world (as a comparison, South Korea has tested 6,343 individuals).
Screening suggests 0.5% are infected; the correct figure is likely higher due to asymptomatics and many not seeking testing: estimates suggest the real number infected is 1%.
Iceland, currently reports two deaths in 963 patients, CFR. 0.21%. If 1% of the population (364,000) is infected, then the corresponding IFR would be 0.05%. However, they have limited infections in the elderly as their test and quarantine measures have seemingly shielded this group, and the deaths will lag by about two weeks after the infection.
Iceland’s higher rates of testing, the smaller population, and their ability to ascertain all those with Sars-CoV-2 means they can obtain. an accurate estimate of the CFR and the IFR during the pandemic (most countries will only be able to do this after the pandemic). Current data from Iceland suggests their IFR is somewhere between 0.01% and 0.19%.
Im not saying your wrong but those numbers mean nothing without widespread testing to see how many are asymptomatic
I don't, know if this issue has been brought up previously. Yesterday, I was driving around to purchase a few things, listening to CBC radio, there was a discussion in progress regarding agricultural farms in Ontario Canada and there reliance on migrant workers to plant and harvest crops. Most of the migrant agricultural workers come from Mexico or Trinidad. There length of stay is usually around 8 months, they receive room and board, they are paid minimum wage, also they pay into the CPP (Canadian Pension Plan) and the EI program. They reply on this income to support their families in the countries they originate from.
They will never be able to claim EI, they can claw back some monies through CPP, but I understand it's a pittance.This closing of borders has impacted the growing and harvesting of agricultural crops, making the food chain unpredictable.
One agricultural farm owner stated that he has advertised offered employment to young men in Ontario, indicated there had been no response, The reason given that it is heavy backbreaking work and most young people are not interested. I guess it's easier to accept a government handout, rather than to particapte in decent good honest work, that will benefit the population.
Another agricultural farm owner expressed her dismay and frustration about the inability to harvest produce, stating that they will have to lie in the fields and rot, there will be no cold crop plantings this year (broccoli, Brussels sprouts and cabbage).
This will not only impact Ontario, here in BC where live, there are many agricultural farms in the Fraser valley and the Southern interior.
Some articles highlighting the problem
www.macleans.ca
www.theglobeandmail.com
Also similar concerns are being voiced in the US this from RT. I am reminded of the Salinas Valley and all the agricultural farms located there.
So this begs the question from me. With all the call up of military reservists we are reading about in the media, why are they are not being mobilized to ensure some degree of food security for the population?
Seems to me another crisis waiting to happen, one of the agricultural farmers stated this will impact frozen and canned products, and will be noticeable before the end of the year, they were unable to predict for next year.
I note at this time with this media flood concerning the virus, no long range weather predictions are given. The area where I live they is concern of another 20 year event, where the area was flooded. The snow pack in the upper elevations is high, there as been some indications, river levels are inceasing and have flooded a riverwalk, close the the river in the city park. We have had lots of sunny, clear days lately.
They will never be able to claim EI, they can claw back some monies through CPP, but I understand it's a pittance.This closing of borders has impacted the growing and harvesting of agricultural crops, making the food chain unpredictable.
One agricultural farm owner stated that he has advertised offered employment to young men in Ontario, indicated there had been no response, The reason given that it is heavy backbreaking work and most young people are not interested. I guess it's easier to accept a government handout, rather than to particapte in decent good honest work, that will benefit the population.
Another agricultural farm owner expressed her dismay and frustration about the inability to harvest produce, stating that they will have to lie in the fields and rot, there will be no cold crop plantings this year (broccoli, Brussels sprouts and cabbage).
This will not only impact Ontario, here in BC where live, there are many agricultural farms in the Fraser valley and the Southern interior.
Some articles highlighting the problem
Migrant farm workers and the cruel trade-off at your local produce aisle - Macleans.ca
Opinion: Is it a fair exchange when the fresh fruits and vegetables that we feed to our kids come at such a cost to other families and their kids?
www.macleans.ca
Canada’s food supply at risk as pandemic tightens borders to farm workers
Agricultural sector employs about 60,000 temporary foreign workers each year to plant, harvest crops
www.theglobeandmail.com
Also similar concerns are being voiced in the US this from RT. I am reminded of the Salinas Valley and all the agricultural farms located there.
So this begs the question from me. With all the call up of military reservists we are reading about in the media, why are they are not being mobilized to ensure some degree of food security for the population?
Seems to me another crisis waiting to happen, one of the agricultural farmers stated this will impact frozen and canned products, and will be noticeable before the end of the year, they were unable to predict for next year.
I note at this time with this media flood concerning the virus, no long range weather predictions are given. The area where I live they is concern of another 20 year event, where the area was flooded. The snow pack in the upper elevations is high, there as been some indications, river levels are inceasing and have flooded a riverwalk, close the the river in the city park. We have had lots of sunny, clear days lately.
dredger
The Living Force
Hi all, 9 pages late but verified rapidly using the search if this video was already posted
It's FRENCH, but you still can activate the auto-traduction if you want to look at it without understanding french
It's a french summary of a lot points about the crisis and it's really well done, well summarized and he refers to a great number of various scientists around the world. To french speaking people here : I think you can go on sending this video to any one who is in the doubt, it should help them to further ask themselves the good questions.
Also, maybe a good one to add in the SOTT articles ?
OFF TOPIC : A bit of technic for anyone here wanting to post a video but wondering if already posted :
When you are on youtube, right to the
buttons, you have a small right arrow, click on it and then you can copy/paste the short link to the video, and even choose to specify a precise passage by enterring the minutes/seconds.
For the example above, the url given was the following one (I added spaces to avoid the forum to display it a second time)
Here it is you have this unique string that reference the video for youtube ==> "izzadeWl3b0"
Copy it in the search engine of the forum, eventually select "this thread" to search just within this exact thread, or other options, then click and you'll rapidly spot if it was already posted somewhere.
Of course, it happen that one video is reposted by other people, create a new youtube video which is the same, meaning that the "clip" itself may have already been posted but it was another youtube video with its own "unique reference/string" - but this case should happen rarely, still the good trick remains valid to know.
It's FRENCH, but you still can activate the auto-traduction if you want to look at it without understanding french
It's a french summary of a lot points about the crisis and it's really well done, well summarized and he refers to a great number of various scientists around the world. To french speaking people here : I think you can go on sending this video to any one who is in the doubt, it should help them to further ask themselves the good questions.
Also, maybe a good one to add in the SOTT articles ?
OFF TOPIC : A bit of technic for anyone here wanting to post a video but wondering if already posted :
When you are on youtube, right to the
buttons, you have a small right arrow, click on it and then you can copy/paste the short link to the video, and even choose to specify a precise passage by enterring the minutes/seconds.For the example above, the url given was the following one (I added spaces to avoid the forum to display it a second time)
https: //youtu.be/ izzadeWl3b0
Here it is you have this unique string that reference the video for youtube ==> "izzadeWl3b0"
Copy it in the search engine of the forum, eventually select "this thread" to search just within this exact thread, or other options, then click and you'll rapidly spot if it was already posted somewhere.
Of course, it happen that one video is reposted by other people, create a new youtube video which is the same, meaning that the "clip" itself may have already been posted but it was another youtube video with its own "unique reference/string" - but this case should happen rarely, still the good trick remains valid to know.
I just shared this video on Facebook and FB Thought Police kindly told me that the video is fake, as verified by independent fact-checkers:
If so, I'd like those fact-checkers to please explain how those people doctored the videos they took of the empty hospitals and where they got the actors from to perform as nurses and paramedics.
Seriously though, it is very strange that hospitals should be empty, pandemic or not, as they are usually fairly busy. The only explanation I can think of is that they reserved them for COVID-19 patients, while the population was told to stay home. The real patients, hystericized by the media, decided to stay home too and hang on to their real diseases. And the media are just lying about the whole thing as they always do.
Mandatory Intellectomy
Jedi Master
That's true, and I know about everything you mentioned there. I made it clear I'm calculating CFR from the available numbers, because that's about the only thing I can calculate. I can't work with numbers that nobody knows.
My point was that those numbers (with which the media scare the population) are nowhere near accurate or meaningful - as you said, "mean nothing without widespread testing".
CFR is calculated from known cases. Whether those are representative of anything is another matter. I made the table to show that the numbers (at this point) are bullshit. (Which, of course, means that even the comparison of Sweden with others is pretty irrelevant, but it gives us some sense of where things are likely heading.)
As I've said, I don't think the actual CFR (from complete and correct data, which we don't have and clearly never will) is even 1%.
The same thing is happening here in middle Tennessee, more or less. You still have the true believers wearing masks.
Ruth
The Living Force
Breaking news on "The High Wire". This is a disease that effects the blood and hasn't been seen before. The protocol for ARDS (acute respiratory distress syndrome) ends up being detrimental to patients (it uses respirators), rather than saving them. It explains why patients respond well blood thiners and chlorquine. Patients presenting with a COVID-19 infection look like a person who has 'the bends' or altitude sickness. Interesting huh?
Even basic advice about how to care for your car is laced with fear-mongering.
Does that mean we need to stay 2 m apart indoors too?
So if the weather is nice and go for a drive to get out of the house, even if you are not getting out of the car, it is not OK, you can only go to buy groceries or drugs... I don't think we need to try to find logic in these measures, because there is none.
Is it bad to let your vehicle sit in the driveway during the pandemic?
As Canadians hunker down indoors and wait out the pandemic, their vehicles may be at risk of having problems down the road if they’re left sitting idle for too long.
www.ctvnews.ca
Does that mean we need to stay 2 m apart indoors too?
So if the weather is nice and go for a drive to get out of the house, even if you are not getting out of the car, it is not OK, you can only go to buy groceries or drugs... I don't think we need to try to find logic in these measures, because there is none.
The Swedish government will be tracking mobile data, starting Easter weekend, to see how people move and if they are really following the recommendations not to travel (so far-surprise-they are). Not much in the papers on this but a little note on good old "text-tv" which nobody watches (I don't know if you are familiar with that so I'm posting a picture below).
At the same time there are articles in the papers on "bad" Russia who are using face recognition. But similar things are happening here?? I'm just so sick of this stupidity!!
At the same time there are articles in the papers on "bad" Russia who are using face recognition. But similar things are happening here?? I'm just so sick of this stupidity!!
Jasophoria
Jedi
For some reason this link does not work on the forum anymore, while it was working before, but if I find it myself, it works fine???
I will post it again.
populair, populaire producten
populaire producten van Vitaminstore ♥ Uitgebreid assortiment, goede ervaringen, voordelig en snel bestellen ♥ Vitaminstore.nl
Metrist
The Living Force
There is a notion that this situation, and how it is affecting people psychologically ... this is only speculation, or even suggestion.
First of all, this is a global scope, with a wide array of factors, conditions, ect. But all the worst aspects of what is reportedly happening, are treated as if it is the same everywhere. Why? Because it is psychological.
So, that being the case, it is relevant only in our minds. But in real life, it is pertinent to our lives - dependent on the factors. Of course we care about others, and what is happening, but our caring won't help. So, if you ask yourself: what can I do? And determine there is nothing you can do but take precaution, then it really isn't that strong a factor, psychologically. You take it in stride. And so it is mostly suggestion, and hype.
So, we are all experiencing this, but in our own regional realities, and much of the speculation: the assertion that people are being affected in a certain way, is dependent on individual cases, then broadcast as if it were types of people generalized into opposing camps.
So, I think people are immune to this because: They care. They ask: 'what can I do?' After that, they go on about their lives as best they are allowed. Because they care, they determine whether the threat applies to them. And they are sane, and act reasonably. Though there are always the nutcases some will use as example to mask the populace in this perception that dissolves our reliance on each other. It is a attempt to channel us into our respective camps. It isn't going to alter our nature. Our civilization might falter, but holding it up is good people and their inherent goodness.
So, psychology caters to the sick, and in a crisis suggests that many might be affected and in need of assistance. But a majority are sane, coherent people and as in all other situations in life, get by without having to access a situation and be hung up on what a few loonies think. We work around them.
First of all, this is a global scope, with a wide array of factors, conditions, ect. But all the worst aspects of what is reportedly happening, are treated as if it is the same everywhere. Why? Because it is psychological.
So, that being the case, it is relevant only in our minds. But in real life, it is pertinent to our lives - dependent on the factors. Of course we care about others, and what is happening, but our caring won't help. So, if you ask yourself: what can I do? And determine there is nothing you can do but take precaution, then it really isn't that strong a factor, psychologically. You take it in stride. And so it is mostly suggestion, and hype.
So, we are all experiencing this, but in our own regional realities, and much of the speculation: the assertion that people are being affected in a certain way, is dependent on individual cases, then broadcast as if it were types of people generalized into opposing camps.
So, I think people are immune to this because: They care. They ask: 'what can I do?' After that, they go on about their lives as best they are allowed. Because they care, they determine whether the threat applies to them. And they are sane, and act reasonably. Though there are always the nutcases some will use as example to mask the populace in this perception that dissolves our reliance on each other. It is a attempt to channel us into our respective camps. It isn't going to alter our nature. Our civilization might falter, but holding it up is good people and their inherent goodness.
So, psychology caters to the sick, and in a crisis suggests that many might be affected and in need of assistance. But a majority are sane, coherent people and as in all other situations in life, get by without having to access a situation and be hung up on what a few loonies think. We work around them.
Just like in the case of hydroxychloroquine, now Vitamin C therapy is discredited.
www.ctvnews.ca
Oh, aren't we lucky that the Gates gang will have a vaccine ready earlier than that?
Oh boy, I guess a considerable percentage of the people on this forum are intolerable...
Claims vitamin C can prevent or cure COVID-19 unfounded, experts warn
While the use of high-dose intravenous vitamin C is being tested as a potential treatment for severe cases of COVID-19 in China, experts warn that the vitamin’s potential to treat or prevent symptoms of the virus have not been proven.
Oh, aren't we lucky that the Gates gang will have a vaccine ready earlier than that?
Oh boy, I guess a considerable percentage of the people on this forum are intolerable...
anka
The Living Force
This article did a great job for me, a medical analfabet. It deals with two known mechanisms of treating Covid-19 and I guess part of it might be useful in future to fight any virus, especially RNA types and the zinc factor is definitely something to keep in mind if one had to undergo any sort of vaccination. This should be a digestible read for anyone. Emphasis mine.
Covid-19: Chloroquine, Zinc and Quercetin
Peter D'Adamo
Chloroquine is a malarial drug first discovered in 1934. It’s still in use for malaria management, although the most common species of malaria-causing organisms are long resistant to it. Hydroxychloroquine (Plaquenil) also has anti-malarial activity, but is much more commonly used to treat certain auto-immune disorders, including rheumatoid arthritis, and systemic lupus erythematosus. Both of these drugs are structurally related to quinine, the famous ‘Jesuit Bark’ (Chinchona spp.) that was the first effective treatment for malaria (and the chemical that gives tonic water its unique flavor). Both pharmaceuticals are long out of patent protection, so generic versions are widely available. Depending on locale, a typical month-long treatment with hydroxychloroquine in the developing world was about US $4.65. Both drugs are on the World Health Organization’s List of Essential Medicines.
All quinine-analog drugs have the potential for side effects. Some are mild (diarrhea, nausea, tinnitus) others can be quite serious (inflammation of the retina, anemia, cardiac instability). Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine preferentially collect in the lungs, which helps increase potency with smaller doses. However, part of risk is due to the medications also collecting more in cells with melanin, which include skin and eye cells. Damage to the eyes can be a risk with large doses or extended use as a malaria or autoimmune disease treatment. People with cardiac problems may also be more at risk of adverse cardiac reactions. There is also a significant risk of interactions with other medications when taken simultaneously. Because of this, both chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine are available only by prescription.
Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine have an extensive research basis as antivirals. There are two acknowledged mechanisms by which these drugs exert antiviral effects.
Mechanism I: Endosome Alkalinizer
The process of viral entry involves the transport of the viral genome across host cell membranes, and the subsequent release of the virus genome into the host cell’s body (cytoplasm). Enveloped viruses like SARS-CoV-2 accomplish the delivery of their genomes into the cytoplasm of the host cells by binding to surface molecules on the outer membrane of susceptible cells, and fusing their outer envelopes with host cell membranes.
This leads to the virus being internalized into bubble-like (vesicle) inclusions known as endosomes.
In order to initiate replication, the virus requires that the endosome have a low (acidic) pH. Both drugs are weak bases (alkaline pH) and are rapidly taken up into the endosome, where they raise the pH to a point where viral replication can’t take place.The virus is therefore unable to release its genetic material into the cell and replicate.
Inhibition of viral infection with the increase pH by chloroquine analogs. Steps: 1. Endosome formation; 2. Fusion; 3. Post-translational modification; 4. Uncoating of the virus. ‘X’ marks points in process where chloroquine/ hydroxychloroquine exerts viral blocking effect. (simplified, from Al‐Bari 2017)
Mechanism II: Zinc Transporter
The mineral zinc is involved in many different cellular processes, and has proven crucial for the proper protein folding, the activity of various cellular enzymes, and most genetic transcription factors. In solutions such as water, zinc exists in its ionic form (Zn2+), where it possesses two extra electrons that it doesn’t need, and would like very much to give away. This ionic aspect is what makes zinc so interesting from an antiviral perspective.
Ironically, even though zinc performs so many critical functions, the cell is not terribly interested in accumulating high levels of it.
The intracellular concentration of free Zn2+ is maintained at a relatively low level by metallothioneins, small molecules that bind metals like zinc, copper and other heavy metals. The cell aggressively throttles Zn2+ because, at elevated concentrations, it can serve as an intracellular signal molecule, and trigger cell suicide (apoptosis), or even block protein synthesis. If that wasn’t enough discouragement, the cell membrane itself tends to repel zinc ions from binding, in much the same way that two magnets will repel each other when the same poles are brought close together.
Zinc is a decidedly anti-viral mineral. High intracellular concentrations inhibit the replication of RNA type viruses, such as SARS-CoV-2. Zinc does this by blocking RNA-dependent RNA polymerase (RdRp), the core enzyme of their multiprotein replication and transcription complex that is critical for the copying of viral RNA.
That’s the conundrum. In high concentrations, zinc can block coronavirus reproduction, but the cell is typically disinclined to tolerate high levels of zinc due to concerns about its other actions.
Enter the zinc ionophores.
Fortunately, there are molecules that can act as facilitators and enhance the entry of zinc into the cell. These are known as zinc ionophores, and here’s the payoff: in addition to its effects on endosome pH, chloroquine has also been demonstrated to be a zinc ionophore.
But there’s even more to the story. In addition to chloroquine, the nutraceuticals quercetin (bioflavonoid) and epigallocatechin-gallate (green tea polyphenol) are also zinc ionophores. Quercetin plus zinc is being tested as an anti-viral in human clinical trials for the treatment of Covid-19. The combination had already made it through animal trials for use against Ebola and SARS-CoV1, and was approved by the FDA for human clinical trials. Plans are underway for a large scale trial in China for patients with Covid-19.
The anti-parasitic drug ivermectin appears to have ionophore activity, as does the antioxidant resveratol.
How zinc ionophores work. 1. Zinc ions (blue hexagons) are in solution outside the cell. 2. The cell’s membrane and binding molecules limit the ability of zinc to penetrate into the cell cytoplasm via special ports (light green shape). 3. A zinc ionophore (red triangle) activates the port (dark green shape) to allow zinc to enter cell (4). Now in the cell, zinc is then able to block the enzyme RNA-dependent RNA polymerase (black shape), which turns off viral replication.
Getting zinc into the cell is obviously dependent on having adequate levels of zinc outside the cell. With most of us, this is usually not a problem. However, zinc absorption does vary by individual. Physiological stressors, such as infection and inflammation, tend to deplete zinc pretty fast. Fortunately, most of the hospitals that are empirically prescribing chloroquine for active Covid-19 are also supplementing with zinc as well.
