Crash site of Brazil jet found

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Crash site of Brazil jet found

Reuters

September 30, 2006

By Cesar Bianconi

BRASILIA, Brazil (Reuters) - Airforce search planes found on Saturday the wreckage of a Brazilian passenger plane that crashed a day earlier in Amazon jungle with 155 people on board and there were no reports of survivors.

The brand-new Boeing 737-800 operated by Brazilian low-cost carrier Gol probably plunged into the ground nose first, Brazil's airport authority said on Saturday.

Search planes found the crash site in Mato Grosso state, about 600 miles northwest of the capital Brasilia in a dense forest area that was difficult to reach, officials said.

The plane disappeared on Friday afternoon after what could have been a mid-air collision with a smaller plane, local officials and media reports said.

Authorities lost radar contact with Gol flight 1907 during its flight from the principal Amazon city of Manaus to Brasilia, the airline said.

Gol and civil aviation officials could not confirm if there were any survivors among the 149 passengers and six crew members on board.

The president of the airport authority Infraero, Jose Carlos Pereira, said the pattern of the wreckage indicated that plan had smashed into the ground nose first.

"Imagine the velocity at which it hit the ground coming from an altitude of 36,000 feet," he told reporters.

Denise Abreu, director of civil aviation authority ANAC, said signs indicated there had been a mid-air collision with a smaller jet, which landed safely.

Embraer aircraft manufacturer said one of its executive jets, a Legacy 600 owned and operated by a client, had been involved in a collision.

The jet made an emergency landing at Cachimbo air force base with five passengers on board, Embraer said. No injuries were reported.

The mayor of a town in Mato Grosso said the plane had crashed on Jarina farm in Peixoto de Azevedo municipality, but the farm's manager later told Reuters that employees of a nearby farm only saw a big plane on Friday evening flying low and then lost it from sight.

"People saw a large plane making strange maneuvering and losing altitude," Ademir Ribeiro said by telephone.

"The native forest is thick here, so they lost visual contact because of the trees," he said, adding that it was impossible to say if that was a Gol plane.

The plane had been received new from Boeing on September 12 and had only 200 flight hours, the company said.

Manaus is host to a number of foreign-owned manufacturing plants making motorcycles, computers and other goods in its duty free zone. It is also a base for tourism in the Amazon, the world's largest rain forest, and a headquarters for several environmental groups.

At Brasilia airport, dozens of friends and relatives, many weeping, gathered anxiously to await news.

Gol is a low-cost carrier that has expanded rapidly since its founding in 2001 to become Brazil's No. 2 airline and to offer flights to neighboring countries.

With its orange and white colors and stylized casual uniforms based on U.S. no-frills carriers, it is an instantly recognizable brand in Brazil and one of its most successful new businesses.

In the last major airline crash in Brazil, 33 people were killed when a plane belonging to regional carrier Rico Linhas Aereas crashed in the Amazon flying from Sao Paulo de Olivenca to Manaus on May 14, 2004.
 
I don't quite understand why you've posted this report Irini. Is there something fishy that you've noticed about the incident that's set off your spider senses?
 
Another new B737 mysteriously crashing from cruise altitude. The latest report at Gulfnews seems to question the theory of a midair collision. Over the years there have been many unexplained B737 crashes. In another incident, the PTB tried to blame it on the pliot committing suicide due to money problems!! SilkAir. But in 2004, the conclusion was quite different. Source Wiki

B737's over the years they have been many uncommanded rudder yaw movements in flight. Source NTSB.

Reading the above incident, I question the light aircraft impact theory. All commercial jets above a certain gross weight, are now required to be fitted with TCAS or "Traffic Alert/Collision Avoidance System". Source NTSB.

Basically, this system provides aural alerts as well as manoeuvre guidance to the pilots. The alerts are both aural and visual alerts. An aural alert sounds like this "Traffic, Traffic" over the loudspeaker and a manoeuvre alert would sound like "Climb, Crossing Climb" or "Descend, Descend". Visually it appears on the Primary Flight Display with a red "box" and the pilots are trained to disconnect the autopilot and fly the aeroplane "out of the red box" to avoid collision with the other aeroplane. Under no circumstances are the pilots to ingore a manoeuvre alert unless they happen below a 1000ft as the aeroplane is about to land. And in any case the alerts are inhibited below a certain altitude, typically below a 1000ft. Also the pilots are not to fly opposite to the manoeuvre alert. Tragically this happen sometime ago over the Swiss/German border where a Russian aeroplane and B757 flown by DHL collided in mid air. In this accident, apart from other factors involved, it was also noted that the B757 pilot flew opposite to the TCAS manoeuvre alert. Source Mid Air Collision.

So looking at the above incident, I think it's again that mysterious uncommanded rudder movement. I have been trying to find the passenger list to see if there is anything there. In the Silkair case cited above, one of the passenger just happen to be the Vice President of Visa International and there were reports that she was to make a comment about the Asian monetary crisis that was on going at that time. Surprisingly I can't seem to find the passenger list for that flight. Perhaps in the Gol aircraft, the passenger list might show something. OSIT

Regards.
 
Peam said:
I don't quite understand why you've posted this report Irini. Is there something fishy that you've noticed about the incident that's set off your spider senses?
I don't know what spider sense is. Too many airplane crashes lately. Too many people die. Seems like somebody is not doing their job well.

A Cyprus boeing crashed August 2005 near Athens. 122 people died. The whole island was mourning for weeks. I don't know what caused the above boeing to crash. But 155 people died and it might have been related to what happened to the Cyprus boeing.


An eerie echo of the Helios crash
By John Leonidou
(archive article - Sunday, March 12, 2006)

AIRLINE manufacturers Boeing were fully aware long before last Summer's Helios Airways crash that warning signals over cabin pressurisation problems could be confusing to the crew, according to emails from the company seen by the Sunday Mail.

Helios Airways flight ZU 522 crashed into a mountainside just north of Athens on August 14, 2005, killing all 121 passengers on board. Though the official accident report is still pending, there are strong indications the pilots were confused over warning signals indicating a gradual loss of pressure in the cockpit. Not realising there was a problem, they eventually passed out, leaving the plane to fly on auto-pilot until it finally crashed three hours later.

"Had there been a proper warning system that would have alerted the crew directly to the problem then it is my belief that the whole tragedy would have been avoided," a Boeing pilot told the Sunday Mail this week.

Two and a half years earlier, a Norwegian airliner experienced almost identical problems to the Helios Airways plane. On November 29, 2002 a Braathen Airline Boeing 737-700 was forced to descend and make an emergency landing just after takeoff after pressurisation problems similar to those in the Helios case. The Braathen pilots, however, realised the problem and brought the plane down safely, and the company immediately reported the problem to Boeing.

In their report to Boeing customer service headquarters in Seattle, Braathens said the pressurisation problem "was not the 'normal' 'rushing air' associated with a rapid decompression, because the leakage was not of a rapid type".

Preliminary investigations into the Helios crash show a slow decompression leak resulted in the pilots passing out.

In the Braathens incident, just as in the Helios tragedy, the problem was compounded by confusion over warning signals: "The warning horn [for high cabin altitude] is the same that is used for the takeoff warning, both with intermittent aural warnings. This led the flight-crew to not identify cabin altitude problems at once."

Replying on December 9, 2002, Boeing said it had received "an increased number of reports of flight crews not configuring the pressurisation panel correctly". But it also admitted it had received "similar comments from a number of airlines" regarding the confusing warning signals, adding, they would be proposing an optional system to fix the problem in about two or three years.

"The high cabin altitude warning horn itself has not changed since the 737 first delivered in 1967," Boeing said. "However, in response to your comments and similar comments from a number of airlines, we are considering development of a limited crew messaging system for the 737NG."

According to David Learmount of Flight International, as well as two Boeing pilots, this system has yet to be introduced, although Boeing did send out a circulate a "reminder" to flight crews about the difference between warning alarms for incorrect takeoff configurations and cabin altitudes - after the Helios Airways tragedy of August 14, 2005.
Several teams of foreign lawyers have offered to represent victims of the accident in suing Boeing in the US courts.

A BOEING 737 pilot, who wished to remain anonymous, yesterday told the Cyprus Mail that the problems experienced by the Norwegian airliner were "not identical, but very similar" to those on Helios. He insisted the tragedy could have been avoided had Boeing installed proper alarms to warn the crew of pressurisation problems in the cabin.

"From what we know so far about what went wrong with Helios, it appears that the pack and bleed switches were in fact on, but that the pressurisation switch was on manual. This is not identical to what happened in the other flight, but very similar, and had there been a proper warning system that would have alerted the crew directly to the problem, I believe the whole tragedy would have been avoided."

The pilot said he wasn't surprised that Boeing had not changed the alarm system after receiving the letter from the Norwegian airliner.

"To change this alarm system is not as simple as some may think. It is not just a matter of changing a few buttons, but changing the whole philosophy of the airplane, which would basically mean retraining all Boeing crew around the world - and that as you can imagine will not be easy."

Copyright
 
Irini said:
Peam said:
I don't quite understand why you've posted this report Irini. Is there something fishy that you've noticed about the incident that's set off your spider senses?
I don't know what spider sense is. Too many airplane crashes lately. Too many people die. Seems like somebody is not doing their job well.
It relates to one of the heightened powers of Spiderman, the comic book hero. I used the term to (inacurately) refer to the intangible way one can sometimes sense danger, or sometimes intuitively feel that there might be more to a story than what we're being told, so deserving more investigating. Our 'spider sense' being a product of intuition, experience, knowledge and awareness so to speak.

You're right, there might be more to this crash. Initial reports say that there was 149 passengers, but the Gol airline has only released 145 names.

http://www.freenewmexican.com/news/50056.html
 
Also the pilots are not to fly opposite to the manoeuvre alert. Tragically this happen sometime ago over the Swiss/German border where a Russian aeroplane and B757 flown by DHL collided in mid air. In this accident, apart from other factors involved, it was also noted that the B757 pilot flew opposite to the TCAS manoeuvre alert. Source Mid Air Collision.
http://news(dot)bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3537561.stm

A preliminary report into the accident found that the controller told the pilot of the Russian plane to descend when its onboard collision warning equipment was telling it to climb.
 
On the face of it, the 2 accidents seem to have different causes. The similarities are that both accidents involved B737's and both involved low cost carriers. In the Cyprus accident, reports seem to suggest that the aircraft had a history of pressurization faults prior to that fateful day. Couple with in-experienced crew and from different nationalities who perhaps couldn't communicate with each other effectively, it was a disaster waiting to happen. Not to mention of reports that the company operating that aircraft was cutting corners to maximize profits.
 
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