'Cyprus plan' proposed for Israel

Alana

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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6119056.stm

BBC News said:
Sunday , 5 November 2006

Israeli Deputy Prime Minister Avigdor Lieberman has said Israel should separate Jews and Arabs so that Israel can be a homogenous Jewish country.
Mr Lieberman said Israel's Arab towns should be given to a future Palestinian state, while Israel should incorporate Jewish settlements in the West Bank.

He said ethnically divided Cyprus was "the best model" to follow.

Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said Mr Lieberman's views did not represent those of the government.

Israeli Arab politicians condemned Mr Lieberman's remarks as racist.

'Best solution'

"Minorities are the biggest problem in the world," Mr Lieberman said in an interview with Britain's Sunday Telegraph newspaper.

"I think separation between two nations is the best solution. Cyprus is the best model. Before 1974, the Greeks and Turks lived together and there were frictions and bloodshed and terror.

"After 1974, they constituted all Turks on one part of the island, all Greeks on the other part of the island and there is stability and security."


Mr Lieberman is a member of Israel's ultra-nationalist Yisrael Beitenu party that was brought into the governing coalition last week.

Arabs make up about 20% of Israel's population.
In 1974 there was an INVASION by Turkish troops in Cyprus who took BY FORCE 1/3 of the island's land, and Greek Cypriots were BY FORCE moved to the unoccupied part, while Turkish Cypriots were BY FORCE moved to the occupied area. And no, there is no "stability and security" on the island.

My surprise is that this is being proposed by Mr Lieberman, while this is what has been taking place in Israel almost EVERY DAY now, when in Cyprus it happened once and the division was set. The Israelis everyday are looking for ways to limit the limited space they left to Palestinians, and everyday by killing they limit their already limited numbers. They Israelis even built a wall, for goodness sake!!!
 
Irini said:
In 1974 there was an INVASION by Turkish troops in Cyprus who took BY FORCE 1/3 of the island's land, and Greek Cypriots were BY FORCE moved to the unoccupied part, while Turkish Cypriots were BY FORCE moved to the occupied area. And no, there is no "stability and security" on the island.
Perhaps you can share with all of us some descriptions of what Cyprus was like before and after this invasion and any observations about the workability of the plan that you have made? Also, can you report what other people on Cyprus say/think?
 
Irini said:
Israel should separate Jews and Arabs
And what do they plan to do with Arab Jews ? Send them to Cyprus maybe ;)
 
Liberman considered a bully of Israel politics. This is how he portrayed:
car_g.jpg


Even psychopathic Olmert felt the need to emphasize that he doesn't hold the same views as Liberman.
This plan is so unrealistic that it's looks more like a test of public opinion then something real that should be considered. There is already Arab genocide going on, and it's continues only because it's subtle and twisted. Most of the Israelis (even pro-Zionists) will never accept such blunt approach. They prefer subtle lies ;)
 
Laura said:
Perhaps you can share with all of us some descriptions of what Cyprus was like before and after this invasion and any observations about the workability of the plan that you have made? Also, can you report what other people on Cyprus say/think?
First, there was never a plan made that was put in practice. There was the Annan plan, and both communities, Greek Cypriot and Turkish Cypriot, were called to vote for or against it on April 24 2004. T/Cs voted mostly "yes", while G/C on the most part voted "no". Thus the plan never was implemented. wikipedia offers an overview and the reasons why most G/C voted against the plan, which from my perspective it's pretty accurate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annan_Plan

The plan was very lengthy and even those who tried to read it, came out of it more confused. Of course the politicians who read it and had their own agendas, tried to promote or not the plan through the media. As a person who voted against the plan, i tell you that one of the reasons i did it, is because there was so much pressure from the US and British governments at the time to say yes to it. Lots of money came to Cyprus at the time for the "vote yes" campaign. Of course there were those who voted "no" due to racist reasons.

I am ashamed to say that i am very ignorant regarding Cyprus history and what really took place. Unfortunately, most Cypriots my age and older are, and now the younger even more, and i wonder whether it's by design, or by an "innately" shared indifference!

I started writing about the situation before and after the war, but i came to the realization that i truly am ignorant on the subject. Yes, i can tell you a story, but it's gonna be my own subjective understanding of it. So, i deleted it all, and i begun over trying to be as objective as possible.

before 1974 T/C and G/C were living together, some communities in harmony, but often there would be disputes between members of the communities, usually the fanatic Nationalists of both sites "cyprus is Greek!" " No, Cyprus is Turkish!".

There were villages and communities that were only T/C and others mainly G/C. The T/C were on the island since the Ottoman occupation of the island in 1570 (before that cyprus was under venetian occupation, and before that under franks and before that under english.... you get the picture!) which lasted until 1878 (when the Turks gave Cyprus to the british). During British rulership both T/C and G/C were fighting against the rulers, but they also fought among themselves. In 1955 Cyprus was freed (partially, because british army still has bases in cyprus) from the british and suddenly the communities were left alone and often members of each fought with each other. In 1960 Cyprus became independent and the 20% of the T/C population was also represented in the government. But there were still the Nationalist Greek fanatics who wanted Cyprus to be united with Greece (i never understood why so much fanatism on this) and the equivalent T/C. in 1963-64 T/C youths were killed by G/C and other conflicts where blood was shed took place, which brought to an end the constitution of G/C and T/C sharing the government. So much for trying!

In 1974 there was a coup to kill Archishop Makarios (at the time Cyprus president, first of one of Cyprus government, very much loved by both communities in Cyprus and whose dream was the peaceful coexistance of both communities) by those Greeks fanatics mentioned above, with the aid of the Junta who was ruling Greece at the time. This created a chaotic state on the island and the Turkish troops arrived (as the 1960 Zurich-London agreement established Turkey, Greece and Britain as the island's babysitters!) to defend supposetely their own T/C population, they however invaded and occupied, till this day, 1/3 of the island.

After the war took place, all G/C that were not killed, were forced to move to the unoccupied land and all T/C were forced to move to the occupied area. Since 1974, no one dared pass the green line separating the 2 communities, and UN men were placed along the line to make sure of this not happening. Since then, Turkish people were brought to the occupied area by the pseudo government for votes, even to the T/Cs dislike. There's a military group of those, named Grey Wolves, who on occasions killed G/C soldiers who stand as guards on our site .

The last 3-4 years, the pseudogovernment of the occupied territories opened few roads and G/C are allowed to visit there, and T/C are allowed to visit here. The government is currenlty trying to create opportunities and events as to bring these two communities together, but there are those who are against it. It is also true that there's a luck of trust among the members of the communities, due to the eons of fighting among the two. Perhaps if we get rid of the Greek and the Turkish and remain plainly Cypriots, we might have a chance. But even by me this would be hard and i don't know if anyone has the right to impose this on any group of people. But i also see that holding on to these "i am greek" and "i am turkish", it won't take us anywhere. But this is the Global problem of today, the inability to realize we are all human beings first, and everything else second, third, etc.

There are G/C who want things to remain as they are and even build a wall along green line. "I would never want my children to be in the same class with T/C children!" i heard mothers say aggressively. I don't understand why, and their answers to my why is that they are "muslims", which is even more peculiar as the mothers who said that rarely go to church! Of course, as long as people like this exist in the T/C and G/C communities, any plan to bring the two communities together will be a failure. Unless most of the people of both communities are willing to try to get together and cooperate for the good of this island, for us all. Because there are bigger sharks out there, who don't really care either for the T/C ot the G/C's luck!

You know what is funny come to think of it? you cannot tell a T/C from a G/C by appearance, they talk different languages but they speak in the same manner, they follow different religions but none is really religious, they dance the same, they drink the same, their music is so similar, they are so alike in so many ways that is surprising that they are not best friends! Of course this last won't be addmited by most G/C.

I wish i knew more about the events and was more accurate on the above narration. As you can see the situation is unlike the one in Israel in events, but like there, here too the pathocrats are who bring trouble to the rest of the people, and have infected both groups with the "my nation/religion/race is better than yours" so they can keep them forever divided, so that psychopaths can conquer. Those who believe they know what's best for this island, and never bothered to ask the inhabitants. Well, we were for the first time for the Annan plan!

A serious study of the Cyprus History is in my immediate plans and the amount of books on the subject is intimitating. It's gonna be a lot of work. I do have access to libraries though and if i focus and push my inertia in a corner, plus put all other readings on the site, it can be possible. Yes, in 1974 there was an invation, but it was the result of the Zurich-London agreement in 1960 and the events of 1963/64, which also was connected to the fact that Cyprus was a British collony up to 1955, which has to do with Cyprus previous occupation by the Turkish empire and so on and so forth. My aim is to start from the beggining.

Last week at work lunch i got "attacked" by saying "Greeks and Cypriots" during a conversation. The "attackers" said i should be ashamed to say such thing "we are all Greeks!". I pointed out that Cyprus has it's own government seperate from Greece, and they said, "yes, but we share language, culture and tradition with Greece so we are Greeks". I shut up, because i truly am ignorant on these matters and i hate to continue to be thus. the aim of my study is to find out where from were the first people who came on the island, all the events and the reasons behind the events that took place from the first settlers to today, as an attempt to understand the cyprus sociopolitical situation of today, especially after reading CofZ and Ponerology. And perhaps find the answer to the question: Whose island is this anyway? Everybody apparently wants to claim it!

If anyone has any suggestions, guidance or pointers to offer, please feel free, any help is appreciated. I don't even know what help to ask for, so please feel free!
 
Irini,

One point that i want to say only. I am greek but i have lots of friends and since 2000 that i am in london many cypriot colleauges.

Before the invasion of 1974 greek and turkish cypriots were living together with NO PROBLEM. Okay minor incidents may have happened but were they donot when two or more ethnic groups co-exist. The day after the invasion all the cypriots (greek or turkish) who were living in london were united in disgust of what it happened and they were TOGETHER.

The whole invasion was yes supported but the greek junta of the time but with the puppet master being the USA and H. Kissinger who hav emet with Makarios and asked some consecions which he did not get and it is said that he said after the meeting ''you will see what will happen to you, you priest''...

Regarding your last paragraph that cypriots are ''greeks'' well you will ask 100 cypriots and you will get about 100 different opinions. Yes we do share the same language and traditions but i think taking into consideration the geographical position and distance they proceeded in paralel and different routes.

Best regards
Andreas
 
Hi Andreas!

Andreas said:
Before the invasion of 1974 greek and turkish cypriots were living together with NO PROBLEM. Okay minor incidents may have happened but were they donot when two or more ethnic groups co-exist. The day after the invasion all the cypriots (greek or turkish) who were living in london were united in disgust of what it happened and they were TOGETHER.
I am aware with what you say in your latest sentence, since my mother was in London at the time of the invasion. However after the 1963-64 incident, as most report that lived at the time, the tensions between the two communities became more ....tense.

Andreas said:
The whole invasion was yes supported but the greek junta of the time but with the puppet master being the USA and H. Kissinger who hav emet with Makarios and asked some consecions which he did not get and it is said that he said after the meeting ''you will see what will happen to you, you priest''...
I would very much appreciate the source of this information.

Andreas said:
Regarding your last paragraph that cypriots are ''greeks'' well you will ask 100 cypriots and you will get about 100 different opinions. Yes we do share the same language and traditions but i think taking into consideration the geographical position and distance they proceeded in paralel and different routes.
My history professor, who is German but is married to a cypriot and lived here most his life said the following regarding how "Greek" or "Cypriot" Greek Cypriots feel:

"When in 2004 Greece won the EURO, all Cypriots were in the streets celebrating and shouting "We won! We won!". But if you are in Athens and a Greek person tells a Cypriot "Anna Vissy [Greek Cypriot Diva] is the best Greek singer", the Cypriot will say "She is not Greek, she is Cypriot!". "

Yes, we have identity problems :)
 
Cyprus - Genocide under the Auspices of the UN?

Officer releases book on his time in Cyprus

Anne Canalp - Cyprus Today, June 7, 2014

Willy Lindh – Genocide under the Auspices of the UN?

A UNITED Nations officer who served time in prison for assisting Turkish Cypriots in 1964 has written a book about his time in the Swedish UN forces in Cyprus.
Willy Lindh, a former UN lieutenant who will be 77 next month, was based in the Erenkoy enclave of five Turkish Cypriot villages “whose only defence was 200 to 300 villagers with shotguns and volunteer Turkish students with only three to four weeks’ military training”
Now a resident of North Cyprus, he was sentenced to eight months in prison by his home country in 1964 after he helped with weapons transportation to protect the villages.
“I took it to the Supreme Court because I felt that it was my moral obligation to protect the community”, he said.
“I did not feel very good about it but I did go to prison. I was set up by my commanding officer who was making money on weapons deals to both sides.”
He wrote the book by hand nearly 50 years ago while serving his sentence and was urged by his wife to publish his memoirs.
Genocide under the Auspices of the UN? Was published in Swedish in December 2013, priced at £18, but is currently being translated into English and will be published in September.
The 222-page paperback contains around a dozen vintage photos and raised a storm in Sweden where Mr Lindh said the United Nations was “a sacred cow”.
He added that he had received either very positive and supportive feedback or extremely negative reactions to the book after he was interviewed by Swedish TV during the 5oth anniversary of Unficyp.
 
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