Horrific beheading on Canadian Greyhound bus

[Erna]

Killer 'displayed severed head'

Manitoba - A man aboard a Greyhound bus travelling across Canada calmly stabbed another man dozens of times and decapitated him, pausing briefly to display the head to horrified passengers before proceeding to disembowel his victim, witnesses said on Thursday.

Passengers fled the bus in panic, and police said later their quick evacuation may have kept the killer from turning on others.

A 40-year-old man, who was not identified, was arrested for the murder on the bus, which was travelling overnight on Wednesday from Edmonton, Alberta, to Winnipeg, Manitoba, Royal Canadian Mounted Police Sgt Steve Colwell told a news conference.

Colwell said police apprehended the man when he broke a window and tried to escape from the bus by jumping out. Authorities declined to name the victim and provided little details about the stabbing.

Colwell said they didn't know what prompted the attack and said they had not yet interviewed the man as of mid Thursday afternoon. He did not explain the delay.

Passengers said the attacker did not seem to know the victim, who appeared to be about 19 years old, and that he wore sunglasses throughout the attack although it was the middle of the night.

Passenger Garnet Caton said the victim was sleeping with headphones on before he was stabbed 40 or 50 times by the man sitting next to him.

"We heard this bloodcurdling scream and turned around, and the guy was standing up, stabbing this guy repeatedly, like 40 or 50 times," Caton said from a hotel in Brandon, Manitoba, where he and other passengers had been taken to rest.

'When he was attacking him, he was calm...'

Caton said the bus stopped and the passengers scrambled to disembark while the suspect allegedly began methodically carving up the man's body.

The attacker severed the man's head with a large hunting knife and held the head up by the door for others to see.

"When he was attacking him, he was calm ... like he was at the beach," Caton said. "There was no rage or, or anything. He was just like a robot stabbing the guy."

Caton said that the attacker eventually tried to get off the bus, but that he, the driver and a passing trucker who had stopped to help, threw their weight against the door to prevent the man from leaving. When the attacker appeared to be attempting to start up the bus and drive away, the bus driver went to the rear of the bus and somehow disabled it, Caton said.

Fellow passenger Cody Olmstead said the man "dropped the head and went back and started cutting the body back up".

Olmstead said the man later taunted police, who had surrounded the bus, and dropped the head in front of them.

He said some of the passengers were watching the movie "Zorro" when the attack took place.

Greyhound spokesperson Abby Wambaugh said 37 passengers and one driver were on the bus.

Bizarre and extremely rare

The victim had been on the bus since Edmonton. Caton said the attacker boarded the bus around Brandon, Manitoba, about 130 kilometres west of Portage La Prairie, a town in the heart of the Canadian Prairies.

The suspect had been on the bus for about an hour and didn't even sit near his victim at first.

"He sat in the front at first, everything was normal," Caton said.

He continued: "We went to the next stop and he got off and had a smoke with another young lady there. When he got on the bus again, he came to the back near where I was sitting. He put his bags in the overhead compartment. He didn't say a word to anybody. He seemed totally normal. About a half an hour later, we heard this bloodcurdling scream."

Colwell, the RCMP spokesperson, praised the passengers for their behaviour.

"It's not something that happens regularly on a bus," he said. "You're sitting there enjoying your trip and then all of a sudden somebody gets stabbed. I imagine it would be pretty traumatic ... the way they acted was extraordinary."

Colwell added that "they reacted swiftly, calmly in exiting the bus and, as a result, nobody else was injured."

Public Safety Minister Stockwell Day called it a "horrific" incident, but did not discuss details of the attack, saying he did not want to jeopardise the investigation.

"We want to make sure that the process is followed as aggressively as possible, a full legal process, and the perpetrator is definitely dealt with the full force of the law," he said.

Day called it bizarre and extremely rare.

"The horrific nature of it is probably one-of-a-kind in Canadian history," Day said.

Watch Caton describe what he saw


I would imagine this is what a Greenbaum subject acts like. Totally robotic.

 

[anart]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

Yeah, it's really freaky. It was covered on the SotT page yesterday - http://www.sott.net/articles/show/163114-Canada-Man-stabbed-beheaded-on-Manitoba-bus .

One wonders if the killer just 'went off early' - or someone on that bus was targeted to witness such a thing for some reason - and who the young man who he killed was - lots of questions, but really, really bizarre all around.

 

[meat robot]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

-

 

[PepperFritz]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

Most predictably, the sheep are bleating for the death sentence to be reinstated.... The hysteria and petty rancour of Canadian society is becoming quite unbearable....

Huh? Are we living in the same country? You make it sound as though there is some kind of widespread hue and cry among Canadian citizens, politicians, and media to reinstate the death penalty, in response to this event. I have seen no evidence of that -- nothing more than a few reactionary comments by the usual suspects. Most of them are actually being made by Americans, along the lines of "Boy, I bet you guys wish you had the death penalty now..." The murderer is only being charged with second-degree murder, and I've yet to even see any public call for a first-dgree charge instead, let alone a significant call for application of capital punishment.

So far, I've found the Canadian coverage of the event to be pretty measured and non-sensational -- definitely not "hysterical". I think most rational people recognize it as the kind of bizarre event that is, thus far, pretty unique in Canadian society. I understand a couple of wacky opportunistic MPs have some comment about there needing to be a "Knife Registry" in addition to our "Gun Registry", but the government quickly dismissed such an idea as silly and impractical.

Do you have some links that might support your take on how Canadians are reacting to this? I've been reading all of the online media about this event, but maybe there's something I missed...?

 

[anart]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

Huh? Are we living in the same country?

It appears so. I'm curious if you have the same 'reaction' to meatrobot's suggestion that this will spur bus travel 'security' that approaches air travel 'security'? Or, do you find that suggestion as equally implausible as you appear to find the death penalty one - since you seemed to 'react' to the death penalty idea and ignore the point that was the crux of the post - which is that this apparently programmed event could likely put the days of 'free and easy' Canadian bus travel (without being patted down by ponerized security jackboots) into the past.

 

[cholas]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

but more importantly, (I believe) the robot flock is crying out for more "airport type" security for the millions of people who cross the country and board the busses in urban centres and small rural outposts.

Very plausible given that the greenbaumish passenger boarded the bus concealing a 'large hunting knife'. Picture that possibilty at an airport now.

A few thousand miles to the south, long distance busses now frequently must stop at military checkpoints which many times involves the entire bus being searched, including luggage while passengers wait outside. The excuse being primarily 'drug gang violence'.

With the large increase in airfare, many persons have likely turned towards the less costly bus - making this incident very timely. It appears to have the same motif: crackdown on travel.

 

[PepperFritz]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

I'm curious if you have the same 'reaction' to meatrobot's suggestion that this will spur bus travel 'security' that approaches air travel 'security'? ....

There's been a lot more public discussion about the security issue, with many people expressing concern, but thus far the strong call for specific measures has been coming (understandably) mainly from the bus drivers union. Most public/media comments fall on the side of pointing out the financial impracticality of introducing such procedures -- especially in remote rural areas like the site of the current tragedy. The following Canadian Press article comments are typical:

Some passengers said there should be security personnel riding on the buses or screening passengers and their bags, as in airports. But some experts say that’s just not realistic.

"Because of the nature of the industry, which is servicing a lot of small towns, with pickups right along the side of the highway, we’re not dealing with the same kind of a controlled environment like an airport," said David Carroll, the director of safety and maintenance with Motor Coach Canada. "It would be extremely difficult and impractical to introduce screening devices, baggage checks, at all these various locations. I don’t think that’s the answer. . . . It just happened to be on a bus. It could just as easily happened in a theatre, in a bar, in a shopping centre."

Robin West, the Canadian director of the Amalgamated Transit Union, said the financial and manpower costs of any large-scale security measures such as security personnel on every bus or airport-style screening would not make it an attractive option for the bus companies. "It’s brought to light (the question of) is there a possibility of security and screening and stuff? But I’ve got to be honest with you — I don’t know that there is, in most cases. I just don’t know how, feasibly, it could be done." Instead, he suggested putting cameras on buses would go a long way toward deterring crime and providing passengers with some peace of mind.

Ian Jarvis, a contract bus driver in Toronto who does not work for Greyhound, said it would be hard to prevent such an isolated and extreme incident. Besides, he said, people may not be willing to pay for extra security. "People use the bus because it’s cheap. It’s affordable. They’re not going to want to pay two or three people to stand there with a metal detector," he said....

Greyhound Bus services in Canada are used primarily by the financially-challenged and/or geographically isolated. Perhaps a series of violent events on buses would lead to major security changes, but I highly doubt that a relatively isolated incident like this one will alter the status quo that much. After the shock of this incident wears off, financial considerations will likely outweigh everything else.

I also have a problem with the suggestion that the media is avoiding the term "beheaded" in favour of "decapitated". If you do a search on Google News, using those words, you'll find a pretty well equal number of articles using the former as the latter.

 

[anart]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

OK, so your 'reaction' is that you 'don't buy into the security aspect' either? I come to that tentative conclusion, even though the bulk of your response to the question is composed of a newspaper article, which is not your take on it, is it? It is the newspaper's take on it.

You do eventually give your take on it with:

Perhaps a series of violent events on buses would lead to major security changes, but I highly doubt that a relatively isolated incident like this one will alter the status quo that much. After the shock of this incident wears off, financial considerations will likely outweigh everything else.

Then, you return to meatpuppet's post with this:

I also have a problem with the suggestion that the media is avoiding the term "beheaded" in favour of "decapitated". If you do a search on Google News, using those words, you'll find a pretty well equal number of articles using the former as the latter.

Which appears to be, at the minimum, legalistic nitpicking. In other words, why even bring this up at this point? Has your Canadian identification been triggered? Is it simply your 'must be right' program being triggered again by meatpuppet's comments about the Canadian reaction, with which you disagree?

Just curious, since at the base of this thread is the fact that an individual displayed quite blatant and gruesomely deadly symptoms of mind-programming during this murder (as Erna pointed out in her post). We have come to learn that such gruesome displays always serve a purpose, though it is almost never clear what that purpose might be at the time.

Meatpuppet presented his hypothesis on what that purpose might be and you replied with 'do we live in the same country' - turning the conversation in another direction - about the Canadian mindset/country/direction. However, Canadian or not - human beings are human beings and how they are affected by such things and what legislation/controls may follow have very little to do with what country they live in (especially at this point in time). In short; just because they're Canadians doesn't mean logic will prevail - just look at France.

So, not sure if your posts are rooted in an identification with what you think Canadians are - or with 'being right' - no offense intended at all, but it appears you're missing the very subtle point that even if this guy was just stone cold loco - and not programmed - this will have an effect. There is a VERY clear global agenda - and a clear schedule to complete it - several pieces fit, so it's worth considering, exploring and discussing with a minimum of reactions that necessarily limit that discussion.

 

[neema]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

The way I see it is that this is a specific program designed to create multiple reactions (unless this is one of those programs that went off too early). Remember the old saying: problem, reaction, solution. Whether security will increase or not immediately after this incident is not as important as the fact that now chances of airport security at bus terminals are much higher than they were before this incident.

Some passengers said there should be security personnel riding on the buses or screening passengers and their bags, as in airports. But some experts say that’s just not realistic.

"Because of the nature of the industry, which is servicing a lot of small towns, with pickups right along the side of the highway, we’re not dealing with the same kind of a controlled environment like an airport," said David Carroll, the director of safety and maintenance with Motor Coach Canada. "It would be extremely difficult and impractical to introduce screening devices, baggage checks, at all these various locations. I don’t think that’s the answer. . . . It just happened to be on a bus. It could just as easily happened in a theatre, in a bar, in a shopping centre."

That I think is exactly the point. Removing all forms of free travel even in “small towns”, might be exactly what solution they are looking for. In addition, another thing that this incident will help to create will be an increase in general anxiety. Because people don’t like the random aspect of this incident. Just read the quote below from this Canada.com news article:

"This is apparently bizarre behaviour. No provocation, no history between victim and offender, so I'm thinking there was something going on in the offender's mind that led to this attack," he said.
He suggested some "trigger event" inside the bus could have inspired the it.
"It could have been a physical appearance of the victim caused a flashback to some memory . . . what the victim was wearing . . . the music coming out of the headphones . . . there has to have been some particular trigger that led to this kind of an outburst. When you've got a perpetrator and a victim who are absolute strangers to each other, clearly it's not personal, because there's no history."
That absence of any logical root to the act, Baillie said, is what makes it so terrifying.
"We all like to have control over what's going on in our environment, and the difficulty is, we don't know who the person is that is sitting next to us," he said. "Again, what leads to people being concerned about it is, so what am I supposed to do? And it appears to be entirely random and so the answer is there's not much you can do."

__http://www.canada.com/topics/news/story.html?id=ba3498aa-995c-4f03-92f7-1a3cb0c79532

I highlighted what I thought where clues in my opinion in trying to understand this event.

And that’s it right there “there’s not much you can do”. It’s like “resistance is futile” And this kind of feeling is what most people avoid and will emotionally react to in a way to gain some sense of control, osit. Of course there is nothing random about this event if you have been following sott and been connecting the clues. Also now that I have seen the pictures of the attacker and the victim, given that Canada has a large immigrant population, especially a large Asian population, I can’t help to think this will increase animosity between the races and increase the racism in Canada in general.
PepperFritz no matter how unfeasible it may sound to have airport style security in rural areas, it will just take couple more “random” incidents like this for people to be BEGGING for this very type of security. Just take 911 incident. It changed everything. The day after we were in a new world.

 

[meat robot]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

_http://icanhascheezburger.com/

 

[CarpeDiem]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

Tributes paid to Canada bus victim from Arab Emirates' The National
Is it possible to completely reprogram an individual (and regarding how totally coldbloodedly Vince Li had murdered Tim, rather 'robotoid-ize him) in just few days? To greenbaum someone you have to work on them from childhood. There had to be a Watcher on the bus to record/oversee the process and/or trigger Li...

Mr Li’s employer also said in an interview yesterday that he was shocked to learn that his “model employee” had been accused of the grisly attack.
Vincent Augert, an independent contractor who distributes newspapers in Edmonton, said that Mr Li was one of his most reliable carriers.
“He was very punctual and always cleanly dressed,” he said. “He was a very nice, polite guy. We would’ve had no reason to let him go before all this happened.”
Mr Augert said Mr Li had worked for him since last July and caused no problems. “I had no odd suspicions about him at all.”
Mr Augert also said Mr Li called him two weeks ago to say he needed a day or two off to go to Winnipeg for a job interview at the end of July.
He said Mr Li called him back and left a message with the dates, but never followed up after that.
“That was unusual for him not to call back and then when he didn’t show up for work on Tuesday we got worried,” said Mr Augert, who said it was sometimes difficult to understand Mr Li because he spoke quickly and had a strong Chinese accent.
He said he called Mr Li’s mobile phone on Thursday and his wife answered. She told him that she hadn’t heard from Mr Li, who had told her he had to leave for a few days because of a family emergency.

 

[Ruth]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

I'm not sure if this is an example of Greenbauming as described here
http://glossary.cassiopaea.com/glossary.php?id=365
or an example of what a person with mental illness does when they are 'triggered' (or even undiagnosed or noncompliant with medications). So little is known about the mind and what causes people to commit these seemingly random acts of violence that I wonder if these mind experiments are still going on. Generally, if you 'mess' with something, or 'break' it in some way, it doesn't usually perform that well. I wonder if they realised this?

What those Greenbaum and MK Ultra types seemed to be doing (way back in the 50s or 60s?) was actually creating a mental illness in order to control the actions of the person's body to whom the mind belonged! Kind of a risky business, when they can 'go off' at any time.... and there are also so many people out there who are already mentally fragile for many, many reasons. The results tend to be none too subtle, and I don't think that this is what the original mind manipulators had in mind.
Some more seemingly random, possibly trauma related violence.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0777958.html

 

[anart]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

Is it possible to completely reprogram an individual (and regarding how totally coldbloodedly Vince Li had murdered Tim, rather 'robotoid-ize him) in just few days? To greenbaum someone you have to work on them from childhood. There had to be a Watcher on the bus to record/oversee the process and/or trigger Li...

I don't think that the comments from the killer's ex-employer necessarily rule out a 'Greenbauming' situation. The whole point of the programming is to create 'alters' - and one of those alters could have simply been a very, very good employee. So, if this was a programming situation (which we cannot know at this point, one way or another) then it would be completely 'normal' to get reports from people who were acquainted previous to the attack saying, he seemed so nice and normal, calm, etc.

Also, not sure why you think there had to be a Watcher on the bus to control or trigger him. If he was programmed, he could have simply 'gone off early' - which is apparently, not uncommon. Anything could have acted as a trigger - the woman he spoke to over a cigarrette before he got back on the bus, the song playing in the victim's earphones, possibly heard very lightly by Li, sitting next to him, the possibilities are endless. That's assuming he was programmed and just completely insane. His ex-employer's comments actually seem to suggest programming over psychotic since his behavior changed so radically. fwiw.

 

[GRiM]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

It gets worse, and even more strange.


TORONTO — A police officer at the scene of a grisly beheading on a Canadian bus reported seeing the attacker hacking off pieces of the victim's body and eating them, according to a police tape leaked on the Internet Saturday.

In the tape of radio transmissions, a Royal Canadian Mounted Police officer refers to the attacker as "Badger" [Anyone knows what that means? grim] and says he is armed with a knife and scissors and is "defiling the body at the front of the bus as we speak."

Alex McLean, uncle of Tim McLean who was killed aboard a Greyhound bus Wednesday night, surrounded by family members reads a statement from the family Saturday, August 2, 2008, in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada. (AP Photo/The Canadian Press, John Woods)

On the tape, which lasts about 80 seconds, officers continue to detail the attacker's movements until one reports, "Badger's at the back of the bus, hacking off pieces and eating it."

The RCMP described the tapes as "operational police communications and, as such, are not meant for public consumption." Police said permission had not been given to use the radio transmission, which was posted on LiveLeak.com and picked up by other Web sites.
(...)
_http://www.statesman.com/news/content/shared-gen/ap/Canada/Canada_Bus_Stabbing.html



I wonder more about Tim (victim), if he was supposed to do something important?

 

[GRiM]

Horrific incident aboard Canadian Greyhound bus

Questioned about whether weapons regulations should be put into place for buses, Day said it would be premature to look at such precautionary measures but added that the legal process will be followed as "aggressively as possible."

The union that represents Greyhound drivers says the company must move to improve its security measures.

"All we can do is physically observe the individual's behaviour, but obviously the item of destruction got on the bus somehow, and if it was visible to any driver, he would not have boarded the bus just for that simple reason," said Jim Higgs, a spokesman for the Amalgamated Transit Union.

"There has to be some reactive measures taken, whether it be metal screening, or whether we design differently our loading policies at various depots [so] you have to funnel down a chute as your only way onto the bus…. At major terminals, I really believe now we have to do something — not only that, we have to be investigating carry-on luggage and certain things like that."

Greyhound spokeswoman Abby Wambaugh said the company is examining security on buses.

"We are working with Transport Canada to review inter-city bus security," she said.

"Due to the rural nature of our network, airport-type security is not practical for bus travel. It's just a completely different system."

_http://www.statesman.com/news/content/shared-gen/ap/Canada/Canada_Bus_Stabbing.html



I wonder what solution they have ready for this "completely different system" they want to impliment?

(sry, for dubbelpost)