I think I underestimated the impact of joining the discussion.

Lopaka

A Disturbance in the Force
This is a bit of a hello again. Since I joined and then withdrew soon after. While I do have a point to this post. I would also like to offer an apology to those familiar with my first post. It did not go as intended. Oddly enough it seemed I no more than joined the site and things became unusual. Then in all honesty alarmingly difficult. That is until it dawned on me what must be happening. Which I can report, changed all of the most important aspects almost straight away.

Now, I had faced more than a few challenges before arriving here. Not to mention the fact that when I did first come by Laura and Ark. I was in several ways led to things to reflect poorly on them (shocker). Which luckily enough actually made me wonder why and check a few things out. Then these things became more subtle. Yet, powerful all the more for it. Such as those odd looks from the near and dears. Then of course the day came when I saw, what they did not know I could (in retrospect it made it all the more damning,, that silent secret accusation). Which was a website calling Laura a cult leader, conspiracy theorist, anti-semetic,, ect and that Ark had run off, money issues (yep, all the red button words that make us turn up the news). Now at first I was hurt. Could those who knew me so well, possibly think I was crazy or duped by a cult? Then I was angry. Then I was uncertain. Was I crazy? HAD I BEEN DUPED BY A CULT?!! Well thank god I figured that out before I got too involved! Then that voice in me told me to look again and remove my emotions. Which I did and then saw some pretty obvious weak links and the illusion fell apart.

Time went by and faced more than a few set backs. Overcame those and continued the search. Ended up getting "Secret History of the World". Using info from the Cass site and my own research to unravel a question or two. There is much to learn. It can seem daunting, but a thrill at the same time. So feeling as though I was at the very least getting a handle on the concept. Time to network a bit. I thought I was better at recognizing an attack then I apparently was,,, surprise!

So, now we are back to first joining here and that going very oddly for me. Resulting in withdrawing. At that point I felt as though I was still engaged and seeking. I was not. I was disoriented and angry about nothing or things I was never bothered by. I continued to at least track news on Sott, but not track down threads of interest as normal. For all intensive purposes I had set aside meaningful research. I still thought I was engaged. Yet physically and mentally I was spiralling down fast. I won't go into every detail. But it got bad and fast. Unusual and with no apparent cause, physical problems. The worst was the mental attack. Thoughts that in reality make no sense. Yet, they were calling the shots briefly. Not pleasent ones either. Yet all the while on a surface level I kept up. I pondered. I recognized manipulations, ect. Which is why I wanted to make this post. As it may help someone else recognize out of rhythm patterns. I really wanted to remind anyone peeling the layers of the onion. How tricky and cleverly dangerous it can be. When those who wish to keep the secrets. Have such a handy toolbox of nasty tricks to use.

Though I only realized it at about three in the morning this past Saturday. Having come home after work and heading straight for my room to rest. I was now deep in the worst pain of a three day headache. Granted I have always suffered headaches more than the average person it seems. In fact to the degree that often a mild headache is not really noticed. I also have had bad bouts with migraines since childhood. Yet that has been far less in recent years. But here I was with this headache that was like none I had ever had and all of them wrapped up together (symptom wise). It is amazing how difficult the past couple weeks have been. Physical pains and unexplained or wildly out of character reactions. I really felt as though I was cracking up. Between the headache and sinus pressure nothing would touch. Dark thoughts and an oddly matter of fact hopelessness. Then I opened my eyes and turned on the light at 3am. With one thought on my mind. I have been under attack. I will spare the tedious proocess of my associative thoughts. I will say from that point I realized not only had it been an attack. It was beautifully and viciously deceptive. Though a few things just rang off with a clear head. Thoughts not of my personality or intent. A couple so opposite that I am now stunned they did not shake me free as they occured. I do think they were a major factor in the recognition of manipulation. It is also interesting to note that the unusual headache was distracting to say the least and at peaks when these thoughts occured. The most interesting thing to note though was for the majority of the time it was subtle. Meaning taking a very minor concern or fear and amplifiing. Since I was aware of the flaws so to speak. They seemed genuine. Of me if you will. Because it WAS, but during this time it was as though through a megaphone. Things like that came immediately into perspective. The light was back on. In more than one way.

I actually resumed my research (including some tied to cass) that very night. For the next several hours I hit on some major realizations and confirmations for me. It seemed sudden but in reality was months of work come to fuition. This is the same research that was derailed at the time of joining this site. I don't tell this for any reason other than perhaps it helps someone else who may be in a struggle. As I have no doubt that is what it was. It is hard to explain the sense of returning to self that night. Doesn't mean other attacks won't happen. Which was something I understood even before,, in theory. But I realize in some important ways I left guards down. It is easy to do I think.
 
Welcome Lopaka!

In the flavor of "The Matrix", you have chosen the Red Pill?

False knowledge and one's sense of self-reality keeps one in a very
deep sleep and it is much like a drug withdrawal when objective truths
begins to penetrate your slumber. Forces within and without really
attacks hard to keep you in a deep sleep and "they" elicit their helpers to
keep the pressure on you every time you get close to objective truths.

But once you have found the path to seeking objective truths (as a sincere
soul seeker), the more will be given to you so as long as you never give up
seeking. In your journeys, you may find that your faith begins to grow on
a foundation based solely on objective truths while weeding out false knowledge.

This is the work we try to do here. But do not ever think that attacks will cease,
be far from it. According to Don Juan, you must think and act like a warrior, always
be on guard, recognize your "petty tyrant", and continually seek objective truths.

As the C's says: "Knowledge Protects, Ignorance Endangers".

I would suggest that you read as many recommended links provided in:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/site_map_qfg.htm

Specifically:
=======
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/waveindex.htm: The Wave
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/index.html The Cassiopaean Experiment
http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/adventureindex.htm Adventures with Cassiopaea
and the rest.

You might want to look at recommended reading offered in the forum:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=4718

Then daily, read the news site for relevant daily news of the day:
http://www.sott.net

We seek objective truths here and with supported facts - DATA
and be sure to put your sacred cows to pasture. Be prepared to
be objective in all you say here - we will (hopefully) not leave any
stone unturned.
 
dant said:
Welcome Lopaka!

In the flavor of "The Matrix", you have chosen the Red Pill?

False knowledge and one's sense of self-reality keeps one in a very
deep sleep and it is much like a drug withdrawal when objective truths
begins to penetrate your slumber. Forces within and without really
attacks hard to keep you in a deep sleep and "they" elicit their helpers to
keep the pressure on you every time you get close to objective truths.

But once you have found the path to seeking objective truths (as a sincere
soul seeker), the more will be given to you so as long as you never give up
seeking. In your journeys, you may find that your faith begins to grow on
a foundation based solely on objective truths while weeding out false knowledge.

This is the work we try to do here. But do not ever think that attacks will cease,
be far from it. According to Don Juan, you must think and act like a warrior, always
be on guard, recognize your "petty tyrant", and continually seek objective truths.

As the C's says: "Knowledge Protects, Ignorance Endangers".

I would suggest that you read as many recommended links provided in:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/site_map_qfg.htm

Specifically:
=======
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/waveindex.htm: The Wave
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/index.html The Cassiopaean Experiment
http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/adventureindex.htm Adventures with Cassiopaea
and the rest.

You might want to look at recommended reading offered in the forum:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=4718

Then daily, read the news site for relevant daily news of the day:
http://www.sott.net

We seek objective truths here and with supported facts - DATA
and be sure to put your sacred cows to pasture. Be prepared to
be objective in all you say here - we will (hopefully) not leave any
stone unturned.
Thanks for the welcome. I would have to tend to agree with the value of the ref'd material from cass. I know I have certainly found extreme value in it. The recommended reading list as well. While I was familiar or at the very least it was on my radar for many. There are others I had not thought of or was completely unaware of altogether. I have actually been reading sott.net on a daily basis and sacred cows never made much sense to me. Which is actually part of the reason I wanted to make my original post.

It occcured to me that someone such as myself. Who by nature never bought much of what was being sold in regards to relgion, ect. Who in general tended to keep an open mind and look at all sides of a matter. Including when I did not come out looking so good in the end. A person with a strong will and point of view and no qualms about using both. Not to mention a person who by life exp learned to rely on themselves. Which for the most part was to my advantage. A person who though shaken by the shocking nature of some truths. Always suspected the lies, just not the ultimate source. So, recovers from the initial blowback of reality. Shaken, but still standing. Delves deep and technically is doing what they should (i.e the focus of the forum).

It is those types among us I wanted to get the point accross. That no matter the strength you may have or the usual skill at navigating the rocky shores. Do NOT underestimate what you face. Do not think that because you managed well in incredible odds through life. That this will be the same. I in fact made that mistake and it almost cost me quite dearly. It was in recognizing certain control factors and negative influences. Which I shut down or removed. That I "thought" I was better prepared for the (inevitable) attacks then I was. In a sense the gates were locked and the front doors triple locked, but the cellar door was open. Those creaks and groans were not the house settling. Someone was creeping up the cellar stairs while I was focused on the front door. In my over confidence in myself and my usual ability to sense the booby trap. I left myself wide open to attack from places unexpected. An attack blended of my own small fears and failings (as I was paying attention to the major flaws, so to speak) that grew slowly and wove itself around till it was breaking me down (though not realized). It was not until two thoughts/feelings so out of character surfaced that I broke free. Yet even they did not do it instantly. Though I am convinced had I not been suffering so in a physical sense and distracted. They would have rang off sooner. Which in and of itself is something to keep in mind. Especially when dealing with sudden and unusual ailments.

More than anything I felt I should offer that word of caution. Not so much to those well entrenched in the battle. Nor those in basic and still a bit shell shocked. No, I address those of uncommon habit and instinct in the first place. The ones who had no illusion about the lies. Perhaps even uncovered a fair bit themselves? It is we of uncommon lives and exp. Who need caution ourselves against our own certainty. Coming back to your ref to sacred cows. It seems to me there are far more sacred cows then most of us care to admit. Which have nothing to do with religion, politics ect. Sometimes (often it seems) the sacred cow is our own opinion of ourselves. Which of course many of you realize. Though if you realize that then you realize how varied the progress and person can be when they arrive here.
 
Hi Lopaka, and welcome (back). After reading your last reply, I think it could be summarized in one sentence: 'Beware of your sacred cows'. Couldn't be more true, but the rest of your post leaves a lot of questions marks. It would be helpful to other readers if you were more specific. For example:

Lopaka said:
It was not until two thoughts/feelings so out of character surfaced that I broke free.
Which two thoughts/feelings do you mean exactly? And why did they 'break you free'?

In the last paragraph, you suddenly start talking about 'We' instead of 'I'. Are you thus projecting your personal experiences on humanity -or at least the part that tries to wake up- as a whole?

Lopaka said:
It is we of uncommon lives and exp. Who need caution ourselves against our own certainty.
I may be wrong, but do you consider 'certainty' to be the same thing as a sacred cow?

Lopaka said:
Sometimes (often it seems) the sacred cow is our own opinion of ourselves.
Can you provide data to backup this statement? Or is it just your opinion?
 
Hi Lopaka,

It's always good to see a fellow journeyman/person persevere in their journey. And giving us an insight into your trials and obstacles is not only helping us understand where you are coming from, but also helps us when we encounter similar obstacles. However, like salleles, I found it difficult to follow your posts. Not because of your English (it is very good), but because most of your first post referred to people, things and events that you did not specify. They were left as a mystery to us. I'm not sure if you were intentionally omitting specific things, perhaps for reasons of privacy, which is perfectly fine. But without knowing what you were referring to, I found it very hard to follow what you were saying and began to lose the thread of your writing altogether. Here are some quick examples:

Lopaka said:
The worst was the mental attack.
Can you explain this mental attack? You mention it, then continue on with the story as if I should already know everything about this mental attack.
Lopaka said:
Thoughts that in reality make no sense. Yet, they were calling the shots briefly.
Can you give an example of these thoughts that made no sense? Could you describe them? How were they calling the shots? How did they influence you? Even one simple example would have helped me understand what you were talking about here.
Lopaka said:
Not pleasent ones either. Yet all the while on a surface level I kept up. I pondered. I recognized manipulations, ect.
How were they not pleasant? Then, what did you ponder? What manipulations did you recognise? The answers to these questions are invaluable to readers of this forum!

From reading your posts I get the impression you are writing with the assumption that we already know the answers to these questions, that we already know what mental attack occurred, what thoughts called the shots or what manipulations you recognised.

Also, on a very minor and trivial note, you appear to be using full stops (.) in the middle of sentences. Like here:

Lopaka said:
really wanted to remind anyone peeling the layers of the onion.
How tricky and cleverly dangerous it can be.
When those who wish to keep the secrets.
Have such a handy toolbox of nasty tricks to use.
When I read this, it sounded like a) poetry or b) you had just finished running a marathon and were trying to get your words out while catching your breath.
You are using full stops when you really only need commas (,) and in some cases where you don't need anything at all.

Don't forget to be considerate for those reading your posts. They will find disjointed sentences hard to get through. Try this instead:

really wanted to remind anyone peeling the layers of the onion just how tricky and cleverly dangerous it can be when those who wish to keep the secrets have such a handy toolbox of nasty tricks to use.
All I did was take out the full stops and add in the word "just" to bridge two sentences. And presto!

Think of a full stop (.) as a long breath/pause and a comma (,) as a short breath/pause.

Just a few suggestions. :)
 
Thanks for the replies. I will address them further below. You both made some good points. Especially considering the enviroment and lack of info on my part. A large part of it does rest in the fact I tend to be very private. So,,,,, I shall attempt to clarify a bit.

salleles said:
Hi Lopaka, and welcome (back). After reading your last reply, I think it could be summarized in one sentence: 'Beware of your sacred cows'. Couldn't be more true, but the rest of your post leaves a lot of questions marks. It would be helpful to other readers if you were more specific. For example:
Lopaka said:
It was not until two thoughts/feelings so out of character surfaced that I broke free.
salleles said:
Which two thoughts/feelings do you mean exactly? And why did they 'break you free'?.
I did not leave the details out by accident. Though I think I see where the value lies for others in my elaboration. Expressing more personal and private aspects is not typical for me. In short the thoughts/feelings were rage and hopelessness. Both out of character and I will explain how they manifested.
First I'll need to explain I would be considered a survivor by nature (I can elaborate but not needed just now). I would also be a person quite fond of animals. In fact my work is with animals. With those two things in mind I will explain further. While the episode lasted a while I will focus on the last day. On this day I was at work (something that even when hectic, I enjoy). I was actually cross ref'ing some of the cass material off and on. I was granted in the throws of a severe headache of two days and I work with dogs. My mood was foul to say the least. Thoughts of the pointless nature of it all and why bother ect. All the sudden killing myself seemed perfectly rational and matter of fact. I even wrote a note. This was unusual to say the least. I am quite content to be alive and little about my life warrants despair. This was the thought mixed in hopelessness. The other was absolute fury and almost striking a dog. Not just any dog. But my dog a very well trained and sweet natured animal. One who I have litterally never laid an unkind hand on. This is an animal so sensitive to my tone and expression. I need only drop tone or scowl and he is crushed that I am displeased with him. I'd sooner cut my own hand off then harm him. For that matter striking a dog period is out of context. So, that was the thought mixed with rage. While they obviously did not win the day. It was not long after those that I throttled down, but the headache intensified. As I mentioned I went to bed after getting home feeling hollow and at 3am with that very same dog right next to me. I opened my eyes and turned on the light. The first thing I saw clearly was my dog and the warmth and affection I always had infused me. It was right then actually I became aware that I was missing it. Then the past weeks and the thoughts and pain all made sense for what they were. The big goofy lug has never made me anything but proud and feel comforted. I had no intentions of exiting stage left. I was more then content to be alive. They were lies, but built from the small truths inside. Of course I get mad now and then of course I get discouraged now and then, but they never rule.

salleles said:
In the last paragraph, you suddenly start talking about 'We' instead of 'I'. Are you thus projecting your personal experiences on humanity -or at least the part that tries to wake up- as a whole?.
It was meant for those trying to wake. Those who see a note of themselves in me. A certain type of person.

Lopaka said:
It is we of uncommon lives and exp. Who need caution ourselves against our own certainty.
salleles said:
I may be wrong, but do you consider 'certainty' to be the same thing as a sacred cow?
No, not the intent. There are many things people consider themselves to be certain about. In many of those cases they would be justified. What was meant to be conveyed. Was not a general certainty nor even the average person just beginning to look around. It was meant for those who already "got" how off this world is. Those who already made a path were there was none before. Those who already have done a fair bit of soul searching and recognition of self. Yet are only recently standing even further back and finally see the big picture. The ref was meant for our certainty about ourselves and our ability to recognize when we are being influenced. When our strongest truth has been our own drive.

Lopaka said:
Sometimes (often it seems) the sacred cow is our own opinion of ourselves.
salleles said:
Can you provide data to backup this statement? Or is it just your opinion?
Sure. Depending on your point of view. Any person whom has never had any trust or belief in the church or goverment. Any person faced repeatedly with extreme odds and overcame and thrived. Any person forced to grow up long before puberty sets in. Any person consistently failed by those around them when growing. Any person who had to rely on themselves more than anyone else. Anyone who went through great trial and still kept balanced, or at the very least recovered it. These people are quite likely going to have the most faith and trust in themselves and their abilities. This is again not a grand all encompassing notion. Many face those things and crumble under the weight or seek excuse and sympathy. It however is valid for others. For example tell me religion is a lie and the goverment is wicked. Ok,,, and the point being? Because it is and has always been that obvious to me. Now tell me my will could be bent to anothers purpose. Tell me my love could be twisted to rage. That would bother me and concern me. Then tell me even once aware of the danger, my defenses could fall? I might fail to recognize the danger? That would be the closest thing to an assualt on my sacred cow. Though I don't think myself all knowing or anything of the kind. I have tended to be more honest and realistic about my nature then most I know. I may not be overly common, but I doubt seriously my lock on that market.
So for me and I am sure at least a few others out there. The sacred cow was not even something I was really aware I had since it was not based on mass belief or even a personal belief. It was just who I was and yet turned out to be a belief.



Nathan said:
Hi Lopaka,

It's always good to see a fellow journeyman/person persevere in their journey. And giving us an insight into your trials and obstacles is not only helping us understand where you are coming from, but also helps us when we encounter similar obstacles. However, like salleles, I found it difficult to follow your posts. Not because of your English (it is very good), but because most of your first post referred to people, things and events that you did not specify. They were left as a mystery to us. I'm not sure if you were intentionally omitting specific things, perhaps for reasons of privacy, which is perfectly fine. But without knowing what you were referring to, I found it very hard to follow what you were saying and began to lose the thread of your writing altogether. Here are some quick examples:
Lopaka said:
The worst was the mental attack.
Nathan said:
Can you explain this mental attack? You mention it, then continue on with the story as if I should already know everything about this mental attack.
Lopaka said:
Thoughts that in reality make no sense. Yet, they were calling the shots briefly.
Nathan said:
Can you give an example of these thoughts that made no sense? Could you describe them? How were they calling the shots? How did they influence you? Even one simple example would have helped me understand what you were talking about here.
Lopaka said:
Not pleasent ones either. Yet all the while on a surface level I kept up. I pondered. I recognized manipulations, ect.
Nathan said:
How were they not pleasant? Then, what did you ponder? What manipulations did you recognise? The answers to these questions are invaluable to readers of this forum!.
As you see above I have addressed a bit of this info. Your point is more than valid though. The habit of protecting myself and there by my personal info is hard to break.
I will address further the manipulations and why it got me. See when I first began to really take apart what I did and why. I identified how easily I was manipulated where possesions and money are concerned (having had nothing as a child. my success was of great import to me). As well as vanity, sex, ect. All had served the purpose of someone quite well for some time,,, just not me. Now these things still acted on me. They just stopped winning and were by all accounts under control. That is when I got careless and the things that have never been a big player in my life. Such as fear, hopelessness and constant low level aggrivation took hold. Very slowly and in small increases over weeks. In addition to repeated severe headaches and nausea. As well as aches and pains never before an issue. In recognizing the majors I underestimated the minors and what they could do.



Nathan said:
Also, on a very minor and trivial note, you appear to be using full stops (.) in the middle of sentences. Like here:.
Lopaka said:
really wanted to remind anyone peeling the layers of the onion.
How tricky and cleverly dangerous it can be.
When those who wish to keep the secrets.
Have such a handy toolbox of nasty tricks to use.
Nathan said:
When I read this, it sounded like a) poetry or b) you had just finished running a marathon and were trying to get your words out while catching your breath.
You are using full stops when you really only need commas (,) and in some cases where you don't need anything at all.
You know I am really glad you made this comment. You actually nailed it pretty close and I didn't even think about it before. You said it sounded like poetry.
Mystery solved. Poetic license gone awry. Being that the vast majority of any writing I have ever done is poetry (oh from about 7yrs to now). I am not surprised to see a blending. The rest your typical notes to and fro, or training manuals I had edited by another. Good advice and eye. Now to break the habit. ;-) Ah, the little things. Granted I am sure faux pas and typo will exist. I will attempt to break that habit.
 
Thank you for this post! After reading this I have decided to forgo any further postings on this forum until I complete my reading of 'The Secret History' and gain a better understanding of where most everyone else on this forum is 'coming from' so to speak. Time spent learning is time better spent than battling against frustration. When one approaches new or unusual modes of thought/philosophies/paradigms it can be extremely difficult.

Having spent four years of my life in a Christian fundamentalist church that was actually in fact a cult I can really understand what you mean by the following:

L said:
Then I was uncertain. Was I crazy? HAD I BEEN DUPED BY A CULT?!! Well thank god I figured that out before I got too involved! Then that voice in me told me to look again and remove my emotions. Which I did and then saw some pretty obvious weak links and the illusion fell apart.
Because of my own experience my guard is constantly up against 'being duped again' and so forth, but I realize thanks to your post that I'm not the only one wrestling with these issues as it pertains to this forum/paradigm and that due to the specialized nature of this arena one must tread very carefully.
 
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