Is this intefering with free will?

Lizziespreparetogovegan

Lizziespreparetogovegan

Jedi Master
Hi all

I attended an introductory Health Kinesiology course over last weekend. During one of the group exercises the teacher asked for a volunteer participant for a procedure which was based around reducing stress for a particular 'worry' that was current in the persons life. One of our group volunteered to get up on the couch and upon being asked what this particular stress was, she announced that she had terminal breast cancer. Needless to say, this was quite a shock for the rest of the group and we all became quite emotional.

So, I was thinking about emailing her with the link to the Eiriu Eolas site and explaining some of the benefits of the program. Although she said that her cancer is 'terminal' she seems keen to explore any avenue that may help her situation and has been having regular kinesiology treatments. She is quite young, about late thirties I'd say, has 4 year old twins and has expressed a desire to challenge her situation and stay alive. However, it would really be an unsolicited email as I'd have to get her address off the class list, she has not given it to me personally. So is this interfering with free will?

On the one hand I think that the program may be of huge benefit to her emotionally and spiritually in a horrendously challenging time. But then again, she may feel it an intrusion for me to contact her with the information so I'm essentially trying to weigh up the potential benefits of the program against the breach of free will. There's also the issue of having to present/explain the program as objectively as possible whilst avoiding giving any 'false hope'. She may have nothing to loose at this stage but the issue of free will seems pertinent.

This has been on my mind for a few days now and was just wondering what others thought....
 
[quote author=Pai]Although she said that her cancer is 'terminal' she seems keen to explore any avenue that may help her situation and has been having regular kinesiology treatments.[/quote]

By saying she seems keen to explore, do you mean that in some way she has expressed interest in anything additional to her kinesiology treatments?
 
Maybe you could explore this ... You could give your contact details to the person who organised the kinesiology course and let them know that you would like the said lady to get in touch with you. You could even let the organiser know that you want to share some info about a breathing/meditation program you use and find beneficial for health, etc. Then the lady has the option to call you if she chooses. As far as stepping over the free will line, I perceive that she was opening her arms to help by sharing her situation with the class in the first place and being a volunteer participant.
Please someone correct me if my understanding of free will is incorrect.
 
Jerry said:
[quote author=Pai]Although she said that her cancer is 'terminal' she seems keen to explore any avenue that may help her situation and has been having regular kinesiology treatments.
Click to expand...

By saying she seems keen to explore, do you mean that in some way she has expressed interest in anything additional to her kinesiology treatments?
[/quote]

Good question Jerry and on reflection, perhaps this is my own interpretation of her intention. After the procedure, she expressed the fact that she was 'alive and it was her intention to stay alive by 'whatever means' despite the gravity of her situation. I walked to the train station with her after class one evening and she expressed that she felt 'alternative therapy' was/had been beneficial but that her husband was very cynical about any benefits.

So she hasn't explicitly stated that she wants to explore anything specific. Again, this is really my own interpretation.
 
Pai said:
So, I was thinking about emailing her with the link to the Eiriu Eolas site and explaining some of the benefits of the program. Although she said that her cancer is 'terminal' she seems keen to explore any avenue that may help her situation and has been having regular kinesiology treatments. She is quite young, about late thirties I'd say, has 4 year old twins and has expressed a desire to challenge her situation and stay alive. However, it would really be an unsolicited email as I'd have to get her address off the class list, she has not given it to me personally. So is this interfering with free will?
Click to expand...

I think its a good idea, this way you are presenting her another choice and it is up to her to try it or not.

Asking does not always means that the other is going to directly ask you because the other is not always aware where He or She can find help and so life brings oportunities through those who can see more, have knowledge and are ready to give.

The important thing here is that no expectation, anticipation or control over the situation should enter the picture just the human beautifull hability to empathize, give knowledge and let the other decide.

Edit: Added quotation to clarify content.
 
fisheye said:
Maybe you could explore this ... You could give your contact details to the person who organised the kinesiology course and let them know that you would like the said lady to get in touch with you. You could even let the organiser know that you want to share some info about a breathing/meditation program you use and find beneficial for health, etc. Then the lady has the option to call you if she chooses. As far as stepping over the free will line, I perceive that she was opening her arms to help by sharing her situation with the class in the first place and being a volunteer participant.
Please someone correct me if my understanding of free will is incorrect.
Click to expand...
.
Thanks for your input Fisheye. To be honest, this would feel more awkward for me. ie setting up a bit of a 'mystery'. Also, we are all in communication via group emails, so whilst I mentioned the message would be unsolicited perhaps it's not a huge jump to just fire off a personal one to her.

With the free will issue, yes, perhaps partially she did volunteer for that particular excercise in order to 'announce' her situation to the group as well as receive the treatment. I suppose the question of whether to contact her has got me thinking about the larger issues about free will, incarnational lessons , the free will of her family, children etc. I don't know, perhaps I'm really over complicating things...
 
If I where in you're situation, I'd print a few thing out (check the forum and SoTT - cancer is a complex problem) and offer them to her with a pinch of salt. Also mention the EE website (and the entire program being free - or lend her the DVD?). Free will isn't violated if you offer something they can take or leave....just be aware that you should attach no outcome to the offer of information. Sometimes its better to at least try and point out alternatives, even if they are not interested.
The dietary recommendations (cutting out gluten/dairy/sugar etc) may be something you can explore with her too...one of the articles I found said that low fat diet don't cut heart disease and cancer risks....so the idea of good fat may be something you could explore.

Some things that may (or may not) help (probably best just to pick one or two and see how they go down rather than overload her at once?)
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/208378-Half-of-breast-cancer-patients-suffer-symptoms-of-post-traumatic-stress-disorder-
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/202714-Breast-Cancer-Virtually-Eradicated-with-Higher-Levels-of-Vitamin-D
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/219571-Study-explains-why-omega-3-fatty-acids-prevent-breast-cancer
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/131141-Alcohol-increases-a-woman-s-risk-of-developing-breast-cancer-but-smoking-has-no-impact
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/222037-The-importance-of-sleeping-in-total-darkness-Sleeping-with-lights-on-can-spur-cancer
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/185189-Zinc-and-Selenium-are-the-Minerals-that-Fight-Breast-Cancer
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/208322-Curcumin-and-Black-Pepper-Combine-to-Stop-Breast-Cancer-Tumor-Cells
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/219322-Surgeon-birth-control-pill-a-molotov-cocktail-for-breast-cancer
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/213341-Are-Household-Cleaners-Linked-to-Breast-Cancer-
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/125343-Pretty-Ugly-Cosmetics-Ingredients-Linked-to-Breast-Cancer-
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/169637-Breast-Cancer-Rates-Higher-after-Mammograms-Study-Suggests-Cancers-May-Go-Away-on-Their-Own
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/184191-Radiation-treatment-for-Breast-Cancer-causes-Cancer-in-the-other-Breast
 
Ana said:
I think its a good idea, this way you are presenting her another choice and it is up to her to try it or not.

Asking does not always means that the other is going to directly ask you because the other is not always aware where He or She can find help and so life brings oportunities through those who can see more, have knowledge and are ready to give.

The important thing here is that no expectation, anticipation or control over the situation should enter the picture just the human beautifull hability to empathize, give knowledge and let the other decide.
Click to expand...

Thank-you Ana

This was generally my thinking. I think my hesitation comes also from my own programs: When others present me with an option where I can see they've put time and effort into thinking about something that may benefit me, I often feel guilty and thus pressured if my initial inclination is to disregard what they've said. Obviously I'm quite conscious of wanting to avoid creating such feelings in this individual.

I suppose I'll have to construct the message carefully and try to communicate this somehow in a subtle way.

If I where in you're situation, I'd print a few thing out (check the forum and SoTT - cancer is a complex problem) and offer them to her with a pinch of salt. Also mention the EE website (and the entire program being free - or lend her the DVD?). Free will isn't violated if you offer something they can take or leave....just be aware that you should attach no outcome to the offer of information. Sometimes its better to at least try and point out alternatives, even if they are not interested.
The dietary recommendations (cutting out gluten/dairy/sugar etc) may be something you can explore with her too...one of the articles I found said that low fat diet don't cut heart disease and cancer risks....so the idea of good fat may be something you could explore.
Click to expand...

Thanks Redfox

These links look useful, I actually had a look at some of them yesterday. Again though, I'm conscious of not wanting to bombard her with too much or come across with an attitude of 'I know what's good for you', especially from a relative stranger.

Although ironically, if there's a chance of beating terminal breast cancer, most of the solutions probably lie with the links you've provided. I might try and slip some in whilst being as subtle as I can :)
 
I personally encourage you to introduce her to the EE program. You'd simply be opening a door in her life and it will be her free will choice if she decides to step through or not.

As to HOW you introduce her to this program is up to you.
 
[quote author=Pai]These links look useful, I actually had a look at some of them yesterday. Again though, I'm conscious of not wanting to bombard her with too much or come across with an attitude of 'I know what's good for you', especially from a relative stranger.[/quote]

If for you it remains a gray issue regarding abridging free will, there's the option of contacting her and truthfully stating that you felt she seemed interested in exploring the alternatives and that you will be at her service when needed.
 
Hi Pai,

I have come across some people that have arbitrarily asked for help or suggestions regarding their health. When it was available for me to talk with them, asked if they minded some friendly advice. Then I passed them the URL for EE and recommended some books on diet and health. Talked about the evils of wheat, dairy and sugar and explained how much better I feel after not eating those things. Then let them mull over the info. The rest was up to them.

I always ask first if they would like some advice before I just pour out all the info. Not sure how many have followed through, and I have not held onto or followed up with any questions because I did not want to infringe on their free will. One or two people I have encountered have given me some feed back about diet, though none have ever mentioned the EE program.

I feel that whenever an opportunity arises to share EE, I go for it without any anticipation on the outcome.
 
Pai said:
This was generally my thinking. I think my hesitation comes also from my own programs: When others present me with an option where I can see they've put time and effort into thinking about something that may benefit me, I often feel guilty and thus pressured if my initial inclination is to disregard what they've said. Obviously I'm quite conscious of wanting to avoid creating such feelings in this individual.
Click to expand...

That's not unusual but as you said it is just a program wich you are projecting and blocks your hability to give without controlling the situation.
There is the possibility that this occurs in her but there are also more possibilities. Now focussing on this one you are restricting the others. Simply, let things unfold without anticipate.

In respect to yourself:

Pay said:
When others present me with an option where I can see they've put time and effort into thinking about something that may benefit me, I often feel guilty and thus pressured if my initial inclination is to disregard what they've said
Click to expand...

That is a generalization wich is usually how programs work, preventing us from seeing each situation for what it is.
In any case you need to discern where your inclination to disregard what other's have said is. Is it based on knowledge of what the options are, how you can implement them, its effectivity, because you are not motivated to try them...? What is it based on?

The fact that others put effort is not what makes it appropriate or not, it is the veracity and practical utility of what they are presenting to you what matters.
The pressure comes from preocupation of what they would think of you, and that's not something is gonna realy benefit you or them, it is the base of your decision to decline or not what others say that counts, osit.
 
Ana said:
That's not unusual but as you said it is just a program wich you are projecting and blocks your hability to give without controlling the situation. [..]

The fact that others put effort is not what makes it appropriate or not, it is the veracity and practical utility of what they are presenting to you what matters.

The pressure comes from preocupation of what they would think of you, and that's not something is gonna realy benefit you or them, it is the base of your decision to decline or not what others say that counts, osit.
Click to expand...

Very much agree. The predator can twist the Free Will concept very masterfully to justify inner considering and lack of action.
Simply sending the link to EE/ mentioning it, in this case, IMO is simply following the call and the flow of the universe.
 
Thanks to all of you for your input. I'm definitely going to contact this individual with the link to the EE site and perhaps some other info.

I don't think I'd normally ponder the issue so much only for the fact that the woman is dying and I suppose I spent time trying to put myself in her shoes and think how I would react to a message with suggestions from someone I hardly knew. Ultimately I guess this is almost impossible as I've never been in the situation.

Ana said:
Pai said:
This was generally my thinking. I think my hesitation comes also from my own programs: When others present me with an option where I can see they've put time and effort into thinking about something that may benefit me, I often feel guilty and thus pressured if my initial inclination is to disregard what they've said. Obviously I'm quite conscious of wanting to avoid creating such feelings in this individual.
Click to expand...

That's not unusual but as you said it is just a program wich you are projecting and blocks your hability to give without controlling the situation.
There is the possibility that this occurs in her but there are also more possibilities. Now focussing on this one you are restricting the others. Simply, let things unfold without anticipate.
Click to expand...

You're right, alot of projection here which has narrowed my consideration. It's interesting as I have a definite program that tends to almost reject out of hand much advice or help which is given by others often without real consideration of whether it may be helpful to me. My wife has pointed this out to me many times and on reflection I think this stems from having very controlling parents and thus being averse to 'being told what to do'.

Ana said:
The fact that others put effort is not what makes it appropriate or not, it is the veracity and practical utility of what they are presenting to you what matters.
The pressure comes from preocupation of what they would think of you, and that's not something is gonna realy benefit you or them, it is the base of your decision to decline or not what others say that counts, osit.
Click to expand...

Indeed, the old 'what will they think' program again which has dominated me for so much of my life. I'll get the message off some time this evening I think.......
 
her husband was very cynical about any benefits.
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This line worries me. It seems that the husband does not show much respect for her free will. This might be an ongoing problem in her relationship and cause much tension and stress.I think foremost this woman needs to feel safe and respected for who she is.



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