Music and the Work

[BHelmet]

Music is such a powerful medium. Powerful in that it accesses the imagination, the mind and the emotions and the body: all the lower centers, for sure. Thus it is no wonder that the PTB would seek to use this medium to their advantage, since manipulation, by any means, is their middle name. If they go to such great lengths to control mainstream media news, TV programming, and movies, certainly the music industry is not immune to their manipulation and control. This should be self-evident by now, I would think. OK, onward.

Perhaps because music can access the emotions directly (and thus bypass the rational mind), dive into the sub-conscious mind, AND influence the body, I believe it provides a fertile ground for 4th way self-observation and study. One of the things Gurdjieff said early on as relayed by Ouspenski in ISOTM, was that we are subject to a series of 'likes' and 'don't likes' by all the little I's; petty, subjective, egoistic tastes (my words). Certainly music is a vast playground for subjective likes and dislikes. Furthermore, it could be argued that what and who we like or dislike may even be reflective of our state of development, awareness and being. (but not to worry, I ain't goin' there!!!)

I think music can also become a kind of sacred cow: an area in which, on a sub-conscious level, 'work' is not required, since music can be viewed as much as vicarious enjoyment/experience and escapism as anything else: an area where 'slacking off' is allowed. However, when this is the case, music also can become an avenue of attack, manipulation, and frequency dampening when we are asleep about it.

Another reason music is such a ripe ground for self examination is that the personal ego can get so tied up in all the likes and dislikes and can feel its identity threatened if some other person criticizes or is indifferent to an artist or song that is heavily identified with and strongly FELT. The area of our personal tastes make a great test tube for creating shocks designed to separate the real I from all the others.

So, I would like to open up a discussion about these issues.

What popular bands and songs are clearly 4D STS manipulations? What type of music are you a sucker for? WHY do you like a particular genre? Does your taste in music reflect your personal aim in life? Are there mind-controlled SRA slaves performing and dominating the radio waves? WHY do they keep playing a lot of the same old crappy songs on the radio DECADE AFTER DECADE? What is more important in determining a songs value: the lyrics or the sound/mood/feeling? Can you tell a Narcissist when you hear one singing? WHY are there SO many female vocalists these days who use that wispy, femme fatale LITTLE CUTSEY GIRL voice? (NOOOO connection to pedophiles in the entertainment industry, right?) Is the NSA using musical tastes and downloads to track and identify certain 'types'. Is the song Somewhere Over the Rainbow really used as a mind-control programming tool like Catcher in the Rye? And if so, do it's sentiments tend to favor.....



.......aw, screw it...



here is the Paramus New Jersey All-Star Kazoo Ensemble doing the William Tell Overture:



embed][/embed

 

[luc]

Thank you BHelmet, I think you summarized some very important aspects of programming via modern music.

Music is such a powerful medium. Powerful in that it accesses the imagination, the mind and the emotions and the body: all the lower centers, for sure. Thus it is no wonder that the PTB would seek to use this medium to their advantage, since manipulation, by any means, is their middle name. If they go to such great lengths to control mainstream media news, TV programming, and movies, certainly the music industry is not immune to their manipulation and control. This should be self-evident by now, I would think. OK, onward.

Yes indeed. Just listen to "Top 40 radio" (I have to sometimes in the gym, yuck!), the programming has become so blatantly obvious - glorification of abusive relationships, total sexualization, treating people (especially women) as objects, violence, pedophilia, promotion of drinking/drug abuse... the psychopathic mindset in a nutshell! It's so disgusting.

Just look at this text by Rhianna for example:

LOVE THE WAY YOU LIE

On the first page of our story
the future seemed so bright
then this thing turned out so evil
I don't know why I'm still surprised
even angels have their wicked schemes
and you take that to new extremes
but you'll always be my hero
even though you've lost your mind
Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
I love the way you lie Ohhh, I love the way you lie
Now there's gravel in our voices
glass is shattered from the fight
in this tug of war, you'll always win
even when I'm right 'cause you feed me fables from your hand
with violent words and empty threats
and it's sick that all these battles
are what keeps me satisfied
Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
So maybe I'm a masochist
I try to run but I don't wanna ever leave
til the walls are goin' up
in smoke with all our memories
Love the way you lie

No questions...

Now compare this to "Lemon Tree" by Peter, Paul and Mary from the early 60's that warns us about the toxic relationships Rhianna is so blatantly promoting, and it becomes obvious to what a shocking degree the psychos have succeeded in hijacking our culture during the last years:

LEMON TREE

When I was just a lad of ten, my father said to me,
"Come here and take a lesson from the lovely lemon tree."
"Don't put your faith in love, my boy", my father said to me,
"I fear you'll find that love is like the lovely lemon tree."

Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.
Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.

One day beneath the lemon tree, my love and I did lie
A girl so sweet that when she smiled the stars rose in the sky.
We passed that summer lost in love beneath the lemon tree
the music of her laughter hid my father's words from me:

Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.
Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.

One day she left without a word. She took away the sun.
And in the dark she left behind, I knew what she had done.
She'd left me for another, it's a common tale but true.
A sadder man but wiser now I sing these words to you:

Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.
Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.

Perhaps because music can access the emotions directly (and thus bypass the rational mind), dive into the sub-conscious mind, AND influence the body, I believe it provides a fertile ground for 4th way self-observation and study. One of the things Gurdjieff said early on as relayed by Ouspenski in ISOTM, was that we are subject to a series of 'likes' and 'don't likes' by all the little I's; petty, subjective, egoistic tastes (my words). Certainly music is a vast playground for subjective likes and dislikes. Furthermore, it could be argued that what and who we like or dislike may even be reflective of our state of development, awareness and being. (but not to worry, I ain't goin' there!!!)

Yes, I do that as well - when I listen to music (or when I'm forced to listen to music :)), I try to observe what it does to me - sometimes I'm just disgusted, sometimes there is a rush of "happy chemicals" even though I don't like the music, and sometimes I start crying because there is so much truth in a song - not only the text, but the performance, the interpretation... And yes, I think it has something to do with where you are in life, what stuff you're working on/thinking about etc.

I think music can also become a kind of sacred cow: an area in which, on a sub-conscious level, 'work' is not required, since music can be viewed as much as vicarious enjoyment/experience and escapism as anything else: an area where 'slacking off' is allowed. However, when this is the case, music also can become an avenue of attack, manipulation, and frequency dampening when we are asleep about it.

Another reason music is such a ripe ground for self examination is that the personal ego can get so tied up in all the likes and dislikes and can feel its identity threatened if some other person criticizes or is indifferent to an artist or song that is heavily identified with and strongly FELT. The area of our personal tastes make a great test tube for creating shocks designed to separate the real I from all the others.

Yes, I sort of was in the music business for a while, and all that crappy music - not only mainstream, but all kinds of "niche" music as well! - really contributed to my totally ponerized world view at that time. I idealized various "artists" and tried to copy what I thought were their "succesful lifestyles", causing misery for myself and others. It wasn't the only factor of course, but I think it was very effective in my programming.

As you said, identification can be really strong - either with a certain artist/band or with a certain "style". It's so crazy how simple it is to divide people and corner them - a dream for the psychos in power!

After I went through a process of "deprogramming" where I completely refrained from listening to any music (just couldn't bring myself to it), I'm now slowly recovering and discovering great music, usually stuff I once dismissed as totally "uncool" It's really such a shame that the PTB managed to root out most of the great music from the mainstream since indeed good music can be so empowering and helpful in terms of knowing oneself, working with the emotional center etc.

 

[MusicMan]

Music is such a powerful medium. Powerful in that it accesses the imagination, the mind and the emotions and the body: all the lower centers, for sure. Thus it is no wonder that the PTB would seek to use this medium to their advantage, since manipulation, by any means, is their middle name. If they go to such great lengths to control mainstream media news, TV programming, and movies, certainly the music industry is not immune to their manipulation and control. This should be self-evident by now, I would think. OK, onward.

Perhaps because music can access the emotions directly (and thus bypass the rational mind), dive into the sub-conscious mind, AND influence the body, I believe it provides a fertile ground for 4th way self-observation and study. One of the things Gurdjieff said early on as relayed by Ouspenski in ISOTM, was that we are subject to a series of 'likes' and 'don't likes' by all the little I's; petty, subjective, egoistic tastes (my words). Certainly music is a vast playground for subjective likes and dislikes. Furthermore, it could be argued that what and who we like or dislike may even be reflective of our state of development, awareness and being. (but not to worry, I ain't goin' there!!!)

I think music can also become a kind of sacred cow: an area in which, on a sub-conscious level, 'work' is not required, since music can be viewed as much as vicarious enjoyment/experience and escapism as anything else: an area where 'slacking off' is allowed. However, when this is the case, music also can become an avenue of attack, manipulation, and frequency dampening when we are asleep about it.

Another reason music is such a ripe ground for self examination is that the personal ego can get so tied up in all the likes and dislikes and can feel its identity threatened if some other person criticizes or is indifferent to an artist or song that is heavily identified with and strongly FELT. The area of our personal tastes make a great test tube for creating shocks designed to separate the real I from all the others.

So, I would like to open up a discussion about these issues.

What popular bands and songs are clearly 4D STS manipulations? What type of music are you a sucker for? WHY do you like a particular genre? Does your taste in music reflect your personal aim in life? Are there mind-controlled SRA slaves performing and dominating the radio waves? WHY do they keep playing a lot of the same old crappy songs on the radio DECADE AFTER DECADE? What is more important in determining a songs value: the lyrics or the sound/mood/feeling? Can you tell a Narcissist when you hear one singing? WHY are there SO many female vocalists these days who use that wispy, femme fatale LITTLE CUTSEY GIRL voice? (NOOOO connection to pedophiles in the entertainment industry, right?) Is the NSA using musical tastes and downloads to track and identify certain 'types'. Is the song Somewhere Over the Rainbow really used as a mind-control programming tool like Catcher in the Rye? And if so, do it's sentiments tend to favor.....



.......aw, screw it...



here is the Paramus New Jersey All-Star Kazoo Ensemble doing the William Tell Overture:



embed][/embed

Compare the pair - "Over the Rainbow"

The Judy Garland version, from "The Wizard of Oz":

_www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSZxmZmBfnU

or this,
The version I like, from the hawaiian Israel "Iz" Ka'ano'i Kamakawiwo'Ole, not long before he died:

_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1bFr2SWP1I

The piece at the end is where they are distributing his ashes.
Very poignant!

 

[BHelmet]

Thank you BHelmet, I think you summarized some very important aspects of programming via modern music.

Thank you, so very much, for your response, Luc. I know you 'got it'. I was starting to feel a little out on the skinny branches with my desire to delve into this area with a magnifying glass. I think watching the manipulation of pop culture and musical taste is as informative and important as monitoring the 'news'. US society is molded this way as much as through the 'education' system. And let's not forget we export this 'culture' (which, by and large, isn't really culture at all, in the traditional sense) all over the world.

Yes indeed. Just listen to "Top 40 radio" (I have to sometimes in the gym, yuck!), the programming has become so blatantly obvious - glorification of abusive relationships, total sexualization, treating people (especially women) as objects, violence, pedophilia, promotion of drinking/drug abuse... the psychopathic mindset in a nutshell! It's so disgusting.

Just look at this text by Rhianna for example:

LOVE THE WAY YOU LIE
even angels have their wicked schemes
and you take that to new extremes
but you'll always be my hero
even though you've lost your mind
Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
I love the way you lie Ohhh, I love the way you lie
and it's sick that all these battles
are what keeps me satisfied
Just gonna stand there and watch me burn
but that's all right because I like the way it hurts
just gonna stand there and hear me cry
but that's all right because I love the way you lie
So maybe I'm a masochist
I try to run but I don't wanna ever leave
til the walls are goin' up
in smoke with all our memories
Love the way you lie

Fabulous example. So amazingly, outrageously dysfunctional and unhealthy, right? I'm like: Is this really happening? It is just so far over the line. Fantastic example. Now this one is so in-your-face, but there are other more subtle and accepted and ingrained formats that fly right under the radar. e.g., All the "I WANT you, I NEED you" type songs. The same fundamental dysfunctional relationship that religion creates with regard to 'god'!

Now compare this to "Lemon Tree" by Peter, Paul and Mary from the early 60's that warns us about the toxic relationships Rhianna is so blatantly promoting, and it becomes obvious to what a shocking degree the psychos have succeeded in hijacking our culture during the last years:

LEMON TREE
Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.
Lemon tree very pretty and the lemon flower is sweet
but the fruit of the poor lemon is impossible to eat.

I totally remember this song. Sigh, I was powerless to combat the sweetness of the flower in spite of the warning! (ha)

Perhaps because music can access the emotions directly (and thus bypass the rational mind), dive into the sub-conscious mind, AND influence the body, I believe it provides a fertile ground for 4th way self-observation and study. One of the things Gurdjieff said early on as relayed by Ouspenski in ISOTM, was that we are subject to a series of 'likes' and 'don't likes' by all the little I's; petty, subjective, egoistic tastes (my words). Certainly music is a vast playground for subjective likes and dislikes. Furthermore, it could be argued that what and who we like or dislike may even be reflective of our state of development, awareness and being. (but not to worry, I ain't goin' there!!!)

Yes, I do that as well - when I listen to music (or when I'm forced to listen to music :)), I try to observe what it does to me - sometimes I'm just disgusted, sometimes there is a rush of "happy chemicals" even though I don't like the music, and sometimes I start crying because there is so much truth in a song - not only the text, but the performance, the interpretation... And yes, I think it has something to do with where you are in life, what stuff you're working on/thinking about etc.

Awesome. I feel not so alone to hear this and good to be able to discuss this. So many nuances. WHY do I 'like' what I like? I know it sounds a bit crazy to have that conversation with yourself, but so much can be learned since it gives access to our automatic response - we can't help liking what we like...but WHY? It also is a clear message from the PTB: what do they think of us, what are they trying to get us to become? How can we resist this domination? In what ways do we allow ourselves to empower our own demise with "It's always a good time. Whoa-o Whoa-o" (trying to keep it upbeat) How do we empower our spiritual sleep with our music choices? Where does one draw the line between peaceful, meditative introspection and self-calming, willful blindness?

I think music can also become a kind of sacred cow: an area in which, on a sub-conscious level, 'work' is not required, since music can be viewed as much as vicarious enjoyment/experience and escapism as anything else: an area where 'slacking off' is allowed. However, when this is the case, music also can become an avenue of attack, manipulation, and frequency dampening when we are asleep about it.

Another reason music is such a ripe ground for self examination is that the personal ego can get so tied up in all the likes and dislikes and can feel its identity threatened if some other person criticizes or is indifferent to an artist or song that is heavily identified with and strongly FELT. The area of our personal tastes make a great test tube for creating shocks designed to separate the real I from all the others.

Yes, I sort of was in the music business for a while, and all that crappy music - not only mainstream, but all kinds of "niche" music as well! - really contributed to my totally ponerized world view at that time. I idealized various "artists" and tried to copy what I thought were their "succesful lifestyles", causing misery for myself and others. It wasn't the only factor of course, but I think it was very effective in my programming.

As you said, identification can be really strong - either with a certain artist/band or with a certain "style". It's so crazy how simple it is to divide people and corner them - a dream for the psychos in power!

After I went through a process of "deprogramming" where I completely refrained from listening to any music (just couldn't bring myself to it), I'm now slowly recovering and discovering great music, usually stuff I once dismissed as totally "uncool" It's really such a shame that the PTB managed to root out most of the great music from the mainstream since indeed good music can be so empowering and helpful in terms of knowing oneself, working with the emotional center etc.

Very well said - it is SO powerful. It is good to bring this beast into the light and that is my intent here.

 

[BHelmet]

here is the Paramus New Jersey All-Star Kazoo Ensemble doing the William Tell Overture:

Compare the pair - "Over the Rainbow"

The Judy Garland version, from "The Wizard of Oz":

_www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSZxmZmBfnU

or this,
The version I like, from the hawaiian Israel "Iz" Ka'ano'i Kamakawiwo'Ole, not long before he died:

_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1bFr2SWP1I
The piece at the end is where they are distributing his ashes.
Very poignant!

First, I lived 10 years on da big Island (Hawai'i) so I am very familiar with Iz. I think it is interesting that Judy sings the song in Kansas before going to Oz.

Background:
Q: (T) Now, you keep referring to the movie, "The Wizard of Oz." You have been saying...
A: 6th density inspired.
Q: (T) You have good filmmakers up there in 6th density. (S) What other movies did they inspire? (T) Before we go off on a sidetrack like that, I'm still trying to grasp something here... okay, you keep referring to the movie, and that we have an ability within us that is something like the Ruby slippers that can take us back to STO any time we wish.
A: Yes.
Q: (T) So, all this stuff we have been talking about, the realm border, the wave, raising the frequencies...
A: Realm wave is the "tornado."
Q: (L) In the analogy of Dorothy and the whole thing, the place where she started out was Kansas, i.e. STO? (J) It was in black and white...
A: Not really.
Q: (L) Was going to the land of Oz the STO state?
A: STS.
Q: (L) So Oz was STS. And Kansas, not necessarily the physical surroundings, but the state of mind of Dorothy prior to the Oz experience, was the STO state.
A: Yes.
Q: (L) So, we don't need necessarily to look at Kansas or the fact that it was filmed in black and white, it is just the state of mind. The going to Oz...
A: And Elvira Gulch.
Q: (J) The lady that turned into the witch.
A: The witch is the Lizards.
Q: (T) Yeah, okay. Tornado. Dorothy fell from the STO to the STS state through the tornado. Is this true.
A: Yes.

So, Judy/Dorothy has this longing for something 'better' but she ends up in Oz. STS

Poignant, indeed.

In a way, the movie and song outlines the fall.

Also interesting and not surprising, if true, that the Lizzies and their minions in 3D would pervert a 6th D inspired song into part of a mind control scheme.

 

[HiThere]

A good theme for a thread, thank you for starting it BHelmet.

I think watching the manipulation of pop culture and musical taste is as informative and important as monitoring the 'news'. US society is molded this way as much as through the 'education' system. And let's not forget we export this 'culture' (which, by and large, isn't really culture at all, in the traditional sense) all over the world.

Yes indeed. Just listen to "Top 40 radio" (I have to sometimes in the gym, yuck!), the programming has become so blatantly obvious - glorification of abusive relationships, total sexualization, treating people (especially women) as objects, violence, pedophilia, promotion of drinking/drug abuse... the psychopathic mindset in a nutshell! It's so disgusting.

Fabulous example. So amazingly, outrageously dysfunctional and unhealthy, right? I'm like: Is this really happening? It is just so far over the line. Fantastic example. Now this one is so in-your-face, but there are other more subtle and accepted and ingrained formats that fly right under the radar. e.g., All the "I WANT you, I NEED you" type songs. The same fundamental dysfunctional relationship that religion creates with regard to 'god'!

Perhaps because music can access the emotions directly (and thus bypass the rational mind), dive into the sub-conscious mind, AND influence the body, I believe it provides a fertile ground for 4th way self-observation and study. One of the things Gurdjieff said early on as relayed by Ouspenski in ISOTM, was that we are subject to a series of 'likes' and 'don't likes' by all the little I's; petty, subjective, egoistic tastes (my words). Certainly music is a vast playground for subjective likes and dislikes. Furthermore, it could be argued that what and who we like or dislike may even be reflective of our state of development, awareness and being. (but not to worry, I ain't goin' there!!!)

Yes, I do that as well - when I listen to music (or when I'm forced to listen to music :)), I try to observe what it does to me - sometimes I'm just disgusted, sometimes there is a rush of "happy chemicals" even though I don't like the music, and sometimes I start crying because there is so much truth in a song - not only the text, but the performance, the interpretation... And yes, I think it has something to do with where you are in life, what stuff you're working on/thinking about etc.

Awesome. I feel not so alone to hear this and good to be able to discuss this. So many nuances. WHY do I 'like' what I like? I know it sounds a bit crazy to have that conversation with yourself, but so much can be learned since it gives access to our automatic response - we can't help liking what we like...but WHY? It also is a clear message from the PTB: what do they think of us, what are they trying to get us to become? How can we resist this domination? In what ways do we allow ourselves to empower our own demise with "It's always a good time. Whoa-o Whoa-o" (trying to keep it upbeat) How do we empower our spiritual sleep with our music choices? Where does one draw the line between peaceful, meditative introspection and self-calming, willful blindness?

I think music can also become a kind of sacred cow: an area in which, on a sub-conscious level, 'work' is not required, since music can be viewed as much as vicarious enjoyment/experience and escapism as anything else: an area where 'slacking off' is allowed. However, when this is the case, music also can become an avenue of attack, manipulation, and frequency dampening when we are asleep about it.

Another reason music is such a ripe ground for self examination is that the personal ego can get so tied up in all the likes and dislikes and can feel its identity threatened if some other person criticizes or is indifferent to an artist or song that is heavily identified with and strongly FELT. The area of our personal tastes make a great test tube for creating shocks designed to separate the real I from all the others.

Yes, I sort of was in the music business for a while, and all that crappy music - not only mainstream, but all kinds of "niche" music as well! - really contributed to my totally ponerized world view at that time. I idealized various "artists" and tried to copy what I thought were their "succesful lifestyles", causing misery for myself and others. It wasn't the only factor of course, but I think it was very effective in my programming.

As you said, identification can be really strong - either with a certain artist/band or with a certain "style". It's so crazy how simple it is to divide people and corner them - a dream for the psychos in power!

After I went through a process of "deprogramming" where I completely refrained from listening to any music (just couldn't bring myself to it), I'm now slowly recovering and discovering great music, usually stuff I once dismissed as totally "uncool" It's really such a shame that the PTB managed to root out most of the great music from the mainstream since indeed good music can be so empowering and helpful in terms of knowing oneself, working with the emotional center etc.

Very well said - it is SO powerful. It is good to bring this beast into the light and that is my intent here.

I identify with what you write - I know I had my musical tastes as a sort of misguided guiding light through my youth, where everything was judged according to whether it was deemed to be "inside" of my particular bubble of tastes in music or not. I also spent endless hours pondering the themes in music and what they meant. I had a period where I only listened to music that "felt" right - classical, Mike Oldfield, Pink Floyd, Enya, uplifting etc - sort of like a "only the worthy shall be heard" phase not unlike what I now observe with new agers and their unilateral focus on love and light.
After that I stretched out to music I had to struggle to appreciate - jazz, fusion, punk, metal etc.

I too had some years totally without music after I gave up the idea of making a living out of it, and then gradually started listening and playing again. So music has had a profound unconscious impact on my life that I only started to become aware of in my mid 20s.

I agree that this is a fertile arena for manipulation and that it has never been as blatantly flat and obvious as now - the Rihanna lyric quote is a perfect example.

 

[MusicMan]

here is the Paramus New Jersey All-Star Kazoo Ensemble doing the William Tell Overture:

Compare the pair - "Over the Rainbow"

The Judy Garland version, from "The Wizard of Oz":

_www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSZxmZmBfnU

or this,
The version I like, from the hawaiian Israel "Iz" Ka'ano'i Kamakawiwo'Ole, not long before he died:

_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1bFr2SWP1I
The piece at the end is where they are distributing his ashes.
Very poignant!

First, I lived 10 years on da big Island (Hawai'i) so I am very familiar with Iz. I think it is interesting that Judy sings the song in Kansas before going to Oz.

Background:
Q: (T) Now, you keep referring to the movie, "The Wizard of Oz." You have been saying...
A: 6th density inspired.
Q: (T) You have good filmmakers up there in 6th density. (S) What other movies did they inspire? (T) Before we go off on a sidetrack like that, I'm still trying to grasp something here... okay, you keep referring to the movie, and that we have an ability within us that is something like the Ruby slippers that can take us back to STO any time we wish.
A: Yes.
Q: (T) So, all this stuff we have been talking about, the realm border, the wave, raising the frequencies...
A: Realm wave is the "tornado."
Q: (L) In the analogy of Dorothy and the whole thing, the place where she started out was Kansas, i.e. STO? (J) It was in black and white...
A: Not really.
Q: (L) Was going to the land of Oz the STO state?
A: STS.
Q: (L) So Oz was STS. And Kansas, not necessarily the physical surroundings, but the state of mind of Dorothy prior to the Oz experience, was the STO state.
A: Yes.
Q: (L) So, we don't need necessarily to look at Kansas or the fact that it was filmed in black and white, it is just the state of mind. The going to Oz...
A: And Elvira Gulch.
Q: (J) The lady that turned into the witch.
A: The witch is the Lizards.
Q: (T) Yeah, okay. Tornado. Dorothy fell from the STO to the STS state through the tornado. Is this true.
A: Yes.

So, Judy/Dorothy has this longing for something 'better' but she ends up in Oz. STS

Poignant, indeed.

In a way, the movie and song outlines the fall.

Also interesting and not surprising, if true, that the Lizzies and their minions in 3D would pervert a 6th D inspired song into part of a mind control scheme.

Yes, now all we need to find out is how to activate the 'Ruby Slippers', in fact what do we have that represents the Ruby Slippers? Mine are black suede.

 

[BHelmet]

A good theme for a thread, thank you for starting it BHelmet.

Thanks for participating. I have focused so much attention on music as a kind of parallel reality almost since I can't remember.

...I know I had my musical tastes as a sort of misguided guiding light through my youth, where everything was judged according to whether it was deemed to be "inside" of my particular bubble of tastes in music or not. I also spent endless hours pondering the themes in music and what they meant. I had a period where I only listened to music that "felt" right - classical, Mike Oldfield, Pink Floyd, Enya, uplifting etc - sort of like a "only the worthy shall be heard" phase not unlike what I now observe with new agers and their unilateral focus on love and light.
After that I stretched out to music I had to struggle to appreciate - jazz, fusion, punk, metal etc.

I too had some years totally without music after I gave up the idea of making a living out of it, and then gradually started listening and playing again. So music has had a profound unconscious impact on my life that I only started to become aware of in my mid 20s.

I agree that this is a fertile arena for manipulation and that it has never been as blatantly flat and obvious as now - the Rihanna lyric quote is a perfect example.

You said some great stuff - the path of the 'acceptable' for starters. LOL, I remember trying to hide the fact I DETESTED Robert Plant's vocals, hence, I just tolerated Led Zeppelin and kept my mouth shut lest I be thought a totally uncool prissy face! (the Led Zep I era, no less) Too funny. I still play head games with what I put on my Ipod. Not for what anyone else thinks, just what I want to expose myself to. I guess it is a balance thing as usual. Every so often, I even like to spin the radio dial to hear what people are being subjected to. It never ceases to amaze me.

There are plenty of outrageously blatant and explicit songs out there that defy belief such as anything by Lady Gaga (I am thinking Pa Pa Poke Er Face - my jaw just about hit the floor when I heard that one) BUT - what is really puzzling me lately are the bands and songs that seem to be in direct conflict with the Powers That Be, yet they are put out by major Labels that are clearly corporate/illuminati controlled, IMO. So, that really has me wondering about how the chess game is being played out. Muse is the classic case in point. Latest album, "Drones"; previous songs like Super-Massive Black Hole, MKUltra, Citizen Erased - a whole album based on Orwell, Uprising, Knights of Cydonia; the list goes on and on and on of great songs that seem so aligned with what is being discussed on this forum. And yet I have a love/hate relationship with their stuff and there are doubts there. I do want to go more into that but it is very late here. I just wanted to respond before bed time. Cheers!

 

[BHelmet]

Yes, now all we need to find out is how to activate the 'Ruby Slippers', in fact what do we have that represents the Ruby Slippers? Mine are black suede.

GREAT question - I gotta think about that one.

I did used to have some red Reebok high tops but they looked more like Bozo shoes than anything else. Click those and I would end up back in the circus!

 

[luc]

(Note to the mods: I think the quotes got confused in post #3 and subsequently in post #5 so that what I wrote got confused with what BHelmet wrote - maybe there's a way to fix it? Thanks!)

Awesome. I feel not so alone to hear this and good to be able to discuss this. So many nuances. WHY do I 'like' what I like? I know it sounds a bit crazy to have that conversation with yourself, but so much can be learned since it gives access to our automatic response - we can't help liking what we like...but WHY? It also is a clear message from the PTB: what do they think of us, what are they trying to get us to become? How can we resist this domination? In what ways do we allow ourselves to empower our own demise with "It's always a good time. Whoa-o Whoa-o" (trying to keep it upbeat) How do we empower our spiritual sleep with our music choices? Where does one draw the line between peaceful, meditative introspection and self-calming, willful blindness?

Very good questions I think and very connected to the title of this thread. And I don't think it's crazy to have that conversation with yourself, it's actually great and part of what Gurdjieff described as self-observation. After all, how can you change your automatic reactions if you don't study them?

Part of our reactions to music I think have to do with identification as described by G.:

"'Identifying' is one of our most terrible foes because it penetrates everywhere and deceives a man at the moment when it seems to him that he is struggling with it. It is especially difficult to free oneself from identifying because a man naturally becomes more easily identified with the things that interest him most, to which he gives his time, his work, and his attention. In order to free himself from identifying a man must be constantly on guard and be merciless with himself, that is, he must not be afraid of seeing all the subtle and hidden forms which identifying takes.
"It is necessary to see and to study identifying to its very roots in oneself. The difficulty of struggling with identifying is still further increased by the fact that when people observe it in themselves they consider it a very good trait and call it 'enthusiasm,' 'zeal,' 'passion,' 'spontaneity,' 'inspiration,' and names of that kind, and they consider that only in a state of identifying can a man really produce good work, no matter in what sphere. In reality of course this is illusion. Man cannot do anything sensible when he is in a state of identifying."

So for example when we hear a certain song/band, this can trigger a whole cascade of thoughts/feelings/memories etc. that become US instantly. We perceive this as "passion" or "great feeling" or even "repulsion", but in reality it's just an automatic trigger to bring about a different little I - maybe one that thinks Led Zep is totally cool or that the Beatles are evil and only the Rolling Stones are great or whatever. I think these thoughts can have many hidden, unconscious reasons - maybe you felt great, strong and knowledgeable in a social situation where you voiced your opinions about Led Zep? Maybe there was a romantic relationship where you impressed your partner with music talk? Maybe it was your ticket as a teenager to be part of the "cool guys"? From what I understand, our brain constantly tries to recreate "chemical rushes", for example by dwelling on certain thoughts/memories, including - paradoxically - negative memories/fancies, since they also trigger "happy chemicals". That could be the reason for example that people like to listen to songs that remind them of a painful relationship or a painful event in their lives, and why oftentimes these painful events get transformed into beautiful memories...

As G. said:

You think, for instance, that a funeral march should provoke in everyone sad and solemn thoughts and that any dance music, a komarinsky for instance, will provoke happy thoughts. But in actual fact this is not so at all. Everything depends upon association. If on a day that a great misfortune happens to me I hear some lively tune for the first time this tune will evoke in me sad and oppressive thoughts for my whole life afterwards. And if on a day when I am particularly happy I hear a sad tune, this tune will always evoke happy thoughts. And so with everything else.

and

"But in order to be able to attain this or at least begin to attain it, a man must die, that is, he must free himself from a thousand petty attachments and identifications which hold him in the position in which he is. He is attached to everything in his life, attached to his imagination, attached to his stupidity, attached even to his sufferings, possibly to his sufferings more than to anything else. He must free himself from this attachment. Attachment to things, identification with things, keep alive a thousand useless I's in a man. These I's must die in order that the big I may be born.

Now, if we get rid of identification with certain music (at least partially), I think we already can counter a lot of the manipulation and programming. By means of self-observation, we can detect the feelings that are triggered in us, and maybe we can learn after a while to be aware of certain "flavors" - is it a "happy-chemicals-rush" or is it something deeper? Why do we react the way we do - are we crying because there is some truth in the song that has to do with our lives or experiences? Or are we feeling "great" because the song triggers all kinds of images/memories/concepts we are identified with? Are we feeling bad because of shame/regret associated with a certain song but which has nothing to do with the music per se? I don't think it's always that easy, but these are some things I ask myself when I react to music...

 

[luc]

Another thing concerning "modern music" I'd like to share:

Here's a video from a guy who recreates part of a modern mainstream hit using a simple apple software - turns out that in those "hits", the producers just clicked together pre-made sound files that came with the software! IMHO, this shows the stunning lack of creativity in modern mainstream music, no wonder if we assume that psychopaths are involved:

https://youtu.be/RR9PBle4W7A

Now compare this to the work on Lennon's "Imagine":

https://youtu.be/WivoeUdSB8k


On another note,

There are plenty of outrageously blatant and explicit songs out there that defy belief such as anything by Lady Gaga (I am thinking Pa Pa Poke Er Face - my jaw just about hit the floor when I heard that one) BUT - what is really puzzling me lately are the bands and songs that seem to be in direct conflict with the Powers That Be, yet they are put out by major Labels that are clearly corporate/illuminati controlled, IMO. So, that really has me wondering about how the chess game is being played out. Muse is the classic case in point. Latest album, "Drones"; previous songs like Super-Massive Black Hole, MKUltra, Citizen Erased - a whole album based on Orwell, Uprising, Knights of Cydonia; the list goes on and on and on of great songs that seem so aligned with what is being discussed on this forum. And yet I have a love/hate relationship with their stuff and there are doubts there. I do want to go more into that but it is very late here. I just wanted to respond before bed time. Cheers!

...maybe this becomes clearer if you compare for example the Muse songs/videos (e.g. "Uprising") with this John Lennon gem:

https://youtu.be/_xDjY7ccBcU


I think Lennon speaks simple truth to people's hearts, while Muse is fancy, dark and violent, and not empowering at all, quite the opposite actually.

 

[HiThere]

Thanks for participating. I have focused so much attention on music as a kind of parallel reality almost since I can't remember.

Parallel reality is a good way to describe it, I think. It took years for me to aknowledge that many/most people didn't feel the impact of music as acutely as I felt I did, and then realizing the extent of one's automated responses to music and other peoples reaction to it.

LOL, I remember trying to hide the fact I DETESTED Robert Plant's vocals, hence, I just tolerated Led Zeppelin and kept my mouth shut lest I be thought a totally uncool prissy face! (the Led Zep I era, no less)

Sacrilege! I would undoubtedly have thought of you as a little crazy if I was told this in my youth. :)

I still play head games with what I put on my Ipod. Not for what anyone else thinks, just what I want to expose myself to. I guess it is a balance thing as usual. Every so often, I even like to spin the radio dial to hear what people are being subjected to. It never ceases to amaze me.

I do this too, and in earlier years worried about damage being done by listening to "dark" music - Black Sabbath and so on.
I had to work with myself to come to appreciate that one can find something in any kind of sound, with a big exception for me being the boring, flat, repetitive, drugged sounds of today, that are so narrowly focused on one particular feeling or desire and sounds constrained and choked. No joy of playing, just manufactured sounds designed to herd people into a moronic state of mind. (I suspect that part of this attitude is down to my own judgemental attitude, as my kids frequently point out).

There are plenty of outrageously blatant and explicit songs out there that defy belief such as anything by Lady Gaga (I am thinking Pa Pa Poke Er Face - my jaw just about hit the floor when I heard that one)

I am still enough of a snob about these things to refuse to expose myself to all the critters in the charts, so I undoubtedly miss a lot of good music these days on account of not listening to radio or chart music as well.
But I am content listening to the old stuff.

BUT - what is really puzzling me lately are the bands and songs that seem to be in direct conflict with the Powers That Be, yet they are put out by major Labels that are clearly corporate/illuminati controlled, IMO. So, that really has me wondering about how the chess game is being played out. Muse is the classic case in point. Latest album, "Drones"; previous songs like Super-Massive Black Hole, MKUltra, Citizen Erased - a whole album based on Orwell, Uprising, Knights of Cydonia; the list goes on and on and on of great songs that seem so aligned with what is being discussed on this forum. And yet I have a love/hate relationship with their stuff and there are doubts there. I do want to go more into that but it is very late here. I just wanted to respond before bed time. Cheers!

I would like to like Muse, but struggle to latch into their sound - it doesn't float my boat. Their guitarist has said in interviews that he doesn't feel he is particularily good compared to the greats in rock music, and while this might be false modesty, I tend to agree - he doesn't have the songs or the playing, but the message is good.

 

[BHelmet]

Yes, now all we need to find out is how to activate the 'Ruby Slippers', in fact what do we have that represents the Ruby Slippers? Mine are black suede.

GREAT question - I gotta think about that one.

I did used to have some red Reebok high tops but they looked more like Bozo shoes than anything else. Click those and I would end up back in the circus!

I slept on it and here is what came to me this morning: 1st, the ruby slippers - left and right - so I thought the 2 hemispheres of the brain? And then I thought, no, the 2 higher centers are the ruby slippers.

 

[BHelmet]

(Note to the mods: I think the quotes got confused in post #3 and subsequently in post #5 so that what I wrote got confused with what BHelmet wrote - maybe there's a way to fix it? Thanks!)

Awesome. I feel not so alone to hear this and good to be able to discuss this. So many nuances. WHY do I 'like' what I like? I know it sounds a bit crazy to have that conversation with yourself, but so much can be learned since it gives access to our automatic response - we can't help liking what we like...but WHY? It also is a clear message from the PTB: what do they think of us, what are they trying to get us to become? How can we resist this domination? In what ways do we allow ourselves to empower our own demise with "It's always a good time. Whoa-o Whoa-o" (trying to keep it upbeat) How do we empower our spiritual sleep with our music choices? Where does one draw the line between peaceful, meditative introspection and self-calming, willful blindness?

Very good questions I think and very connected to the title of this thread. And I don't think it's crazy to have that conversation with yourself, it's actually great and part of what Gurdjieff described as self-observation. After all, how can you change your automatic reactions if you don't study them?

Part of our reactions to music I think have to do with identification as described by G.:

"'Identifying' is one of our most terrible foes because it penetrates everywhere and deceives a man at the moment when it seems to him that he is struggling with it. It is especially difficult to free oneself from identifying because a man naturally becomes more easily identified with the things that interest him most, to which he gives his time, his work, and his attention. In order to free himself from identifying a man must be constantly on guard and be merciless with himself, that is, he must not be afraid of seeing all the subtle and hidden forms which identifying takes.
"It is necessary to see and to study identifying to its very roots in oneself. The difficulty of struggling with identifying is still further increased by the fact that when people observe it in themselves they consider it a very good trait and call it 'enthusiasm,' 'zeal,' 'passion,' 'spontaneity,' 'inspiration,' and names of that kind, and they consider that only in a state of identifying can a man really produce good work, no matter in what sphere. In reality of course this is illusion. Man cannot do anything sensible when he is in a state of identifying."

So for example when we hear a certain song/band, this can trigger a whole cascade of thoughts/feelings/memories etc. that become US instantly. We perceive this as "passion" or "great feeling" or even "repulsion", but in reality it's just an automatic trigger to bring about a different little I - maybe one that thinks Led Zep is totally cool or that the Beatles are evil and only the Rolling Stones are great or whatever. I think these thoughts can have many hidden, unconscious reasons - maybe you felt great, strong and knowledgeable in a social situation where you voiced your opinions about Led Zep? Maybe there was a romantic relationship where you impressed your partner with music talk? Maybe it was your ticket as a teenager to be part of the "cool guys"? From what I understand, our brain constantly tries to recreate "chemical rushes", for example by dwelling on certain thoughts/memories, including - paradoxically - negative memories/fancies, since they also trigger "happy chemicals". That could be the reason for example that people like to listen to songs that remind them of a painful relationship or a painful event in their lives, and why oftentimes these painful events get transformed into beautiful memories...

As G. said:

You think, for instance, that a funeral march should provoke in everyone sad and solemn thoughts and that any dance music, a komarinsky for instance, will provoke happy thoughts. But in actual fact this is not so at all. Everything depends upon association. If on a day that a great misfortune happens to me I hear some lively tune for the first time this tune will evoke in me sad and oppressive thoughts for my whole life afterwards. And if on a day when I am particularly happy I hear a sad tune, this tune will always evoke happy thoughts. And so with everything else.

and

"But in order to be able to attain this or at least begin to attain it, a man must die, that is, he must free himself from a thousand petty attachments and identifications which hold him in the position in which he is. He is attached to everything in his life, attached to his imagination, attached to his stupidity, attached even to his sufferings, possibly to his sufferings more than to anything else. He must free himself from this attachment. Attachment to things, identification with things, keep alive a thousand useless I's in a man. These I's must die in order that the big I may be born.

Now, if we get rid of identification with certain music (at least partially), I think we already can counter a lot of the manipulation and programming. By means of self-observation, we can detect the feelings that are triggered in us, and maybe we can learn after a while to be aware of certain "flavors" - is it a "happy-chemicals-rush" or is it something deeper? Why do we react the way we do - are we crying because there is some truth in the song that has to do with our lives or experiences? Or are we feeling "great" because the song triggers all kinds of images/memories/concepts we are identified with? Are we feeling bad because of shame/regret associated with a certain song but which has nothing to do with the music per se? I don't think it's always that easy, but these are some things I ask myself when I react to music...

Fantastic post, Luc, and really pertinent quotes from G that are spot on regarding musical identifying. Thanks for reminding me of them and showing how those quotes relate to musical tastes. It is a jungle out there, and a jungle 'in here' as well! Good job wielding a machete to it all.

Chuckle... I do remember when that was a defining question: who is better, the Stones or the Beatles? Oh my. As for Zep, something always bothered me about them. Just a feeling. I had no idea Page was so into Crowley and the dark occult, i.e., STS, but I had this sense something was not 'right' with them. And I surely judged people severely, in a very petty way, based on their musical tastes. I still have to fight that one. "How can you possibly like 'X' when 'X' is so clearly a lower centered offering; well, it must mean you are not very evolved, ignorant, or just plain stupid." Ugh - and there is my own lower level stuff!

 

[davey72]

Music these days is a tragedy. I listen to the words of these songs that the kids are raised on these days, and it saddens me.
On another note, i wonder if music such as the works produced by people like Gurdjieff have any affects that we are not aware of?