Online criticism of ponerology

Approaching Infinity

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Can you all count the logical fallacies in this one?

_http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Study-of-Evil---Whats-It-All-About?&id=5278771

The philosophical debate about good and evil or rather good versus evil is even older than the any written record of mankind. Still, today people are fascinated by the topic, and as a coordinator for a think tank which operates online, and consider the number of religious folks out there, the topic will never die; it's always just a breath away it seems. Not long ago, an acquaintance from Australia and I were discussing this topic.

He suggested I study up on Lobaczewski's Scientific Studies of Evil, and so I did, and then I told my acquaintance; "I did check out Lobaczewski website, and found myself intrigued and thus, read the whole thing, quite interesting. You have given me new insight to think about, and I thank you for that. It is a pleasure to learn new things, or listen to other views." Still, as interesting as these notions are I am skeptical of this philosopher's assessments.

You see, after reading his website, I feel as if I should email Andrew Lebaczewski and recommend some books for him to read, although I doubt he'd like my recommendations. In fact, I bet he'd discard my suggestions as irrelevant, and in a fit of hypocrisy dismiss their contents completely. It had occurred to me when reading his website, that maybe he does know a thing or two about this abnormal behavior, as he almost appears to have many of the same traits, which he himself rails against.

Indeed, it seemed to me as I studied the philosophy behind his notions more, that perhaps, it is a almost to the point of the same paradox he describes when defining this abnormal psychopathic behavior which he has observed in his scientific studies. Perhaps, that is a miss-read on him on my part, although, I suspect not. And then I asked my acquaintance what he thought. He indicated to me, that he'd never considered that, and was more focused on the scientific theory than anything else.

Since my acquaintance was good enough to recommend this philosophy and scientific study of evil to me, I also recommended a couple of books to him on the topic, namely John Douglas' books such as "Mind Hunter" and "Obsession" as these too might shed some light on this over all topic. It seems that much of what Lebaczewski has to say does fit in-line with works such as "The Prince" and "Theory and Practice of Hell" as well as some others, and other such things we observe in human societies, and other species as well.

It's all interesting and worthy of discussion, thus I am quite happy to see my acquaintance brought this all to my attention. Still, I was bothered by Lobaczewski's accusations about bloodlines - Royal Lines specifically and this ridiculous notion of evil genes. Why you ask, simple, you see, in fact, since I do have Royal Lines, and share genes with the Cheney Family (which Lobaczewski calls evil) on my grandmother's side and the Bush's on my Mayflower ancestry side, that would mean if Lobaczewski is correct and he has indeed figured it all out, then I personally would have all the traits he describes.

However it also since I know self, and know myself to be quite honorable, I see much of his work as a hit piece, at least on the website which displays his name. Therefore, perhaps that old adage; "It takes one to know one," rings true enough and has in a round-about-way caused me to write that article that you read? Or perhaps Lebaczewski is merely full-of-it, which is another possibility.

Nevertheless, my acquaintance stated; "It's from the book, "Political Ponerology, the science of evil adjusted for political purposes". It was written by a group of psychologists secretly in the 1950's in Eastern Europe under communist rule."

Okay, that's interesting, however, if this was written in the 1950's then all the references to President Bush, Cheney, Neo-conservatism is a later add-on right? Thus, someone took that original work, someone who was a left-leaning individual and forced it onto the President Bush years. And in fairness the author of the secondary works of this line-of-thinking did also mention issues with gangs, groups, religion, and other sides of the political spectrum as well.

Indeed, also, I suppose if a right leaning person got a hold of that work, and went to update it they would mention folks like Soros, Gore, Clintons, Obama, Ruben, and Rahm Emanuel for instance. And really the original work addresses Marxism, Czars, Hitler, etc., and the updated seems to go after Christian Right, etc. Which means in a way - the updated is nothing more than a carefully contrived political hit-piece and thus, it would pay to read the original first, and then the reader (me, in this case) needs to use this knowledge to apply to the present period.

Thus, I asked my acquaintance if this was his thinking as well, or if did he did enjoy the updated due to the references against the right-wingers? It's okay if he does, I am not to judge a man by his political persuasion, still, it might be good "if my acquaintance and I were to open a dialogue" that I could know where he was coming from? Speaking of which, it is a very interesting topic, and I did enjoy studying it immensely.

Although in many regards the implications of labeling people "evil" has been overplayed far too much to introduce fear and incite the masses to attack a political opponent. So, where does evil come from, maybe it comes from labeling something else evil without looking into your own mirror to see if it's just a reflection. Please consider this.

Lance Winslow is a retired Founder of a Nationwide Franchise Chain, and now runs the Online Think Tank. Lance Winslow believes it's hard work to write 21,300 articles; _http://www.bloggingcontent.net/
 
That was awful. The plethora of grammatical errors bespeaks a mind full of disorganized thoughts. The complaint about the work being updated to reflect contemporary realities is absurd on the face of it, and the suggestion that it is politically biased would seem to indicate that the author's own politics are perhaps, somewhat compromised. Admitting he's a relative of both Bush and Cheney makes me skeptical about him, too. Ah, and then there's all the stuff about emailing Lobaczewski ... good luck email a dead man! :lol:

Nice to know the intellectual heavy hitters are taking on Ponerology. When such fine minds as this are opposing the idea, you know it must be wrong.... :lol:
 
psychegram said:
That was awful.

I agree. Maybe Lance should actually read through the books he reviews instead of just flipping through the pages, since that appears to be what he's done here.

Strange, if you look through some of the other articles he's written, he has a number of articles on asteroids and NEOs. :huh:

_http://ezinearticles.com/?expert=Lance_Winslow

# Why Study NEOs or Near Earth Objects?
[Reference-and-Education:Astronomy] Did you know that NASA has discovered over 40 known NEOs which are accessible for a human manned space mission? Just imagine landing humans on an asteroid or a Near Earth Object (NEO). And it may be possible from what we learn to ride on top of an NEO and then use it take us places, saving energy throughout the solar system, basically hitching a ride for free.

# What Progress is Being Made in the Study of NEOs or Near Earth Objects?
[Reference-and-Education:Astronomy] What Progress is Being Made in the Study of NEOs or Near Earth Objects? We sure know a lot more than we did about Near Earth Objects than we ever have in the past. In many regards we find that they are much more dangerous than we had ever believed to life on Earth and our Earth's biosphere.

# How Much Have We Learned With Our Space Missions to Near Earth Objects
[Reference-and-Education:Astronomy] We have sure learned a lot from studying asteroids and comets. We have spent hundreds of millions of dollars in space missions, research, and telescope time. We've collected dust samples from comets, and we've even sent a probe into a comet to kick up debris and then collected that too.


# What Are We Trying to Learn in Our NEO or Near Earth Object Research?
[Reference-and-Education:Astronomy] NASA and other scientists have gathered, and they have come to the conclusion that it's time to send a manned mission to an NEO or Near Earth Object. The President of the United States has even signed off on the mission, and it appears that it is in NASA's budget. The question is do we know enough to land on such a space rock?

[...]
 
The philosophical debate about good and evil or rather good versus evil is even older than the any written record of mankind.
Starting his article with this sentence tells me immediately that we're not going to be dealing with any facts, here.

I did check out Lobaczewski website, and found myself intrigued and thus, read the whole thing, quite interesting.
He read the whole website. Not a terribly impressive task, and certainly not enough information to make an informed statement about an incredibly rich and detailed tome that breaks down, extremely well, a topic that "is even older than any written record of mankind".

His off-the-cuff dismissal of the "ridiculous notion of evil genes" is typical COINTELPRO, but at least he's honest enough to divulge to us that he's bothered by it...but then he follows up with a misdirection play bringing in Gore, Clinton, Obama, etc.

psychegram said:
The plethora of grammatical errors bespeaks a mind full of disorganized thoughts.
Lance Winslow believes it's hard work to write 21,300 articles; _http://www.bloggingcontent.net/
To make 21,300 omelets, you have to break a LOT of eggs :)
 
:shock: Uh, I'm apparently the 'acquaintance from Australia'. I don't know why he said I was from Australia, and I'm not an aquainance either. I came across his articles, and he had some interesting topics, to include those that Ryan pointed out, so I emailed him the Ponerology website. I'm pretty sure I didn't respond when he wrote back (he basically replied with most of the things in the article). So this part of the article was interesting, "And then I asked my acquaintance what he thought. He indicated to me, that he'd never considered that, and was more focused on the scientific theory than anything else."

And yes, lots of nonsensical statements. It is clear he didn't read the book, otherwise he would have saved a little bit of face in drawing some faulty conclusions. But much of his way of thinking may have probably persisted even if he had read the book, but who knows.

This is particular made me :O

However it also since I know self, and know myself to be quite honorable, I see much of his work as a hit piece, at least on the website which displays his name. Therefore, perhaps that old adage; "It takes one to know one," rings true enough and has in a round-about-way caused me to write that article that you read? Or perhaps Lebaczewski is merely full-of-it, which is another possibility.

So uh, if you know yourself to be honerable, 'it takes one to know one' rings true???
 
Approaching Infinity said:
Can you all count the logical fallacies in this one?

_http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Study-of-Evil---Whats-It-All-About?&id=5278771
he has problem with blood lines, good vs evil and most of his comments are more or less impressions than the science ponerology talks about. He seems to be not bothered of deeds of current day psychopaths. He wants science to be nice to every body than the objective as it should be .
 
Here is Lance's Bio


http://www.lancewinslow.org/founder.shtml

Mr. Winslow is a "Futurist" and member of the World Future Society. He is also a member of the Federation of American Scientists. Being an Entrepreneurial Capitalist by nature he is also a member of The Ayn Rand Institute. Mr. Winslow, as founder is organizing chapters for The OTT - Online Think Tank to help network the most brilliant minds of the Planet. He is actively recruiting members now;
 
[quote author=Lance Winslow]

The philosophical debate about good and evil or rather good versus evil is even older than the any written record of mankind. Still, today people are fascinated by the topic, and as a coordinator for a think tank which operates online, and consider the number of religious folks out there, the topic will never die; it's always just a breath away it seems. Not long ago, an acquaintance from Australia and I were discussing this topic.

He suggested I study up on Lobaczewski's Scientific Studies of Evil, and so I did, and then I told my acquaintance; "I did check out Lobaczewski website, and found myself intrigued and thus, read the whole thing, quite interesting. You have given me new insight to think about, and I thank you for that. It is a pleasure to learn new things, or listen to other views." Still, as interesting as these notions are I am skeptical of this philosopher's assessments.
[/quote]
Right at the outset, he has relegated good and evil to the realm of philosophy. Then he calls Lobaczewski a philosopher though a couple of sentences before he mentions that he was asked to study scientific studies of evil.

[quote author=Lance Winslow]
It's all interesting and worthy of discussion, thus I am quite happy to see my acquaintance brought this all to my attention. Still, I was bothered by Lobaczewski's accusations about bloodlines - Royal Lines specifically and this ridiculous notion of evil genes. Why you ask, simple, you see, in fact, since I do have Royal Lines, and share genes with the Cheney Family (which Lobaczewski calls evil) on my grandmother's side and the Bush's on my Mayflower ancestry side, that would mean if Lobaczewski is correct and he has indeed figured it all out, then I personally would have all the traits he describes.However it also since I know self, and know myself to be quite honorable, I see much of his work as a hit piece, at least on the website which displays his name.
[/quote]
Sharing some genealogy with these families does not necessarily imply that the specific genetic mutations that are hypothesized as the root of psychopathology will be present. Very black and white and immature argument here which serves as the centerpiece of his criticism.
[quote author=LW]
Okay, that's interesting, however, if this was written in the 1950's then all the references to President Bush, Cheney, Neo-conservatism is a later add-on right? Thus, someone took that original work, someone who was a left-leaning individual and forced it onto the President Bush years. And in fairness the author of the secondary works of this line-of-thinking did also mention issues with gangs, groups, religion, and other sides of the political spectrum as well.

Indeed, also, I suppose if a right leaning person got a hold of that work, and went to update it they would mention folks like Soros, Gore, Clintons, Obama, Ruben, and Rahm Emanuel for instance. And really the original work addresses Marxism, Czars, Hitler, etc., and the updated seems to go after Christian Right, etc. Which means in a way - the updated is nothing more than a carefully contrived political hit-piece and thus, it would pay to read the original first, and then the reader (me, in this case) needs to use this knowledge to apply to the present period.
[/quote]
More ponerized, black and white thinking - right necessarily criticizes left , left necessarily criticizes right - both call each other evil for political gain. Some interesting choice of names though.

[quote author=LW]
Although in many regards the implications of labeling people "evil" has been overplayed far too much to introduce fear and incite the masses to attack a political opponent. So, where does evil come from, maybe it comes from labeling something else evil without looking into your own mirror to see if it's just a reflection. Please consider this.
[/quote]
Paramoralism?
[quote author=Puzzle]
Mr. Winslow is a "Futurist" and member of the World Future Society. He is also a member of the Federation of American Scientists. Being an Entrepreneurial Capitalist by nature he is also a member of The Ayn Rand Institute.
[/quote]
Interesting. Is he just ponerized like most or maybe his identification with the "royal genes" does have same basis in reality?
 
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