Pessimism is good but also a slippery slope? Complaining, Cynicisms, Sarcasm, crankiness, moaning and whining

[Cosmos]

The other day I saw something that made me think deeply about something that seems to come natural to some people; the following interesting video from a guy that gets a lot of things right and nails them very well:

A couple of weeks later - after observing interactions with others and also in regards to automatic reactions to"silly little ordinary happenings in life", rather closely, and finding myself pretty dismayed about how easy and automatic it is to get cynical, to complain and see things half empty everywhere, from the smallest outburst of anger if one forgets something or does something wrong, to the "screw it!" reaction, when something doesn't go as planned or falls down for example, to bigger things, especially in regards to interactions with others and even bigger scale things, like in regards to society - I stumbled on the following link about the way complaining alters the brain in a negative way that reinforces even more crankiness and outburst of that kind.

How Complaining Rewires Your Brain For Negativity (And How To Break The Habit)

In which three different types of complainers are mentioned:

Type of Drains
Everyone complains, at some point, at least a little, says Robin Kowalski, PhD, a professor of psychology at Clemson University.

There are different types of complainers, according to Kowalski, such as The Venter. The Venter is a “dissatisfied person who doesn’t want to hear solutions, however brilliant.”

Venting. We’re just letting off steam, right? Maybe not. I’ve personally found that the complain drain can be soul draining, not just for the complainer, but for all within earshot.

Other types you may have met along the way (or may be yourself) are the Sympathy Seekers, the I got it worse than you do, and the habitual everything sucks folks.

The Chronic Complainers, those living in a state of complaint, do something researchers call “ruminating.” This basically means thinking and complaining about a problem again and again. Instead of feeling a release after complaining, this sort of complaining can actually make things worse. It can cause even more worry and anxiety.

No one is suggesting you be a peachy-keen-Josephine and pretend all is swell when it isn’t. What I’ve learned in my mindfulness practice is to aim to do the opposite.

The Sympathy Seeker kind is well described in the following video I think and seems to be on the very far end side of the negative scale for complainers :

It is even more interesting to observe the thinking patterns that ordinary lead to the "little", "screw it man!" outbursts. It really seems to start with wrong thinking and I thought that what Samenow in his books about the criminal mind describes (see forum thread about it) somehow might tell us a lot about this tendency to complain, especially if it goes too far. He spoke of a matter of "degree" in regards to the criminal mind and that everyone exhibits it to one extent or the other in their thinking. Maybe it is the same for complainers.

We know that pessimism per se isn't something negative and if handled properly is actually something that is a desirable and sane approach to a lot of things; but can a connection to complaining, cynicisms, sarcasm, crankiness, moaning and whining very easily develop if one doesn't pay strict attention to ones thinking and actions? Can it go overboard very easily and make the life not only of oneself but others a living hell? I think the answer is a clear yes.

I'm not even sure if I confuse apples with oranges here in putting Pessimism in the same sentence as the other characteristics? I have to think about that more since complaining is indeed something completely different I think. For example, I think Jordan Peterson is a pessimist (as he explained in one his videos I think) and a lot of people here as well, but yet the message is full of hope and compassion and pretty much free of complaint.

So I would only suggest that pessimistic people might be more susceptible to get cynical and cranky about things and life in general. I guess this is the main reason why I think it is an important topic that shouldn't be ignored and maybe dealt with on an individual bases "in the work".

Maybe being pessimistic by nature has a lot potential for growth in the right direction, since it makes it easier to see things that need to be improved, but it might also make it more likely to slip off into the complaint mode, since you can get easily cynical and so forth?

So what I'm getting at here is that complaining (and not pessimism per se!!!) might be a trap that especially people who seek the truth can easily fall into when they learn more. The thing about complaining, cynicism and sarcasm, is that it somehow seems to rob yourself and others of a lot of energy and that it seems to starts right at the smallest things and thoughts I think. Especially cynicism and sarcasm, seem to easily lead to state were compassion and understanding for others and their circumstances diminishes. Or so is my thinking at the moment.

What do you think?


Edit: meant "whining" and not "whinging" both in the headline and in the text. Corrected now (29.12.2018)

 

[Chu]

The definition of pessimism:

pes•si•mism (pes′ə miz′əm), n.

1. the tendency to see, anticipate, or emphasize only bad or undesirable outcomes, results, conditions, problems, etc.:His pessimism about the future of our country depresses me.
2. the doctrine that the existing world is the worst of all possible worlds, or that all things naturally tend to evil.
3. the belief that the evil and pain in the world are not compensated for by goodness and happiness.

Well, based on that, most of us could be said to be pessimists, eh? Yet, I think your questions relate to what was discussed in the latest Session thread: non identification, "enjoying the show". I think that it's important to always find one thing to be grateful for, regardless of how low you feel, or how bleak things seem. And do something for someone else, as small as it may seem.

Yes, I think you are right. And that the problem is not so much complaining, cynicism, etc., but actually not doing anything. Many people just sit and criticize, but don't do anything to make a situation better or to better themselves. Sure, it's difficult to do if you see no hope whatsoever in your actions being able to change the current situation. But there ARE things that can change, even if only at a small scale, or perhaps even in non-linear terms. So, complaining just for the sake of complaining is wise-acring, but if the complaint, rant or whatever is accompanied by some productive action, all the while remembering to be grateful and as objective as possible, then I think it's fairly healthy. If it is not based on projection and petty dislikes, on wanting to shift blame, on splitting, on internal consideration, etc., then it's okay in moderation, and can be a healthy way not to bottle things up.

It is also related to not thinking in black&white terms only. Some things are really unacceptable, some are morally neutral, and we should know which is which, how not to take them personally and let go of the minor things, while saving our anger for things that really are wrong, for giving a bit of truth to the lies.

FWIW.

 

[loreta]

The most important thing to do when you open your eyes in the morning is to say: thank you, I am here, I am alive, I am with the people I love, with my animals. Thank you. Then feel this, this love, this presence, this moment where stress is not there, where there is just you waking up another day, feel even if it is just for one minute. Feel your body, this extraordinary machine. Your heart. I do this every morning since some days. I feel happy. Even if it is just one minute. (or more)

Evidently during the day things are different and you complain. I complain. I forget that I am alive. That my heart is working. I am angry, I complain, complain. Where is my heart? Where is my breath? I forget that I am alive. This is worst then to be pessimist.

Try to change things little by little, try to know oneself, correct oneself, mirror oneself. Than accepting what it is. We complain the most part of the time because we refuse what it is. I talk about me. Every person is a world.

A lot to do. Times are hard, they will become harder. We must learn to be grateful to be here. We can not change this planet, just myself. But it is not an easy task.

I don't like cynicism. Cynicism hurts. But I like irony, and maybe we can learn to be a little more ironic with ourselves and this can be fun.

Thanks Pashalis and Chu.

 

[duyunne]

Physiological pain and suffering I think is the prime force behind persistent negativity in most intelligent people. No one *wants* to be mean and grumpy all day.

The next time someone comes off as mean, consider that this might just be symptomatic to on going pain or even an diagnosed anxiety disorder as an example. I notice when I have anxiety or when my TMJ flares up I tend to become very closed off and irritable.

 

[Turgon]

We know that pessimism per se isn't something negative and if handled properly is actually something that is a desirable and sane approach to a lot of things; but can a connection to complaining, cynicisms, sarcasm, crankiness, moaning and whinging very easily develop if one doesn't pay strict attention to ones thinking and actions? Can it go overboard very easily and make the life not only of oneself but others a living hell? I think the answer is a clear yes.

I think pessimism is akin to being realistic about the state of the world and human beings in general, who are often fickle and self-centered, as Caesar said. Just observing ourselves and other people have shown this to be true.

So cynicism and sarcasm has its place because of the above. However, it can get over the top and if a person engages in it too often it can alter your perceptions to such a degree that it might become pathological and harmful to one's self and others.

Gurdjieff stated in his 82 rules for life - never complain - and I try to live by that as best as possible when I catch myself complaining too much or becoming too cynical because it really doesn't help and like Chu said, if there's no action or effort to change your situation if you don't like it, is draining and takes away from trying to navigate the world in a healthy way and bettering yourself and the world around you.

I have a 'friend' --- pessimism --- who complains all the time. Unless a situation goes his way he becomes incredibly cynical and sarcastic, whines and is never happy with things. He has to find something, and I've seen this same mode of being mirrored in others and even myself. If he is happy, it's short lived and only for himself. It's to such a degree now that he rarely shows concern or gratitude, or at least switches to this default state often when any demand might be asked of him. Despite the relative periods of calm over the years, it has caused so much frustration and conflict with the rest of us who are a small group of friends that try and work with it.

He is obviously suffering but also has very little compassion or understanding for other people, so in turn has none for himself. I've often anguished as to how to help him but found nothing I say works, or if it gets through, I later discover the message becomes distorted or what was said earlier parroted back in a sarcastic or condescending way. Which is really hurtful because that kind of attitude spreads and causes unnecessary animosity. Your sharing your suffering but not in a way intended to lift the burden off your shoulders but rather spread it to others.

So I've lost hope for him, which might be the more realistic and pessimistic view to take, and like Chad Prather said in the video, try and limit my exposure as much as possible because life is hard as it is without having other people making it worse. Laura said it in a quote that we have all grown up suffering hurts and traumas but that doesn't give us the right to be cold, hurtful and unloving towards other people.

So cynicism, sarcasm, crankiness, and complaining plays its part to survive in what can be an unforgiving world, but I find it can also dampen the human spirit and lessens the possibility of finding joy or meaning out of difficult and sometimes impossible situations whereas being too hopeful and idealistic, which I associate with naivety can be unrealistic and leads to disappointment.

So my take on it is having a healthy dose of pessimism prepares you for the worst but also allows you to be open to the possibility of things going unexpectedly well without being too attached to an outcome.

At least that's my 2 cents.

 

[Cosmos]

And that the problem is not so much complaining, cynicism, etc., but actually not doing anything. Many people just sit and criticize, but don't do anything to make a situation better or to better themselves. Sure, it's difficult to do if you see no hope whatsoever in your actions being able to change the current situation. But there ARE things that can change, even if only at a small scale, or perhaps even in non-linear terms.

Yes I think that is a good way to put it and what Prather also suggest in the first video. If one is prone to get complainy and cynic about things, trying to do something good for others in any small way possible, is a good recipe to not slip down into a dangerous dynamic.

So, complaining just for the sake of complaining is wise-acring, but if the complaint, rant or whatever is accompanied by some productive action, all the while remembering to be grateful and as objective as possible, then I think it's fairly healthy. If it is not based on projection and petty dislikes, on wanting to shift blame, on splitting, on internal consideration, etc., then it's okay in moderation, and can be a healthy way not to bottle things up.

Agree as well. I also think that practising gratefulness and humility, as mentioned above and by loreta in her post, is a key ingredient that can easily be forgotten if not practised and remembered firmly.

In regards to "it is not based on projection and petty dislikes, on wanting to shift blame, on splitting, on internal consideration, etc., then it's okay in moderation" I would say that it maybe can happen more often then people think and that it is a good goal to recognise that and trying to not expose others to it anymore.

There is likely a good reason why Gurdjieff, as Turgon pointed out, made it one of his rules to not complain, since that comes so natural/automatic to most, if not all human beings to one extend or the other.

It is also related to not thinking in black&white terms only. Some things are really unacceptable, some are morally neutral, and we should know which is which, how not to take them personally and let go of the minor things, while saving our anger for things that really are wrong, for giving a bit of truth to the lies.

Very well put and I would add that maybe also Assumptions play a big role in cynic, complainy behaviour, especially if it has gotten out of hand.

I notice when I have anxiety or when my TMJ flares up I tend to become very closed off and irritable.

Definitely! That is why it makes it even more important when one tends to be on the "irritable" or lets say "neurotic" side, to work against that tendency and not let it out on other people as best as possible.

 

[BHelmet]

Pessimism is expecting things to go badly. Complaining occurs after they do.

But things going badly is very subjective. Why should they go how you want...How your machine wants? That is STS, no?

The antidotes? Stoicism for one. Look for the lessons in things going badly. Take responsibility for fixing your complaints. Or an exercise in acceptance. Often external complaints are a smokescreen to avoid confronting our own flaws.

It is all fodder for work on the self. Grist for the mill. Thank the universe for being so troublesome.

 

[Yas]

I think that it is hard to not be pessimistic but I also noticed what you imply Pashalis, that then we can go overboard on the cynical side and even become what would be a bit grumpy because we are, I guess, less patient, less joyful, and filled with anticipation and expectations of bad things to come. What can happen is that we can become a bit of nihilists ourselves since we don't see the point of anything we do if all we can hope for is bad, I suppose.

I think that there's a difference, though, in a pessimism that at is "accepting" the situation and just dealing with it, and a pessimism that is not accepting it and resenting it. And I guess that's also where stoicism comes. In the "accepting pessimism", you know things aren't very good and might not go very well, yet you just deal with the cards you've got and play them the best you can, which would be, maybe, "stoic pessimism". With the other type of pessimism, you are constantly expecting the world o situation to change towards what way you expect it to be, pessimism comes because the world doesn't match your expectations and you are angry and resented because of that. I suppose that when we have this second type of pessimism, we're more prone to that attitude of complaining and not doing much about it. And we're more prone to negative effects of pessimism.

I think that we can fall into this state temporarily sometimes and, as you said, it is important to keep it in check. I guess that when we have too many expectations of a particular outcome that is kind of too far or not very clear still, we can become a bit pessimistic in the bad way.

The antidote I've found to that so far is keeping in mind what are my expectations and remembering to not get so attached to them, like, learning to have a aim, but not anticipating the outcome as much as I can. For that, I guess it is important to be more in the present and focus on the things we can do right now. What has been mentioned about remembering every day what we already have right in front of us and around us which we can be grateful for helps with that, I think. We are so much better than so many people in so many ways, that there surely is a lot for which to be grateful. We have so many resources, tools and lessons we've already learnt that we can put to practice. And, usually, we have some good people around us or to whom we are connected, people with whom we can share and learn... and yes, remembering that every day is an opportunity to improve oneself, our relationship with others, learn something, helps to become more focused in the present without having to shift into a rose-coloured view of reality. The future isn't very promising, maybe, but we can still live the best we can while we're here, I suppose.

I kind of like this little video about pessimism, it's very short and maybe reductionist, but it's also just a "funny" video, so don't expect too much