Pinpointing pain and feeling it move or disappear...

[tridean]

Hi All,
Wasn't sure whether to start this here or in 'what's on your mind', but wanted to share something to get feedback.

I have to start out by saying I don't take pain killers.

A while ago I decided to try something when I had a headache and that was to pinpoint the pain, give it some form such as an object form,. it doesn't matter, it could be a body of light, look like a fishing sinker weight, anything, as long as it had form,. and what I found was that the pain would either move or go away. If it moved, I would simply follow it, or if it moved too quick, wait for it to re-appear somewhere else and repeat, and eventually it would go away.

I have done this every time since whenever I have had a headache, and without fail it works, but sometimes taking longer than other times, and there are times when it puts me to sleep.

Today, I noticed my muscles tensing up, and decided to try it with this, and it too went away.

There is a back pain I have had to deal with for a number of years and decided to try this here too. The only difference here is that the pain comes on as a sharp pain when I am out of position etc, so it is not a pain that sits there for a time, however, I was able to get myself into a position to keep some of the pain constant, and I was able to 'follow' the pain around, it was as if the pain didn't like me focusing on it, and so it needed to move.

Was wondering if others have done this or experienced this?

Dingo

 

[RedFox]

Yup, I use to do this a lot too with the same sort of results. You can use the same for muscle tension too (just imagine the tension as a tightly closed hand...the give the hand the sensations of being as tightly closed as possible...then imagine it relaxing and what that feels like and your muscles should also relax).
One thing does come to mind however, that just like painkillers (I don't like them much either) by removing the pain (especially if it is a reoccurring pain) you are missing an important message from your body about something.
That's not to say pain relief isn't useful, but just keep in mind what your body may be trying to tell you. Food allergies are the first thing to consider, then stress (what is causing the stress) etc....

*edit* to add, pipe breathing into pain (visualising that you are actually breathing through the part of your body that's in pain - whilst pipe breathing) has a really powerful pain relieving effect. fwiw

 

[tridean]

Yup, I use to do this a lot too with the same sort of results. You can use the same for muscle tension too (just imagine the tension as a tightly closed hand...the give the hand the sensations of being as tightly closed as possible...then imagine it relaxing and what that feels like and your muscles should also relax).
One thing does come to mind however, that just like painkillers (I don't like them much either) by removing the pain (especially if it is a reoccurring pain) you are missing an important message from your body about something.
That's not to say pain relief isn't useful, but just keep in mind what your body may be trying to tell you. Food allergies are the first thing to consider, then stress (what is causing the stress) etc....

*edit* to add, pipe breathing into pain (visualising that you are actually breathing through the part of your body that's in pain - whilst pipe breathing) has a really powerful pain relieving effect. fwiw

Thanks for that. I certainly knew of stress, but food allergies I hadn't considered. Thanks.

I do find it funny though, when the pain moves around it's like it has a mind of its own.

 

[Thor]

A couple of years ago I was on a three month yoga retreat and I recall the Swami describing exactly the method that you mention as a way of overcoming many different types of pain. They had been teaching the technique for 30 years and had had students with very good results for many different issues such as migraine, toot aches, back pains, fibromyalgia, and other that I don't recall.

On a somewhat related note, John E. Sarno, M.D. has written a very interesting book called Healing Back Pain, that describes a method to treat many different chronic pain situations. In short the theory is that the subconscious will create a pain at one or more places in your body as a way to distract you from something that you (subconsciously) don't want to deal with. He calls the overall problem Tension Myositis Syndrome and the way it works is that the oxygen supply to muscles, nerves, or ligaments are decreased ever so slightly which results in cramping and resulting pain. From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_E._Sarno:

"John E. Sarno (born 1923) is Professor of Clinical Rehabilitation Medicine, New York University School of Medicine, and attending physician at the Howard A. Rusk Institute of Rehabilitation Medicine, New York University Medical Center. He graduated from The Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons in 1950. In 1965 he became the Director of the Outpatient Department at the Rusk Institute. He is also the originator of the diagnosis of the controversial psychosomatic condition, tension myositis syndrome (TMS), which has not received serious study from mainstream medicine....

...Sarno's most notable (and controversial) achievement is the development, diagnosis and treatment of TMS, which is not recognized by mainstream medical science. According to Sarno, TMS is a psychosomatic illness causing chronic back, neck, and limb pain which is not relieved by standard medical treatments. He includes other ailments, such as GI problems, dermatological disorders and repetitive-strain injuries as TMS related. Sarno states that he has successfully treated over ten thousand patients at the Rusk Institute by educating them on his beliefs of a psychological and emotional basis to their pain and symptoms.[1] Sarno's theory is, in part, that the pain or GI symptoms are an unconscious "distraction" to aid in the repression of deep unconscious emotional issues. Sarno believes that when patients think about what may be upsetting them in their unconscious they can defeat their minds strategy to repress these powerful emotions in this manner, the symptoms are seen for what they are and the symptoms then serve no purpose, and they go away. Supporters of Sarno's work hypothesize an inherent difficulty in performing the clinical trials needed to prove or disprove the diagnosis, since it is difficult to use clinical trials with psychosomatic illntesses.[2]"

A further discussion of TMS can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tension_myositis_syndrome

 

[tendrini]

Dingo - I have also used this method for pain. I first read about it in a book by Tony Robbins, the "success guru", who attributed it to NLP. The technique was just like you described - you visualize the pain, give it a concrete form and then imagine it being removed in some way. Sometimes I have pain in my legs, and I have found that often just trying to focus and figure out where it is coming from is enough to make it go away.

Thor - That is really interesting about TMS and oxygen supply. Makes me wonder if all these pains are really psychological.

 

[RedFox]

Dingo - I have also used this method for pain. I first read about it in a book by Tony Robbins, the "success guru", who attributed it to NLP. The technique was just like you described - you visualize the pain, give it a concrete form and then imagine it being removed in some way. Sometimes I have pain in my legs, and I have found that often just trying to focus and figure out where it is coming from is enough to make it go away.

Thor - That is really interesting about TMS and oxygen supply. Makes me wonder if all these pains are really psychological.

I think pain and health problems can definitely be psychological. A faulty belief (i.e. accepting lies about yourself and world as truth), emotional pain and trauma, repressed memories/traumatic memories from very early in life etc can all be the cause.
From my own experience, trying to tackle the psychological route first doesn't work too well...if at all. It had no lasting effects, with the exception of learning about my own psychology (which helped me clear up some of my negative thinking/faulty self image).
What worked in the end was tackling my diet (getting rid of gluten/dairy/sugar/soy etc etc)......then realising I still had some health problems and pain left I went back to the psychological causes and this time it seems to be working really well.

Seems you have to clean up your diet, detox and probably do E-E for a while to then be able to shift the psychological causes of pain/disease. This is my understanding of my own situation at the moment. Others may be different.

 

[Thor]

Dingo - I have also used this method for pain. I first read about it in a book by Tony Robbins, the "success guru", who attributed it to NLP. The technique was just like you described - you visualize the pain, give it a concrete form and then imagine it being removed in some way. Sometimes I have pain in my legs, and I have found that often just trying to focus and figure out where it is coming from is enough to make it go away.

Thor - That is really interesting about TMS and oxygen supply. Makes me wonder if all these pains are really psychological.

I think pain and health problems can definitely be psychological. A faulty belief (i.e. accepting lies about yourself and world as truth), emotional pain and trauma, repressed memories/traumatic memories from very early in life etc can all be the cause.
From my own experience, trying to tackle the psychological route first doesn't work too well...if at all. It had no lasting effects, with the exception of learning about my own psychology (which helped me clear up some of my negative thinking/faulty self image).
What worked in the end was tackling my diet (getting rid of gluten/dairy/sugar/soy etc etc)......then realising I still had some health problems and pain left I went back to the psychological causes and this time it seems to be working really well.

Seems you have to clean up your diet, detox and probably do E-E for a while to then be able to shift the psychological causes of pain/disease. This is my understanding of my own situation at the moment. Others may be different.

I believe that on one level all pain is created in the mind. However, that is easy to say and until I know that internally, it is just an interesting text book fact. Unfortunately I am not at a stage where I can use that knowledge to help my chronic pain :(

Following up on Sarno's approach, the idea is that if you have chronic pain that can't be explained by conventional medicine, you might be suffering from TMS. If so, the subconscious will manifest TMS in a variety of places, depending on where your vulnerabilities are. For some people that will be the lower back, for others, it will be a tension in the jaw, fibromyaligia, knees, bowels,etc. I am currently reading The Ultramind Solution which is extremely interesting. Here, the opposite mechanism is highlighted, namely that much of your psychological pain is due to physical imbalances, largely dependent on a faulty diet and toxins in the body. Trying to tie these two theories together, my hypothesis is that you develop "weak spots" in your physical armor due to you diet. Whichever weak spots come up can be taken advantage of by your subconscious, through TMS. Once you clean up your diet and detox you remove many of the weak spots and the chronic pains that remain must be psychological in nature.

I have been doing EE for a couple of months now but haven't been able to notice any difference. However, since so many people on the forum have such good results from it, I find it difficult to believe that I should be the only one that is so messed up that it can't help me. Also, I hear many people saying that it does have an effect on the subconscious whether I notice it or not.

I will start the six weak diet program from The Ultramind Solution in a couple of week and am really looking forward to what that will bring. To be rid of my back pain would truly be a life changing event and just improving the situation would make my year :) . Already, following the threads on the forum has led me to take magnesium supplements and use magnesium oil on the back which is a great improvement. It doesn't treat the root cause but it alleviates the secondary pain coming from muscles and tendons tightening up to protect the painful area. So I'm cautiously optimistic :/

 

[tridean]

When I was about 17-18, I was given a book simply called "Mind Power". It was given to me by my mates brother, and really thought nothing of it. Rode my bike to another mates house, and he wasn't home, so I sat on his porch with this book. I read it twice that afternoon waiting for my friend!

The biggest impression I got from it was about healing the body, and it suggested a method of green light on the pain. At that time I had a back niggle that had 'niggled' me for years, and as soon as I applied this method on it it went away never to return! So, you can imagine the mission I went on from there if you've read any of my other posts in recent times, (http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=19546.0)

Anyway, since then by habit, I have said 'Dr Real will heal' even up to now. It is many times purely mechanical and habitual...this was another suggestion in the book, used in isolation of a pain, and as a general tonic.

To this day, I have had little by way of reasons to dismiss it, because I generally do not get sick as often as all the people I know who are close to me, however I have had a roller coaster ride and i guess when I am strong it is easier, and when I am weak it is harder.

For example, heart burn is a big thing in my Dad's side of the family. I used to get it as a kid all the time and no one believed me, because 'apparently' kids don't get it. Anyway, when I was around 20-22, my life was a shambles and it was rife in me, even drinking water gave it to me, and yes, I would Dr Real it, but most times it would fail. So I succumbed, went to the doctor, who thought it was an ulcer, gave me heaps of pills, it did nothing. Then I had en endoscopy, and this showed that I have a faulty valve. The weird thing is, since then I hardly ever suffer from it. It's as if, by knowing what was physically causing it, it no longer had as much power over me. Go figure!

So in my experience, and this is all it is because I don't know how subjective I am in anything, I have witnesses those who get sick the most seem to have fallen into the belief that our bodies are quite fragile, and that germs, bugs and viruses are real mean and nasty critters that have immense power, and only powerful drugs can stop them.

I have also realized that bosses and those who make money from commissions etc, seemed to have taken the 'managerial/owner' vaccination because in my experience, the employees always take more sick days than the employers.

So yeah, I think the mental, or psychological aspect of it is very important. I have learned from my own observations that I get weaker when I am looking for sympathy too.

But the food thing, as I mentioned earlier is new to me, so i need to make an effort to look at my diet. Should be interesting

 

[tridean]

I think pain and health problems can definitely be psychological. A faulty belief (i.e. accepting lies about yourself and world as truth), emotional pain and trauma, repressed memories/traumatic memories from very early in life etc can all be the cause.
From my own experience, trying to tackle the psychological route first doesn't work too well...if at all. It had no lasting effects, with the exception of learning about my own psychology (which helped me clear up some of my negative thinking/faulty self image).
What worked in the end was tackling my diet (getting rid of gluten/dairy/sugar/soy etc etc)......then realising I still had some health problems and pain left I went back to the psychological causes and this time it seems to be working really well.

Seems you have to clean up your diet, detox and probably do E-E for a while to then be able to shift the psychological causes of pain/disease. This is my understanding of my own situation at the moment. Others may be different.

Does anyone think that there may be a connection between using the mind to eliminate pain and the subconscious mind making you go 'off' certain foods?

This is just something that came to me as I recently have found myself going off certain foods that up until recently I have loved all my life, and the mention here in this thread about food allergies and certain foods being the cause of some pains etc.

My thinking is along the lines of, if you have a pain and you can use the mind to eliminate it short term, i.e. using the method that I mentioned at the beginning of this thread, and that after time, you keep applying this method, the mind is then working to remove what ever is causing it permanently. Then if it is psychological, then something is going to happen to force you to visit whatever is the cause, i.e. an insight, a revelation etc which will enable you to root out the cause. If it food based, the mind will want to find a way to keep you from the foods that are causing it, hence over time create a discomfort towards that food.

Any thoughts?

 

[agni]

I've discovered accidentally similar technique couple of months ago without use of visual images.

I was reflecting on pain (while had a headache), and remembered C's saying about cancer patients in acknowledging the pain. It brought up memory/experience, where I've burned myself and eased the pain with ice pack, but as soon as I remove ice pack, I would be in pain again. So, I've dealt with the situation by accepting the pain from the burn, feeling it, after I did that it pretty much went away.

So, I've wondered if the same could be applied to headache. So, I've started to identify spots in the head, where pain was radiating from. So, pretty much, it came down to identifying the spot, feeling it's pain, recognizing it and relaxing it by concentrating on it (letting it go). Then to next spot, until all areas are recognized. Worked like a charm. Clears out headache completely. I haven't head a headache since I was not able to let go.

I do not know what is the process behind it, but if I to take a guess: As above as below, perhaps ? Process seems to be quite similar in dealing with psychological & emotional pain.