Psycopaths and Hostages to Fortune

[alwyn]

First of all, I want to thank Laura and the forum for illuminating the work on Ponerology, and also for articles, etc. in dealing with the 'Garden Variety Psycopath.' I used to hear alot about the 'petty tyrants' that Castaneda used to talk about, and got caught up by a few of them. (I'm being modest...there wasn't a hook I wouldn't take, for a while .) I finally got to the point where I had worked on myself to the point of not having many places for the psychos to hook on to...and then I had a child.

I think that the heart-softening that happens when you have a child can sometimes turn your brain to mush. I started to believe the world could be good again. I thought that everyone must have SOME good in them. It was something about looking into my son's eyes, and seeing absolute love and trust. About this time, the lights must have come up in the psychopathic target locator, 'cause all hell broke loose.

The father of my child took up with a real sociopath, who stayed with him long enough to bust up our relationship, and then move on. My child's father decided that child rearing wasn't for him, and moved out. (Not too far, we're rather stuck in a three-way land partnership, but he moved about as far as the back end of the forty.) My son was diagnosed with asthma, and almost died from the tender ministrations of what passes for 'Western Medicine.' I had to take on the medical establishment to keep them from repeating the drugs that almost killed him twice. I found a homeopath, got my son on the road to healing, got married , and was settling down with my new family when the proverbial effluent hit the fan.

The same woman who was responsible for breaking up our relationship took up with the father of my child again. Only now, she set her sights on my son. Somehow, she convinced this socially delinquent father that their relationship could only be complete if her son and mine were all together in the same household. I suppose I could deal with the ensuing custody battle, but the way she twisted my son's mind was insane. The poor kid didn't know if he was coming or going, and I couldn't figure out how this seemingly charming woman could cause so much damage, and convince just about everyone around me that I was crazy, an unfit mother, and a danger to my son. I didn't have a name for this, I just knew it was wrong, and I set out to find the answer.

I can't even tell you how I got to this site, I only know I did, and, finally, I had a NAME for what was happening to me and my son. The research and resources have been invaluable, and went a huge way towards restoring my equilibrium. I just wonder if anyone else has any experience with psychos targeting their children (I seem to remember Laura had a comment or two), but, more importantly, how can we protect our children?

What I came up with for my boy was, rather than fight a war of words (which apparently can't be done with a sociopath...glad I got that fact) I tried to point out the inconsistencies and disparities between action and words. It is hard for him. He was raised with the truth, and has a truly loving heart. And, I suppose, it is better that this come up now, while I am still able to somewhat intercede, rather than later, with no warning or oversight. I don't know what I'll do if they prevail in court. I'm worried that they will kill my son through neglect (this idiot woman told my son his asthma was psychosomatic...obviously she never sat next to hospital monitors counting breaths and heartbeats, wondering if they would flat-line or improve...psychosomatic my a**).

I feel I can handle anything but this, and I don't really have a choice in the matter. This is war, and handle it I must.
So, how do you all handle the war with your hostages to fortune?

 

[Miss Isness]

Hello alwyn, thanks for sharing your personal experience. I've learned that the goal of psychopaths is to keep us confused, emotionally over heated, and exhausted so that we don't have the energy to prevail against their selfish agendas. So you can expect contradictory behavior, button pushing, and the unrelenting pressure of dealing with whatever kind of problems they can throw in your path.

I'm learning just like you, but I think the two most important things to do are: 1) to keep your emotional equilibrium - find what works best for you, don't just keep it all inside. Sometimes emotional flare ups can be avoided by looking at one's feelings in the cold light of reason, other times we need an outlet - a walk in nature, physical exercise, a therapeutic, creative activity, etc., 2) increase your knowledge base by reading, observing, and networking. Don't allow yourself to become isolated. Counterbalance the psychopathic input with investing time in healthy relationships. Sometimes spending time with 'normal' people can restore your state of being without even focusing on finding solutions to your problems. If you can maintain or restore a healthy psychological state, you will have the strength and clarity to see through psychopathic manipulations, and understand how to deal with them. If you maintain social contacts with normal people, you will be less vulnerable to attack as anyone of your contacts could come to your aid at anytime., and psychopaths know this.

Conserve your energy. Don't give your psychopathic attacker the pleasure of getting a rise out of you. Use your fear of losing your son to fuel your search for knowledge that will circumvent the loss. That's what it's there for. Don't forget that every quality has its polar opposite. For every evil there is an equally powerful force for good that can be expressed through you.

Even if what I've written is nothing new, I hope that the reassurance that you aren't alone will give you strength. Hang in there....

 

[vinny]

alwyn, thanks for sharing your story. they psycho's will always find the weak spot and will use it mercilessly.

manipulating a person through their child/children is absolutely the vile-est thing ever. I understand what you are going through, and you have my sympathy.

there are some things you can do to help the situation. It sounds as though you (and anyone else in a similar situation) really need to get hold of the book 'In Sheep's Clothing' by George K Simon Jr, Ph.D. It exposes all the moves used by covert aggressives, and has very good guidelines in how to defend yourself against it. Some of it is quoted here on the forum/site. You may find these useful, as I certainly did:

http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/psychopaths_in_sheeps_clothing.htm

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=2043

http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/psychopath.htm

 

[Adaryn]

I suppose I could deal with the ensuing custody battle,
(...)
I don't know what I'll do if they prevail in court. I'm worried that they will kill my son through neglect (this idiot woman told my son his asthma was psychosomatic...obviously she never sat next to hospital monitors counting breaths and heartbeats, wondering if they would flat-line or improve...psychosomatic my a**).

How could they prevail ? You're his genetic mother and the one who took care of your child all his life, while his father ran away with another woman. You're the one with experience, who knows about his disease (serious asthma) and who knows what kind of treatment he needs. You're the one who has the legitimate right for your son's custody. Besides as you say, it could endanger your son's life to live with persons who know nothing of the treatments needed and the disease (I particularly think of this woman, who apparenlty knows next to nothing, as you described the way she understands your son's disease). And check Sleepyvinnie's links, they give advice on how to deal with sociopaths. I wish you good luck !

 

[alwyn]

there are some things you can do to help the situation. It sounds as though you (and anyone else in a similar situation) really need to get hold of the book 'In Sheep's Clothing' by George K Simon Jr, Ph.D. It exposes all the moves used by covert aggressives, and has very good guidelines in how to defend yourself against it. Some of it is quoted here on the forum/site. You may find these useful, as I certainly did:

http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/psychopaths_in_sheeps_clothing.htm

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=2043

http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/psychopath.htm

Hey, thanks, these are all good links, and I had perused them. I think the tenor of my question was more "how can I prepare and protect my child?" as the links are all very well and good for adults...

I remember now how I found this forum, it was downloading "the Mask of Sanity". Good book, it really helped me to identify the problem. I did order the Sheep's Clothing book, as well. It was also helpful. Also "The Sociopath Next Door" was quite good. I realized I was on to something when I stopped talking to this woman, and SHE almost went nuts. Unfortunately, my visitation arrangement currently puts my son into her hands two days a week. I'm documenting evidence, I have my son visiting a psychologist (which seems to be helping him) I'm just having trouble paraphrasing the info into child size bits of information.

ON another note, this might make a good book idea for someone...

 

[alwyn]

I've learned that the goal of psychopaths is to keep us confused, emotionally over heated, and exhausted so that we don't have the energy to prevail against their selfish agendas.

Ain't that the truth..

I think the two most important things to do are: 1) to keep your emotional equilibrium - 2) increase your knowledge base by reading, observing, and networking. Don't allow yourself to become isolated. If you maintain social contacts with normal people, you will be less vulnerable to attack as anyone of your contacts could come to your aid at anytime., and psychopaths know this.

Conserve your energy. Don't give your psychopathic attacker the pleasure of getting a rise out of you. Use your fear of losing your son to fuel your search for knowledge that will circumvent the loss. .

Excellent advice, thank you. Happily, one of the good things about my life is I know some really wonderful people, and some excellent psychologists. In fact, one of this woman's allegations was that I am not mentally stable. I was able to have one of my friends, who is the head of the dept. of psychology of a major university, write me a testimonial. I can understand how she could make these allegations; until I figured out the nature of her game I was always getting caught up in the drama of either defending myself or my child. ( I can't begin to tell you how loud I screamed when I went up to their house and found my asthmatic child sleeping on the floor next to open fiberglass insulation. I'm afraid I really quite lost my temper.) It wasn't until I was crying on the phone to my sister (who is a FBI trained hostage negotiator, bless her heart) and got reamed by her because she said I sounded like every piece of trailer trash she had ever talked to, that I realized I really needed to do something, and fast. That's when I filed court papers to adjust the custody arrangement, and, of course, the fit really hit the shan.

It was empowering to realize that all I had to do was not respond to her. I had about three blissful months. So of course, she upped the ante with my child. The game is afoot. I can't back down on this one. It's rather down to who has the better lawyer at this point. She is a pillar of the business community. I'm just a scruffy artist. I'm a darn good mother though, and I'm afraid I have the mother bear instinct in spades.

Her son is also a VERY strange fish. A chip off of the sociopathic block. He is always trying to get one over on my kid, or hurt him. I actually had to threaten this kid to stop him hurting mine. Everyone was outraged, but I noticed he stopped physically abusing my son.

Anyway, I don't mean to rant; thanks again for the excellent advice.

 

[Amanecer]

.... I think the tenor of my question was more "how can I prepare and protect my child?" as the links are all very well and good for adults...

Hi alwyn,

Thanks for sharing your story. I am sorry you are going through such a difficult time. I had a disastrous experience with a sociopath, however he did not target my children. It sounds like you have some great support through friends and psychologists....that will certainly help keep you grounded when the psycho woman starts spinning her b******t stories. Something I realized, (too late) when I was dealing with a sociopath, is that everything is just a game. This legal battle is just another mountain for this woman to conquer, yet heart wrenching for you. Perhaps, a bigger fish will swim by and she will turn her sights to something else.

As far as talking to your child about the situation....I can share something I have talked to my own child about concerning evil. One day, my son came in crying. I asked him what happened, and he said "Mama, I wasn't doing anything...I was being happy, and this ant just crawled on me and bit me! That was so mean!" I told my son that unfortunately there are also people just like those ants. Some people are just mean. It doesn't matter if we are nice, care about them, etc. They will "bite" you anyway. I told him that the best thing to do in the case of fire ants or mean people is to get away from them. I know your child can't necessarily run away, but he could possibly leave the room, call you on the phone, or listen to headphones....if he perceives manipulation is going on. I don't know how old your son is....but if he knows what triggers his asthma, he can avoid those things while in this woman's house. Is he old enough to have a cell phone of his own while visiting them? He could call you at anytime he felt he was being put in a bad situation. I am sure you have gotten great advice from the psychologist's he is seeing. I don't know if what i've written will be of any help, but as Miss Isness said, perhaps it will bring reassurrance or support in knowing that you are not alone .

My heart goes out to you and your son. Hang in there.

 

[Kel]

Trends come and go through the years in the courts. For instance, in family law, the trend has lately been to give undeserved favor to fathers. For instance, in my case, when I divorced my daughters father, while I was definitely her primary caregiver since she was born--her dad was gone--I mean out of the country--for much of her first 4 years, there was nothing I could do to prevent 50/50 custody and also 50/50 residence. Since he was not a convicted criminal, there's really nothing I could do to prevent this decision.

However, one growing trend I've seen in the past few years regarding family law is "Parental Alienation Syndrome" or PAS. You may have already heard of it in your state. You can look it up on line as well as ask your attorney about it, but basically it is when one of the parents manipulates the child to believe that the other parent is harmful--therefore causing great harm to the child. This can be as little as saying negative things about the other parent in front of the child, or more extreme manipulation. The syndrome is gaining a great deal of favorable attention in the courts and if it can be shown that this is taking place, your child's father could lose complete custody of his son.

Document everything. You'll need evidence. Do not answer the phone when he (or she) calls. Call him/her back right away, but record all messages. Also, it's worth a shot to record live phone conversatons. In most states phone conversations are not admissable in court, but check with your state. If not, at least record the phone messages because they will be admissable. Do not let them know that you are trying to prove PAS is going on until you have evidence. This documenting, and recording is all a real pain to go through, but as you said, this is war, and right now you do not have the luxury of getting on with your life in the usual way.

I certainly do not see how you could lose custody in the 50/50 setup, being his biological mother without a criminal record. But be careful--PAS is serious and could be turned against you as well if you are dealing with psychopaths who truly do not care about your child. Do not talk about your ex in front of your child to other people--even on the phone--and never say anything negative about him to your child.

I wish you all the best and my heart goes out to you and your son during this difficult time.

-Kel

-

 

[Beau]

For instance, in my case, when I divorced my daughters father, while I was definitely her primary caregiver since she was born--her dad was gone--I mean out of the country--for much of her first 4 years, there was nothing I could do to prevent 50/50 custody and also 50/50 residence. Since he was not a convicted criminal, there's really nothing I could do to prevent this decision.

Why would you want to prevent it? It sounds like you would like to keep your child for yourself and not let him/her see the father. I'm sure there is more to the story so maybe you could elaborate on why you would want to keep your daughter away from her father.

 

[alwyn]

As far as talking to your child about the situation....I can share something I have talked to my own child about concerning evil. One day, my son came in crying. I asked him what happened, and he said "Mama, I wasn't doing anything...I was being happy, and this ant just crawled on me and bit me! That was so mean!" I told my son that unfortunately there are also people just like those ants. Some people are just mean. It doesn't matter if we are nice, care about them, etc. They will "bite" you anyway. I told him that the best thing to do in the case of fire ants or mean people is to get away from them.

Good story, and good analogy. I recently found a book, by Idries Shah, called "The Old Woman and the Eagle." It seems to be a good 'innoculation' type of story. It deals with just this issue, recognizing those who would harm us, and getting away.

Is he old enough to have a cell phone of his own while visiting them? He could call you at anytime he felt he was being put in a bad situation.

If only. He, being a good boy, listens to adults. (I'm going to have to work on this...foster some rebellion, perhaps.) The wicked stepmother will not let him call me, and controls access to the phone, by having them not work or not be available. Our cell-phone reception is problematic, being in mountain country. But, he has started to come on down the hill to visit when he feels things are out of hand, so that is good. I'm in court this Wednesday...will see how it goes.

 

[alwyn]

Trends come and go through the years in the courts. For instance, in family law, the trend has lately been to give undeserved favor to fathers. For instance, in my case, when I divorced my daughters father, while I was definitely her primary caregiver since she was born--her dad was gone--I mean out of the country--for much of her first 4 years, there was nothing I could do to prevent 50/50 custody and also 50/50 residence. Since he was not a convicted criminal, there's really nothing I could do to prevent this decision.

Yeah, the doctrine of 'fair and balanced' goes a long way. Mostly it's a question of who has the bigger lawyer, from what I can see.

However, one growing trend I've seen in the past few years regarding family law is "Parental Alienation Syndrome" or PAS. ... basically it is when one of the parents manipulates the child to believe that the other parent is harmful--therefore causing great harm to the child.

I've read about this, including the fact that the psych who came up with this is uncredited and a little demented...He is lionized by fathers, and castigated by mothers, at least from the general information I came up with. However, any port in a storm, and, if there is precedence, I can indeed use it.

Document everything. You'll need evidence... In most states phone conversations are not admissable in court, but check with your state.

Oh, so not legal in California...

If not, at least record the phone messages because they will be admissable.

Good to know

But be careful--PAS is serious and could be turned against you as well if you are dealing with psychopaths who truly do not care about your child.

I particularly like that bit about turning everything around. I've never seen such a classic case of projection in my life. Here's a woman that used to leave her son behind an alestand while she was out dallying, to put it politely, calling me a bad mother. If it wasn't so threatening, I'd be ROTFLMAO.

Thanks for your advice and good wishes...

Alwyn

 

[Ruth]

Its clear that the needs of the child must come first.

The needs of the mother, father, the law or any third party (well meaning or not) should be of no consequence
to the ultimate well being of the child. The court, the law and the judge should be keeping that in mind.

Here, they are trying the less adversarial approach because they have recognised its advantages.
http://www.familycourt.gov.au/presence/connect/www/home/about/less_adversarial_trials/main_page_less_adversarial_trials

For instance, in my case, when I divorced my daughters father, while I was definitely her primary caregiver since she was born--her dad was gone--I mean out of the country--for much of her first 4 years, there was nothing I could do to prevent 50/50 custody and also 50/50 residence. Since he was not a convicted criminal, there's really nothing I could do to prevent this decision.

Why would you want to prevent it? It sounds like you would like to keep your child for yourself and not let him/her see the father. I'm sure there is more to the story so maybe you could elaborate on why you would want to keep your daughter away from her father.

50/50 huh? Sounds like something Solomon would try in order to be 'fair' - - but to which party?? Its a pity that relationships and trust aren't as cut and dried as law is and need to be developed, earned... and to evolve and grow. Where is the child in all of this?