Quote from an Israeli Soldier

[stonepony]

With all the Israeli bashing that goes on here I thought maybe people should read this and realise that not all Israeli soilders are evil. Not everyone wants to be at war.

"This war isn't going to end anytime soon and it's so depressing. In the last few times I got back home I couldn't leave my house and meet friends because it's so dangerous with the rockets and all. This weekend is the worst that has been so far. Yesterday I actually heard rockets fall and I'm afriad that next time rockets can fall even closer to my house.
I'm trying to think what caused this war to burst out like this, and I just can't find a decent answer. Hizbullah kidnapped three Israeli soldiers, and in return the Israeli Air Force bobmed Beirut. Why not do what we usually do, and free some hundreds of Lebanese prisoners? Why kill dozens of innocent Lebanese citizens, children included each day? Why destroy Beirut like this? We're causing ourselves to become loathsome in the eyes of the rest of the world, plus Lebanese that didn't hate Israel until now. Just perfect."

I'm sure someone will tear into me/this quote.

 

[Beau]

With all the Israeli bashing that goes on here

Please post specific references to this claim.

Not everyone wants to be at war.

Yet nothing changes.

 

[Russ]

It seems strange to me that this person doesn't know why they are fighting, yet they still are, and like they say, its at the expense of civilians lives. So why not just... not fight? Or at least find out why they are doing it - what they are fighting for, before they start pulling triggers?

Am I missing something?

 

[FranzJoseph]

It seems strange to me that this person doesn't know why they are fighting, yet they still are, and like they say, its at the expense of civilians lives. So why not just... not fight? Or at least find out why they are doing it - what they are fighting for, before they start pulling triggers?

Am I missing something?

Probably the same thing Buffy Ste Marie wrote about 40 years ago:

The Universal Soldier

Buffy Sainte-Marie

He's five feet two and he's six feet four
He fights with missiles and with spears
He's all of 31 and he's only 17
He's been a soldier for a thousand years

He's a Catholic, a Hindu, an atheist, a Jain,
a Buddhist and a Baptist and a Jew
and he knows he shouldn't kill
and he knows he always will
kill you for me my friend and me for you

And he's fighting for Canada,
he's fighting for France,
he's fighting for the USA,
and he's fighting for the Russians
and he's fighting for Japan,
and he thinks we'll put an end to war this way

And he's fighting for Democracy
and fighting for the Reds
He says it's for the peace of all
He's the one who must decide
who's to live and who's to die
and he never sees the writing on the walls

But without him how would Hitler have
condemned him at Dachau
Without him Caesar would have stood alone
He's the one who gives his body
as a weapon to a war
and without him all this killing can't go on

He's the universal soldier and he
really is to blame
His orders come from far away no more
They come from him, and you, and me
and brothers can't you see
this is not the way we put an end to war.

Buffy comments on the song:

I wrote "Universal Soldier" in the basement of The Purple Onion coffee house in Toronto in the early sixties. It's about individual responsibility for war and how the old feudal thinking kills us all. Donovan had a hit with it in 1965.

http://www.creative-native.com/lyrics/univelyr.htm

 

[stonepony]

With all the Israeli bashing that goes on here

Please post specific references to this claim.

There have been articles comparing Israeli to the Nazi movement. I'm not saying what Israel is doint is right, and I believe they are commiting genocide. I just wanted to point out that it's not all Israelis are bad people.

Not everyone wants to be at war.

Yet nothing changes.

I guess it means that some people still want war. I'm just pointing out that even some soilders don't want war. It's easy to sit at a computer and say "stop war"

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

I guess it means that some people still want war. I'm just pointing out that even some soilders don't want war. It's easy to sit at a computer and say "stop war"

It's easy? Well then where do you propose we sit to make it a little more challenging for us? On a tree branch perhaps with a sign that says "stop war"? Yes that would not be so easy, climbing trees is not easy. But we're not concerned with how easy something is but with how effective it is. If you have a better idea, we're all ears.

Also, it is in fact much more difficult to see through the lies, through the propaganda, through the pathocracy, and understand the reasons behind world's problems, understand and SEE the pathocracy, and THEN say "stop war" because of this understanding, not because you burped and the words "stop war" accidentally came out from the burp. It's much easier to say "not all soldiers agree with the war" - that one is pretty obvious, it's true for every war.

 

[Lucy]

"The Universal Soldier"

Buffy comments on the song:

It's about individual responsibility for war and how the old feudal thinking kills us all.

In every war there are a few who are willing to take "personal responsibility." If it can happen here in the United States, what excuse do Israeli soldiers, or soldiers from any country, have? Sure, the pathocrats make it as difficult as possible...but that's to be expected, and doesn't absolve anyone from personal responsibility.

From: www.truthout.org/docs_2006/062506A.shtml
Resistance in the US Military to the War on Iraq
by Ann Wright / Sunday 25 June 2006

"Resistance to the war on Iraq within the US military community is growing. Over eight thousand American soldiers are absent without leave (AWOL), most living underground in the United States. Many now refer to AWOL as "Against War of Lies" instead of Absent Without Leave. Individual non-public resistance in the military generally results in an administrative discharge without publicity. Thousands have turned themselves in to military authorities and have been administratively discharged from the military. US military bases discharge dozens of war resisters each week."

"Public resistance by military personnel to the war on Iraq results in court-martial to make an example of the resister. Some military personnel have applied for conscience objector (CO) status. Most have been denied CO status and ten have been court-martialed and imprisoned for publicly refusing to obey orders to deploy to Iraq to commit criminal acts there, including murder by bombing innocent civilians, shooting innocent civilians, and torture. Those who refuse to deploy to Iraq and kill for the Bush administration generally receive more punishment than those who commit criminal acts of murder and torture. "

"Acts of resistance, big and small, recognized nationally or never heard of by most, by military and civilians are all important elements of ending the illegal war, the war crime, committed by the Bush administration. People of conscience all over the country are refusing to be silent and are taking courageous steps to end the illegal war on Iraq."
~~~
As Buffy says: "the old feudal thinking kills us all. So each person who goes along with the old feudal thinking, and fails to take personal responsibility by resisting, bears responsibility for the killing.

 

[paulnotbilly]

Apparently the same is happening here in the UK, only the ones refusing to serve and being court martialled are making it into news. It's being kept quiet about the ones who've gone AWOL.

 

[henry]

With all the Israeli bashing that goes on here I thought maybe people should read this and realise that not all Israeli soilders are evil. Not everyone wants to be at war.

Can you point to any place where we suggest that all Israeli soldiers are evil? We know that an army is a mixture of people. Unfortunately, as others have suggested, until the common soldier says "No" to the orders and the killing, it will continue.

"This war isn't going to end anytime soon and it's so depressing. In the last few times I got back home I couldn't leave my house and meet friends because it's so dangerous with the rockets and all. This weekend is the worst that has been so far. Yesterday I actually heard rockets fall and I'm afriad that next time rockets can fall even closer to my house.

As far as the "danger" to Israel, the Hezbollah rockets are qualitiatively less dangerous than the bombing and rockets of Israel falling on Labanon and in Palestine. It is the state of Israel that brought on these rocket attacks, not Hezbollah.

I'm trying to think what caused this war to burst out like this, and I just can't find a decent answer. Hizbullah kidnapped three Israeli soldiers, and in return the Israeli Air Force bobmed Beirut. Why not do what we usually do, and free some hundreds of Lebanese prisoners? Why kill dozens of innocent Lebanese citizens, children included each day? Why destroy Beirut like this? We're causing ourselves to become loathsome in the eyes of the rest of the world, plus Lebanese that didn't hate Israel until now. Just perfect."

I'm sure someone will tear into me/this quote.

Hizbollah did not "kidnap" any Israeli soldiers. They captured Israeli soldiers who were in Lebanon. As you suggest, the response is way out of proportion to the trigger. If you read what we write, you will see we have an explanation: the leaders of Israel are psychopaths -- as are the leaders of many other countries. The true enemy is not the Arabs, it is everyone who is not a psychopath, that is, people of conscience. Israel was suppposedly founded as a safe haven for the Jews. It is clear that today's Israel is far from that.

Why?

Because the true intentions of Israel's leaders have nothing to do with protecting Jews. On the contrary, we have been trying to excplain for years that their real intention is to bring on another mass killing, of both Jews and Arabs.

That is the real agenda.

 

[stonepony]

With all the Israeli bashing that goes on here I thought maybe people should read this and realise that not all Israeli soilders are evil. Not everyone wants to be at war.

Can you point to any place where we suggest that all Israeli soldiers are evil? We know that an army is a mixture of people. Unfortunately, as others have suggested, until the common soldier says "No" to the orders and the killing, it will continue.

"This war isn't going to end anytime soon and it's so depressing. In the last few times I got back home I couldn't leave my house and meet friends because it's so dangerous with the rockets and all. This weekend is the worst that has been so far. Yesterday I actually heard rockets fall and I'm afriad that next time rockets can fall even closer to my house.

As far as the "danger" to Israel, the Hezbollah rockets are qualitiatively less dangerous than the bombing and rockets of Israel falling on Labanon and in Palestine. It is the state of Israel that brought on these rocket attacks, not Hezbollah.

I'm trying to think what caused this war to burst out like this, and I just can't find a decent answer. Hizbullah kidnapped three Israeli soldiers, and in return the Israeli Air Force bobmed Beirut. Why not do what we usually do, and free some hundreds of Lebanese prisoners? Why kill dozens of innocent Lebanese citizens, children included each day? Why destroy Beirut like this? We're causing ourselves to become loathsome in the eyes of the rest of the world, plus Lebanese that didn't hate Israel until now. Just perfect."

I'm sure someone will tear into me/this quote.

Hizbollah did not "kidnap" any Israeli soldiers. They captured Israeli soldiers who were in Lebanon. As you suggest, the response is way out of proportion to the trigger. If you read what we write, you will see we have an explanation: the leaders of Israel are psychopaths -- as are the leaders of many other countries. The true enemy is not the Arabs, it is everyone who is not a psychopath, that is, people of conscience. Israel was suppposedly founded as a safe haven for the Jews. It is clear that today's Israel is far from that.

Why?

Because the true intentions of Israel's leaders have nothing to do with protecting Jews. On the contrary, we have been trying to excplain for years that their real intention is to bring on another mass killing, of both Jews and Arabs.

That is the real agenda.

I can see now that I was incorrect in accusing anyone of Israeli bashing. It is obvious I am still uninformed.

 

[homemars]

I can vouch for one such incident where it says "A top Israeli general has resigned over the attacks on Lebanon. Major General Udi Adam, who was commander of the Israeli ground forces in Lebanon during the conflict, quit on Wednesday. He had faced widespread criticism in Israel for his handling of the campaign and was also replaced by another general in the closing days of the war."

Amihai Ayalon, a leading member of the centre-left Labour party says:

"He (Halutz) has lost the trust of those under his command, the officers and the soldiers. And therefore we are just at the beginning of a major shake-up in which people will take personal responsibility".

This is exactly what this wonderful song "The Universal Soldier" is all about.

::: Worth a Visit: http://www(dot)jkcook.net/index.html

 

[Art]

"This war isn't going to end anytime soon and it's so depressing. In the last few times I got back home I couldn't leave my house and meet friends because it's so dangerous with the rockets and all. This weekend is the worst that has been so far. Yesterday I actually heard rockets fall and I'm afriad that next time rockets can fall even closer to my house. I'm trying to think what caused this war to burst out like this, and I just can't find a decent answer. Hizbullah kidnapped three Israeli soldiers, and in return the Israeli Air Force bobmed Beirut. Why not do what we usually do, and free some hundreds of Lebanese prisoners? Why kill dozens of innocent Lebanese citizens, children included each day? Why destroy Beirut like this? We're causing ourselves to become loathsome in the eyes of the rest of the world, plus Lebanese that didn't hate Israel until now. Just perfect."

Could you please provide your source of information?

I can see now that I was incorrect in accusing anyone of Israeli bashing. It is obvious I am still uninformed.

Well at least you recognize it. It is all over the place, studied and analized thoroughly from top to bottom over and over again: The enemy are the psycopaths on power. And they are the enemy of humanity, wherever they are, included Israel