Rumsfeld on Jon Stewart

axj

The Living Force
_http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/wed-february-23-2011-donald-rumsfeld

I find it interesting to observe that despite all the lies and the denial, Rumsfeld comes across as very centered - which to me is surprising. Some of that is certainly the superficial charming of the psychopaths, but it seems to go deeper. I wonder if the crystalisation of a 'dark' center may have something to do with it.
 
That is disturbing to me.
A man who is crueler a spider can impress upon our mind the image of being centered or assured,

hm :huh:
 
Good example of psychopathic confidence. He could also be an essential psychopath, who Lobaczewski said had a 'grandfatherly' sense to them, I think.
 
I saw the broadcast interview and only watched 2/3 of the "extended" web interview so far. If only Jon Stewart had a better understanding of psychopathy he might be able to do us a favor in exposing Rumsfeld for what he is.

I was going to post this in the humor section but I think it deserves a little more prominence. I saw it yesterday on Salon and hopefully it's on its way to being a "meme", hopefully followed of course by a better understanding of psychopathy among the general populace rather than more people taking the whole lizard thing [among our political leaders] literally. But for the moment it's pretty funny by itself.

_http://www.salon.com/news/donald_rumsfeld/index.html?story=/politics/war_room/2011/02/25/rumsfeld_lizard_person
Rumsfeld refuses to deny being a lizard person
By Alex Pareene

Donald Rumsfeld's book tour is probably making him miserable. Here's a guy with deep contempt for the press in general subjecting himself to impudent questioning of his decisions, and this doesn't seem like a man who feels the need to justify his decisions. He even had to pretend to enjoy a discussion with Jon Stewart.

But, honestly, I don't understand what led him to actually call in to "The Opie and Anthony Show." I mean, there was some interesting, informative discussion of Rumsfeld's history and politics and so on. I think. But all anyone will remember is that comedian Louis C.K. repeatedly asked Rumsfeld if he was a lizard person.

_http://wonkette.com/439328/donald-rumsfeld-refuses-to-answer-whether-or-not-hes-a-lizard-person

This is an edited version of the interview, as uploaded by Louis C.K.:

_http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK8Y2nO_8TM

It is definitely worth a listen. Rumsfeld never once denies that he is a lizard person from outer space.

C.K. is referencing the theories of former sportscaster and internationally renowned conspiracy researcher David Icke, who has worked for years now to expose the shape-shifting reptilian Anunnaki gods from the constellation Draco. Disguised as humans, they secretly rule the world. For more, seek out Jon Ronson's documentary about Icke, which is is available on YouTube. (Also you can just watch videos made by the people who believe these things.) [more links in article]
 
I can't watch that man, I know enough about what he is and what he has done that it's like watching a serial killer being feted on television and allowed to act as if butter wouldn't melt in his mouth. Disgusting. There is no such thing as "human civilization".
 
Perceval said:
I can't watch that man, I know enough about what he is and what he has done that it's like watching a serial killer being feted on television and allowed to act as if butter wouldn't melt in his mouth. Disgusting. There is no such thing as "human civilization".

Amen
 
Shane said:
Good example of psychopathic confidence. He could also be an essential psychopath, who Lobaczewski said had a 'grandfatherly' sense to them, I think.

He is pretty certainly an essential psychopath:

"They are fast-talking, charming, self-assured, at ease in social situations, cool under pressure, unfazed by the possibility of being found out, and totally ruthless.” (Hare 121)"
From: http://www.ponerology.com/psychopaths_3.html

I find it helps watching him from a 'clinical' perspective, especially in a somewhat challending situation where he talks with people who completely disagree with him. It just shows how they operate.
 
That's one reason I don't think the whole "lizard person" question is a complete joke. On some level he knows lizard person = essential psychopath and refuses to dignify it with a response. If they were to have an actual discussion about it this equation might come up and he might be asked to contend with evidence he is an essential psychopath. In the radio clip, the first time Louis C. K. asks him if he is a lizard person he responds with some anecdote about a stranger buying his dinner at a restaurant. I guess it's supposed to mean some people think he is a nice guy or something. Is that supposed to be evidence against being a lizard person / essential psychopath?!
 
I think that Rumsfeld and Cheney are indeed some of the best choices when it comes to exposing psychopaths in power.

Everyone already agrees that they are slimy bast#rds, and in many places there is half-joking talk of them being "on the dark side".

Also, the war criminals prosecution of Bush, Cheney and so on in Europe may help in exposing them and others.
 
There is also the angle that Rumsfeld, Cheney, et al are well aware of the David Icke shapeshifting reptilian psy ops and they are willing to subtly encourage these beliefs among those who are already unhinged. The "crazy" people will say, "See, he's a lizard! He wouldn't deny it!" while everyone else laughs about it and at no point does discussion of psychopathy come up. I'm not so sure this will work anymore. I feel like I see psychopath / sociopath brought up a lot more in the media these days, but maybe that's just because I'm looking for it.

Maybe before Rummy is done with his book tour someone will really put the "Are you a psychopath?" question to him. That's sort of a good exercise for us. Is there a question or series of questions you could ask a public, political psychopath to get him to reveal himself? Obviously he wouldn't come right out and say it, but for those who were psychologically aware there might be subjects more likely to reveal it.
 
I wasn't too much disturbed by Rumsfeld. His mask of sanity was to be expected. What was more disturbing and rather sad is how easy Jon Stewart was on him....but then again it's a comedy show and Stewart is in many ways a left gate keeper even if unknowingly. He believes in the official 9/11 story and won't even think to question it, so I doubt that he even would consider the topic of Psychopathy and Ponerology. He just dabbles on the surface with his political comedy show and now he's cracking jokes with a psychopath. Now that IS sickening. :barf: The only "excuse" he has is his ignorance.
 
meta-agnostic said:
There is also the angle that Rumsfeld, Cheney, et al are well aware of the David Icke shapeshifting reptilian psy ops and they are willing to subtly encourage these beliefs among those who are already unhinged. The "crazy" people will say, "See, he's a lizard! He wouldn't deny it!" while everyone else laughs about it and at no point does discussion of psychopathy come up. I'm not so sure this will work anymore. I feel like I see psychopath / sociopath brought up a lot more in the media these days, but maybe that's just because I'm looking for it.

Maybe before Rummy is done with his book tour someone will really put the "Are you a psychopath?" question to him. That's sort of a good exercise for us. Is there a question or series of questions you could ask a public, political psychopath to get him to reveal himself? Obviously he wouldn't come right out and say it, but for those who were psychologically aware there might be subjects more likely to reveal it.

In the radio show, Louis CK asks Rumsfeld if he would trade France for Texas and Arizona, that is, he says that if it so happened that the only way to save Texas and Arizona from destruction was to "wipe out" France. Rumsfeld responds "can you imagine if I answered that question?" referring to the obvious media/political repercussions that would stem from it. He then relates it to the earlier lizard question. Louis CK points out the difference and asks him what would be hurt if he denied being a lizard being? What repercussions would come of that. Rumsfeld wouldn't answer that either. The only thing I could think of to answer this question is the scenario you have suggested, meta-agnostic.
As for the "Are you a psychopath?" question, I think he would either not answer it, or just ramble about people paying for his dinners. I'm not sure a series of leading questions would be effective in exposing political psychopaths as they are very careful of what they say publicly.


Spiral Out said:
I wasn't too much disturbed by Rumsfeld. His mask of sanity was to be expected. What was more disturbing and rather sad is how easy Jon Stewart was on him....but then again it's a comedy show and Stewart is in many ways a left gate keeper even if unknowingly. He believes in the official 9/11 story and won't even think to question it, so I doubt that he even would consider the topic of Psychopathy and Ponerology. He just dabbles on the surface with his political comedy show and now he's cracking jokes with a psychopath. Now that IS sickening. :barf: The only "excuse" he has is his ignorance.

I'm not sure about this Spiral Out, but it's possible that Jon Stewart isn't entirely ignorant to all of this and is just afraid to attempt to expose him (as a psychopath). I mean, what would you do in Stewart's position? Similarly with 9-11, I couldn't tell you if he actually believes the official story or is just trying to keep his job.



Also, there is the possibility that Rumsfeld actually is an evil alien lizard being :scared:
 
Ask_a_debtor said:
Spiral Out said:
I wasn't too much disturbed by Rumsfeld. His mask of sanity was to be expected. What was more disturbing and rather sad is how easy Jon Stewart was on him....but then again it's a comedy show and Stewart is in many ways a left gate keeper even if unknowingly. He believes in the official 9/11 story and won't even think to question it, so I doubt that he even would consider the topic of Psychopathy and Ponerology. He just dabbles on the surface with his political comedy show and now he's cracking jokes with a psychopath. Now that IS sickening. :barf: The only "excuse" he has is his ignorance.

I'm not sure about this Spiral Out, but it's possible that Jon Stewart isn't entirely ignorant to all of this and is just afraid to attempt to expose him (as a psychopath). I mean, what would you do in Stewart's position? Similarly with 9-11, I couldn't tell you if he actually believes the official story or is just trying to keep his job.

True, he might be aware of it, but doesn't want to loose his day job. Regardless this is not the time to be politically correct, imo. If Jon Stewart is sincerely interested in making this world a better place and not just use it as comedy material for his show and if he has some serious doubts about 9/11, then he could address it just as all the other political issues he addresses. An intelligent "celebrity" like Stewart could truly make some waves in that sense.......It's a matter of conscience......but he might loose his job and get under all kinds of attacks...OR more and more people would actually come out and speak out......but I'm just speculating :/

Cowardice asks the question:
"Is it safe"?
Expediency asks the question:
"Is it politic"?
Vanity asks the question:
"Is it popular?"
But conscience asks the question:
"Is it right?"
And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular but one must take it because one's conscience tells one what is right."
- Martin Luther King

Humor is a good way to spread some truth, but it can also become a distraction and buffer.
This article by Mr. Fish is pretty good in that regard: _http://www.truthdig.com/arts_culture/item/give_us_this_day_our_daily_show_20101101/

[...]
Jokes, like any other form of magic, can take a truth, usually a horrible one, and convert it into a satirical concept that, because it is an opinion and no longer tethered to fact, is malleable and, therefore, capable of either rising above or nestling beneath, like a whoopee cushion, those truisms that the joke teller hopes to subvert. Humor, then, like any other form of mollification, can often dislodge the disease of hopelessness from any situation that appears hopeless and invigorate the joker’s chosen audience with hopeful optimism. But, of course, on the other hand, when such a distraction is allowed to divert attention away from a situation that may in fact be truly hopeless and really dangerous then the diversion can prove disastrous.

In other words, readying a slide whistle and a pair of cymbals for the consequences of a safe that is being pushed from a 10-story window above a crowded sidewalk will not alter the physics of gravity sufficiently to temper the tragic consequences.

And that is precisely what I believe makes Stewart and Colbert, particularly in the context of a political rally staged at the nation’s capital in obvious response to Beck’s event, ultimately ineffective as either saviors of our collective cultural sanity or inspirational martyrs maligned unjustly by our savage indifference to our own fate. After all, when a clown is chosen by a society’s pandemic fear of the dark to lead us all into the light, we can’t be certain that the clown will think to move us all beyond the circle of his own spotlight. But why should he? A comedian’s ultimate obligation is to a society’s funny bone, all other bones be, perhaps not damned, but at least razzberried and machine-gunned by the fury of a seltzer bottle.

Thusly, when an average of 2 million viewers, myself included, tune in every weeknight to see “The Daily Show With Jon Stewart,” they are there to jeer and hoot and ridicule the despicability and ineptness and sometimes criminality of both our elected officials and the media outlets that leech off their troubling antics and sell us our soap. They are there to see powerful men and women clobbered by their own exposed hypocrisies. Viewers of “The Daily Show” are there to have their anxiety alleviated, to have their mistrust of politicians justified and to have the pain and humiliation of their being continuously shat upon by oppressive forces from the upper echelons of government and industry and social pedigree lessened. Indeed, these are the noble tasks of the satirist: to help not only maintain but also to promote the concept that the power we invest in authority is power that we can also divest, to prove that laughter is much more likely than sorrow to inspire our desire to congregate as a democratic society and to shake the fear from our natural instinct to retreat from psychological hardship and to cower in isolation.

But, of course, enlightening people to the reality of bullshit is only half the task of the satirist and by no means an end unto itself. After all, it is not the diagnosis of a disease that cures the patient.

So, minus the existence of a well-organized, well-informed, deeply passionate and viable peace and anti-establishmentarian movement in this country, what will usually end up happening is that contemporary satire will often convert our rage at the dominant culture into whimsy and transform us from a threat to the social structures that berate us to complacent idiots. Political comedy, without practical application within a political strategy, will merely satiate our hunger for real change with a punch line and rob us of our sensitivity to any number of social and political injustices. Remember that levity provides a biochemical relief to our physiologies. It tells our insides that all is well and that there is happiness in our lives and that being buoyed by this temporary joy is justified by its own ends. Only when a wound is allowed to remain open and some measure of discomfort is permitted to pester our morality will we act to seek a solution to eliminating our pain and the pain that we empathetically feel in others.
[...]
 
I know Jon Stewart was a psychology major in college. Well, I knew it anyway, but I decided to verify for good measure:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_stewart#Early_life

I think it's a safe bet he at least understands the concept of psychopathy even if he thinks of it in the general vernacular as "sociopath". I know I have heard at least "sociopath" used on both his show and Colbert's. But then when I was a psych major a little over a decade ago, I'm not even sure psychopathy was mentioned in my abnormal psychology class. It may have been briefly or it may have just been lumped in with anti-social personality disorder. I didn't learn about psychopathy in-depth until my last course which was an exclusive study in psychopathy, and that was one of those optional high level credit-fillers. Then I became obsessed with the concept of it for maybe 6 months, even freaking out about it a little, then it sort of slipped to the back of my mind until I came across it here. I'm sort of disappointed in myself for not latching onto it and pursuing it further earlier on, but maybe the idea of constantly analyzing everyone to see if they are a psychopath is a little much without all the Big Picture reasons that explain why it's necessary.

Who knows, if Stewart and/or Colbert were to receive copies of Political Ponerology, maybe they would read it! Or maybe it would make more sense to try and have someone as a guest on their shows to promote "Ponerology for Dummies" when it comes out. I'll make a deal. If someone would put together a good package, i.e. Ponerology, a cover letter, supplemental materials, whatever, I would hand deliver it to both studios and get the name of the receiver so we could see who had read it and how far up the chain it got. I know smaller gestures have made a difference.
 
Also, if Stewart were to ask Rumsfeld something on the level of "Are you a psychopath?" even if he was thinking it, I think it would be on the level of pretty strong fighting words. I'm not sure he would do it. Maybe he would have a few years ago before he started to kiss as much political ass as he does these days, or maybe he would be willing to skirt around the issue more closely as I was suggesting if he had spent time thinking of the right questions to ask him.

But subsequent to the Daily Show interview, Louis CK has broken the taboo ice with the "Are you a lizard?" question. Now before his book tour is over we just need another interviewer, maybe another comedian, to reference the lizard question and follow it up in a friendly, good-natured joking way (or not) with "Are you a psychopath?"
 

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