Shocks

[Xerxes]

Some years ago I was involved in "human potential" work, eg. The Forum, Lifespring, etc. Looking back now I can see that many of the methods used in these programs are "variations" on Gurdjieff's work, although it was not revealed as such. Many of the methods clearly were not. In the "trainer" program, one of the "methods" used is a technique called S.E.E. - Significant Emotional Event. The idea is simple, have a "trainer in training" go up in front of the room and deliver an exercise or process to the participants. Then in a side discussion with the trainer in training, the head trainer "rips" the delivery apart, purposefully creating as much as a trauma for the trainer in training as possible. The resulting "significant emotional event" for the trainee allows him or her to SEE. For example, he/she is able to see how his/her ego got in the way of the delivery. In essence, it is a "shock" to wake the person up. And once "awake" he/she can "see" more clearly, particularly his/her self.

It seems to me that I don't necessarily need someone to do this TO me to wake up. I have many "shocks" in my life. For example, various successes and failures at public speaking. The successes I barely remember at all, nice experiences but not shocks. The failures, however, are intensely emotionally charged. Failure, meaning I was essentially so entrenched in fear and self-consciousness that I turned beet-red and stammered my way through the whole thing. I'm sure it was painful to WATCH let alone experience. And, of course, the fear was all made up in my head with no rational explanation for it. I was presenting to a very nice group of about 60 people. No, the fear was based on previous experiences and totally automatic and unconscious. I labeled it a "negative" experience at the time, and I made up "negative" interpretations about the event--"I wasted people's time", "I'm a horrible speaker", etc. It was a kind of despair, though mostly unconscious as well.

Now, even to this day, when I think back to this experience, I can feel the temperature on my skin rising, the fear returning--and the negative thoughts resurfacing. I can also remember almost every detail of the event, who was there, what time of day it was, what I said, people's facial expressions, etc. The shock experienced then, is a shock experienced now. I can't say I was awake then but I wake up NOW, in this moment. What is the difference? My thought patterning. I can control where I take it. Along with my skin temperature rising, my thoughts become clearer (a natural effect of waking up). In place of the negative thought patterns, which I now see as a hindrance, I go with...right..."the Lizzies" and "I'm in prison and need to escape." And "yes, network...", "knowledge protects, so LEARN!"

So what I'm looking at right now, is...do we have a series of alarm clocks already built in neatly inside us? And all we have to learn how to use them? Over time the emotional charge of the shocks may wear of as I experience them, but that would just be a benefit as well, would it not?

I'm just working through this. Is this making sense or am I way off?

 

[RyanX]

Some years ago I was involved in "human potential" work, eg. The Forum, Lifespring, etc. Looking back now I can see that many of the methods used in these programs are "variations" on Gurdjieff's work, although it was not revealed as such. Many of the methods clearly were not. In the "trainer" program, one of the "methods" used is a technique called S.E.E. - Significant Emotional Event. The idea is simple, have a "trainer in training" go up in front of the room and deliver an exercise or process to the participants. Then in a side discussion with the trainer in training, the head trainer "rips" the delivery apart, purposefully creating as much as a trauma for the trainer in training as possible. The resulting "significant emotional event" for the trainee allows him or her to SEE. For example, he/she is able to see how his/her ego got in the way of the delivery. In essence, it is a "shock" to wake the person up. And once "awake" he/she can "see" more clearly, particularly his/her self.

Hi Xerxes,

I'm not familiar with this particular method of self development that you speak of. In some ways it sounds similar to the 4th Way methods, but I think there are some significant differences. For instance, how much of a shock is it if one is expecting to get "ripped apart" on a particular performance? I could see that it might point out areas for improvement in the context of delivering a particular training exercise, but this wouldn't seem to allow that trainer to see much of themselves below the surface. If they are already expecting this sort of treatment, it might allow them time to form a certain level of buffering before the shock even took place. I think the most useful shocks come without any anticipation.

I also think you're right about using your life as a way of receiving shocks. Public speaking might be one such shock depending on the individual, but some of the biggest shocks I've found come from the assimilation of knowledge, coupled by the activity of self observation and seeing how one's life is far from being aligned with that knowledge. Think of the shock somebody must feel reading about psychopathology and then suddenly realizing that they have been living in a relationship with such an individual for a number of years? The sudden realization that this person really has no capacity for empathy or any of the other emotional qualities we tend to give to people blindly. That's just one example.

 

[ana]

It seems to me that I don't necessarily need someone to do this TO me to wake up. I have many "shocks" in my life. For example, various successes and failures at public speaking. The successes I barely remember at all, nice experiences but not shocks. The failures, however, are intensely emotionally charged. Failure, meaning I was essentially so entrenched in fear and self-consciousness that I turned beet-red and stammered my way through the whole thing. I'm sure it was painful to WATCH let alone experience. And, of course, the fear was all made up in my head with no rational explanation for it. I was presenting to a very nice group of about 60 people. No, the fear was based on previous experiences and totally automatic and unconscious. I labeled it a "negative" experience at the time, and I made up "negative" interpretations about the event--"I wasted people's time", "I'm a horrible speaker", etc. It was a kind of despair, though mostly unconscious as well.
Now, even to this day, when I think back to this experience, I can feel the temperature on my skin rising, the fear returning--and the negative thoughts resurfacing. I can also remember almost every detail of the event, who was there, what time of day it was, what I said, people's facial expressions, etc. The shock experienced then, is a shock experienced now. I can't say I was awake then but I wake up NOW, in this moment.

You just remember how bad you did feel in that situation (ego), it has nothing to do with self remembering/discovering wich is the purpose of any REAL shock.

So what I'm looking at right now, is...do we have a series of alarm clocks already built in neatly inside us? And all we have to learn how to use them? Over time the emotional charge of the shocks may wear of as I experience them, but that would just be a benefit as well, would it not?

I'm just working through this. Is this making sense or am I way off?

The question is, Who is asking?

 

[anart]

You just remember how bad you did feel in that situation (ego), it has nothing to do with self remembering/discovering wich is the purpose of any REAL shock.

This is a good point. There is a very real difference between emotional abuse in order to 'break someone down and control them' and a 'shock' as defined by the 4th Way. Mirroring that produces a shock does so not to instill trauma to be used to control, but to allow the person being mirrored to See themselves in a way they have yet to See themselves, objectively. It is done to benefit the person, not 'break them down'. It has little to nothing to do with capitalizing on a sense of fear (the vast majority of people are terrified of public speaking, so this is a very vulnerable time to 'break someone down' in order to pull them under mental/emotional control).

The overriding energy behind a mirror is Objective Love and it is an ultimately empowering exercise, for the Real self. Breaking someone down, emotionally, in order to create a point of emotional/mental control is pretty much diametrically opposed to the 4th Way concept of shock and mirroring. As always, the devil is indeed in the details.

 

[Laura]

Also, shocks in The Work are generally handled VERY carefully. It is meant to produce some heat, but gentle heat that is generated by the individual themselves by getting them to look at themselves and take onboard other perspectives.

 

[Lilou]

Some years ago I was involved in "human potential" work, eg. The Forum, Lifespring, etc. Looking back now I can see that many of the methods used in these programs are "variations" on Gurdjieff's work, although it was not revealed as such. Many of the methods clearly were not.

I have not delved very far into Gurdjieff, but I would NEVER imagine Lifespring to be in any way related. When I was in college, back in the 80's, a friend of mine begged me to take the "basic training" course offered by Lifespring. He purported it to be awesome for personal growth and networking. I paid the money (alot for me at that time) and went to the meeting. After the first evening class, it became apparent it was about manipulation and control and hooking you to take more courses (and giving Lifespring more money).

If you were not satisfied with the course, a full refund would be given, but only if you attended the entire week. Well, I wanted my money back, so I continued to go. It was certainly shocking, but not in a good way. Folks were humiliated and brought to tears. Each person had filled out a card, giving background information on work, education, goals, etc.... This information was then used by the psychopathic "trainer" as a tool to break the person down. The room temperature was manipulated, usually too cold, and you were "required" to hang your coat at the door.

A bell was used to time breaks. After the first bell range, you had something like 3 minutes to get back to your seat, then a second bell range. If you were not seated, the psychopath would go on the attack against you, in front of the entire group. It was simply hideous to watch.

Well, me, being a rebel....missed the second bell and was locked out. The gal at the door, it turns out, was the live-in girlfriend of the "trainer". She apologized and said she could not allow me back in until the next break. Fine with me, I'd like a smoke anyhow! I chatted with her, asked how she ended up there, and after a few minutes, the poor gal was bawling her eyes out and said she didn't have a means to escape and leave. It was very sad. I suggested she phone her parents and just go home (she was about 25 yr/old).

To make a long story a bit shorter, on the 3rd night of class, I was given a full refund and asked to leave! Myself and a 19 yr old punk rocker type were creating such a stir, many in the group were waking up and going to be requesting their full refunds as well. To stop this wave of refunds, they kicked us out!

There is a very real difference between emotional abuse in order to 'break someone down and control them' and a 'shock' as defined by the 4th Way. Mirroring that produces a shock does so not to instill trauma to be used to control, but to allow the person being mirrored to See themselves in a way they have yet to See themselves, objectively. It is done to benefit the person, not 'break them down'. It has little to nothing to do with capitalizing on a sense of fear (the vast majority of people are terrified of public speaking, so this is a very vulnerable time to 'break someone down' in order to pull them under mental/emotional control).

The overriding energy behind a mirror is Objective Love and it is an ultimately empowering exercise, for the Real self. Breaking someone down, emotionally, in order to create a point of emotional/mental control is pretty much diametrically opposed to the 4th Way concept of shock and mirroring. As always, the devil is indeed in the details.

Anart sums it up very well. If ever someone tries to convince you to take a Lifespring course, RUN. It has nothing to do with the 4th Way. It appears to be a business, run by psychopaths.

 

[vinny]

Anart sums it up very well. If ever someone tries to convince you to take a Lifespring course, RUN. It has nothing to do with the 4th Way. It appears to be a business, run by psychopaths.

This sounds very similar to the Landmark Forum (thread: here)