Suggestions for mum's reflux and heartburn

[Fluffy]

Hi all, I am after some advice for my mum who has been following a low carb diet on and off for a year or so but every time gets really debilitating bouts of reflux and heartburn. Tests have eliminated stomach ulcers and her gall bladder didn't seem to have any issues according to blood tests although her symptoms do seem to correlate with gall bladder attack symptoms.
She has read Gaby's keto consensus document and bits and pieces of threads and links that I've sent her about candida, life without bread and ketogenic diets and is really committed to getting to the bottom of her digestive issues.
Mum has eliminated all the foods that are not recommended, she exercises, takes digestive enzymes, magnesium and overall has a pretty balanced diet of healthy fats, quality proteins and mostly leafy green veggies. The only medication she takes is thyroxin for her under-active thyroid problem that she's had since in her 20s, she's now 56.
A typical day of eating is an omelette cooked in butter and often some bacon for breakfast, a leafy olive oil salad with chicken for lunch and dinner would be a cut of meat with fat on and more leafy veggies with butter. Like me and many others mum has tried many different diet fads for most of her life and pretty much maintained low fat diets with binge outs on chocolates, lollies and other evils on the weekends or in times of stress or reward for the last 10 or more years. We are taking into account the damage this abuse has more than likely done to her system and I know myself that recovery from this has been a personal battle of my own and I'm 21 years younger than she is.
Her last bout of heartburn/reflux lasted about 2 months, it was severe and caused lots of grief and lost nights sleep. It began after seeing a nutritionalist who put her on something akin to the Atkins diet. Mum had never done a high fat diet before and thought this to be the culprit, but her symptoms truly went into full agonising swing after a weekend away eating loads of bad foods, breads, sweets, nasty restaurant meals etc.
I feel really stuck about how I could help her, I've done some research but haven't bee able to find anything that she hasn't tried or any other relevant info. She is committed to changing her lifestyle which is a real blessing for both of us that we have each other to bounce off because no one else in our family and friends is interested in the hard facts and making the changes to better health.
I know that this might not have any relevance but I just wanted to add that she quit smoking 15-20 years ago and it's probably been since then that she really began to struggle with food choices and diet. Mum is of a healthy weight but I'd probably suggest that she is insulin resistant and has a significant candida problem. Her dad died at 58 from sudden heart attack and her mum is type 2 diabetic. I'm trying to give as much info as possible so someone out there might be able to relate, give some appropriate guidance or has had a similar experience. This might be unrelated but also seems to be some negative psychological connection with food that has been passed down through the generations- a program that needs to be attended to no doubt.

Anyway, thanks for reading, any advice, tips, suggestions etc are so appreciated. We really hope to get to the bottom of this before another full blown episode erupts.

 

[Meg]

Hi Fluffy,
That's generally a sign of not enough stomach acid. Has she tried Betaine HCL supplementation?

Taking a hydrochloric acid supplement - Another option is to take a betaine hydrochloric supplement, which is available in health food stores without prescription. You'll want to take as many as you need to get the slightest burning sensation and then decrease by one capsule. This will help your body to better digest your food, and will also help kill the helicobacter and normalize your symptoms.

http://www.sott.net/article/182908-Acid-Reflux-Caused-by-Too-Little-Acid-Not-Too-Much

Another article on stomach acid and how to improve digestion with HCL and other tips:
http://www.sott.net/article/266284-Natural-solutions-to-increase-stomach-acid-and-improve-digestion

 

[Gaby]

Fluffy, here is another useful article:

Acid Reflux - A malady of those who eat mainly carbs
http://www.sott.net/article/281996-Acid-Reflux-A-malady-of-those-who-eat-mainly-carbs

I suspect quitting smoking added an extra stress into her system. Those who quit smoking have a 6-fold increase risk for autoimmune thyroid problems. There seems to be a complex interaction between smoking and the immune system in that “transition from current to ex-smoker may lead to limitation in activity, to chronic health conditions, to physical and psychological symptoms and to a higher hospital admissions“. Smoking is associated with a low prevalence of thyroid auto-antibodies. Under-active thyroid function is almost always related with autoimmune thyroid problems. More info here:

Smoking cessation is followed by a sharp but transient rise in the incidence of overt autoimmune hypothyroidism - a population-based, case-control study.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22651374

DGL is a good one for temporary symptomatic relief while she gets a hold of the problem:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/julie-chen-md/dgl-supplements_b_2976260.html

My 2 cents!

 

[Nancy2feathers]

Hi Fluffy,
That's generally a sign of not enough stomach acid. Has she tried Betaine HCL supplementation?

Taking a hydrochloric acid supplement - Another option is to take a betaine hydrochloric supplement, which is available in health food stores without prescription. You'll want to take as many as you need to get the slightest burning sensation and then decrease by one capsule. This will help your body to better digest your food, and will also help kill the helicobacter and normalize your symptoms.

http://www.sott.net/article/182908-Acid-Reflux-Caused-by-Too-Little-Acid-Not-Too-Much

Another article on stomach acid and how to improve digestion with HCL and other tips:
http://www.sott.net/article/266284-Natural-solutions-to-increase-stomach-acid-and-improve-digestion

Along with the above advise and the advice given by Gaby, I know quite a few people who cured their acid reflux supplementing with raw apple cider vinegar by drinking a shot daily and cooking or adding it to a salad. ACV has many health benefits. I believe it`s high in potassium and other minerals.

 

[Fluffy]

Thanks for the replies so soon, I just spoke to mum and she said chewing gum helps, that's a sign of low stomach acid... Should this correct after time with high fat diet and healing ketones? She has been taking HCl with pepsin and will up her dose and is taking on board all the advice... Won't be getting her back aboard the smoking train though, too far gone there

 

[Tracy Anne]

Thanks for the replies so soon, I just spoke to mum and she said chewing gum helps, that's a sign of low stomach acid... Should this correct after time with high fat diet and healing ketones? She has been taking HCl with pepsin and will up her dose and is taking on board all the advice... Won't be getting her back aboard the smoking train though, too far gone there

I have been taking the Betaine for a few days now, after Laura recommending it, and I have found that I am already digesting food quicker and easier and this has dramatically eliminated my heartburn to the stage that I dont wake up with it during the night. Just one tablet with each meal and it seems to have done the trick.

 

[Lilou]

[quote author= N2F]
I know quite a few people who cured their acid reflux supplementing with raw apple cider vinegar by drinking a shot daily and cooking or adding it to a salad. ACV has many health benefits. [/quote]

A shot of vinegar will typically cure a bout of heartburn, almost immediately. White vinegar works well too. To make it easier to swallow, a small amount of vinegar diluted in a small amount of water gives the same relief vs. a straight shot. Hope your mum feels better soon, Fluffy.

 

[Gaby]

Fluffly, here is a nice summary:

15 Natural Remedies for the Treatment of Acid Reflux and Ulcers
_http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/04/28/acid-reflux-ulcer-treatment.aspx

It helps to understand the root problems and thus, what can be done about it.

 

[Laura]

A typical day of eating is an omelette cooked in butter and often some bacon for breakfast, a leafy olive oil salad with chicken for lunch and dinner would be a cut of meat with fat on and more leafy veggies with butter....

Her last bout of heartburn/reflux lasted about 2 months, it was severe and caused lots of grief and lost nights sleep. It began after seeing a nutritionalist who put her on something akin to the Atkins diet. Mum had never done a high fat diet before and thought this to be the culprit, but her symptoms truly went into full agonising swing after a weekend away eating loads of bad foods, breads, sweets, nasty restaurant meals etc.
....

I know that this might not have any relevance but I just wanted to add that she quit smoking 15-20 years ago and it's probably been since then that she really began to struggle with food choices and diet. Mum is of a healthy weight but I'd probably suggest that she is insulin resistant and has a significant candida problem. Her dad died at 58 from sudden heart attack and her mum is type 2 diabetic. I'm trying to give as much info as possible so someone out there might be able to relate, give some appropriate guidance or has had a similar experience. This might be unrelated but also seems to be some negative psychological connection with food that has been passed down through the generations- a program that needs to be attended to no doubt.

As an insulin resistant person, I have found that, to feel best, I need to keep my carbs below 10 per day to avoid the heartburn/reflux. It seems that it is carbs mixed with fats/protein that cause the problem. You might have her check her carb level with the leafy greens. A carb counter is a good idea. You'd be surprised how carbs can sneak up on you.

Eggs are actually problematical for a LOT of people, especially if they have leaky gut. I had to give them up entirely for about two years until my gut was sufficiently healed to be able to handle them at all. I still can only eat them once in awhile. But this applies mainly to the egg whites.

LYSOZYME (EGG WHITES)

It’s curious that egg yolk has been vilified, because it’s actually the egg white that causes most of the problems.

Egg whites contain lysozyme, an enzyme that is very good at breaking apart the cell membranes of certain bacteria. Sarah Ballantyne has used lysozyme in the lab for this very purpose. “Lysozyme works very quickly, is very resistant to heat, is stable in very acidic environments, and is really a pretty ingenious little enzyme,” she says. “It has the ability to form strong complexes with other proteins.”

Lysozyme survives cooking and our stomach acid, defies digestion, attaches on to the other proteins in the egg white (and whatever else it comes in contact with, especially bacteria) and sails right through our enterocytes—even in healthy individuals without leaky gut.48 “The problem is the other proteins that piggyback on lysozyme,” explains Ballantyne. Because lysozyme binds to bacteria so well, these are likely to come along for the ride.

“In the case of autoimmune disease, individuals are more sensitive and tend to have exaggerated immune and inflammatory responses to foreign proteins in the circulation,” says Ballantyne. “These individuals are also more likely to form auto-antibodies in response to bacterial proteins that may enter into the circulation with lysozyme.”

If you are a healthy individual with a healthy gut, you should probably limit your egg intake, but not for the “traditional” reasons of lowering cholesterol or fat intake that may come to mind.

Dairy, of any kind, can also be problematical. Again, I had to give up butter for a couple of years before gut healing was advanced enough to be able to tolerate it. I think I'm one of those who cannot tolerate any milk/cheese/etc because of genetics. Anything other than butter sends me into a crisis.

I have found that I have to increase my fats significantly and that is often difficult. What I do now is eat a couple of links of sausage for breakfast, and put a pat of butter on each bite. Then, I have a few pieces of bacon, and I'm done until late afternoon when we eat our second (and last) meal of the day. This meal usually consists of a small piece of meat that we eat with a pat of butter or homemade mayonnaise piled on each bite. We try to eat no later than 6 PM and take our betaine and bromelain for digestion help so that by 11 pm when we are in bed, there are no problems with indigestion or reflux and we can safely take our magnesium without interfering with stomach acid. IF any indigestion appears at any time because of the fat, I simply take an additional betaine capsule. I've taken up to 3 per meal along with a bromelain pill or two.

 

[Fluffy]

A typical day of eating is an omelette cooked in butter and often some bacon for breakfast, a leafy olive oil salad with chicken for lunch and dinner would be a cut of meat with fat on and more leafy veggies with butter....

Her last bout of heartburn/reflux lasted about 2 months, it was severe and caused lots of grief and lost nights sleep. It began after seeing a nutritionalist who put her on something akin to the Atkins diet. Mum had never done a high fat diet before and thought this to be the culprit, but her symptoms truly went into full agonising swing after a weekend away eating loads of bad foods, breads, sweets, nasty restaurant meals etc.
....

I know that this might not have any relevance but I just wanted to add that she quit smoking 15-20 years ago and it's probably been since then that she really began to struggle with food choices and diet. Mum is of a healthy weight but I'd probably suggest that she is insulin resistant and has a significant candida problem. Her dad died at 58 from sudden heart attack and her mum is type 2 diabetic. I'm trying to give as much info as possible so someone out there might be able to relate, give some appropriate guidance or has had a similar experience. This might be unrelated but also seems to be some negative psychological connection with food that has been passed down through the generations- a program that needs to be attended to no doubt.

As an insulin resistant person, I have found that, to feel best, I need to keep my carbs below 10 per day to avoid the heartburn/reflux. It seems that it is carbs mixed with fats/protein that cause the problem. You might have her check her carb level with the leafy greens. A carb counter is a good idea. You'd be surprised how carbs can sneak up on you.

Eggs are actually problematical for a LOT of people, especially if they have leaky gut. I had to give them up entirely for about two years until my gut was sufficiently healed to be able to handle them at all. I still can only eat them once in awhile. But this applies mainly to the egg whites.

LYSOZYME (EGG WHITES)

It’s curious that egg yolk has been vilified, because it’s actually the egg white that causes most of the problems.

Egg whites contain lysozyme, an enzyme that is very good at breaking apart the cell membranes of certain bacteria. Sarah Ballantyne has used lysozyme in the lab for this very purpose. “Lysozyme works very quickly, is very resistant to heat, is stable in very acidic environments, and is really a pretty ingenious little enzyme,” she says. “It has the ability to form strong complexes with other proteins.”

Lysozyme survives cooking and our stomach acid, defies digestion, attaches on to the other proteins in the egg white (and whatever else it comes in contact with, especially bacteria) and sails right through our enterocytes—even in healthy individuals without leaky gut.48 “The problem is the other proteins that piggyback on lysozyme,” explains Ballantyne. Because lysozyme binds to bacteria so well, these are likely to come along for the ride.

“In the case of autoimmune disease, individuals are more sensitive and tend to have exaggerated immune and inflammatory responses to foreign proteins in the circulation,” says Ballantyne. “These individuals are also more likely to form auto-antibodies in response to bacterial proteins that may enter into the circulation with lysozyme.”

If you are a healthy individual with a healthy gut, you should probably limit your egg intake, but not for the “traditional” reasons of lowering cholesterol or fat intake that may come to mind.

Dairy, of any kind, can also be problematical. Again, I had to give up butter for a couple of years before gut healing was advanced enough to be able to tolerate it. I think I'm one of those who cannot tolerate any milk/cheese/etc because of genetics. Anything other than butter sends me into a crisis.

I have found that I have to increase my fats significantly and that is often difficult. What I do now is eat a couple of links of sausage for breakfast, and put a pat of butter on each bite. Then, I have a few pieces of bacon, and I'm done until late afternoon when we eat our second (and last) meal of the day. This meal usually consists of a small piece of meat that we eat with a pat of butter or homemade mayonnaise piled on each bite. We try to eat no later than 6 PM and take our betaine and bromelain for digestion help so that by 11 pm when we are in bed, there are no problems with indigestion or reflux and we can safely take our magnesium without interfering with stomach acid. IF any indigestion appears at any time because of the fat, I simply take an additional betaine capsule. I've taken up to 3 per meal along with a bromelain pill or two.

Gee Laura that all sounds very familiar, mum just read your post and said it doesn't sound like you eat much. I suppose that she probably isn't getting enough fat in her breakfast if she is feeling hungry in the day time.. Mum's diet is better than mine, I'm still trying to convince myself that I don't need a sweet fix after dinner, it's all psychological, but thank god for xylitol and erythritol, they're helping me though while I get a hold of myself. If you have a moment could you quickly give an example of a typical day of eating while you were healing your gut.
Loads of appreciation to everyone who has posted advice here for my Mummy

 

[Laura]

Gee Laura that all sounds very familiar, mum just read your post and said it doesn't sound like you eat much.

When you get enough fat, you don't need a lot of other stuff. Eating twice a day is so much simpler!

I suppose that she probably isn't getting enough fat in her breakfast if she is feeling hungry in the day time..

Definitely. If you are feeling hungry, you aren't getting enough fat. And if you have cravings, you are getting too much protein in relationship to your fat.

Mum's diet is better than mine, I'm still trying to convince myself that I don't need a sweet fix after dinner, it's all psychological, but thank god for xylitol and erythritol, they're helping me though while I get a hold of myself. If you have a moment could you quickly give an example of a typical day of eating while you were healing your gut.
Loads of appreciation to everyone who has posted advice here for my Mummy

As you know, we started this whole process in 2008 after my shoulder surgery when I knew something had to be done. We researched like mad for years and experimented on ourselves, and other forum members joined the experiments and reported results in two main threads: "Life Without Bread" and "Ketogenic Diet". A number of books by unrelated individuals appear to be significantly based on the results we reported here on the forum.

What helped the MOST, after ups and downs, one step forward, two steps back, was the high fat ketogenic diet with minimal carbs. Now, this carb issue can vary from person to person. I'm very sensitive and must restrict severely. My husband can tolerate way more carbs than me without getting cravings. I try to keep him under 50 a day. But he needs lots of fat for energy so he gets fat bombs daily.

Now, when I say HIGH FAT, I really mean it. It took me quite awhile to really, truly, grok how much fat is needed! That's why there is a bite of butter with every bite of my breakfast sausage. And just about everything else, too. If I want a snack, it's a slice of ham spread thickly with butter, rolled up.

So, seriously, you really have to up the fat a LOT and take measures to make sure that your body can deal with it through the transition, like betaine and bromelain, other digestive enzymes. Maria Emmerich's book is good and so is Jimmy Moore's. Gaby is bringing one out too but it's in editing right now.

One of my favorite dinners at the moment is little pork tenderloin medallions eaten with a bite of butter for each bite of meat. Last night, we had chicken breasts in coconut milk with tarragon and each bite went in with a bite of butter. I only ate half a breast; I was full. Nothing else; no salad, no veggies. We have green beans occasionally, but I've given up peas and carrots too, except scattered in a salad for color and a bit of taste variation. Half a cup of peas is 10 grams of carbs and that gives me no wiggle room for the rest of the day.

This morning, two 4 inch sausage links and 5 pieces of bacon. Each bite of sausage went in with a bite of butter.

I've cut out xylitol entirely, and only use a tiny bit of erythritol occassionally, keeping my daily total of carbs under 10 grams.

 

[Fluffy]

Gee Laura that all sounds very familiar, mum just read your post and said it doesn't sound like you eat much.

When you get enough fat, you don't need a lot of other stuff. Eating twice a day is so much simpler!

I suppose that she probably isn't getting enough fat in her breakfast if she is feeling hungry in the day time..

Definitely. If you are feeling hungry, you aren't getting enough fat. And if you have cravings, you are getting too much protein in relationship to your fat.

Mum's diet is better than mine, I'm still trying to convince myself that I don't need a sweet fix after dinner, it's all psychological, but thank god for xylitol and erythritol, they're helping me though while I get a hold of myself. If you have a moment could you quickly give an example of a typical day of eating while you were healing your gut.
Loads of appreciation to everyone who has posted advice here for my Mummy

As you know, we started this whole process in 2008 after my shoulder surgery when I knew something had to be done. We researched like mad for years and experimented on ourselves, and other forum members joined the experiments and reported results in two main threads: "Life Without Bread" and "Ketogenic Diet". A number of books by unrelated individuals appear to be significantly based on the results we reported here on the forum.

What helped the MOST, after ups and downs, one step forward, two steps back, was the high fat ketogenic diet with minimal carbs. Now, this carb issue can vary from person to person. I'm very sensitive and must restrict severely. My husband can tolerate way more carbs than me without getting cravings. I try to keep him under 50 a day. But he needs lots of fat for energy so he gets fat bombs daily.

Now, when I say HIGH FAT, I really mean it. It took me quite awhile to really, truly, grok how much fat is needed! That's why there is a bite of butter with every bite of my breakfast sausage. And just about everything else, too. If I want a snack, it's a slice of ham spread thickly with butter, rolled up.

So, seriously, you really have to up the fat a LOT and take measures to make sure that your body can deal with it through the transition, like betaine and bromelain, other digestive enzymes. Maria Emmerich's book is good and so is Jimmy Moore's. Gaby is bringing one out too but it's in editing right now.

One of my favorite dinners at the moment is little pork tenderloin medallions eaten with a bite of butter for each bite of meat. Last night, we had chicken breasts in coconut milk with tarragon and each bite went in with a bite of butter. I only ate half a breast; I was full. Nothing else; no salad, no veggies. We have green beans occasionally, but I've given up peas and carrots too, except scattered in a salad for color and a bit of taste variation. Half a cup of peas is 10 grams of carbs and that gives me no wiggle room for the rest of the day.

This morning, two 4 inch sausage links and 5 pieces of bacon. Each bite of sausage went in with a bite of butter.

I've cut out xylitol entirely, and only use a tiny bit of erythritol occassionally, keeping my daily total of carbs under 10 grams.

Thanks for that. It's all up to trial and error for mum now. We discussed today what giving up keto and 'going back' would mean and with the info we have there doesn't seem to be any options but to persevere with experimenting, keeping a food diary and more education. Anyhow, what is there to 'go back' to???? It's been done and it doesn't work. I had a moment last week where I tried a bit of waffle to see what it did to me, holy moly, tummy cramps, brain fog, almost like depression, lethargy, irritability... It went on for 3 days afterwards. If there's one thing I know for sure now with 100% certainty it's that there is no 'going back'. I'm a ketoer for life. Well.... Life as it is in this very moment anyhow... I'll eat waffles if it's the only way to survive a famine ;)

 

[mugacoffee]

One of my favorite dinners at the moment is little pork tenderloin medallions eaten with a bite of butter for each bite of meat. Last night, we had chicken breasts in coconut milk with tarragon and each bite went in with a bite of butter. I only ate half a breast; I was full. Nothing else; no salad, no veggies. We have green beans occasionally, but I've given up peas and carrots too, except scattered in a salad for color and a bit of taste variation. Half a cup of peas is 10 grams of carbs and that gives me no wiggle room for the rest of the day.

This morning, two 4 inch sausage links and 5 pieces of bacon. Each bite of sausage went in with a bite of butter.

Thats a lot of butter. I didnt realise it was that heavy in fat. Laura, I'm reading my Keto adapted book and preparing for keto. Do you find (or anyone) that you get a bit sick of the diet after a time? If this diet is best for optimal health does that no mean at one point humans in the past ate similar amounts of fat? where did they get it all from?