Trump's 'Liberation Day': US govt imposes tariffs to 'reset' global trade, 'MAGA', 'defeat' China - Will it work?

All I am getting from all these is that Trump thinks America doesn't need the rest of the world, and it's the rest of the world that needs America. The whole mutual coexistence and codependence seems to be non existent.
For comparison: Russia has been thriving despite (and partly due to) massive sanctions by the entire West. The effect of sanctions is similar to high tariffs.

In the case of Russia, some industries started to thrive by no longer being outcompeted by foreign products. I think Chinese substitutes for Western products also play a major role.

So I do think that the US tariffs have a good chance of being successful, despite the short-term problems they create. If Trump lowers income taxes as well, the outcome would be even better.

One likely outcome is that these tariffs will lead to the creation of new free trade agreements with various countries that are more dependent on the US (supposedly 50 countries are ready for that). The removal of tariffs is a sort of leverage in these cases.
 
Absolute comedy

There was a fake news headline that Trump was supposedly going to announce a 90-day tariff pause and magically the markets in the US turned green while the previous day in Asia the markets fell mainly Hong Kong.

●The Nikkei 225 index saw a sharp decline, closing down 7.9%
●The Shanghai Composite Index dropped 7.3%
●Taiwan Taiex index closed down 9.7%
●Hong Kong's stock market closed down 13.2%, the biggest one-day drop since 1997.

The chronology so far from The Kobeissi Letter
What just happened?

At 10:10 AM ET, rumors emerged that the White House was considering a "90-day tariff pause."

At 10:15 AM ET, CNBC reported that Trump is considering a 90-day pause on tariffs for ALL countries except for China.

By 10:18 AM ET, the S&P 500 had added over +$3 TRILLION in market cap from its low.

At 10:25 AM ET, reports emerged that the White House was "unaware" of Trump considering a 90-day pause.

At 10:26 AM ET, CNBC reports that the 90-day tariff pause headlines were incorrect.

At 10:34 AM ET, the White House officially called the tariff pause headlines "fake news."

By 10:40 AM ET, the S&P 500 erased -$2.5 TRILLION of market cap from its high, 22 minutes prior.

Never in history have we seen something like this.

The trade war will escalate

 
For comparison: Russia has been thriving despite (and partly due to) massive sanctions by the entire West. The effect of sanctions is similar to high tariffs.
I don't see any "thriving" Russia around me yet: high central bank rate of 21%, high inflation (official 10%, real 20%-30%), constantly rising prices for food and clothing, very expensive cars and housing, low pensions/salaries, terrible healthcare, terrible demographic situation, millions of migrants and thousands of other problems. All these problems have been accumulating for years, and it hasn't gotten any better now.
It seems that the sanctions have made life better for only a small group of oligarchs, but not for most ordinary people.
In the US, things don't seem so bad yet, but Trump is certainly driving his train into the abyss at full speed. Perhaps, after some time, we will start to think that life in Russia is not so bad anymore, compared to the US.

One likely outcome is that these tariffs will lead to the creation of new free trade agreements with various countries that are more dependent on the US (supposedly 50 countries are ready for that). The removal of tariffs is a sort of leverage in these cases.
We'll see, but it seems like a utopia. The US has a colossal export-import imbalance. And no duties can fix it. What kind of "free" trade can we talk about? The US is trying to return the "former" colonial world, where they were the hegemon and humiliated and robbed everyone, by threats and blackmail. But the old world has collapsed and there is no return to it.
 
I don't see any "thriving" Russia around me yet
Russia had the fourth-largest GDP growth among the G20 last year, only behind China, India and Indonesia and higher than any Western country. Considering that the sanctions were meant to destroy the Russian economy, I would say that this counts as a thriving economy.

It may be more difficult for Russia this year, since one of the consequences of Trump's trade war is that the oil price has reached a four year low - and Russia depends a lot on income from oil and gas.

We'll see, but it seems like a utopia. The US has a colossal export-import imbalance. And no duties can fix it. What kind of "free" trade can we talk about?
The removal of tariffs or duties will probably not fix the export-import imbalance. The free trade agreements could simply keep some countries closer to the US - economically and maybe geopolitically.
 
No matter how many positive things Trump has done he is going to be remember for this period we're in now, and I don't think it will end up a positive result for the majority of Americans. The stock market is a very visible quantitative measurement of "wealth" in the minds of most people - Messing with people's money, in this very visible way, isn't a smart idea. I am rather shocked that Trump is taking this far - I wonder if someone has convinced him or coerced him into this position.
 
Russia had the fourth-largest GDP growth among the G20 last year, only behind China, India and Indonesia and higher than any Western country.
I do not question the GDP growth figure. But it has been discussed here on the forum before, it is just that - a figure. It has no real connection to the purchasing power of the citizens.

Tariffs however do have direct impact on what we as consumers can buy, especially when it is not made onshore - which specifically in US is pretty much everything. We are likely to see similar downward "quality of living" spiral as Russia experienced in late 90-ties until Putin took over and set different course. And despite the fact of having followed the course last 25 years, Russia still has a long way to go in order "to be there" to make it country of plenty. Difference here is, Russia is half way up there, US is half way to the bottom.
 
Messing with people's money, in this very visible way, isn't a smart idea.

It is mentioned that between 47% and 62% of adults in the US have investments in the stock market either through individual stocks, stock mutual funds, or retirement accounts like 401(k)s or IRAs (types of retirement savings accounts in the United States)

The market volatility directly impacts retirement accounts and personal investments. Many investors, who were initially optimistic about Trump’s presidency, are likely experiencing anxiety, frustration or fear. If this continues, it is not unreasonable to think that they will join movements such as "Hands Off" if they have not already done so.

 
I do not question the GDP growth figure. But it has been discussed here on the forum before, it is just that - a figure. It has no real connection to the purchasing power of the citizens.
GDP growth is usually a good indicator of how an economy is doing overall, including the per capita purchasing power. Of course it can be skewed too much if oligarchs pocket most of the increase or if the GDP is based to a large degree on "financial wizardry" of banks.

And despite the fact of having followed the course last 25 years, Russia still has a long way to go in order "to be there" to make it country of plenty.
What I mean by "thriving economy" is that it is apparently growing at a good pace despite massive sanctions (and faster than Western economies). It does not mean that Russia is already a country of plenty when compared to Western countries.

Though if you look at the PPP numbers (purchase power parity per capita), the difference is not that large either: The EU average per capita income in PPP is about $60,000 while the Russian per capita income in PPP is about $45,000.
 
GDP growth is usually a good indicator of how an economy is doing overall, including the per capita purchasing power. Of course it can be skewed too much if oligarchs pocket most of the increase or if the GDP is based to a large degree on "financial wizardry" of banks.


What I mean by "thriving economy" is that it is apparently growing at a good pace despite massive sanctions (and faster than Western economies). It does not mean that Russia is already a country of plenty when compared to Western countries.

Though if you look at the PPP numbers (purchase power parity per capita), the difference is not that large either: The EU average per capita income in PPP is about $60,000 while the Russian per capita income in PPP is about $45,000.

I think it's the GDP per capita figure that's the important one for individual people. What does it matter if the country is doing well but that isn't sipping down in earnings and other benefits to citizens? Like India is a supposed powerhouse but millions upon millions are in poverty... 😐

One reason I don't think the tariffs thing will be a net benefit in the way Trump thinks is I don't think he's being honest to begin with. He wasn't truthful about the tariffs other countries impose on the US, and he has been very quiet about US services sector. It also doesn't make sense that he's imposing tariffs in places where it doesn't make sense i.e. there are no people there or literally the place produces something that America can't due to lack of that resource or climate conditions for that thing.

I also don't think Trump has strong economic advisers around him. All the top names are in other fields - defence, healthcare, internal security, media, technology etc.

I think the economic guys he will recruit will run circles around him when this whole thing starts to unravel in unpredictable ways. I don't think you can tariff the whole world and not expect utter chaos. Chaos is unpredictable and if there will be any benefits, I don't think they will be benefits that were planned for.

I'm also noticing how thus far it's all about firing people from jobs in the name of efficiency and not giving or creating jobs for people.

I am getting a flavour of Trump that's giving me cause for concern - his celebration of death, posting those videos of people being blown up in Yemen and celebrating is really antihuman and it makes you question things about his inner makeup. Even if those people were "bad guys" I don't think that is conduct becoming of the president of the USA.
 
No tail pulling for the Dragon

Trump: "if China does not withdraw its 34% increase above their already long term trading abuses by tomorrow, April 8th, 2025, the United States will impose ADDITIONAL Tariffs on China of 50%, effective April 9th"

Well, China’s investment in U.S. Treasury securities (TSYs) remains significant. TSYs are debt instruments issued by the U.S. Department of the Treasury to finance government spending. China is still a major player in the U.S. debt market because holds $775 billion in TSYs as of February 2025

China has been reducing its holdings in TSYs over time as part of a broader strategy and with this instrument can do damage to the US.

As one X user said: "Wait until China dumps their U.S. Treasuries. Real fun begins then"


So far China has responded by selling another $50BN in TSYs. Some analysts, however, view this event as positive or not so serious as the 10-year Treasury yield remains almost unchanged despite the sell-off.

20250407_113337.jpg
 
Russia had the fourth-largest GDP growth among the G20 last year, only behind China, India and Indonesia and higher than any Western country. Considering that the sanctions were meant to destroy the Russian economy, I would say that this counts as a thriving economy.
I don't quite understand what you're trying to prove here. I live in Russia (and I see the real picture), but you don't. The GDP indicator is a spherical horse in a vacuum that makes little sense.
Moreover, we just learned from the session that the real population of, for example, China is much less than a billion. So what is the "official" GDP of China worth then? It's a made-up figure. The same is probably true for the "official" GDP of the US or Russia - these are just figures that are far from reality.

What I mean by "thriving economy" is that it is apparently growing at a good pace despite massive sanctions (and faster than Western economies). It does not mean that Russia is already a country of plenty when compared to Western countries.
The problem is that we don't know the real growth figures of any country. After all, we don't even know the real number of residents in these countries. It's garbage in and garbage out. The economy is illusory and it is falsified on many levels.
By almost any "official" economic indicators, the US is doing well. The situation in the US is much better than in most countries in the world - this is what the UN, the World Bank and all other global structures assure us. But according to the C's, the US doesn't have nearly the gold reserves they "officially" claim.
And what do we see in the current reality? Trump is "breaking" his own economy over his knee, fighting with the rest of the world. One piece of news causes the market to grow by $3 TRILLION, and then another piece of news causes it to fall by $2.5 TRILLION in THIRTY MINUTES.
You can, of course, continue to count the "official" economic indicators, but I'll just grab some popcorn and enjoy the show.🍿
 
An analyse of the situation explaining the world wild commerce deal witch was in place and so what can happen now.

Ricardo Hausmann - Convinced of an easy victory, Donald Trump has launched a global tariff war aimed at reducing the US trade deficit. But while Trump is focusing on imported goods, he is overlooking the far more important role played by services, intellectual property and investment in maintaining the United States' global economic dominance.


In August 1914, Europeans attached little importance to the century of peace that had followed Napoleon's defeat at Waterloo. As historian Barbara W. Tuchman recounted in her 1962 book ‘The Guns of August’, public opinion in Berlin, Paris, London and Vienna was swept up in a wave of collective euphoria - a feverish excitement about the expected benefits of a swift and decisive world war. The result was four years of misery and devastation. A similar sense of misguided bravado seems to pervade the administration of US President Donald Trump as it continues its reckless assault on the global security and trade order of the last 80 years. Convinced of an inevitable and easy victory, Trump has unilaterally declared war on the post-war order, ignoring the lesson of Field Marshal Helmuth von Moltke the Elder, military architect of Prussia's victory over France in 1870-1871: ‘No battle plan survives first contact with the enemy’.


On the face of it, the United States looks well placed to win Trump's trade war against China and its major trading partners such as Canada, Mexico and the European Union. In his public speeches, Trump often emphasises the large US trade deficit in goods, which reached a record $1.2 trillion in 2024. In his view, this trade deficit is irrefutable proof that the United States is being treated ‘very, very unfairly and very badly’.
Because it imports more than it exports, the US has more foreign goods to tax than exports vulnerable to retaliation. Trump intends to exploit this strategic advantage by using tariffs - the ‘most beautiful word in the dictionary’, as he once put it - to pressure companies based in Canada, Mexico and China to relocate production to the US, thereby eliminating the trade deficit. Given that most of America's trading partners depend on access to the US market, Trump believes he can wield his economic might and force his rivals into submission.


But trade is not a battlefield, and economic influence in one area does not necessarily translate into easy victories elsewhere. The fundamental flaw in Trump's strategy is that it focuses on the trade deficit in goods, neglecting the far more important role played by services, intellectual property and investment in the global economy. This short-sightedness leaves the US vulnerable to countermeasures that could undermine the very benefits it takes for granted.


The standard critique of Trump's trade agenda is that sooner or later he will recognise that producing goods in the US raises costs, harms consumers and erodes the competitiveness of US exports. But this argument overlooks a crucial detail: the United States' economic ties with the rest of the world extend far beyond goods. Services and investment are just as important, if not more so. And if this is where its potential advantages and vulnerabilities lie, there is little reason for other countries to retaliate with tariffs.


In particular, the US has a considerable surplus in the services sector, reaching $278 billion in 2023, thanks to sectors such as finance, telecommunications, digital trade, high value-added business services and the licensing of US patents and copyrights. And even this figure only reflects direct US sales to foreign consumers. In reality, most major US companies operate abroad through foreign subsidiaries. In 2024, profits from foreign operations totalled $632 billion. Once these profits are taken into account, the US invisible trade surplus approaches $1,000 billion.
What's more, US companies such as Apple, Google, Microsoft, Facebook, Nvidia, Johnson & Johnson and Tesla use their innovation-based market power to extract rents from consumers and businesses around the world. If these companies were hit with the equivalent of tariffs, they would not be able to pass on the cost to their foreign customers. After all, if they could raise their prices without losing profits, they would have done so already.


If we multiply the profits of US companies abroad by 26 - the average price/earnings ratio of S&P 500 companies - the value of US investments abroad can be estimated at $16.4 trillion. By contrast, foreign companies operating in the United States earned just $347 billion in 2024. In fact, the US surplus in services and foreign equity income almost offsets its trade deficit in goods. This makes its $16.4 trillion in foreign assets a far more attractive target for retaliation than tariffs on US exports.


The United States' dominance of technology and intellectual property (IP), which underpins its massive surplus in the services sector and its stock market earnings, is no accident. It has its origins in the post-war international order, in particular in the great compromise reached by the international community in 1994 during the so-called Uruguay Round of trade negotiations. Under the terms of the resulting Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights (TRIPS), developing countries undertook to enforce the IP protections of advanced economies in exchange for market access.
As recent studies show, TRIPS has imposed significant costs on most developing countries. Yet they have accepted it as the price of gaining better access to Western markets. But if the US is now seen as reneging on its share of the market, why should emerging economies respect theirs? Many countries would be encouraged to challenge TRIPS, or even to coordinate their efforts to weaken it or abandon it altogether, thereby jeopardising intellectual property-intensive sectors such as technology, pharmaceuticals and entertainment...
 
I don't quite understand what you're trying to prove here. I live in Russia (and I see the real picture), but you don't. The GDP indicator is a spherical horse in a vacuum that makes little sense.
Moreover, we just learned from the session that the real population of, for example, China is much less than a billion. So what is the "official" GDP of China worth then? It's a made-up figure. The same is probably true for the "official" GDP of the US or Russia - these are just figures that are far from reality.


The problem is that we don't know the real growth figures of any country. After all, we don't even know the real number of residents in these countries. It's garbage in and garbage out. The economy is illusory and it is falsified on many levels.
By almost any "official" economic indicators, the US is doing well. The situation in the US is much better than in most countries in the world - this is what the UN, the World Bank and all other global structures assure us. But according to the C's, the US doesn't have nearly the gold reserves they "officially" claim.
And what do we see in the current reality? Trump is "breaking" his own economy over his knee, fighting with the rest of the world. One piece of news causes the market to grow by $3 TRILLION, and then another piece of news causes it to fall by $2.5 TRILLION in THIRTY MINUTES.
You can, of course, continue to count the "official" economic indicators, but I'll just grab some popcorn and enjoy the show.🍿
Actually it is not quite as hopeless in terms of tracking the figures as people might think. The headline numbers are highly manipulated, but there are ways of getting at the data better using more reliable data sets that hedge funds have been using for years. For example, if you track the revenues of largely cyclical companies compared to their stated price increases (in SEC reports they will often give a breakdown of sales X% volume, X% pricing, X% mix, X% acquisitions, etc. or you will have looked at industry figures of their major product lines to get pricing if they don't fess up in their filing or conference calls) and if you have a large enough data set, that will clue you in on the major year over year and quarter to quarter trends. Since company results typically are audited independently, these numbers tend to be more reliable than government figures. In fact I used to use data like that (in addition to noting certain data from the census office that tended to be leaked early that most people did not know about that went into the GDP calculation :)) to forecast the top line GDP number from time to time when it mattered. M2 can also be a good proxy for economic growth and is updated weekly, if you can filter out all of the money printing.

I have not even attempted anything like that in years, but someone could go through that to get a real sense of what is really happening with the economic figures. Even the balance sheet of governments themselves can be useful if you know where to look for leading indicators of problems (unemployment insurance balances, for instance). And the average person going to the grocery store probably have a better notion of inflation than whatever the government comes up with themselves! In the US I typically look at shadowstats.com as decent estimates as what way the economy is going now, but even John's data is probably influenced by bad data from the census bureau. Just go right to the top line organic growth of major S&P500 companies if you want the real story.
 
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