The Waldseemüller map created in 1507

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We all know these search engines knows our tastes and throws some thing at us and out of which some picks our curiosity. Few days back, one of the Graham Hancock video showed on the youtube right side ribbon. The theme is typical of Hancock's thesis - Ancient knows more and maps are depiction of it. Some old maps were shown though most discussion is about Piri Reis map.

We all know C's said Piri Ries map dates back to 14,000 BCE . Obviously, European rulers wanted these maps for their funding of so called explorations and need directions. So some picked what they have in possession and tried to create maps. We don't know how accurate these are w.r.t each geographic area and the source maps they used. It may be accurate at the time of source map, may not be later vice versa. or complete/part fabrication. Too many variables there .

Here is article about the "economy" of the time. The name "America" popped up with this Waldseemüller map for the first time in the honor of Italian explorer Amerigo Vespucci, who claims to have landed on the continent before Christopher Columbus

The epic story of the map that gave America its name

A few hundred years ago, when much of the world was mysterious and unknown, two European humanists came together to produce an extraordinary map of the world.

www.bbc.com

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The map, printed in 1507, measured about 1.4m by 2.4m, a size that matched its grand ambition to portray the world in its entirety. And indeed, it did depict more of the world than ever before. For centuries, Europeans had believed that the world was made up of three landmasses: Asia, Africa and Europe, with Jerusalem at its centre. That’s why Italian explorer and coloniser for Spain, Christopher Columbus, had gone to his deathbed just a year earlier believing that where he had landed in the Americas was just another part of Asia. However, this new map depicted a fourth part of the world for the first time. To the left of Europe, it showed a long, thin version of South America, with a small-sized North America above it. The new continent was surrounded by water, and, on the part that is known today as Brazil, the map-makers placed a name: America.
...
That these two Germans came together to undertake such as project in St-Dié-des-Vosges was not simply a question of money. The location of the town was also significant. As Toby Lester told me, “You had explorers setting off from the Atlantic coast in Spain and Portugal, who were bringing all their information back there, and the Italians who were funding and going on these expeditions, churning through a lot of the information, and the Germans in the middle, doing strong, leading work with printing.” St-Die, near Strasbourg, Basel and Freiburg, was, like other locations that set up printing presses, at a convergence where information could move back and forth easily.
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Ultimately, the Waldseemüller map reminds us that all maps are political. By putting north at the top of the map, whereas the previous convention was to place east at the top, and placing Europe at the middle, makes it literally Eurocentric. The decision of the map-makers to name an entire, inhabited continent after a European man who went there, privileges the European perspective and demonstrates the European attitude and ambition of the time. It is an outlook that predicts the way in which the Europeans would continue to take possession of lands, resources and people, erasing cultures and killing millions.

Few images from the above Video picked my curiosity for the strange geography of Indian subcontinent. Taking screenshot of it and browser image search led to me to this Waldseemüller map. It looks Piri Reis map doesn't have South Asia in it.

Here is the clearer map I could find is here. https://i.natgeofe.com/n/70ca817d-0834-4b40-ae67-a63a6ea4893e/1262849_2x1.JPG

Focusing on the Indian continent is VERY interesting for few reasons for me. This is ASSUMING that this author drawing is based on some very old accurate map which was accurate ( in ancient time) and he simply recopied those areas.

• Current Indian geography as a one piece is not there in this Map.
• C's said Indian plate got attached to Eurasian plate around 70K YA. Obviously I assumed current land is similar to 70K YA though I have some reservations to my question. I looked for some clues whether North Indian piece came first and south Indian piece came later. But couldn't find much in that direction.
• C's said also said there is a submerged area ( continent/region/city) called "Kumara Kandam" and it was later than ( "Closer") than Younger Dryas Period ( 10K BCE approx.) Kumara Kandam proponents used the shape of this island ( Taprobane - middle of the above picture marked as Red 1). Kumara Kandam proponents call Sri Lanka is part of Kumara Kandam.
  • Currently, Historians associate Taprobane as the old name of Sri Lanka.
  • And you have this Ramayan Story that starts with hero "Rama" in Ayodya (in North India) and ends up down in to Lanka killing its king "Ravana" ( fictious being based on comets) for abducting Rama's Wife "Sita". Hero's rescuing "Abducted" woman after "good vs evil" battle. is common mythical theme.
• There was an endless debate related to Origin of the word "India" that often the form of "Left vs Right" battle. British Indologists insist that the name is give by Arabs/Musilsm for any thing beyond "Indus" River. But locals quote old texts calling it "JambuDweep" . Dweep means Island.
• VedVeer Arya's (VA) chronology gives very interesting clues
  • Earlier version Sanskrit texts talk as if southern part of north India is border of "JambuDweep".
  • "Jambu" comes from a character called Jambavan. JambuDweep aka "island of Jambavan". VA places him in the Dwarika ( West India - marked as 2 in the above map), place in the northern part of India. C's already said there is a submerged place called 'Dwarika' went down around Younger Dryas period.
• In this map which is based on

All this leads to some basic questions. I know this question is 'Wild', But we heard enough of this wild stuff as accurate - exploded planet in the backyard etc. 50,000 YA nuclear war and so on without even talking about 'Aliens'.

• Is this Waldseemüller map's depiction of Indian subcontinent is accurate at any time?
• If true, how many years old back this geography is accurate.
• If true, When did the last time current India subcontinent geography formed.

Dragon's tail (Peninsula) (marked as Red 3)- Thailand and Malaysia

The Dragon's Tail is a modern name for the phantom peninsula in southeast Asia which appeared in medieval Arabian and Renaissance European world maps. It formed the eastern shore of the Great Gulf (Gulf of Thailand) east of the Golden Chersonese (Malay Peninsula), replacing the "unknown lands" which Ptolemy and others had thought surrounded the "Indian Sea".
...

Early history​

The peninsula does not appear in any surviving manuscript of Ptolemy's Geography or other Greek geographers. Instead, it is first attested in the Ptolemaic-influenced Book of the Description of the Earth compiled by al-Khwārizmī around 833 AD. Ptolemy's map ended at 180°E of the Fortunate Isles without being able to explain what might lie on the imagined eastern shore of the Indian Ocean or beyond the lands of the Sinae and of Serica in Asia. Chinese Muslims traditionally credit the Companion Saʿd ibn Abi Waqqas with having missionized the country as early as the 7th century; the trading community was large enough that a large-scale massacre is recorded at Yangzhou in 760.[2][3] Merchants such as Soleiman showed Al-Khwārizmī that the Indian Ocean was not closed as Hipparchus and Ptolemy had held but opened either narrowly or broadly. Al-Khwārizmī left most of Ptolemy's eastern coast but the creation of the strait created a new peninsula, beyond which he placed the Sea of Darkness and the Island of the Jewel.[4][5]
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The Portuguese were aware of the peninsula's likely nonexistence by shortly after the fall of Malacca, when Albuquerque acquired a large Javanese map of Southeast Asia.[17] The original was lost aboard the Froll de la Mar shortly afterwards[18] but a tracing by Francisco Rodrigues was sent in its place as part of a letter to the king.[note 1] Nonetheless, published maps continued to include it in different forms for another century.

Few other Interesting observations from Map

• There are few words keep popping up in this map. Probably it is reflection of "Obsession" of India among european explorers of that time.
  • Libia, Ethiopia through out Africa
  • India across Asia - India superior, India meri Dionalis in current Chinese region, India in South East region.
    • Keep in mind many of the Hindu God's still exist in the South East Asian countries even to this day. Ramayan is very popular even to this date. Though it is attributed to south Indian empire's influence 2000 years back.
  • Tartaria , Scithia in the Russian region.
• If this dragon's tail is geographical reality long time back, Probably this is a mess resulted from Toba super volcano that destroyed this region 70K years ago?
• This also raises question of origin of the word "India". At one point in the long past, did Paranthas ( or Denisovans) are called this ocean as "Indian ocean". I don't mean exact word "India" as such but some thing equivalent of it in the languages of that time?

 

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To understand little more about this map in a "attempt" to bridge the gap between C's 3 races (Native americans, Paranthas , Kantekanians of Atlantean times ) to current form , I took different words in the map ( those are clear enough to decipher) and searched using Microsoft copilot ( AI). My line of focus is Indian subcontinent. These words on the map are in sort of Latin which I am not familiar so I used Microsoft copilot and it was helpful in deciphering. I put the numbers to identify regions mentioned on the maps and modern interpretation

copilot search of these regions as follows. It is obvious that whoever created the map ( region names, shape of geography, positioning) thought north India is separate from south India. These are understandable w.r.t know how of that time in 16th century.

But, where did they got this map from? I suspect this came from ancients. 16th century map makers reconciled all the information they had and mapped the names to the map.

Does this map related to any of In the ancient Indian literature ( Mahabharata , Puranas)? . There are two words used for Indian ancient literature - Aryavarta , JambuDweep. Not much mention of Kumara kandam in them , but ancient Tamil cities are mentioned in these Puranas and Mahabharata. But Aryavarta has southern border which is Vindhya Mountain range in central India. Vindhya Range - Wikipedia

The Vindhyas are regarded as the traditional geographical boundary between northern and southern India,[18] and have a distinguished status in both mythology and geography of India.[3] In the ancient Indian texts, the Vindhyas are seen as the demarcating line between the territories of the Indo-Aryans and that of the others.[5] The most ancient Hindu texts consider it as the southern boundary of Aryavarta.[Kalidasa, HH Wilson (1843). The Mégha dúta; or, Cloud messenger] The Mahabharata mentions that the Nishadas and other Mleccha tribes reside in the forests of the Vindhyas.[19] Although the Indo-Aryan languages (such as Marathi and Konkani) spread to the south of Vindhyas later, the Vindhyas continued to be seen as the traditional boundary between the north and the south of India.

Then what is Jambudweep and where is it? Descriptions from Puranas has mountains, regions under the frame work of concentric circles etc. It looks its description is that of Asia. below quoted texts are from copilot
Q: Aaryavarta vs jambudweep

Āryāvarta and Jambudweep are ancient names used to describe regions of the Indian subcontinent, each with its own historical and cultural significance.

Āryāvarta​

• Meaning: The term “Āryāvarta” translates to “Land of the Aryans” and is found in ancient Hindu texts such as the Dharmashastras and Sutras1.
• Geographical Extent: Initially, Āryāvarta referred to the northern Indian subcontinent, particularly the Indo-Gangetic Plain. Over time, its boundaries expanded to include regions from the Himalayas in the north to the Vindhyas in the south, and from the eastern to the western seas1.
• Cultural Significance: Āryāvarta was considered the region where Indo-Aryan culture and religion predominated. It was seen as the heartland of Vedic civilization1.

Jambudweep​

• Meaning: “Jambudweep” is derived from the Sanskrit words “Jambu” (a type of tree) and “Dweep” (island or continent). It is often used in ancient Indian cosmology to describe the entire Indian subcontinent2.
• Geographical Extent: Jambudweep was considered one of the four continents in ancient Indian cosmology, representing the known world to ancient Indians. It included the entire Indian subcontinent and sometimes extended to other parts of Asia2.
• Cultural Significance: The name Jambudweep appears in various ancient texts, including Buddhist and Jain scriptures, and was used to describe the realm of human habitation2.

Both names reflect the rich historical and cultural heritage of the Indian subcontinent.

what is Jambu tree?

The Jambu tree typically refers to the Syzygium cumini, also known as the Java plum, black plum, jamun, or jambolan1. This evergreen tropical tree is native to the Indian subcontinent and Southeast Asia1.

Started to sound like Indian subcontinent and South East Asia are same at some point in time. We have to keep in mind undercurrent of Hindu dieties is same in South India and South East Asia.
Is kumarakandam is same as Jambudweep?

Kumari Kandam and Jambudweep are distinct concepts, though both are rooted in ancient Indian mythology and cosmology.

Kumari Kandam​

• Mythical Continent: Kumari Kandam is a mythical lost continent believed to have existed south of present-day India in the Indian Ocean. It is often associated with the ancient Tamil civilization1.
• Cultural Significance: The legend of Kumari Kandam is particularly significant in Tamil literature and culture, symbolizing the ancient and advanced Tamil civilization that supposedly existed before being submerged by the sea1.
• Origins: The concept of Kumari Kandam gained popularity in the 19th and 20th centuries, influenced by the idea of Lemuria, a hypothetical landmass proposed by European and American scholars to explain geological similarities between continents1.

Jambudweep​

• Cosmological Island: Jambudweep, on the other hand, is a term from ancient Indian cosmology used to describe the known world, particularly the Indian subcontinent2.
• Geographical Extent: In ancient texts, Jambudweep is depicted as one of the seven dvīpas (islands or continents) and is considered the central and most significant landmass in the cosmological model2.
• Cultural Significance: Jambudweep is mentioned in various Hindu, Buddhist, and Jain scriptures, representing the realm of human habitation and the center of the ancient world2.

While both terms reflect the rich mythological and cultural heritage of the Indian subcontinent, they refer to different concepts and regions. Kumari Kandam is a mythical lost land associated with Tamil culture, whereas Jambudweep represents the ancient cosmological understanding of the Indian subcontinent.

Why jambuweep is an island?

The term Jambudweep comes from ancient Indian cosmology and translates to “the island of Jambu trees” (Syzygium cumini, also known as the Java plum or black plum)1. Here’s why it’s considered an island:

Cosmological Context​

• Dvīpa Concept: In ancient Indian cosmology, the world is divided into seven concentric island continents (dvīpas), each separated by different types of oceans1. Jambudweep is the central and most significant of these dvīpas1.
• Geographical Representation: Jambudweep is depicted as an island surrounded by oceans, fitting into the cosmological model where each dvīpa is encircled by a distinct ocean1.
• Cultural Significance: The name Jambudweep highlights the abundance of Jambu trees in the region, symbolizing the fertility and richness of the land2.

Historical Usage​

• Emperor Ashoka: The term was used by Emperor Ashoka in the 3rd century BCE to describe his realm, which included the Indian subcontinent2.
• Scriptural References: Jambudweep is mentioned in various Hindu, Buddhist, and Jain scriptures, representing the known world to ancient Indians2.

In essence, Jambudweep is considered an island due to its depiction in ancient cosmological models and its symbolic representation of the Indian subcontinent.
Is there a particular aspect of Jambudweep or its cosmology that you’d like to explore further?
1: Jambudvīpa - Wikipedia2: Why is India called Jambudweep? - NCESC

describe jambudweep according to siva purana?

In the Shiva Purana, Jambudweep (Jambūdvīpa) is described as the central and most significant of the seven dvīpas (island continents) in ancient Indian cosmology1.

Key Features of Jambudweep in Shiva Purana:​

1. Central Position: Jambudweep is situated at the center of the world, surrounded by seven oceans. These oceans are made of salt water, sugarcane juice, wine, ghee, curd, milk, and pure water1.
2. Mount Meru: At the heart of Jambudweep stands Mount Meru, a golden mountain that is considered the axis mundi (world axis). It extends 84 Yojanas in height and 16 Yojanas below the earth1.
3. Surrounding Mountains: Several significant mountains surround Mount Meru, including Himavat, Hemakūṭa, and Niṣadha to the south, and Nīla, Śveta, and Śṛṅgin to the north1.
4. Varṣas (Regions): Jambudweep is divided into nine regions or varṣas, with Bharata Varṣa being the most well-known. Other regions include Kimpuruṣa, Hari Varṣa, Ramyaka, Hiraṇmaya, and the northern Kurus1.
5. Sacred Rivers: The island is traversed by sacred rivers, including the Jambunadi, which is said to flow from the fruits of the Jambu tree (Syzygium cumini) that grow on Mount Meru1.
6. Divine Inhabitants: The regions of Jambudweep are inhabited by various divine beings, sages, and mythical creatures. The central region, Ilāvṛta Varṣa, is particularly sacred and is home to Brahma’s city, Brahmapuri1.

Symbolism:​

• Cosmic Order: Jambudweep represents the cosmic order and the interconnectedness of the universe, with Mount Meru symbolizing the spiritual center.
• Fertility and Abundance: The presence of the Jambu tree and the sacred rivers highlights the fertility and abundance of the land.

This description from the Shiva Purana provides a rich and symbolic representation of the ancient Indian worldview, blending geography, mythology, and spirituality.

If I take these mountain ranges of Jambudweep and look for where they are now ( atleast based on copilot)

• southern side : Himavat (Himalayas) , Hemakuta ( is located in Hampi, Karnataka, south India) , Nisadha (Not clear )
• Northern side :
  • Nīla ( Tien Shan Range: Some scholars identify Nīla Mountain with the Tien Shan range in Central Asia, located to the north of the Kunlun Mountains)
  • Śveta, and Śṛṅgin ( Śveta Mountain is described as being situated to the north of Ilāvṛta Varṣa, one of the regions of Jambudweep1. It is part of a series of mountains that include Nīla and Śṛṅgin1. )

That's why many consider Jamabudweep is more like Asia rather than India alone.

If we consider shape of geographical region in the map has some validity at some point in the past:

• does it has any thing to do C's description of Atlantean races ( Native Americans, Paranthas and Aryans) and cataclysm that destroyed 50% of the land and decimation of the Paranthas 50KYA. Of course, we don't know the scope of the "destruction" in what sense ( human cost, geography changes and so on).
• Does this map representation of South Asia/South East Asia is 50KYA old? - 'Wildest' guess of My life. I don't know.
• Interestingly this region sits on 'ring of fire' region , that gets activated by cosmic events that keeps coming back over and over ( 3600 year comet cluster, disintegrated big comet remnants, venus disturbances etc.).