USA, a souless country?

[judvic]

Hi,

on the French TV there was a documentary about the automobile industry and there was a focus on Detroit, USA.
It is rare that we have such pictures of the USA, usually shown as the promised Land.
But there we had an insight on a third world country, with so many houses left abandonned and a population divided by two from 2 000 000 to 900 000.
Even though I knew that huge parts of the USA are getting poorer, seeing the pictures came as a shock. Most of the people shown were obese.

Poverty is one thing, but ruined people is another one. In African countries I know, there is still hope because people are alive and intelligent.
But in the USA it doesn't seem that way. So many people there seem to have lost something, or being robbed from something.
My wife studied in the USA in 2001-2002 and I had planned to join her and start a life there. She came back saying there was no way she could live there though she had made friends with a lot of japonese students and a very nice American accountant wtih whom she lived, but who was so lonely in her house that she rented a room to foreing students.

With my wife we train to spot americans in a crowd: it is easy because many Americans have a fixed stare in the eye. They have this blank and empty look as if they were without spirit.
Did some of you notice this and have an explanation for it?

Ludovic

 

[zoobiedoo]

As a U.S. citizen currently living in the U.S. (remember 'America' covers more than just the U.S.), I definitely agree with you - and it horrifies me on a daily basis.

I had the opportunity to visit France a couple times a few years ago and found the country to be so much more "human" than the very antiseptic U.S. The French people I met were amazing. The countryside is amazing and I think is evidence of some of the best kinds of activities that humans can engage in being performed there on a daily basis. The very human history evident in France is also engaging. It felt like I had discovered a "root" to myself as a human, almost an origin of sorts, a real context. It's like having amnesia and then one day remembering all the things you had forgotten.

In the U.S., there is much less history, especially where I live, so that as a native, one feels lost without a context to provide a sense of foundation for one's life. I guess it would be accurate to describe life and most of the people here as impoverished - psychologically, historically, emotionally, economically, morally, ethically, etc. So it's very poignant indeed that you were watching a program about the impoverishment of one U.S. community. That program is a micro-cosmos of what's happening to the whole People of the U.S. and their Soul, or so I've noticed. And I think it's what our controllers have in store for the whole world eventually...

Thinking about all this now, and the word antiseptic, a couple images come to mind. Here, I know quite a lot of people who will not touch door handles without using a paper tissue in order to protect themselves from the germs of other people. In France, it is common to kiss strangers on the cheeks as a simple greeting. Juxtaposing those two images speaks profound volumes, I think. In a very real sense, the U.S. has become "germaphobic" to everything else but itself, remembering of course that germaphobia is an irrational fear of something imagined.

Talking about a "fixed stare" in U.S. citizens is interesting also. One thing I can't help but do constantly is watch people. I try not to be too overt about this activity so as not to creep people out, but it still amazes me that the vast majority of people don't seem to notice whether they're being watched or not. Every now and then there will be an attentive pair of eyes staring back at me and at those times I always wonder if they were watching me first or if they noticed me watching them - though maybe there really is no difference. Either way, when my eyes meet another's, there is always a brief connection on some level, even if it's just a quick acknowledgement of each other's existence. But for the people who don't pay attention and who blankly stare ahead heeding only what's on their minds for the fleeting moment, there is never any real connection with them. It's like looking through a window into a building where people are moving about automatically, robotically, and where the watcher has no opportunity for real contact or interaction with the robot people inside the building.

I have to wonder whether most people here are just paying attention to their own thoughts to an almost autistic degree, or if there is really any "attention" there at all.

 

[D Rusak]

Maybe this is a little paranoid or crazy, but I've taken to wearing sunglasses more often as I walk around town. I like to look at people's expressions while people are out and about (it can also be a good shock remind one to observe oneself). Wearing dark glasses helps avoid drawing attention to myself. People really DO look like they are hypnotised much of the time. I notice this particularily at the end of the average work day, as people are either rushing for or, alternately, taking their time getting to trains, buses, etc. to go home.

 

[judvic]

As a U.S. citizen currently living in the U.S. (remember 'America' covers more than just the U.S.),

In French I am carefull not to mistake America and USA. I use "etats-uniens" for US citizens. I don't know the equivalent in English.

I definitely agree with you - and it horrifies me on a daily basis.

I had the opportunity to visit France a couple times a few years ago and found the country to be so much more "human" than the very antiseptic U.S. The French people I met were amazing. The countryside is amazing and I think is evidence of some of the best kinds of activities that humans can engage in being performed there on a daily basis. The very human history evident in France is also engaging. It felt like I had discovered a "root" to myself as a human, almost an origin of sorts, a real context. It's like having amnesia and then one day remembering all the things you had forgotten.

Yes people in France are still alive, even though I am worried that they start changing. François Mauriac had a great sentence: to his critics who complained that is characters in his books were too dark he answered:"In this post nuclear world, at least my character have a soul, even if it is a dark one". Such is France with all its bad sides. There is still life around the "aperitif" and work is only just there for the money. And you can still find great food.

I guess it would be accurate to describe life and most of the people here as impoverished - psychologically, historically, emotionally, economically, morally, ethically, etc. So it's very poignant indeed that you were watching a program about the impoverishment of one U.S. community. That program is a micro-cosmos of what's happening to the whole People of the U.S. and their Soul, or so I've noticed. And I think it's what our controllers have in store for the whole world eventually...

Living in Central Europe I see how fast people are loosing their "soul" . 10 years ago, the place was full of interesting persons. Now it's the jungle law and cynism and it has affected deeply the spirit of these countries, OSIT. It is as you say an impoverishment on all planes.

Thinking about all this now, and the word antiseptic, a couple images come to mind. Here, I know quite a lot of people who will not touch door handles without using a paper tissue in order to protect themselves from the germs of other people. In France, it is common to kiss strangers on the cheeks as a simple greeting. Juxtaposing those two images speaks profound volumes, I think. In a very real sense, the U.S. has become "germaphobic" to everything else but itself, remembering of course that germaphobia is an irrational fear of something imagined.
Talking about a "fixed stare" in U.S. citizens is interesting also. One thing I can't help but do constantly is watch people. I try not to be too overt about this activity so as not to creep people out, but it still amazes me that the vast majority of people don't seem to notice whether they're being watched or not. Every now and then there will be an attentive pair of eyes staring back at me and at those times I always wonder if they were watching me first or if they noticed me watching them - though maybe there really is no difference. Either way, when my eyes meet another's, there is always a brief connection on some level, even if it's just a quick acknowledgement of each other's existence. But for the people who don't pay attention and who blankly stare ahead heeding only what's on their minds for the fleeting moment, there is never any real connection with them. It's like looking through a window into a building where people are moving about automatically, robotically, and where the watcher has no opportunity for real contact or interaction with the robot people inside the building.

I have to wonder whether most people here are just paying attention to their own thoughts to an almost autistic degree, or if there is really any "attention" there at all.

It is interesting that you refer to autistics and to germs. Maybe there is an actual link between germs, autism (which is a lack of empathy to an extreme) and this fixed stare. It could be vaccination campaign associated with conditionning and the brutality of everyday life that leads to this emptiness.

My best friend left for the US 7 years ago. We were both sea men (merchand navy officers) and had developped a close relationship due to the facts that we shared so much time on board.
For his own reasons, he wanted to quit France, and find his American dream. He got married with a US girl, and worked there like a slave, repairing air conditionning devices. After a year he had a stroke. He who was so carefull about his diet (he actually introduced me to dietetics) gained 25 kgs. He told me, here it is "struggle or die".

I saw him 3 years afer his departure. I could not recognise him. He was so hard, so utilitarian in his relationships...
The US society had developped his dark side.

He is now divorced and I have lost contact with him.

Thanks a lot for your insight on the life in the USA.


Ludovic

 

[Ruth]

I have to wonder whether most people here are just paying attention to their own thoughts to an almost autistic degree, or if there is really any "attention" there at all.

Could this be the 'fixed stare' of a people concentrating so intently on 'survival' that they tune out to all other things? Kind of like the stare of a world class athlete when they are about to compete in a race? It just seems so totally blank. At some level they may all know that 'something dreadful is coming their way'.... and they are its prey. That'd be a good reason to want to try and 'tune out'.

 

[Petey of Lone Tree]

Does anyone have any figures on how much television is watched by Americans compared to the rest of the world?

I ask this question not with an intention to provoke any discussion of the misinformation or disinformation which might be received from the TV, not with the intention of discussing the inanity, banality, or sheer stupidity of what is viewed and listened to; but does anyone besides me at least suspect that the TV might be being used as a disordering device for normal brain patterns? Somewhere in the Cassiopaean literature I recall reading that the actual technology available to the PTB is 150 years advanced beyond what we ordinary mortals are aware of. If so, it's not difficult to imagine that some sort of "stupefaction device" is a part of either the TV set or the broadcasting medium.

 

[seek10]

Being lived in US and else where, my impression is , Americans invests too much in govt. and its beneficiary multi national companies in all respects psychologically , emotionally ,financially. It is very difficult to live with out really become part of main stream society money MACHINE. Hypocracy is ultimate level. Property taxes are so high one can't live with out ongoing serious income. This blind belief in govt. and its subsidaracies ( including notorious federal agencies ) and along with abundant cheap junk , highly tempting food with endless self help propaganda in the name of exercises, one is always running in circles like a circus animal. There is a saying that basic needs for humans is 'Food, Clothes, house'. Except House , most percentage of americans has all others, that is why very lazy to even question their own lifestyle which makes them more like a machine. One way americans are the most controlled country well before bush saga started and there is some books how this is achieved systematically over decades relegating all the investments and decision to concentrated group of companies and people.

 

[cholas]

Having spent a few weeks this summer in the Empire, for the first time in nearly two years, I was for a while in total culture shock. I agree with the notion that the u s, as a whole, seems souless and dead. I do know there are pockets of awareness and high,clearer energy, but have not visited those "islands" recently.
As Petey brought up, it was very distressing to listen to so much general chit-chat revolving around what was on tv last night. Hypothetically I would say that nearly every citizen spends their evening hours in front of the strobe. Also the use of cell phones is phenominal. It actually seemed like a form of addiction. A friend who works in a high-tech computer field once visited me without his cellphone.........Having been a hard-drug addict in years past, he was in a position to postulate that something was VERY sinister and addictive in cell-technology. He actually went through a mild form of withdrawal which we talked about at length. All told, I see the u s as a testing ground for the dumbing-down of the population, with all technology to do this being utilized. The people I was around lived like this: Wake up, immediately check email. Then cell-phone calls all the way to the office. Followed by an entire 8-10 hour day in front of the computer/cell phone. More cell phone activity while driving home, followed by television/video games. And do it again tomorrow....It ends up literally being mind-alteration. Thus the blank-look.
-c

 

[Neil]

I don't know if this has any relevance, but all of our college work is submitted over the computer. We have reached a phase where we hardly use paper. Most of the textbooks have an online program where you work out problems and submit quizzes through a computer interface and the scores are automatically recorded and cataloged; all the professor has to do is check the final numbers when it comes time to do grades. All they need to do now is figure out how to administer exams on computers and we won't need paper at all.

I read an article on Yahoo the other day entitled "You Might Wear Computing's Next Wave" Something that I remember from that article is a device that senses someone's feelings so that you can adjust your mood accordingly. The application was you could take it to job interviews and increase your success rate by accurately responding the moods and perceptions of the other person. We are becoming one with our machines. It makes you wonder what's going to happen to "soul" when we're all just a bunch of defacto cyborgs walking around. It gives new meaning to the phrase man-machine.

 

[anart]

I read an article on Yahoo the other day entitled "You Might Wear Computing's Next Wave" Something that I remember from that article is a device that senses someone's feelings so that you can adjust your mood accordingly. The application was you could take it to job interviews and increase your success rate by accurately responding the moods and perceptions of the other person.

This rather reminds me of this article - http://www.signs-of-the-times.org/articles/show/141770-This+Is+Your+Brain+on+Advertising - simply because it is 'computerizing' the recognition of, and interaction with, normal human behavior and motivation. In the article referenced, it's fairly obvious that the conclusions reached by the brain scans are conclusions already reached by in-depth qualitative market research. To put it plainly, if you advertise feminine hygiene products during a rugby match, you're not going to get much of a return on your investment.

Human beings react more strongly to messages in context - this is a basic human understanding - not complicated at all - yet entire industries are being established to examine basic human reactions that should be evident to normal human beings. Is that the key? Are these industries being established because 'not normal' human beings are unable to come to basic conclusions about what does and does not motivate a normal human being?

As far as Neil's example is concerned - it is a perfectly normal human capacity to read and react to a person's mood if one is engaged in conversation. Why would a computer need to be involved? Who would see a need to have a computer 'read' normal human reactions? It really speaks to one species working very hard to correctly 'read' another species - could that be the 'playing field' we are increasingly dealing with?

 

[Cyre2067]

Given Anarts and Neil's posts it does indeed sound like a group of people that cannot understand normal human emotional context is attempting to 'compensate' for it, via technology and advertising. More evidence to suggest those that control funding are indeed psychopathic.

Regarding the original topic of the thread, and being a US citizen, I just wanted to add that I don't really see people walking around looking empty or hypnotised. I do think it's important to remember that everywhere, all humans are machines, perhaps to varying degrees, but i don't think geography has much to do with it.

While in Europe I did notice a willingness to befriend, and an ease with which conversation was engaged that I don't typically find here. To give an example, I met some really cool girls, one from wales the other england, on the train from toulouse to barcelona. Given the long train ride, we had a lot of time to talk and found we had a lot in common and really enjoyed eachothers company. By the time we got to barcelona, Katie (the welsh) offered take me back with them to Montpelier, let me stay at her place and show me around town.

Needless to say, I went with them and had a blast.

What I do see here in the US is a focus on sports, as if they're some sort of drama worthy of following. That focus seems to keep people moreso then the "global drama" that we all follow. There's also a focus on the mediocre, weddings, babies, new houses, graduations, vacations, cars... that all are the typical "markers" of "progress" in one's life. Seems everyday at work we're discussing one of the above.

I've also seen a clique-i-ness that is pervasive. At work, they're cliques, in my social group, my family, it seems almost any time there's a group of people within that large group smaller cliques form and competition/conflict or avoidance thus ensues. It also happened on my dorm floor in college, and even within my 5 person house my senior year. Maybe this happens everywhere - I didn't really spend enough time in europe to get a feel for it there, but everyone seemed much more social with everyone, and the formation of cliques was less apparent.

So is the US a soul-less country? I'd say no, our leaders definitely lack soul and conscience, but again that seems to be the same everywhere. Are we a testing ground for a lot of mind-control technology? Likely, and ignorance of such makes you much more susceptible, thus negating your soul's input, but i don't think they can take it away or destroy it, and their techno-magic doesn't work on everyone.

 

[Kesdjan]

I don't think the U.S. is totally souless, as long as people have consciences it can never be, but I do think it is headed towards less conscious and more mechanical modes of behavior.

As Cyre pointed out, the U.S. is overly focused on mundane things, although American football has never sparked any deadly riots to my knowledge.

There is a kind of distrust of anything different here. People's relationships with others are superficial, and I think many peoples emotions have been somewhat deadened. That kid on the video wasn't the only one who laughed at the taser incident at UF, many people found it funny, and many people horrifyingly thought he deserved it.

The music people listen to is terrible, distilling all kinds of narcissistic virtues. And much of the more popular forms of music sounds the same. I don't have anything against rap, country, or pop, but many of those songs praise an OP-esque existance. These kids who listen constantly to songs only about money and sex, are slowly distroying their essence, if they had one to begin with. When my brother played his viola for a talent show a few months ago, many people (these were kids and young "adults") started to groan and complain about having to sit through the piece. This really tells a lot about american kids because they payed for the tickets (so they weren't being forced to sit through it), the piece was only like three minutes long, and (if I may impartially say so) my brother played it well. Nope, there is not much creativity in America today.

Education has degenerated into how many points you can get. Everything is quantified. Don't ask questions, take your test and shut up! Of course, there are the occasional real teachers, who actually care about learning, but they are definitely the minority. My highschool "American Government" class reminds me of the kind of propaganda the nazis made famous, with the textbook extoling the virtues of the two-party system, critisizing the ignorance of people who beleived their vote didn't count, and spewing the same old crap about America being the "freeist country in all the world". And college, of course, is just an extension of high school as far as "education" is concerned.

Still, the situation isn't hopeless, as knowledge spreads psychopathy decreases. Such observations shows one how important the work we're doing here, uncovering the truth in ourselves and in the world, really is.

 

[Renaissance]

I just wanted to add that I don't really see people walking around looking empty or hypnotised.

Well, if we're comparing people to the scenes from the Night of the Living Dead as being 'empty or hypnotized' I'd agree. But unfortunately recognizing the kind of hypnotism we're talking about isn't that easy. If you take a drive in most any city you'll be sure to notice the abnormal mounting tension seen in others and in the self. The same could be said at work and homes all over the place. We've become ill equip to properly resolve conflict, particularly petty things. This seems to have become dramatically worse after 9/11 and is increasing all the time as we see from the Signs page. There seems a lot of answers in this from understanding dissociation. People can appear conscious but act out in all sorts of hysterical behavior. Imo, it's this hysteria and dissociation that is a large part of the 'look of being hypnotized,' and I do see people and myself walking around like this every day.

 

[Cyre2067]

I just wanted to add that I don't really see people walking around looking empty or hypnotised.

Well, if we're comparing people to the scenes from the Night of the Living Dead as being 'empty or hypnotized' I'd agree. But unfortunately recognizing the kind of hypnotism we're talking about isn't that easy.

Oh I'd definitely agree, but from what was said previously guess I was thinking they were describing more obvious, overt behavior/composure.

ie:

With my wife we train to spot americans in a crowd: it is easy because many Americans have a fixed stare in the eye. They have this blank and empty look as if they were without spirit.
Did some of you notice this and have an explanation for it?

Heh I'm not denying that Americans don't "stand out", some more then others. When I went abroad I often got prematurely labeled Canadian, which i took as a compliment.

Talking about a "fixed stare" in U.S. citizens is interesting also. One thing I can't help but do constantly is watch people. I try not to be too overt about this activity so as not to creep people out, but it still amazes me that the vast majority of people don't seem to notice whether they're being watched or not. Every now and then there will be an attentive pair of eyes staring back at me and at those times I always wonder if they were watching me first or if they noticed me watching them - though maybe there really is no difference

I tend to make eye contact often, I like to greet people with the customary head nod, the occasional smirk, a verbal hello, what's up, hey, and i find some people responsive, other's not. One guy at my work refuses to say hello, or respond to a greeting. Questions are given short direct answers, and he totally avoids all eye contact. But that's the exception, not the rule, at least in my experience.

 

[kenlee]

Cyre2067 said: Regarding the original topic of the thread, and being a US citizen, I just wanted to add that I don't really see people walking around looking empty or hypnotised. I do think it's important to remember that everywhere, all humans are machines, perhaps to varying degrees, but i don't think geography has much to do with it.

What I do notice is that the people in the US simply do not feel, or at least are not conscious of, the "terror of the situation" in their bones. The group mind is unconscious of the seriousness of the situation but at some level they feel it, yet they will not acknowledge it consciously. As a result there is "differential" between what is and what people want to believe. The greater the differential between the unconscious and the conscious then the greater the shock when the cold water of reality hits. The running programs buffer them from this conscious acknowledgement. There is even a certain kind of feeling of superiority among those who do not feel the terror of the situation. They even become proud of their programs since these programs give them a certain (false) feeling of strength, of control.