Homer's Odyssey : a great masterpiece

[Laura]

Hi Ian,

The forum's notification system brought your post to my attention. I have two remarks to make:

First, when citing a passage from any work it's customary to give precise details about the exact location within the work (Book number, verse number/s, etc.) in order to know the context of the citation. The context can help explain the intended meaning of difficult passages.

Secondly, just in case you don't know -- we have a very long thread (34 pages) about the Odyssey here: The Odyssey - Manual of Secret Teachings?

Reading it might give you the needed background info and some extra clues regarding what the poem is all about.

Or, Ian's contribution is inspired. I'd never really noted that passage and it sure raises the eyebrows! Thanks for bringing it to our attention.

Maybe we can merge this with the main Odyssey thread?

 

[Chu]

Assuming it's accurate, this is almost like singing - Listen to the Illiad in ancient Greek.

It's a one minute 30 seconds audio clip of a professor Steven Dates 'reading' in ancient Greek. :)

Amazing, if accurate! The tones are fluctuating in pitch (several times in one syllable) and duration, and the vowels vary in length. I've seem simplified versions of either one or the other in modern languages, but I don't know that a combination still exists today in one and the same language.

 

[Laura]

Assuming it's accurate, this is almost like singing - Listen to the Illiad in ancient Greek.

It's a one minute 30 seconds audio clip of a professor Steven Dates 'reading' in ancient Greek. :)

Amazing, if accurate! The tones are fluctuating in pitch (several times in one syllable) and duration, and the vowels vary in length. I've seem simplified versions of either one or the other in modern languages, but I don't know that a combination still exists today in one and the same language.

I have my doubts about it.

 

[3DStudent]

I've not found anyone proposing the English version on the Internet yet, but if I find that, i'll post it here. It really IS worth seeing!

Haven't seen any legitimate english copies (torrents only), but found subtitles which could be used for the German/French/Italian versioned DVD's

Update: I've found out that L'Odissea/Homer's Odyssey miniseries by Franco Rossi is now available with English subtitles on YouTube (in 4 parts). It's an unofficial version made available thanks to the work of a passionate amateur, who embedded English subtitles in the French version.
1st part here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjN_merCA0Q&t=28s

Highly recommended!

I skipped around watching over an hour on parts one and two and it looks like a great movie!

 

[Alana]

Assuming it's accurate, this is almost like singing - Listen to the Illiad in ancient Greek.

It's a one minute 30 seconds audio clip of a professor Steven Dates 'reading' in ancient Greek. :)

Amazing, if accurate! The tones are fluctuating in pitch (several times in one syllable) and duration, and the vowels vary in length. I've seem simplified versions of either one or the other in modern languages, but I don't know that a combination still exists today in one and the same language.

I have my doubts about it.

I too doubt whether this was the way ancient greeks talked in general. It would have taken a long time to just greet each other! It might have been how they read poems or how they performed in dramas. Perhaps not comedies? I can't imagine one of Aristophanes' comedies being perfomed in this drawn out tonality, since punch-lines are often delivered faster to catch the audience by surprise. Also, according to time period and region, there are several ancient greek "languages", dialects, accents... So I would imagine it would be very hard for any researcher today to say with accuracy, "that's how they spoke back then".

What I do know is that, the polytonic system and the different letter compinations to produce the sounds of the vowels "ee" "o" and "ε" in ancient greek writing, existed in order to indicate the length and tonality of how to pronounce each vowel. Modern greek has done away with polytony and the vowel sounds are now all the same.

Regarding the sing-song way of talking, some dialects like those of Cyprus and Crete, do sound like that even to this day.

On a funny and related note, the students fo a New Zealand school of classical studies created videos of popular songs (ie. Mamma Mia by ABBA, Let it Go from Frozen) translated and sung in ancient Greek of the 5th century BC. Though a lot of Greeks reacted to the pronounciation, the students and the professors replied that that was the Attic pronounciation of the time (or what they imagine it to be). But anyway, it was a great project overall and probably difficult, most people liked it, though they made fun of it. You can see a sample of the songs here, on an article posted on el.sott a couple of years ago:

https://el.sott.net/article/2410-to-mamma-mia-let-it-go-kai-hot-n-cold-diaskeyasmena-sta-archaia-ellhnika

 

[Adaryn]

I've not found anyone proposing the English version on the Internet yet, but if I find that, i'll post it here. It really IS worth seeing!

Haven't seen any legitimate english copies (torrents only), but found subtitles which could be used for the German/French/Italian versioned DVD's

Update: I've found out that L'Odissea/Homer's Odyssey miniseries by Franco Rossi is now available with English subtitles on YouTube (in 4 parts). It's an unofficial version made available thanks to the work of a passionate amateur, who embedded English subtitles in the French version.
1st part here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjN_merCA0Q&t=28s

Highly recommended!

I skipped around watching over an hour on parts one and two and it looks like a great movie!

Oh indeed it is! It's described by every critic and viewer as the best and most faithful adaptation of The Odyssey. The Albanian actor playing Odysseus is just fantastic. He IS Odysseus (as I "imagined" him when I first watched that series as a teen). You'll find a complete review here:
http://www.mythimedia.org/doc/Leaves%20of%20Homeric%20Storytelling.pdf

Some key points which add to the beauty of that miniseries:

the preservation of a Homeric narrator-an off-screen aoidos who serves as the viewer's faithful guide and companion through the entire film. Uniquely in the history of films based on Homer, the narrator preserves the two key features of Homeric diction: formulaic epithets and similes. This alone ensures the film a closer adherence to its model than occurs in any other screen adaptation,

What I called Rossi's will to style appears most notably in some of the scenes set on Ithaca. For special emphasis, Rossi at certain moments has Penelope's servant women move as a group and speak in unison or by turns; at the same time they are facing the camera and so directly addressing the film's spectators. They comment on their situation and its possible ramifications in the way the chorus of classical Greek tragedy
does in fifth-century Athens. To anyone who recognizes the choral function--avant la tragédie, as it were-the effect is striking. It is also an indirect reminder that Homeric epic was a major source of material for Aeschylus, Sophocles, Euripides, and the other tragic playwrights.

 

[Vulcan59]

Looks like a new movie in the making, directed by Christopher Nolan scheduled to be released in July 26'.

Follows Odysseus in his perilous journey home after the Trojan War, showcasing his encounters with Polyphemus, the Sirens, Circe, and finishing with his reunion with his wife, Penelope.

The Odyssey (2026) | Action, Adventure, Fantasy

The Odyssey: Directed by Christopher Nolan. With Zendaya, Tom Holland, Anne Hathaway, Matt Damon. Follows Odysseus in his perilous journey home after the Trojan War, showcasing his encounters with Polyphemus, the Sirens, Circe, and finishing with his reunion with his wife, Penelope.

www.imdb.com

 

[mkrnhr]

:O They assume Odysseus' gender? And he still has a wife? What's become of Hollywood? Not sure the actors are up to the task though.

 

[SasaM]

:O They assume Odysseus' gender? And he still has a wife? What's become of Hollywood? Not sure the actors are up to the task though.

Well, maybe wait until the movie is done and released to the public, there could be still surprises in store.